Speidel Braumeister (brewmaster)

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My guess is that there is an algorithm built into the Braumeister to heat the water more to compensate for the loss of heat due to the "cold" grains...

That's also my theory. But I think the heat compensation (the algorithm) is activated at the "fill in malt" stage (i.e. when you start pouring the malt in the malt pipe - between the two stages "fill in malt" and "malt filled in?"). When pressing "Start" in the "malt filled in?" stage the unit enters the different phase stages.

I am more concerned with the loss of heat during the main mashing. When the internal thermostat is showing, say, 66C - my reading with the Thermopen off the top of the grain bed can give me 2-3 degrees lower.

Interesting how accurate your data is compared to mine. But like I said, the temperature drop is happening gradually through the whole malt bed - which is pretty thick (6kg)! So maybe 2-3 degrees Celsius isn't that bad after all. But still an issue you should be aware of (and find a solution to if possible).

I tend to max out the grain bill to just south of 6 kg - that certainly may have an impact on the circulation of the heated water, which leads to the temp drop.

A maxed out grain bill would certainly affect the circulation. And that would work counteractive to the heat compensation (the algorithm). The heat compensation probably works better at a grain bill of 4-5 kg.

I have the insulating jacket - but I often take it off during mashing due to the fact that the temperature often starts to drift upwards when using it.

I will give it a try next time (Sunday).

And a solution to the problem where the temperature rise during mash in could be to set the initial temperature (mash in/dough in) about 3 degrees Celsius lower than the first phase.
 
I just wanted to let you know that I created a forum dedicated to the Speidel Braumeister. It is in no way my intention to try and replace forums like HBT, but I've found that BM information is a bit scattered.

Besides a forum there are plans for a Braumeister wiki and some more BM dedicated tools.

Please feel free to join us at http://braumeisters.net

As with all forum launches, content is thin, but I hope this changes rapidly...

Prost!

Niels
 
I just wanted to let you know that I created a forum dedicated to the Speidel Braumeister. It is in no way my intention to try and replace forums like HBT, but I've found that BM information is a bit scattered.

Besides a forum there are plans for a Braumeister wiki and some more BM dedicated tools.

Please feel free to join us at http://braumeisters.net

As with all forum launches, content is thin, but I hope this changes rapidly...

Prost!

Niels

thanks! i'm registered!! i hope everyone from here posts mods and suggestions there as indeed it will be easier to find than searching back through this enormous thread
 
I now have some data from using the insulation jacket during the mashing.

I put the jacket on after I noticed that the temperature had even out (the dough in/mash in was set to 3 degrees Celsius below the temperature I had set for the scarification phase).
Of course the temperature of the mash rised quickly (10-15 seconds) to 68 degrees Celsius. When the temperature had stabilized I dressed the BM in the insulation jacket.

As the wort circulates through the malt bed during the first phase (first scarification phase) the temperaure of the liquid fall as the temperature of the malt is still too cold – that's why we get a difference of 2-3 degrees Celsius from the temperature we have chosen for that phase.

The first minutes of the first phase, the wort coming up from the top of the malt pipe was only 53-54 degrees Celsius, which is 14 degrees Celsius lower than the set temperature!

After 15-20 minutes the temperature had reached an equilibrium throughout the malt bed, and now the difference was only 1 degree Celsius from the actual temperature (which I consider spot on in this system).

I got pretty much the same result during the second phase. But the huge difference of 14 degrees was only an issue during the first phase – when the wort was circulted through the malt the first time. And I felt that the equilibrium throughout the malt bed happened faster during the second phase.

The above data was with a BM 20 litres, 6 kilo malt and the use of the insulation jacket.


My lesson from the above is that I will probably start to use a dough in/mash in phase (as phase 1). I will probably mash in at either 40 degrees or 52 degrees (I will see...). I don't really think this is necessary for well modified malt, but I think it might be important to prepare/heat up the malt bed for the first scarification phase.

