Easy Partial Mash Brewing (with pics)

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Used this method for my first partial mash last weekend and made what i'm told is a total newbie mistake. Instead of letting the grain bag slowly drain, I compressed the bag and forced out the wort. How big of a mistake was this? I had about 7.5lbs of grain and 3lbs of DME in the total recipe.
 
Also, I forgot to ask about speciialty grains vs base grains and time in mash. Do i blend all grains for the entire 60min? For some reason i did the 2-row for 60min, but added the crystal/oats at the mid point so that they were only mashing for 30min. hopefully these 2 mistakes didn't ruin a batch.
 
what's wrong with compressing the bag to force out the wort? I figure you just don't throw away as much wort that would be sucked up in the grains... I just drank a beer I did with this method and it seemed to turn out just fine... although it was a light blonde type beer that wasn't too complicated.
 
"I wouldn't recirculate the wort. Instead, to increase efficiency, I often use a small amount of the sparge water and pour it over the grains while they are sitting in my colander over the mash pot. This allows a bit of run-off before you dunk it in the sparge water. I've found it increases efficiency, especially in my all-grain bag batches."

What type of temperature do you recommend for this process?

Like many have said already, thanks for this great thread, made my jump to PM with this method and I'm not going back!
 
Hey DB, thank you for the advice.

I haven't been able to report back for a while because I did a couple of extract-only batches in the meantime. Now I have a good update.

I always get my grain from my LHBS, and they mill it for me there. The crush is very consistently the same. I examined it closely and compared it to photos I found here on HBT and elsewhere, of correctly and incorrectly milled grain. It looks right to me. A little bit of powder, but mostly chunks of grain and mostly-intact hulls. This squares with my assessment of the owner's knowledge and experience (he's won, run, and judged at many competitions over 25 years). I think the crush is right, but next time I might just buy elsewhere to see how it goes.

On my next partial-mash I tried pouring some of the sparge water over the grains in the colander, but found no difference in efficiency that way.

For my most recent PM I brought out the big guns and tried several things:
I added pH 5.2 to my mash water at dough-in.
I increased my boil volume to 5 gallons so I could use more water in the sparge.
I did a double batch sparge, with half of the water in one pot for 7mins and the other half in another pot for 7mins.
During the sparges I stirred the grains well and even picked up the bag briefly once or twice to ensure that the water was penetrating well and flowing through the grain.

47% that time.

I'm going to get a digital thermometer, just to check if my glass one is a source of error. I have heard of them being incorrectly calibrated before.

The only thing that comes to mind beyond that is a possible water issue. I have medium-hard water, so I would not expect to be low on Ca, but you never know. The water department folks in Philly are shining examples of helpful government employees, so I might have some water sent away for testing if I ever go all-grain.

In the meantime, this method gives me a great way to control the body/dryness balance of my brews. So what if I have to use a little more DME? At least it's consistent, so I always know how much I'm going to need. And I am making some damn fine ales! :fro:
 
Used this method for my first partial mash last weekend and made what i'm told is a total newbie mistake. Instead of letting the grain bag slowly drain, I compressed the bag and forced out the wort. How big of a mistake was this? I had about 7.5lbs of grain and 3lbs of DME in the total recipe.

what's wrong with compressing the bag to force out the wort? I figure you just don't throw away as much wort that would be sucked up in the grains... I just drank a beer I did with this method and it seemed to turn out just fine... although it was a light blonde type beer that wasn't too complicated.

This is up to debate. There is a line of thought that squeezing the bag will result in extraction of tannins, but I have yet to find a single instance of this being nailed down as a contributing factor of off-flavors.

I generally don't think it's necessary so I don't "risk" it. I usually just pour additional water over the grain to rinse it and then I'm done. You can only get so much out of it anyway.

Also, I forgot to ask about speciialty grains vs base grains and time in mash. Do i blend all grains for the entire 60min? For some reason i did the 2-row for 60min, but added the crystal/oats at the mid point so that they were only mashing for 30min. hopefully these 2 mistakes didn't ruin a batch.

There are options (such as cold-steeping) for leaving your specialty grains separate and mashing your base malts by themselves. Very rarely do I use these methods, however, and I will generally recommend just mixing it all together for your mash.

