Hobbit Brew?

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No, you are still a geek.

(just kidding)

OK, a brown ale using oak chips is good, herbs might be open to what would taste best. Hobbiton wasn't london, even if it was based on it, Tolkien didn't put humans in hobbiton so he must have wanted some subtle differences eh? And I don't want to brew something gross.
 
cheezydemon said:
No, you are still a geek.

(just kidding)

OK, a brown ale using oak chips is good, herbs might be open to what would taste best. Hobbiton wasn't london, even if it was based on it, Tolkien didn't put humans in hobbiton so he must have wanted some subtle differences eh? And I don't want to brew something gross.

i guess a good idea now would be to see if they talk about food recipes in the text, and what spices/herbs they may have used. I suspect some rosemary possibly found its way into their taters! ;)

I will probably still put a small amount of fuggles or east kent in mine, i like to believe the hobbits had some hops around and ol gaffer probably had a few vines in his garden. I need to dig my copies out from the moving boxes that are STILL unpacked!
 
Perhaps his works need a rereading with this perspective in mind (oh boy this is going to be a long project!)

Scan for mention of herbs and brews. Of course, Tolkien often used old names or invented his own for things. Could be alot of research for somebody!

As to oak chips, why not. Probably would be sour as well. A mild historically refered to a fresh beer that had not yet gotten sour with age. Supposedlyt they were up to 8% abv so they weren't milds in the sense of todays terms.

I still think investing gruit ales is the way to go. Beers like browns and milds in todays terms were not really named as such from what I understand. I don't think you can start with a modern style to do this.

Then again, it is all about a fantasy world in the end... :fro:
 
blacklab said:

I am missing something here. What, his hair is BROWN? Oh, is he the obese wow player? Gotcha.

We need an herb that would make it bitter, or we could pretend that they had hops. I personally don't want a psychoactive beer, that just sounds dangerous and probably illegal.

The dwarves preferred stout. Interesting.
 
Interesting thread! This is just the sort of nerdiness that I can get into. Incidentally, I know that both C.S. Lewis and Tolkien were down for some ale. I did my philosophy degree under a professor who did his degree (Lit/Phil) under Lewis. I forget the name of their little group, but they were famous for taking long hikes that always ended at an old fashioned type pub where they loved traditional ales. You can totally see how that comes through in LOTR. I'm inspired. Next to some Middle Earth brews. Is it just me, or does it look like Saruman must have had all those orcs brewing some nasty BMC all industrial-style under his tower?
 
I seem to remember much more drinking going on in the hobbit like when they were floating down the river on the kegs as well as the party in the beginning
 
Monk said:
Interesting thread! This is just the sort of nerdiness that I can get into. Incidentally, I know that both C.S. Lewis and Tolkien were down for some ale. I did my philosophy degree under a professor who did his degree (Lit/Phil) under Lewis. I forget the name of their little group, but they were famous for taking long hikes that always ended at an old fashioned type pub where they loved traditional ales. You can totally see how that comes through in LOTR. I'm inspired. Next to some Middle Earth brews. Is it just me, or does it look like Saruman must have had all those orcs brewing some nasty BMC all industrial-style under his tower?

Lol
SARUMAN: "Oh my dark minions! Have you stolen the rice and the tiny bit of grain for our brew! And you there! Yes you! did you steal the 2 ounces of hops to put in our 8 million gallon brew kettle?"

I am with you Joser, I think that the clues may be in The Hobbit, not the LOTR. I hope to take a look tinight.
 
JoSeR said:
Not sure, anyone have a copy of the hobbit handy?
Pretty sure some were ale casks. Some were definitely apple barrels, but some were wine or beer.

What about at the meeting in the beginning? Any clues about the ale or where he stored it? We are probably talking about flat beer, no?
 
cheezydemon said:
I am missing something here. What, his hair is BROWN? Oh, is he the obese wow player? Gotcha.

We need an herb that would make it bitter, or we could pretend that they had hops. I personally don't want a psychoactive beer, that just sounds dangerous and probably illegal.

The dwarves preferred stout. Interesting.

Well, the herbs traditionally brewed with were bittering agents. They were not all psychotropic and some such as yarrow are typical garden flowers. Supposedly myrica gale is available from some HBS. Wild marsh rosemary is another story. It is NOT related to the culinary rosemary herb btw.

Here are the first few links I pulled up for gruit.

http://www.gruitale.com/

http://www.fortunecity.com/boozers/brewerytap/555/gruit.htm

Oh and heather ale was also apparently huge in the british isles (especiall northern parts) prior to hops. i believe there are even some commercial breweries making it today (sans hops)
 
I am a complete nerd (hence I spend my time on a computer message board devoted to homebrewing) and I know a bit about the Lord of the Rings. If I had to make a guess I would tell you that at least in Hobbiton, and probably in Bree as well, they would be drinking what we would consider English Ale. This is because Hobbiton was Tolkein's idealized vision of pre-war of England.

As for drinking ale in the other cultures of Middle Earth, I couldn't say other than that all of Middle Earth is meant to be similar to Northern Europe. Perhaps there were other ale styles and Lagers but I would still be willing to bet English Style Ale dominants.

The books were originally intended as a Saxon myth as England does not actually have any myths of her own (the King Arthur story being written by the French) so I would assume all the ale was English in Tolkein's mind (the pubs and drinking scenes described in the book would seem to support this).

So there is my super geeky answer to the question. I return now to my lvl 50 Hunter in Kalimdor ;)
 
cheezydemon said:
Pretty sure some were ale casks. Some were definitely apple barrels, but some were wine or beer.

