Troeg's Mad Elf

Yakima 728
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I brewed a batch inspired (basically copied) from Oldsock's recipe about a month ago. I couldn't get my hands on fresh sweet cherries to go with my sour cherries, so I subbed in some fresh sweet plums. This was my first batch at such a high gravity using BIAB and didn't hit my target gravity of 1.101.

OG 1.089
Mashed @ 66C/150F for 60 min.

79% Pilsner
12% Weyerman Munich I
8% Honey (at flame out)
1% Chocolate Malt

Saaz (CZ) 8.6 IBU @ 90 min.
Saaz (CZ) 5.0 IBU @ 30 min.
Irish moss @ 15 min.
Saaz (CZ) 1.8 IBU @ 10 min.

50g/L (~6oz/gal) Sour cherries and sweet plums in secondary
WY1214/WLP500 recultured from a Chimay bottle fermented about 20C/68F

Primary was for 13 days, then racked onto the fruit and left it for 11 days. After that I racked to a tertiary to clean up. The color is great, but the alcohol is pretty hot. There is quite a bit of banana from the yeast and I'm a little worried that I left it on the fruit too long and got some tannins. I'll report back in about a month or so when I bottle it and can take another sample.
 
i was going to just use canned cherries so i didnt have to try and find fresh ones. how did you prep your cherries and plums?
i figured it would be hot right out of the primary...have to let it mellow a bit.
 
No problem! Good luck! I will be giving one of these a crack myself very soon. Just another piece of info: https://www.troegs.com/our_brews/mad_elf_ale.aspx

Troegs commonly uses chocolate malt for the color and complexity in their beers so you should make sure you add it to the recipe above. I will post a recipe when I make one that tastes right (which I wont know until December or so). On a tour on Troegs I did in July they were already fermenting Mad Elf so this is a beer that should take months to be ready (probably mostly for conditioning time to let that ABV settle in).
 
yes i figured i wouldnt be able to have it for this season, but i want to perfect it before i move back to PA so that way i dont have to pay out the $ for it when i live there.
 
Good call. Every year I find myself buying at least a case of the stuff and drinking it at multiple bars. A great beer like this is worth it but as a homebrewer I am hesitant to spend $30/case let alone $60-$100!!!
 
seckett, I just pitted and froze the fruit overnight. I forgot to mention that I've never tried the original brew, but it sounds tasty!
 
oelfool said:
seckett, I just pitted and froze the fruit overnight. I forgot to mention that I've never tried the original brew, but it sounds tasty!
Click to expand...

thanks for the info. might be a dumb question but how did you know it was sanitary? i have never used fruit in a beer before except for fruit extract so i dont count that. how do you ensure you arent putting in some nasties that are on fruit into the beer?
the original is pretty damn good, but super expensive!
 
Usually when I make my raspberry ale, I thaw the frozen berries and then heat to just below boing for a few minutes with a little water if necessary. But, for this batch I was in a rush and used the excuse that it had enough alcohol that it would be fine. I've never seen anything definitive that you should boil the fruit, pasturize the fruit or just chuck it in. Might not be a bad idea to heat the cherries up and pasturize them. This is an expensive brew and long wait to risk it. Heating may also add more pectin and create haze, but that's not something I worry about too much yet. Looking forward to trying this one again next year with just cherries and the Westmalle yeast. Thanks WissaBrewGuy for the link.
 
The sanitary fruit thing is somewhat of a debate but in general if you are adding them to a secondary fermentation there is very little that is going to infect your beer. The alcohol will kill most things even at a low ABV. There are a ton of threads on here about secondary additions concerns and most of the time the general consensus is "don't worry."
 
ok then thanks for the info. Since it is easier and seems to sound safe enough i guess i will just put them in there. im not worried about getting something from the fruit...just was worried about it ruining the beer.
 
Well I can't guarantee the fruit will taste good but there is only one way to know! I would just wash the fruit prior to adding it with warm water to get any dust or pesticides off of them.
 
Well it seems i am going to be making this sooner rather than later. We are having a beer off for the holidays at work. There are a few of us that brew and a lot of people that like to drink beer. so the rules are holiday beer and it has to be AG. even though i havent made this before if i t comes out close to the real deal then it will be amazing. i just hope that 7-8 weeks is enough for this beer to be drinkable...
 
Sounds great! 7-8 weeks should be ok maybe a little rushed if you are bottle conditioning. Just take your time with your primary fermentation and make a HUGE yeast starter so the yeast get a good healthy fermentation.
 
i am going to keg it so it should be just enough time. I have everything now so i can brew it tomm night as soon as i get off work. do you think i need a starter even if i use a Wyeast 3787 smack pack? i figured that using the high gravity yeast with the smack pack would be sufficient.
 
seckert said:
i am going to keg it so it should be just enough time. I have everything now so i can brew it tomm night as soon as i get off work. do you think i need a starter even if i use a Wyeast 3787 smack pack? i figured that using the high gravity yeast with the smack pack would be sufficient.
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If you can, I would suggest it. 3787 is obviously tolerant to higher ABV but it is always good to make a starter. I have not used this yeast before but I am pretty sure the high alcohol yeast are just able to survive in higher alcohol concentration; that doesn't mean they will not produce unwanted esters if under pitched. If you are brewing tonight then it is probably too late unless you make it now and use a stir plate. Mr. Malty suggests a 2 1/3 L starter for this OG (1.095) regardless of yeast.

That being said, you could always just use 2 or 3 packs to properly pitch (Mr. Malty suggests 3.5...)
 