You should still get plenty of conversion for the oats at thirty minutes. You could possibly run the risk of not having the enzymes convert the oats, but only if the enzymes were denatured or you didn't have enough 2-row to begin with. Specialty grains, such as crystal and roasted grains, are not as much a concern, as they do not need to be mashed or converted and are mainly for color and flavor.

"I wouldn't recirculate the wort. Instead, to increase efficiency, I often use a small amount of the sparge water and pour it over the grains while they are sitting in my colander over the mash pot. This allows a bit of run-off before you dunk it in the sparge water. I've found it increases efficiency, especially in my all-grain bag batches."

What type of temperature do you recommend for this process?

Like many have said already, thanks for this great thread, made my jump to PM with this method and I'm not going back!

I heat my sparge water to about 170°F. That ensures that the mash temps never exceed 165°F. It's possible that I don't actually do a "mash-out", in that I don't denature the enzymes (starts at 162°F, a lot of people go to 168°F) but I find no reason for this to be a concern. Basically, I rinse the grains with hot water, I don't mash out. If the sparge ends up sitting at only 150°F, it doesn't concern me, it's still rinsing grains, and possibly finishing up a small amount of conversion.

In the meantime, this method gives me a great way to control the body/dryness balance of my brews. So what if I have to use a little more DME? At least it's consistent, so I always know how much I'm going to need. And I am making some damn fine ales! :fro:

And that's what it's all about. I'm currently using this method to attempt a 2 hour brew day and my efficiency is cut to about 50% because of the short mash and sparge times. It may cost a bit more, but the flavor is amazing...I'm not sacrificing quality.

Still sorry to hear about your efficiency problems. I generally get at least 60% with this method...let me know if you experience any changes.

I've been getting a lot of PMs and thank yous lately. I can't respond to everyone with my current busy schedule so just let me state that I really enjoy and appreciate the feedback and I'm glad this page is still providing a good step up to grain for beginning brewers. Keep up the questions!
:mug:
 
I found this thread...I started skimming through it to find if my question already got answered, but it is 60+ pages so here is my question.
What is the best way to figure out how much base malt in grain you need to convert the mash?
I understand that you need a certain amount of High diastatic grain in the partial bill...if I understand correctly, you can multiply the degrees lintner of each grain times the pounds of each grain then divide that by total pounds of grain (basically an average), and as long as it is over 35 you have enough power to convert?

Am I close?:confused:
 
Finally read all 90+ pages! Thanks Deathbrewer for the procedure and for keeping up with all the questions. Going to brew a brown this weekend using this method again (without compressing the grains).
 
I found this thread...I started skimming through it to find if my question already got answered, but it is 60+ pages so here is my question.
What is the best way to figure out how much base malt in grain you need to convert the mash?
I understand that you need a certain amount of High diastatic grain in the partial bill...if I understand correctly, you can multiply the degrees lintner of each grain times the pounds of each grain then divide that by total pounds of grain (basically an average), and as long as it is over 35 you have enough power to convert?

Am I close?:confused:

Yes, that should work fine. However, a lower diastatic power (close to 35) will still have MORE trouble converting and may take longer, so take that into consideration.

Remember that most malted wheat or rye have a higher diastatic power than barley, so don't be concerned if you are using those in your recipe.

Recently I mashed with 100% german wheat, which only has a diastatic power of 40 or so due to its lesser degree of modification. I got really low efficiency (which I planned on) but it goes to show that more diastatic power definitely helps.
 
Hey I just wanted to say what everyone else has said so far. I used this method for a Rye pale ale I made and it came out absolutely awesome. Thanks for the OP Deathbrewer.
 
Thanks for this thread. This is my second time using your method and I like it a lot -- at least until I can do all grain! But man is it helpful! Thanks once again!:mug:
 
Excellent thread. I'm looking to scale back and do some more experimenting so this will help greatly. How long are you able to get out of a bag?

Do you mean how many times can you reuse a linen bag? I just rinse mine out and then wash them in the washing machine. I have yet to wear one out. I have about 50-60 bags, so I guess I rotate the inventory well enough not to wear out the bag.
 
"I wouldn't recirculate the wort. Instead, to increase efficiency, I often use a small amount of the sparge water and pour it over the grains while they are sitting in my colander over the mash pot. This allows a bit of run-off before you dunk it in the sparge water. I've found it increases efficiency, especially in my all-grain bag batches."

