Selling beer, the legal way?

Does anyone have a ballpark what it would cost to be able to legally sell brew? I'm in PA if you know for this state but I'd like to know in general.

I didn't know the answer but I did a quick Google search which took me to the PLCB website. There's some legalese here but no straight-up dollar amount. I would imagine that it's not an easy thing to do in this state, from what I understand our liquor laws are pretty strict.

http://www.lcb.state.pa.us/plcb/cwp/view.asp?a=1334&Q=546199#sect431

ryser2k said:

I didn't know the answer but I did a quick Google search which took me to the PLCB website. There's some legalese here but no straight-up dollar amount. I would imagine that it's not an easy thing to do in this state, from what I understand our liquor laws are pretty strict.

http://www.lcb.state.pa.us/plcb/cwp/view.asp?a=1334&Q=546199#sect431

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WOW, so are we suppose to understand that? I'm getting that it will cost about $600 if I need the import liscense which I don't know if I need or not. And I could not sell anything less than a case..

It would probably cost you $3-4,000 in Oregon. Some states, every batch has to be tested for ABV & volume. Others (Oregon included) the State has to approve each label. Unless you have a 4 barrel setup, it would be tough to break even.

david_42 said:

It would probably cost you $3-4,000 in Oregon. Some states, every batch has to be tested for ABV & volume. Others (Oregon included) the State has to approve each label. Unless you have a 4 barrel setup, it would be tough to break even.

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yeah that was what I'm trying to find out. Ideally I'd like to just be able to sell to my freinds and others to pay for equipment and stuff.

I emailed the lcb to find out some details, I can't make any sense from their website. Everything I found is geared towards very large business, although if the fees are like I think then I see why. Plus I'm not positive but we have a maximum number of licenses for each area and they can sell for many, many thousands of dollars.

Real easy way around that, have your friends buy the makings. They can "rent" the gear & pay you for storage & bottling. So long as you aren't selling the finished product, you don't get the state involved.

Out here, we call them "brew your own" shops.

For Sale: 1 Case of 22 ounce beer bottles - $20. Contents unknown

Response from LCB.


In order to have a license for a brew pub you must have a brewery. The Brewery License Application fee is &700.00 and the License fee is $1425.00 prorated quarterly, for a new license and to transfer an existing license the fee is $550.00 - $700.00 depending on the type of transfer. The Liquor Code states in part (you can read it in it's entirety on our website):

SECTION 446. BREWERIES. -
Holders of a brewery license may:

(1) Sell malt or brewed beverages produced and owned by the brewery on the licensed premises under such conditions and regulations as the board may enforce, to individuals for consumption on the premises and to hotel, restaurant, club and public service liquor licensees.

(2) Operate a restaurant or brewery pub on the licensed premises under such conditions and regulations as the board may enforce: Provided, however, That sales on Sunday may be made irrespective of the volume of food sales if the licensed premises are at a stadium or arena location. The holder of a brewery license may sell at its brewery pub premises Pennsylvania wines it has purchased from either the holder of a Pennsylvania limited winery license or from the board; provided, however, that said wines must be consumed at the licensed brewery pub premises.

The PLCB beat me to it. I was just writing this...

ryser2k is right about these f'd up liquor laws. I did a little research into this before, and it ain't easy. You would probably first need a license to manufacture. That's a filing fee of $700. plus $1425 for a brewery license. Plus the fees for your criminal background check and blue prints of the plant, property and apparatus.

Then there is the retail license. (which you would probably need for off-premises sales) From what I can tell, getting a new one requires an act of congress. Literally. Otherwise, you have to locate an exisiting one to purchase. I'm not sure exactly what retail licenses are going for, but I've seen bar/tavern licenses selling for up to $180k.

trinitone said:

The PLCB beat me to it. I was just writing this...

ryser2k is right about these f'd up liquor laws. I did a little research into this before, and it ain't easy. You would probably first need a license to manufacture. That's a filing fee of $700. plus $1425 for a brewery license. Plus the fees for your criminal background check and blue prints of the plant, property and apparatus.

Then there is the retail license. (which you would probably need for off-premises sales) From what I can tell, getting a new one requires an act of congress. Literally. Otherwise, you have to locate an exisiting one to purchase. I'm not sure exactly what retail licenses are going for, but I've seen bar/tavern licenses selling for up to $180k.

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Yeah I love this state.

No joke. I am fairly new to PA and I am having a hard time adjusting. I mean, having to go to 2 different places to get a six pack AND a case.

trinitone said:

No joke. I am fairly new to PA and I am having a hard time adjusting. I mean, having to go to 2 different places to get a six pack AND a case.

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If you drink wine it adds a whole other level of fun. Trust me this state sucks on many levels, If my family was not all here I would have moved by now.

Hey come on now, this state isn't so bad... you can just go to Delaware or Virginia for the booze

Anyway if you read through those liquor laws, you can see some interesting things. I noticed one section referencing a law from 1925, saying that all beer must be sold in quantities amounting to at least a case worth of bottles or more.

That law screws us in so many ways... six packs can only be purchased from bars at a hefty markup... beer cannot be sold by the bottle at all...

Also I thought the direct wine shipping policy was hilarious too. You can't order directly from places like wine.com, but if you find a wine that you can't buy from the PLCB, you can have wine.com ship to your local state store, where they will charge you an additional $4.50 handling fee, Pennsylvania's 18% liquor tax, 6% sales tax (and 1% sales tax in Philadelphia & Allegheny counties).

I'd love to see these laws change but I doubt they will in my lifetime... no politician is going to waste his time on stuff like this.

I was assuming the references to selling a case or more were to ensure that this was truly a wholesale distribution outlet, that you would need a different type of license to sell direct to the public.

Massachusetts FINALLY has a proposition on the ballot to allow the sale of wine in grocery stores. I still can't figure out our laws - because about one out of every four grocery stores DOES sell beer and wine (and a couple sell hard liquor as well). I've given up trying to understand our blue laws...

Also I thought the direct wine shipping policy was hilarious too. You can't order directly from places like wine.com, but if you find a wine that you can't buy from the PLCB, you can have wine.com ship to your local state store, where they will charge you an additional $4.50 handling fee, Pennsylvania's 18% liquor tax, 6% sales tax (and 1% sales tax in Philadelphia & Allegheny counties).

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And a PLCB employee will go over your order with you to make sure you received everything you were supposed to. (And nothing you weren't!)

I was assuming the references to selling a case or more were to ensure that this was truly a wholesale distribution outlet, that you would need a different type of license to sell direct to the public.

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No, here in PA, the public can buy at the wholesaler. We just have to buy at least 128 oz. IF we want less, we have to go to a Deli. WTF?