Baseball--AL or NL?

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Dude

Dude

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Which league do you like best?

I'm an AL guy. Grew up watching the AL with the Brew Crew and I think it is a much more exciting brand of baseball.

I've gotten a good taste of the NL since the Brewers switched over and I enjoy it, but I have to admit I'm still an AL fan. The automatic out for the pitcher is stoopid.
 
NL baby. No doubt.

Play like baseball was meant to be played. . . LET THE PITCHER BAT!
 
And this thread doesn't have a poll why?

I grew up with the DH, but I can't stand it. I *hate* the whole, leadoff-man-get-a-walk-then-hope-the-DH-hits-a-bomb "strategy." I like that there's actually some management required of the manager in NL games. Do you let the pitcher hit 'cause he's mowin' them down, or take him out because it's the 7th inning and he's almost done anyway? I love that there are more steals, and sacrifices, and all of that. Small ball, to me, is much, MUCH more exciting that "work the count then swing from your heels."

As much as I love Papi, he *ought* to be playing 1st base. I really don't think he should ever be MVP if he never goes in the field.
 
Pitchers suck at hitting. Who wants to see two easy outs at the end of the rotation? The AL brand of baseball is far superior and much more exciting.
 
rdwj said:
Pitchers suck at hitting. Who wants to see two easy outs at the end of the rotation? The AL brand of baseball is far superior and much more exciting.
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Yes, but the American League killed the inside pitch.


Once the pitchers stopped batting, they no longer had to fear retribution. They could bean with impunity. This lead to a rash of beanings and riots, ultimately leading to a severe clamp-down on inside pitching. Thus we enter the era of the power hitter, where small ball means less.


And, those last two hitters aren't "easy outs"- they are your two chances to move a runner into scoring position before turning the order.

See? It's called small ball and it's the way the game is supposed to be played. With strategy. Ditto for the inside pitch. Knowing when, where, and at whom to throw inside was a big part of the game. Nowadays, you throw down the middle and let the big guy smack it around. borrrring...
 
Toot said:
Yes, but the American League killed the inside pitch.


Once the pitchers stopped batting, they no longer had to fear retribution. They could bean with impunity. This lead to a rash of beanings and riots, ultimately leading to a severe clamp-down on inside pitching. Thus we enter the era of the power hitter, where small ball means less.


And, those last two hitters aren't "easy outs"- they are your two chances to move a runner into scoring position before turning the order.

See? It's called small ball and it's the way the game is supposed to be played. With strategy. Ditto for the inside pitch. Knowing when, where, and at whom to throw inside was a big part of the game. Nowadays, you throw down the middle and let the big guy smack it around. borrrring...
Click to expand...

I understand small ball - my team of choice actually played quite a bit of it in 05 when they won the WS. Pitchers may not have to face other pitchers, but their teammates do and that's a pretty decent deterrent.

Pitchers ARE, by in large EASY outs. Most #9 hitters are too - or #8's in the NL. Ya, you can pitch hit and pull a double switch, but I like seeing pitchers face guys like Ortiz and Thome. Without the DH, their careers would be over.
 
I don't buy it. #8 and 9 hitters are easy outs? Maybe in Little League, but we're talking about the pros... hitting in the .220's is nothing to sneeze at...
 
Toot said:
I don't buy it. #8 and 9 hitters are easy outs? Maybe in Little League, but we're talking about the pros... hitting in the .220's is nothing to sneeze at...
Click to expand...

.220 sucks - especially when their RISP and HR total is low
 
rdwj said:
Pitchers suck at hitting. Who wants to see two easy outs at the end of the rotation? The AL brand of baseball is far superior and much more exciting.
Click to expand...


Um, Babe Ruth was originally a pitcher with the Red Sox..........


There is a TON more involved in the NL game because of the fact that the pitcher hits. I am SO glad the Brewers switched leagues. Nine times out of ten the DH is just some washed-up position player that can't do anything anymore but swing the bat. I hate the DH. And yes, I am fully aware that Molitor would never be in the Hall without the DH rule. I still hate it.
 
rdwj said:
.220 sucks - especially when their RISP and HR total is low
Click to expand...

Why is a team that gets more hits automatically more fun to watch? Is golf more fun to watch than baseball merely because they hit the ball more? Why not just eliminate the walk? Then there will be more hits. By your logic, that will make the game more exciting.