Another solution could be to add 10-15 minutes to the first phase.

...I will look into this further.

If someone with a 50L BM has any experience to share in regard of the above I would be very happy.
 
I now have some data from using the insulation jacket during the mashing.

I put the jacket on after I noticed that the temperature had even out (the dough in/mash in was set to 3 degrees Celsius below the temperature I had set for the scarification phase).
Of course the temperature of the mash rised quickly (10-15 seconds) to 68 degrees Celsius. When the temperature had stabilized I dressed the BM in the insulation jacket.

As the wort circulates through the malt bed during the first phase (first scarification phase) the temperaure of the liquid fall as the temperature of the malt is still too cold – that's why we get a difference of 2-3 degrees Celsius from the temperature we have chosen for that phase.

The first minutes of the first phase, the wort coming up from the top of the malt pipe was only 53-54 degrees Celsius, which is 14 degrees Celsius lower than the set temperature!

After 15-20 minutes the temperature had reached an equilibrium throughout the malt bed, and now the difference was only 1 degree Celsius from the actual temperature (which I consider spot on in this system).

I got pretty much the same result during the second phase. But the huge difference of 14 degrees was only an issue during the first phase – when the wort was circulted through the malt the first time. And I felt that the equilibrium throughout the malt bed happened faster during the second phase.

The above data was with a BM 20 litres, 6 kilo malt and the use of the insulation jacket.


My lesson from the above is that I will probably start to use a dough in/mash in phase (as phase 1). I will probably mash in at either 40 degrees or 52 degrees (I will see...). I don't really think this is necessary for well modified malt, but I think it might be important to prepare/heat up the malt bed for the first scarification phase.

Another solution could be to add 10-15 minutes to the first phase.

...I will look into this further.

If someone with a 50L BM has any experience to share in regard of the above I would be very happy.

Very nice write-up CJ - thank you.

This past Sunday, I wrapped my BM with a towel (attached photo) - I had a MUCH boil than I ever had.

The take-away that you mentioned regarding doughing-in at 40C is fully in line with George Fix's famous 40C-60C-70C mash (half an hour for each rest) and 50C-60C-70C for the lesser-modified Pils malts. John Palmer highlights this as well in his How To Brew book:

http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/chapter16-2.html

Proper liquefaction of the mash is very important and I also try to incorporate it in all my step-mashing.

Jacket.JPG
 
In the past I always doughed in at 40 degrees Celsius for 20 minutes (and yes, I blame John Palmer among others for that). The reason for me to mash in at that regime wasn't just to liquefie the mash, but I also felt that it were more gentle to the mash/enzymes and I also believed that the enzymes were distributed more efficiently before the first scarification rest.

Back then I doughed in at 40 degrees Celsius even if I was going to use only one scarification step (and mash out).

...but after discussing the above with my friend (as he's got a degree in brewing engineering) and getting inputs from a quite famous brewmaster here in Sweden, I skipped the above step (and I did not notice a huge difference in the yield).

But I still believe in the reasons I listed above (even if they might not be of as much importance as I first thought). And I do believe that the dough in might be even more important when using a BrewMeister.

So like I said in my previous post – I will probably go back to the dough in step and see how that affects the stabilisation and evenness of the temperature throughout the malt bed (of the first scarification step). Spontaneously I think that the issue with the huge difference of 14 degrees Celsius in the beginning of the mash will be gone. And I also believe that the 15-20 minutes for the temperature to even out throughout the malt bed will be shorter (at least that's what I hope).

And I do recommend you to buy the insulation jacket – even if it wouldn't help you during the mash, it WILL help a lot during the boil. I can also recomend you to buy the hood for the BM. It helps the boil even more (without covering the BM).
 
The jacket is on the to-buy list (however - currently sold out at MoreBeer, my go-to online brew store).

I do have the hood - you can see it peeping out from under the towel :)
 
I do have the hood - you can see it peeping out from under the towel :)

Oh yeah - there it is!