I always recirculate the first two or three run off of my wort. It is called Vorlaufing.
 
I did this method for the first time on Saturday, there were a few hiccups. Mainly using too much water that didn't end up fitting all in my pot. Just added it as some wort boiled off. I didn't bother to read the entire 25 pages of this post so I just wanted to add one thing. If you are like me and are using two pots in a set one is 5gal and one is 4 gal you should mash in the 5 gallon and sparge in the 4 gallon. Then when you are sparging the inital wort from the mash can begin heating.

Even with overfilling my fermenter by about .25gallons I was able to overshoot the target OG of 1.068 by 1.074. Okay not a big deal, but I thought for sure the first go around my efficiency would be subpar. Wish I had jumped into PM prior to the summer to allow me to save some money on wheat extract.
 
DeathBrewer

I've brewed many AG beers using your stove top method. :mug:

Attempting my first German Alt and the instruction calls for:

60 min Sach rest @ 151 deg F
10 min Mash out @ 170 deg F

Is this just another way of saying:
60 min Mash @ 151 deg F
10 min Sparge @ 170 deg F ?

There was an alternative method with Sach A and Sach B which I didn't want to bother with.

Thanks in advance for your help.
 
DeathBrewer

I've brewed many AG beers using your stove top method. :mug:

Attempting my first German Alt and the instruction calls for:

60 min Sach rest @ 151 deg F
10 min Mash out @ 170 deg F

Is this just another way of saying:
60 min Mash @ 151 deg F
10 min Sparge @ 170 deg F ?

There was an alternative method with Sach A and Sach B which I didn't want to bother with.

Thanks in advance for your help.

60 mins at 151F/80C sounds like a good conversion "rest". In this case they are the same thing. Mashing is a process of several steps and the Sach rest is one of those steps.
I would be sure to stir the mash a few times to break up the proteins and to get the grains coated with hot liquor. Don't stir overly aggressive, just mix in and stir gently. 150-152F should give you a dryer tasting Alt.

I think that the recipe may be calling for a multi-step infusion technique where you can use two different infusions. I have only done this ONCE and decided it was too much trouble for me just to make beer.
I don't use minutes for my sparge. I usually sparge until the grain output is somewhat clear. Remember that if you have too much water (low SG), you can use reduction (boiling) to get the SG back to your target value.

John Palmer's web page goes into detail: http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/index.html

I would stick to single infusion and not worry too much. You do want to have the sach-rest to be consistent and not a lot of variation. Try to keep it within 1-2F.
 
For the steps posted by the OP how would you determine you have conversion? I have never done any grain brewing yet, and when I saw this thread I thought it would be a good step in that direction. I am just curious as to how you know you have conversion? I have watched a video that showed a iodine test to determine conversion, I was wondering if there was any other way. And the steps said to mash for 30-60 mins, does it really matter where you stop between 30-60 mins?
 
For the steps posted by the OP how would you determine you have conversion? I have never done any grain brewing yet, and when I saw this thread I thought it would be a good step in that direction. I am just curious as to how you know you have conversion? I have watched a video that showed a iodine test to determine conversion, I was wondering if there was any other way. And the steps said to mash for 30-60 mins, does it really matter where you stop between 30-60 mins?

The time that you have conversion rest does make quite a difference in how much the wort is converted into fermentables. As a rule of thumb, I usually mash no less than 50 minutes. I do think that it would depend on your malt type and quality. Pale 2-row malt as a base is pretty standard and is what I use 90% of the time. Sometimes I use Maris for English and Scottish and I also use some German Pils malts.

As a rule of thumb, I would just stick with the 50-60 minute range and try to keep that mash temperature to your optimum range. For a beginner, I would try to stay at 153F/67C because that temp is right in the middle and would produce a good beer for most styles.

Some basic to advanced mashing can be found at John Palmer's site http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/index.html

It is not the only site, but it is the site I used when I started brewing. I also think that most experienced home-brewers would tell you to RELAX about this and don't worry too much. Yes, you want to do your best, but beer is very forgiving and it takes quite an effort to screw it up.
 