But as I see it, it's more about the strategy- working around your deficiencies and weaknesses to eek out a run or a win. Doesn't matter if nobody on the team is hitting over .210, if you're winning, those ought to be exciting games. Some of the most exciting games I've ever seen were 1-0 or 2-1. Of course, if someone has a short attention span, they can blink and miss the entire game in a 5 second span. If you are like that, then I guess I can understand. You want to know that a BIG hitter is coming up because then you will know you are supposed to be excited. It's not as difficult as, say, checking out how big of a lead the guy has at second, trying to figure out if they're going to hit and run.. or maybe squeeze with the guy on third. Nope. That's complicated. I'd rather get excited when the big heavy guy gets up to the plate. That's when I'll know to be excited... :p

You remind me of the people who complained about the boring baseball game they were watching. 7 innings and there hadn't been a single hit!!!
 
I agree, Toot. Sure, a clutch homerun is exciting, but IMHO not nearly as exciting as a walk, stolen base, sac bunt, and sac fly for the winning run in a 2-1 game. Or the defense invoved in a double play. Or watching two pitchers throwing bullets in that no-hit battle you mentioned. Small-Ball rules.:ban:
 
Bernie Brewer said:
Poke fun if you want, but teamwork like that, esp with the game on the line, is poetry in motion.
Click to expand...

Just messin'.

Surprised you like that though...seeing the Brewers can't do it. Watching any of those guys execute a bunt is comedy relief in itself.
 
Yeah, I know. They trade away anyone who can. Podsednik, for example. At least he's got a ring to show for it. Brewers got to rent Carlos Lee for a year and a half. Aw, now you got me started.....:(
 
Bernie Brewer said:
Yeah, I know. They trade away anyone who can. Podsednik, for example. At least he's got a ring to show for it. Brewers got to rent Carlos Lee for a year and a half. Aw, now you got me started.....:(
Click to expand...

Honestly, the Brewers have a great nucleus of kids. However, they aren't be coached right. They are terribly undisciplined at the plate. I thought that would go away with Wynegar, but I guess not.
Did you see some of the pitches Hall was swing at today. My gawd....he needs to sit for a few days and regroup.

I totally blame this on coaching. Yost couldn't coach himself out of a wet paper bag.
 
When a pitcher in the NL, one of those 'automatic outs' gets a big hit, thats excitement! I love the NL game.
 
Toot said:
Why is a team that gets more hits automatically more fun to watch? Is golf more fun to watch than baseball merely because they hit the ball more? Why not just eliminate the walk? Then there will be more hits. By your logic, that will make the game more exciting.

But as I see it, it's more about the strategy- working around your deficiencies and weaknesses to eek out a run or a win. Doesn't matter if nobody on the team is hitting over .210, if you're winning, those ought to be exciting games. Some of the most exciting games I've ever seen were 1-0 or 2-1. Of course, if someone has a short attention span, they can blink and miss the entire game in a 5 second span. If you are like that, then I guess I can understand. You want to know that a BIG hitter is coming up because then you will know you are supposed to be excited. It's not as difficult as, say, checking out how big of a lead the guy has at second, trying to figure out if they're going to hit and run.. or maybe squeeze with the guy on third. Nope. That's complicated. I'd rather get excited when the big heavy guy gets up to the plate. That's when I'll know to be excited... :p

You remind me of the people who complained about the boring baseball game they were watching. 7 innings and there hadn't been a single hit!!!
Click to expand...

I didn't realize there weren't 1-0 pitchers duels in the AL. No squeeze bunting or moving runners over! Thanks for the lesson! What have I been watching all these years? LOL

Honestly, the NL is where good AL pitchers go when they can't compete anymore. It's been the inferior league for a LONG time now.
 
Wolf said:
When a pitcher in the NL, one of those 'automatic outs' gets a big hit, thats excitement! I love the NL game.
Click to expand...


Yeah no kiddin. A base hit with the pitcher up and a man on third?

How can that not pull at the heart strings of every red-blooded male who dreams of being able to step up to the plate just once?
 
rdwj said:
I didn't realize there weren't 1-0 pitchers duels in the AL. No squeeze bunting or moving runners over! Thanks for the lesson! What have I been watching all these years? LOL

Honestly, the NL is where good AL pitchers go when they can't compete anymore. It's been the inferior league for a LONG time now.
Click to expand...