I have the hood connected to a ventilation system (which is a bit too effective - it also affects the rate of the boil in a negative way if set too high).
 
I am in the middle of my first batch with the 20L, a nice ESB. A few thoughts:
*I really like this machine! It really saves a lot of space and complexity - no separate thermometers, pumps, timers, pots, and the like. I'm doing on top of the washing machine and running laundry for SWMBO with all the spare time.
*It is so easy! Except for a couple tasks you can walk away or work on cleaning up your equipment. At the start, I was getting things ready while the water was heating, and then I cleaned the malt pipe and so on while waiting for boil temperature.
*The jacket really works. I have a nice rolling boil
*It said add hops, so I just tossed in the pellets, but the pump was running and I heard it chopping through them - I hope it is okay. Then I realized it wasn't yet at boil, and needed to ramp up. It did then ask again for hops when the pump was off. Was I just too impulsive? Do you think the pellets hurt the pump?
* This thing puts out a lot of heat. The room is full of steam and hop aroma.
*This machine really gives us versatility. I wonder if less modified malts would be good for some lagers? You can change the lengths of the rests to get less body, more alcohol, more body, more head proteins, and so on.
* I need a lot more information about mash schedules. There are some on the Speidel site, but not much explanation. I may have to get back to the theory sections in the texts.
* My elevation is less than 500 feet but I never got above 99 degrees C
 
Jette, well done, my first brew was also an ESB.

About the mash schedules. Lately I've used infusion Hochkurz mash which is very popular in Germany commercially. I've noticed that the wort gets very bright very early and that my 4.3% beers taste like 5+% easily mouthfeel-wise.

Mash in (5minutes) 55degc
maltose rest 40m 63c
dextrinisation 50m 70c
mash out 15m 77c

Braukaiser explains it all better (scroll down):
http://www.braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Infusion_Mashing
 
*It said add hops, so I just tossed in the pellets, but the pump was running and I heard it chopping through them - I hope it is okay. Then I realized it wasn't yet at boil, and needed to ramp up. It did then ask again for hops when the pump was off. Was I just too impulsive? Do you think the pellets hurt the pump?

The BM told you what?? The Braumeister does not keep track of your hop additions (but maybe I misunderstood). The pumps are never on during the boil – which means you added your hops way too early. The pumps turn off at 88 degrees Celsius.

...or does the BM keep track of your hop additions in the preset mode?? I can't find anything about that in the manual – and I have always programmed my own mash schedules.


* This thing puts out a lot of heat. The room is full of steam and hop aroma.

It sure does. That is why I added the hood which is connected to a ventilation system.


* My elevation is less than 500 feet but I never got above 99 degrees C

But you still had a good rolling boil? Then I would not worry too much. If you do not get a good boil, invest in the hood (copper or stainless).
 
Adding hops before the boil kicks in is called first-wort hopping and is a fairly popular technique these days.

However, CJ - I think you bring up a good point that given the BM's technical peculiarity of running the pump until the wort hits 88C, maybe FWH better not be used to avoid messing up the pump.

Or perhaps it can be done if you have the right equipment - such as a metal mesh hop strainer.
 
Jette, well done, my first brew was also an ESB.


Braukaiser explains it all better (scroll down):
http://www.braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Infusion_Mashing

Very nice, thanks for the link!

I popped a home brew while doing my mash. This is the first one of the year. It is an old Papazian recipe, so I did not expect greatness. It was crystal clear, three to four fingers of foam, light, clean and refreshing. Charlie was right when he said the Honey Lager is better than anything you are paying good money for now! SWMBO likes it better than a Belgian!
 
Guys, I'd like to share a lifehack about the Heat Insulation Jacket for BMs:

One could save a fortune by getting the foil backed camping mat for $13
http://amzn.com/B00G238F74

And cut out the holes for handles/valve in 5 minutes instead of paying the $100+ for the original version.