What about at the meeting in the beginning? Any clues about the ale or where he stored it? We are probably talking about flat beer, no?
I would say a flat or nearly flat for sure, I understand it was almost impossible to get the fed-ex guy to deliver kegging supplies to middle earth
They all got loaded at the meeting in the beginning and I think there is a reference to what they were drinking?
 
JoSeR said:
I would say a flat or nearly flat for sure, I understand it was almost impossible to get the fed-ex guy to deliver kegging supplies to middle earth
They all got loaded at the meeting in the beginning and I think there is a reference to what they were drinking?

I just remembered! I read an article a few weeks ago that said that brown malt and brown ales don't have the traditional flavor because the grains are traditionally kilned over a wood burning fire and have a smoky flavor!
 
cheezydemon said:
Pretty sure some were ale casks. Some were definitely apple barrels, but some were wine or beer.

What about at the meeting in the beginning? Any clues about the ale or where he stored it? We are probably talking about flat beer, no?

Probably cask conditioned, so not flat, but close to flat. Put into the cask to age and probably drop another point or two gravity wise and get a natural carbonation. Probably served at cellar temps too.
 
Indeed. And I am thinking pale 2 row malt, fire kilned to a mild brown(no way to homogonize this, but it will be interesting if several of us do this)

Cask carbed eh? Wow, that is scary lol. This may be taking shape.
 
pale 2 row malt fire kilned to a "brown" (I am thinking maybe on the grill with a screen)
some light english style hopping
an interesting herb if anyone can come up with one
oak chips
lightly carbed
cool but not cold
med-high gravity
 
I think the reason the ale is called "Gaffer's ale" is because Gaffer Gamgee (Sam's father) shares a cup of ale at the Green Dragon with Frodo, Sam and Ted Sandyman.
 
Was that just made up for the movie? I don't remember the Gaffer actually making an appearance in the books(except through Sam's comments)
 
I just checked northernbrewer and you can get heather tips, myrica gale(sweet gale) elderberries, juniper berries, mugwort, and wormwood. All traditional herbs. However the general concensus seems to be against this route.

Perhaps there could be several recipes and a brew exchange in the end?
 
knights of Gambrinus said:
I just checked northernbrewer and you can get heather tips, myrica gale(sweet gale) elderberries, juniper berries, mugwort, and wormwood. All traditional herbs. However the general concensus seems to be against this route.

Perhaps there could be several recipes and a brew exchange in the end?

I am all for heather tips, as for the rest......naaaaaah.

Maybe we could all devise a slight variation on the ingredients

I call Heather tips!
 
cheezydemon said:
A little smoke, not like smoking the grains in a smoker, but... fire toasted I guess.

Back in those days after malting was done by specialists, but before pale and Pilsner malt were all the rage, brown malt was typically toasted in two-story kiln buildings. Wood, straw, or coke could be the fuel, depending on regional availability. Coke was the most preferred, since it burned most cleanly. Straw also burned fairly cleanly, so it was preferred over wood. A lot of the problems from wood came from maltsters that did not properly manage the fire or that used unseasoned woods to cut costs. However, there are records of pleasant wood notes.

If you are going to toast your own brown malt, keep in mind that the malt was held far above the fire, and not always directly over it at close range. The brown color and toasty character was more the product of oven toasting, rather than broiling.

If you really wanted to approximate an old, brown malt porter, you might do better to use brown malt and a small percentage of rauchmalt (maybe 5-10% of the grain bill).


TL
 
TheJadedDog said:
I couldn't say other than that all of Middle Earth is meant to be similar to Northern Europe.


Actually, it's supposed to BE Northern Europe, just a long long time ago. Tolkien states this in his letters. His whole work is supposed to be a lost history of our world, rediscovered.
 
knights of Gambrinus said:
I just checked northernbrewer and you can get heather tips, myrica gale(sweet gale) elderberries, juniper berries, mugwort, and wormwood. All traditional herbs. However the general concensus seems to be against this route.

Perhaps there could be several recipes and a brew exchange in the end?

Hmm.. I think a combination would be good, but probably not a kitchen sink. A little more study on the Old Gaffer would help us narrow down what his tastes might have been. I'm still not opposed to using a little hops in this brew ;) here's a good start: http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Hamfast_Gamgee

You'll notice in the above article that he knows about root vegetables, maybe he through a little sweet potatoe in his ale (I'd like to avoid that though) buutttt.. isn't ginger a root? And aren't hop rhizome's roots?
 
It's scary, but I was starting to think the same thing myself. After all, different races, living in different areas with access to different ingredients must have resulted in a whole variety of regional brews. In regards to O'Flannagain, I was thinking that using ginger might be the way to go. Would you still use some hops for bittering, or would that do the trick on it's own? How about for aroma?

I forget who mentioned it, but someone also suggested a beer with a pretty substantial OG-not too bad of an idea. Those hobbits were some pretty chipper fellows. So are we going to get a variety of Middle-Earth brews going here?
 
beenjammin said:
dare i suggest a seperate brew for hobbits, humans, dwarves, elves, and even goblins and orcs?

I can't imagine orc brew would be anything short of vile
 
When I get home I'll start scouring my Tolkien library for any more clues as to herbs used or beer styles.
 
Off the top of my head I can remember that Bilbo got ale for one of the dwarves from a cellar in the beginning of The Hobbit.

In Fellowship they were forced to make a detour from the Green Dragon, and I don't think we get to see anything about the beer there, except for the previously mentioned song. I'll take a look through my books to see what else I can find.

Grabbed my books. Maybe I'm remembering the part about the Green Dragon wrong.
On page 82 in the chapter Short Cut To Mushrooms of FotR, Pippin mentions an in called the Golden Perch having the best beer in Eastfarthing, but no mention as to any specifics.
 
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