WissaBrewGuy said:
If you can, I would suggest it. 3787 is obviously tolerant to higher ABV but it is always good to make a starter. I have not used this yeast before but I am pretty sure the high alcohol yeast are just able to survive in higher alcohol concentration; that doesn't mean they will not produce unwanted esters if under pitched. If you are brewing tonight then it is probably too late unless you make it now and use a stir plate. Mr. Malty suggests a 2 1/3 L starter for this OG (1.095) regardless of yeast.

That being said, you could always just use 2 or 3 packs to properly pitch (Mr. Malty suggests 3.5...)
Click to expand...

see and now i am not sure what to do. I am planning on brewing this today, but i am unable to get my hands on anymore 3787 as my LHBS is out and i would have to drive 1.5 hours or so to get another one. maybe i will brew today, make a starter before i start brewing and when it is going well pitch it. so sometime late tomm i will pitch...seems to be the best case scenario since i wont have time except for today to brew...
 
seckert said:
see and now i am not sure what to do. I am planning on brewing this today, but i am unable to get my hands on anymore 3787 as my LHBS is out and i would have to drive 1.5 hours or so to get another one. maybe i will brew today, make a starter before i start brewing and when it is going well pitch it. so sometime late tomm i will pitch...seems to be the best case scenario since i wont have time except for today to brew...
Click to expand...

I don't know, you might get away with it you have a stir plate, big starter and it gets to high krausen at pitching time.

But in all likely hood, I would worry about under pitching with your proposed schedule. If it were me I would postpone brewing rather than risk the whole batch.
 
seckert said:
see and now i am not sure what to do. I am planning on brewing this today, but i am unable to get my hands on anymore 3787 as my LHBS is out and i would have to drive 1.5 hours or so to get another one. maybe i will brew today, make a starter before i start brewing and when it is going well pitch it. so sometime late tomm i will pitch...seems to be the best case scenario since i wont have time except for today to brew...
Click to expand...

I am honestly torn on this one. While I can see wobrien's point, If I were in your shoes I would probably brew today and pitch tomorrow like you have said. Since it is the first time you are brewing this it may be better just to do it but under pitching may give you a wrong impression as to the taste of the beer. As you can see I am wavering in my opinion as I type... Ah hell, just go for it! :fro:
 
yes i am torn as well...this beer has to be ready on dec 12th and not a day later...so i am on a severe time crunch. if i dont get this going today then it will have to wait another week and not be ready by the 12th since it needs so much conditioning time. i am going to just make the starter today and pitch as soon as i can...
 
seckert said:
yes i am torn as well...this beer has to be ready on dec 12th and not a day later...so i am on a severe time crunch. if i dont get this going today then it will have to wait another week and not be ready by the 12th since it needs so much conditioning time. i am going to just make the starter today and pitch as soon as i can...
Click to expand...

Go for it, then make it again soon with a nice starter and compare the two. That is usually my strategy with these dilemmas.
 
You know what, my reading comprehension must be off this morning. I thought you were planning on pitching at the end of your brew day. If you are going to pitch tomorrow, that should give you enough time. But pitch at high krausen and throw in the whole starter, you won't have time to properly cold crash and decant.

Also, be especially anal about your sanitation if you are going to let your wort sit overnight.

Good luck!
 
well I decided to play it safe and re arranged tomorrow so I can brew...SHMBO isn't super happy, but she knows brewing is important to me so she isn't too bad off...waiting for the smack pack to blow up so I can get the starter going.
 
Just finished up my brew day of Mad Elf. I think everything went really well. Can't wait to drink it.
 
Madsciontst said:
Just finished up my brew day of Mad Elf. I think everything went really well. Can't wait to drink it.
Click to expand...

I brewed this yesterday as well...I didn't quite get the 1.1 OG though that the recipe says. I was at 1.095 still going to be a pretty powerful brew though! Which yeast did you use? starter or no?
 
Madsciontst said:
I used wl530 but i didn't use a starter. I hope it works.
Click to expand...

I used the Wyeast 3787 and made a starter...it is going full steam ahead now! probably more activity than I have ever heard before...:D

let me know how yours turns out since you used a different yeast with no starter. if it works then it would save some time.
 
seckert said:
I used the Wyeast 3787 and made a starter...it is going full steam ahead now! probably more activity than I have ever heard before...:D

let me know how yours turns out since you used a different yeast with no starter. if it works then it would save some time.
Click to expand...

Great! I knew that yeast starter would rip through that wort!

I'm sure both of your brews will be great!
 
WissaBrewGuy said:
Great! I knew that yeast starter would rip through that wort!

I'm sure both of your brews will be great!
Click to expand...

Rip through is an understatement! i put on a blow off tube yesterday just in case...this morning the jar i had the tube going into was over flowing with krausen! good thing i had it all on a towel...so i cleaned it all up and put blow off tube back on...wondering what it will look like when i get home today.
i think if i had to do it again i wouldnt have made a starter since it fermenting almost too vigorously for comfort...lol
 
The first 24 hours not much activity but after that it took off. The fermentation is crazy.
 
Madsciontst said:
The first 24 hours not much activity but after that it took off. The fermentation is crazy.
Click to expand...

maybe the difference was the starter? i pitched mine Sat evening and Sunday morning it was already going crazy and got worse and worse during the day...by Monday morning is when i had a mess...now this morning there is still activity, but it is slowing down. so this evening i will take off blow tube and put airlock on...
 
Mine is still crazy. The airlock blew off the carboy.I have to get a blowoff tube.
 
Has anyone brewed this with a clean yeast strain? I know this beer is built on that spice and I really enjoy it, but sometime the spicy yeast gets to me.
 

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