The standard size mat available in Russia (for just $5 :) ) fits perfectly well for 50L BM
 
Adding hops before the boil kicks in is called first-wort hopping and is a fairly popular technique these days.

Quite familiar with FWH. But that involves adding a portion of the hops at the beginning of the sparging (for example as soon as the malt pipe is removed) - and I got the feeling that the BM told him to add the hops before the boil had started (before 88 degrees Celsius). I honestly got quite confused (almost thought that he had a never version of the controller software).

maybe FWH better not be used to avoid messing up the pump.

I agree. I would still use FWH, but make sure to use a strainer or similar (hop bag) until the pump stops at 88 degrees Celsius.
 
One could save a fortune by getting the foil backed camping mat for $13
http://amzn.com/B00G238F74

Thanks - got a photo by any chance?

I considered doing that, but I am afraid that the plastic part of the mat is not high-temp grade, thus it may start melting during the boil time.

...BM told him to add the hops...

To the best of my recollection, BM doesn't track one's hop additions.
 
You can definitely program reminders for hop additions during the boil. It's either 2 or 3 possible additions - can't remember which. Those reminders trigger from boil start, so not sure why pump would be running (if that was what happened).

Here's another nice article about step mashing and the different rests:
http://***********/stories/techniqu...rain-brewing/1529-the-science-of-step-mashing
 
You can definitely program reminders for hop additions during the boil.

And how do you do that?? I searched the whole manual and found nothing (although it's not the first time the BM hides secret functions that's not mentioned in the manual).
 
I was just setting up the program and it asked about hop additions. I think there were 3 or 4 options, I used 3 additions of pellet hops.
 
And how do you do that?? I searched the whole manual and found nothing (although it's not the first time the BM hides secret functions that's not mentioned in the manual).
It is introduced in a newer version of the firmware. You probably have an older firmware if it is not there.

Niels
 
It is introduced in a newer version of the firmware. You probably have an older firmware if it is not there.

As I suspected - a new version of the firmware! I hope the hop addition-phase-function is the only difference from the version I have (I can - and want to - live without that).

Higher temperature accuracy etc. - that I would love to have.
 
As I suspected - a new version of the firmware! I hope the hop addition-phase-function is the only difference from the version I have (I can - and want to - live without that).

Higher temperature accuracy etc. - that I would love to have.

Just confirmed it's 3 hop additions you can program. And it's not mentioned in my version of the Operating Instructions :)

It's a minor feature - just an alarm. It's a nice-to-have if I'm not paying attention to when the boil timer starts. I usually use my BeerSmith timer since I'll mostly have more than 3 boil additions (hops, Whirlfloc, Servomyces, malt extract).
 
It is introduced in a newer version of the firmware. You probably have an older firmware if it is not there.

Niels

Thanks Niels - is there a way to upgrade the firmware? I usually just use the kitchen timer as a reminder for my hop / whirlfloc / yeast nutrients additions reminder.

If the new firmware fine-tunes the temp control, I'd like to have it if the upgrade is possible.
 
And it brews better beer! :) I also noticed that they may have adjusted the temp sensor. Others had to set 102 to get a good boil, but my status does not exceed 99 C, so 100 is fine.
 
Thanks Niels - is there a way to upgrade the firmware?

I emailed Speidel before Xmas about this and Ralf advised the older units' processor is at the maximum capacity and cannot be upgraded.

No big deal in the grand scheme of things.

cliffo
 
with the topic of the hood coming up a few posts back i would like to canvas opinion among BM-ers (posted something similar on nielsr's new bm forum https://forum.braumeisters.net/ but no response yet). i'm building a new brew space and there is an old dryer duct. in my old place i ran the BM in the kitchen and cracked open the window. the result was a lot of steam throughout the apartment and ceiling condensation above the BM, with that tough kitchen paint you can get it was no problem but still not ideal to fill the place with steam. so i am thinking of getting the stainless hood, and connecting directly to the duct and out a little chimney. my fear is that i'm going to get condensation in the duct and backwash of all the dust (and dms) into my wort unless i make a trap, ie a low point on the duct that can be drained. or else i need to install a kitchen fan to actively blow out. hood users- what are your thoughts please?? is everyone connecting to a fan? thanks!!
 
with the topic of the hood coming up a few posts back i would like to canvas opinion among BM-ers...