Awesome Beerman, thanks for the great advice, that is exactly what I needed :) Going to get a recipe together and try my first run next weekend when my fermenter is free'd up.
 
My brewing buddy and I have used this as a base for our brewing process. Please make comments on our technique, we would like to know if it's a good one, or if we can improve it.

We have 2x 2gal pots and 2x 5gal kettles. We want to maintain a full boil and 5gal batches, so we do 2 half batches and combine in the primary. Our typical recipe is 5lbs 2-row + up to 3lbs specialty (8lbs max total grain), then suppliment with 2lbs 10oz DME (buy 3 lbs and use 6oz for 2L starter).

First step is getting the 2x 2gal pots (filled with 1.5gal water) to 165F, add grain bag + 4lbs grain (50% each item on grain bill), cover, and place in oven at 150F. We leave them both for 60min.

At 60min the first is removed, grain bag drains, place colander between pot and grain bag, dump ~0.5gal of 170F (from 5gal kettle) over grains, drain, then "sparge" by tea bagging with remaining water in 5gal kettle @ 170F (total water, prior to 0.5 gal dump over grains, is 2gal), finally combine and bring to boil and add hops accordingly (all @ 50% recipe and w/ DME @ 10min remaining).

When the 1st kettle breaks and the 60min clock starts, we remove the second 2gal pot and repeat, this gives us ~30min separation between the end of the 2 boils. We have an immersion wort chiller to get us to temp (70F) in ~20min.

We dump the second wort on top of the first, give a whirl, take an OG, pitch the 2L starter.

We live in small condo's in Chicago, so we don't have room for much equipment and don't have space to brew outside. This method allows us to have a "full boil" and mash @ 1.5qts/lb. Our calculations show each kettle starts at 3.06gal and ends at about 2.45gal, so our end batch is 4.9gal, the big starter takes us just over the 5gal mark.

Thought? Critique’s?
 
Thank you, Thank you, Thank you DeathBrewer. I ran across this post a couple of months ago after completing a few extract brews with my father in law. I tried to convince him to go partial, but couldn't get him to listen. I just completed my first batch on MY new equipment (a partial mash Widmer Drifter pale ale clone) and it could not have gone better thanks to your advice. FIL came over & was impressed by how simple & efficient the process was...Don't be scared noobs, it is fun & easy!!! I actually ended up about 18 points over my estimated SG...guess that efficiency is pretty damn good!!! These forums have kept me from committing so many noob mistakes, not to mention kept me from posting many noob concerns. I have always been able to find the answers I needed right here. This batch was my first partial mash, first liquid yeast, first yeast starter, and first solo run, and all went great once I got all my sh*t together! Thanks again & I'll keep y'all posted on the results of this fine brew day.
 
I did my first PM today (spotted cow clone/pepper beer base) and it went pretty good, and a lot easier than I thought it would be. In fact, it's just as easy as a straight extract batch. I did have a little trouble with my mash temp, so I hope I didn't screw it up too bad there, but I was 4 points over than my target OG so it must be okay. I tasted the wort and it was nice and sweet, had a great golden color. I'm excited for this beer.

I didn't read the whole thread though, so it probably has been discussed, but can I do full boils? Basically after mashing/sparging on the stove, put the wort and fill to pre-boil level in the turkey fryer and move it outside to do the boil?

I'm gonna be doing PMs consistently from now on. Also, I haven't checked yet, does Beersmith convert extract + steeping grains to partial mash?
 
Sure you can do a full boil. If you are, you may wish to check out my all-grain mashing, in my sig, go full grain with your current setup. (as long as you have a big enough pot)
 
im gearing up to brew my first partial as soon as the kit arrives from AHB (chocolate orange holiday ale) - this is very very helpful - thank you
 
I used this method today for a Winter Welcome clone and hit 75% efficiency - right on my 1.071 OG that Beer Smith estimated. Thanks for the info!
 
I used this technique last night for my first partial mash batch. It was a 2-gallon batch, and I think I've come to the conclusion that this might be too much labor for a case of beer. All the more excuse to move up to 5-gallon batches! :)

I did discover that it's pretty difficult to maintain a consistent temperature with a small partial mash for a small batch -- keeping 2 quarts of water at 152 proved pretty impossible. However, I still ended up with 67% efficiency, which is what I had estimated going in, so I'm pretty excited about that! I'm hoping that larger batches will lend themselves to more consistent temperatures and greater efficiencies.