My team is in the AL. I'm not debating the superiority of one league over the over... Just saying that the more traditional rules make for a better, more even-keeled game.
 
Baron von BeeGee said:
NL...play by the rules, dammit!
Click to expand...

Ya, let's play by the rules! Don't let the catcher stand behind the plate and make him catch the ball on a bounce! Players should be out if they are struck with a ball before reaching a base. Use stakes in the ground instead of bases! Get rid of those outfield walls!

Which rules do you want to play by? They've changed PLENTY over the years
 
rdwj said:
I didn't realize there weren't 1-0 pitchers duels in the AL. No squeeze bunting or moving runners over! Thanks for the lesson! What have I been watching all these years?
Click to expand...

Stop putting words in my mouth and stop being silly like a girl.

I never said it didn't happen in the American League. I just said it's the exciting part of baseball... and it occurs more often where you don't have a juiced-up, washed-up ringer who can't field a grounder stepping up to the plate every couple of innings to knock one out of the park. Don't get me wrong, I like Thome as much as the next guy, but if we eliminated the DH tomorrow, the game would not suffer...
 
rdwj said:
Ya, let's play by the rules! Don't let the catcher stand behind the plate and make him catch the ball on a bounce! Players should be out if they are struck with a ball before reaching a base. Use stakes in the ground instead of bases! Get rid of those outfield walls!

Which rules do you want to play by? They've changed PLENTY over the years
Click to expand...
Somebody needs a beer, best enjoyed with tongue planted firmly in cheek. :rolleyes:
 
Toot said:
I never said it didn't happen in the American League. I just said it's the exciting part of baseball... and it occurs more often where you don't have a juiced-up, washed-up ringer who can't field a grounder stepping up to the plate every couple of innings to knock one out of the park. Don't get me wrong, I like Thome as much as the next guy, but if we eliminated the DH tomorrow, the game would not suffer...
Click to expand...

It is an exciting part of baseball that exists in both leagues. You don't like the 'washed up ringers'; I don't like watching pitchers flail at the ball.

In all honesty, I kinda like that there are different rules in the leagues. It's a variety that doesn't exist in any other team sports.

As fas as putting words in your mouth, I did no such thing and I didn't start whining when you tried to imply that fans of the nl game are somehow brighter fans with this little gem

Toot said:
Of course, if someone has a short attention span, they can blink and miss the entire game in a 5 second span. If you are like that, then I guess I can understand.
Click to expand...

So, you want to throw barbs, expect some in return. No reason for silly name calling.
 
rdwj said:
As fas as putting words in your mouth, I did no such thing and I didn't start whining when you tried to imply that fans of the nl game are somehow brighter fans with this little gem
Click to expand...

I would NEVER suggest NL fans are smarter. Afterall, Cubs fans are NL fans!

However, imagine a retarded drooling idiot sipping on a supremely crafted IIPA. The fact that the retard is drooling and stupid and generally clueless does not change the quality of the beer. Similarly, the fact that Cubs fans are much like the retarded little boy does not alter the superiority of their brand of baseball...

I am most certainly not suggesting that the fans are more intelligent, merely that the style of baseball is more interesting, has something of a more human element to it that I find appealing.

:mug:
 
Looks like this thread is getting kind of deep.....honestly I didnt read all of it....

Just thought Id say AL!

My team is AL, and I just keep up with the al alot more. Watched a NL game last night...SD and LA and it just wasnt as good. The DH makes a better and more fair game and the NL should switch to that.

Go Tigers!
 
f'n internet...i just typed up a long response for you then hit the wrong button.....get back to you tomorrow....gotta get to bed.
 
rdwj said:
Honestly, the NL is where good AL pitchers go when they can't compete anymore.
Click to expand...

... and the AL is where NL hitters go when they're too broken down to play in the field anymore.

AL teams will score more runs, overall - but does that mean that they're better overall, or just that they're more freespending? The AL/NL superiority debate is also skewed by the fact that both the Yankees and the BoSox are in the AL and buying their way to victories.
 
the_bird said:
... and the AL is where NL hitters go when they're too broken down to play in the field anymore.

AL teams will score more runs, overall - but does that mean that they're better overall, or just that they're more freespending? The AL/NL superiority debate is also skewed by the fact that both the Yankees and the BoSox are in the AL and buying their way to victories.
Click to expand...

