Effects of High PH

I'm TRYING to explain to a All Grain Brewer that he needs to get his PH below the current 7.7 and TRYING to get him to at least use filtered water.

Water that comes into the house is already softened and has chlorine and he does not filter it (as I do). He says he boils all the bad taste out!! ?? does he??

I can't think of the correct words that describe the flavors all of his beer have. It's messy, not clean, has a blandness to them . . . . .HELP!!!

How do I get this across to him!

If it's just Chlorine, then he could very well be boiling the bad stuff out, as he calls it. That is to say that Chlorine is fairly volatile and boiling can get rid of it. However, Chloramine is supposed to be much less volatile, and boiling is not effective. So it's important for him to know for sure which his water department is using.

Also, when you say his pH is 7.7, that's the pH of the water, not the mash. When he adds the grains, his pH will drop. How much depends on the acid content of the malts.

His flavor problem may just be a simple imbalance of flavor minerals. It's REALLY hard to tell without a water profile and recipes...

What type of filter are you recommending he use? Just using a charcoal filter will do little for his mash pH, if that is indeed his issue.

I know the filter will not adjust the PH. I'm getting a water report from Ward Labs later this week. The filter was just for getting fid of the bad taste . Interesting about Chlorine and Chloramine. I'll have to check up on that one.

Found out - the water Comp adds Silicates, Fluoride and Chlorine Azone ETA REGNO 7870-5 (whatever that is)

If he's pre-boiling the water then he can boil the chlorine out. However, if you use chlorinated water in your mash it's too late to take care of the chlorine during the normal boiling process - by that point the chlorine has already bonded and will create chlorophenolics (band aid, medicinal, plastic) flavors and aromas that will not come out no matter how long you boil the wort.

Charcoal filters work great, in our house we have a whole house filter and a second filter hooked up to the "brewing water only" spout. As an alternative to a filter you can crush 1 campden tablet per 5 gallons of water used an add that to your strike water and sparge water. The campden will also eliminate the chlorine and is even pretty effective against chloramine.

For the PH problem, the primary hazard of too high a PH is extraction of tannins (husky, grainy, astringent flavor) but it can also have an effect on yeast health and over all fermentation. 5.2 stabilizer works great to address PH concerns.

Tell him to try reading this - it doesn't have to be complicated:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f128/brewing-water-chemistry-primer-198460/

WOW - someone not ANTI 5.2 stabilizer. Seems that is the anti-chemical these days. I love it.

I believe it's the chlorophenolics I'm tasting. thanks!

If it is the chloramines that's causing a problem, 1 campden tablet is generally good for 20 gallons of water. Crush and add it pre-mash, and give it a few seconds to work its magic. That's all it takes.