First of all - my ventilation system is NOT constructed in this way today. But the basic construction is the same.

Ventilation.jpg


Today the fan is located at the end of the pipe. The bend is of steel (not plastic like in the picture) and I don't have a plastic connection to the hood...

...yes, plastic melts.

No risk of DMS getting back in the boil with this system. The steam cools down at the bend and drips down the other end as water.
 
The fans can be set up outside to 'suck' air into the pipe rather than mounted inside end to blow down them.
 
Has anyone regretted going with the Braumeister? I see the gravity limitations and I'm wondering if this can be fixed with a smaller crush? Does that add any astringency?

Sorry if this is a redundant question, I am close to buying one, but I want to make sure it does everything I need. The cleaning of my keggles is getting to be a bit monotonous, so I need a change.

Also, if I get the 50L can I do full boil 5 gallon batches?
 
Has anyone regretted going with the Braumeister?

Not yet – and I have had mine well over a year now (almost two I recon!). If I want to make Big Beers I add mash extensions (spray malt). I have also concentrated the wort by boiling to a volume under 20 litres (but I rather not do that). I guess you could do two mashes – and boil them both at the same time. But that takes some extra time...
 
nervous- definitely no regrets. but i bought it for the small footprint, so i could assemble and brew in my kitchen, then take it down and stash away. for that you can't beat the BM. smaller crush could possibly not recirculate as well, i think in general (from reading many pages of this thread and personal experience) people have better efficiency from more coarse crush.

coldjazz- thanks for the pic, where you have the low point on your tubing do you have a valve to drain the condensed water? assuming you vent to outside...
 
I have not tried any big beers in it yet, but I am truly amazed at how easy brewing is with it. You could do a second mash, you could boil it down further, or you could add LME/DME. That wouldn't be the end of the world. It does allow you to make some amazing beers - step mashing is so simple, just pushing a button. I'm glad I did not go through the 3 vessel stage when I went to all grain. But you could always keep your old equipment.
 
I have not tried any big beers in it yet, but I am truly amazed at how easy brewing is with it. You could do a second mash, you could boil it down further, or you could add LME/DME. That wouldn't be the end of the world. It does allow you to make some amazing beers - step mashing is so simple, just pushing a button. I'm glad I did not go through the 3 vessel stage when I went to all grain. But you could always keep your old equipment.

I'm about to start fermenting my 2nd "big beer." First one came out really good - a double wheat beer (1.080 SG). Second one is about to be kegged - a doppelbock (also 1.080 SG). It's looking really good so far.

Used LME for both. I have a close, local source of high quality LME (MoreBeer). Pretty easy to work with it in the Braumeister. The first time, I tried adding the LME directly to the BM, but the extract went right to the pump and gummed it up. Now I pull a few liters out of the boil to dilute the LME on my stove top in a big pot before adding.
 
Good tip for us working with integral pumps. You could do a double batch and add it for the boil. You could also get a 50l.
 
he first time, I tried adding the LME directly to the BM, but the extract went right to the pump and gummed it up.

I always add it to the boil - as the pumps are off. As soon as the boil starts rolling I add the spray malt.
 
thanks for the pic, where you have the low point on your tubing do you have a valve to drain the condensed water? assuming you vent to outside...

Right now the water simply drips down in a vessel (same as I use for the spent grains).

But I will try and find another solution as I upgrade my system. The steam condense quickly into water, so I don't think I will be able to transport it outside the brewery (unless I crack the brewery walls open).
 
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