But hitters move to the AL to do what they still can do well. Pitchers move because they're no longer good enough at what they do to compete against stronger lineups.

I'm sure money has something to do with it, but it's not really just about the top teams. If you look at payrolls for this year, the NL has 6 of the 7 lowest. Now, money doesn't always equal success, but it's hard to stay competitive when you won't spend.
 
Interesting topic, as me too grew up with the Brewers as an AL team and now are an NL team. Having watched both leagues, I for some reason enjoy the NL more and I'm glad they made the switch. I can't really say why, maybe it's the developing rivalries or maybe because I think there is more strategy in the NL; double switches, having to plan for when your pitcher hits, etc. or maybe I just enjoy the game more now.

One thing that frightens me about the AL this year is if come June Baroid Bonds is traded and playing DH for someone like the Yankee's and breaks Hank Aaron's record. Baroid Bonds is a joke.

And dude I have to respectively disagree about Yost. I think he's a good coach. I know it's hard to believe.....but just wait til fall when they finally enter the postseason again!
 
rdwj said:
But hitters move to the AL to do what they still can do well. Pitchers move because they're no longer good enough at what they do to compete against stronger lineups.
Click to expand...

Hitters move to the AL because they are no longer good enough to play the game. Pitchers move because they are still good enough to play professional ball. At least pitchers in the NL can still pitch (to a degree). Designated Hitters in the AL can't do 50% of what makes a baseball player a baseball player. No way would a pitcher still be pitching if he lost 50% of his effectiveness. Basically, your argument is backwards. A pitcher who still is good enough to pitch in the NL is more of a baseball player than a Designated Hitter who can't even play in the field!

I'm sure money has something to do with it, but it's not really just about the top teams. If you look at payrolls for this year, the NL has 6 of the 7 lowest. Now, money doesn't always equal success, but it's hard to stay competitive when you won't spend.
Click to expand...

Very true. The AL has better teams. But that's an entirely different debate than that of which style of baseball is better. This is the second time you've brought up "AL is better" when discussing what set of rules is better. I don't see why that is relevant. It's like comparing the German form of Government to the North Korean form of government and declaring Germany's government is better because it is a nicer place to visit. Two different discussions there and one isn't relevant to the other. Anyway I just want to make sure you really understand what you are arguing about...
 
Toot said:
Hitters move to the AL because they are no longer good enough to play the game. Pitchers move because they are still good enough to play professional ball. At least pitchers in the NL can still pitch (to a degree). Designated Hitters in the AL can't do 50% of what makes a baseball player a baseball player. No way would a pitcher still be pitching if he lost 50% of his effectiveness. Basically, your argument is backwards. A pitcher who still is good enough to pitch in the NL is more of a baseball player than a Designated Hitter who can't even play in the field!
Click to expand...

The DH roll is to hit and they do it better than most position players. Most of them CAN play the field, just not brilliantly. With NL rules, plenty of these guys would still be playing the game as full time players because of their bats - which would make defenses worse. The guys that weren't full time players, would be part time players and they'd hit off the bench. They would still be very useful.

Pitchers that move to the NL ARE less effective. They're not good enough at their MAIN job to compete with the very best - that can't be debated. They're also mostly VERY poor hitters.

I want to see the best batters facing the best pitchers with the best possible defense behind them. That's AL ball.

If watching lesser pitchers facing fewer dangerous hitters with sometimes suspect defenses is what you want to see - by all means, watch the NL.


Toot said:
Very true. The AL has better teams. But that's an entirely different debate than that of which style of baseball is better. This is the second time you've brought up "AL is better" when discussing what set of rules is better. I don't see why that is relevant.
Click to expand...

Did you miss Bird's quote directly above that response? It's relevant to his comment about the AL being better because they're spending more money.
 
Toot said:
Originally Posted by Toot
Click to expand...
rdwj said:
Originally Posted by rdwj
Click to expand...

You two need to get a room...
lol_hitting.gif
 
Toot said:
Yeah no kiddin. A base hit with the pitcher up and a man on third?

How can that not pull at the heart strings of every red-blooded male who dreams of being able to step up to the plate just once?
Click to expand...

Like Brewers pitcher Dave Bush, who just hit a 2 out, 2 rbi double against the Reds :rockin:
 

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