Either way, I wanted to say thanks for posting this! It gave me the courage to try a partial mash without having to invest in new equipment.
 
Step 10:
Ferment...i split this 5 gallon batch into two 3 gallon fermenters and topped off with tap water. You may not be able to use your tap water to top off...you can either boil and cool some h20 or use bottled water if you'd like. I also used two different yeasts (notty and windsor) and eventually blended them back together into one keg.

13split.jpg


As for target gravity, i usually shoot for the middle of the style at 65% efficiency. i've experienced as low as 60%, but it's usually in the 65-70 range. as this is meant to be an enjoyable brew day, i don't take a sample until the beer is finished, poured and topped off.

EDIT: Since using the 10 minute sparge, my efficiency has been at a steady 70% efficiency for the last 4 batches.

I hope this helps inspire some people to make the jump to partial mashing from extract! all you really need is the bag in addition to some regular equipment to see how easy it is. once i started doing this, there was no turning back. i regularly make partial mash and all-grain batches nearly 3 times a week now.

let me know if you have any questions on this process or if you need any easy partial mash recipes. some of my favorites are hefeweizens, dunkelweizens and cream ales, as well as the irish rye stout in my drop down.

Take care and keep brewing!
:mug:

what do you mean by efficiency? and how do u check it?
 
nevermind i see it's talking about how much sugar u got out of the grain during mashing by using beersmith
 
DB and/or others,

I've read that brewing with pumpkin requires (or at least is recommended) a partial mash to convert any starches present in the pumpkin. After reading your descriptions, I'm much more confident in trying my first partial mash.

I'm wondering if anyone has a good recipe and if this method would still work considering the addition of the pumpkin. Note: I'm thinking about using a fresh cooking pumpkin, roasted in the oven and cubed. Would I add the cooked pumpkin cubes into the mash with the grains? I would prefer to avoid using canned pumpkin to eliminate the large amounts of trub I've read about with this type of beer.

Thanks for helping a noob
 
The enzymes are in the malt, so if you mash the pumpkin with the malt, and if the enzymes can get to the starches, then they will convert it.

It is not necessary, as far as I know, to actually convert the starches, since you are going for a pumpkin flavor rather than using it as a primary sugar source, am I correct? So, if you are not counting on it to up your ABV%, then don't sweat the mash.

Good luck to ya!! :D
 
Hey DB, a few questions for you:

- How long does it take you to do this Partial Mash?

- How long did you usually do the boil with the hops?


I just have to calculate a grain bill for a pale ale.
 
Forgot one, so one more:

- I use a cooler with water and frozen water bottles. During the first day or so of fermentation, I find it hard to keep the water at a steady temp. Not being home due to work, I think it might fluctuate a bit. I brewed a wheat all extract about 3 weeks ago and I think it did this, but it's been at about 68/69 degrees for the last 16 days. Is that alright as you mentioned in a post a few years ago? Or is the temp control which I don't think I can do, an absolute must to be steady?
 
As steady as possible, but just keeping it low is most important. I'm sure your wheat is fine.

Partial mash brew time: about 3-3.5 hours, or more if i'm being lazy and taking my sweet time in regards to cleaning and setup.

I generally do a 60 minute boil.
 
As for pumpkin, the ONLY way to use pumpkin is in the mash. If you dump it in the boil or something, you won't get anything from it. Using it in the mash doesn't necessarily make it taste like pumpkin (that's more the spices you use) but if you want to use pumpkin, in the mash is the way to go. Use some 6-row or a bunch of 2-row to convert it. Go for a mild or light brown ale recipe.
 
Thanks DB.

I usually do 5 gallon batches and have a 7 gallon kettle. If I bought say a 5 gallon kettle, would you mash in the 5 g and boil in the 7?

Sorry if this is a lot of questions, I just want to do this right:
I was looking at your water ratios, so if I did 6 lbs of grain in (I think what you said) is 2 or so gallons. How much would you use to sparge? Then pour the strike water from the partial mash into the sparge water? How many gallons would that probably be after boil? I'm used to cooling 2 gallons in the fridge to chill down the wort after boil.
 
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