Irish Stout Guinness Draught Clone

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Drumming,

The problem that I see right off the bat is you have flaked barley in that recipe with no 2nd row, or 6th row, to convert the starches to sugar. Your so close to AG in the recipe as it stands its kind of funny. You might add Dextrine to the recipe instead of the flaked barley that will give you the head your looking for but that stuff is expensive.

I guess to help fix this where I think it will be a little more correct. I just need to ask a few questions:
1. Are you wanting to make Guiness Draught (curvey bottle), or Guiness Extra Stout?
2. What is the limiting factor keeping you from going to all grain? Is it the size of your boil kettle?? What size do you have?
3. Are you in the kitchen with this on the stove?
4. How much time are you wanting to spend on this brew, during brew day?


That should get us off and running.
 
All I did was input his recipe and hit convert in Beersmith. Either would be fine.
I don;t do AG because I Only have the 1 kettle (converted keggle) and Don't want to do BIB because i'm not sure I can keep my temps right with my fryer burner.

Time is not really an issue. Going to go up to AG when I get all my kegs done and burners purchased just would like a nice guiness stout on tap for this summer.
 
Quick question. I planned on brewing this on saturday, but i forgot to sour some Guinness. Is it to late? Am I better off brewing this the following weekend? Not sure if guinness will sour from wed night - sat am
 
Quick question. I planned on brewing this on saturday, but i forgot to sour some Guinness. Is it to late? Am I better off brewing this the following weekend? Not sure if guinness will sour from wed night - sat am

You should be fine. Go with 2 bottles (24 oz) and dont freeze just add the soured beer into the last 10 min of the boil.
 
Well thats good news. That means you have alot of room in your kettle. Just to make this simple I would add some 6 row (which has some more enzymes) or simply cut your pale malt extract in half. If your using canned extract and add either 2nd row or 6 row malt to your steep. Then do your steep and when you think your done do an Iodine test and go from there.

To do the Iodine test go to wally world and get some Iodine. Next collect a few drops of wort and put it on a white background like plastic. I use material similar to a cutting board. Then add a drop of Iodine. What your looking for is the mixture to stay roughly the same color. If it turns blackish then all the starches haven't been converted, so let it cook a little longer.

A good dry run is to simply put a drop of Iodine on paper, which has alot of starch in it, you don't want that color. You want it to kind of stay the Iodine color.

:mug:
 
I wanna use DME. Just like it better. So How much 2 or 6 should I add (no preffrence as to either really)? I'll balance the DME after that in beer smith. What is the iodine test doing during a steeping? I didn;t think steeped grains did anything but influence color? So how would 2 or 6 allow me to cut my DME addition? In order to get the sugars from the 2 row i would need to mash wouldn;t I?
 
Since this is a bit of a mini-mash I would add around 3lbs of 6 row since it has more enzymes in it. Normally steeping does just that, however this would use the steep as a mini-mash to convert the flaked barley to sugar. The goal would be to keep the steep around 150F until you get good conversion via iodine test 45+minutes depending on how much water you use. 1.5 quarts of water per pound of grain would really help, this is mashing. Next add the rest of the water after you have conversion. Then add the extract, and proceed as normal.

That would get it done. If after looking at this your head swells you could take the flake out altogether, add Malt Dextrine (an extract) in its place, steep the roasted only, add your DME extracts and call it good.
 
I have another quick question on the original recipe... the mash temp says 170.5, I assume this is strike temp? Before or after preheating the MTL?
 
That is correct. Also know the original recipe from page one gives you more of a Guiness Extra-Stout beer IMO, not a Guiness Draught. Wading through all the posts can be a bit of an under-taking.
 
Yeah I've reread this thread a couple times! Or tried to!

Are there altercations to this for more of a Draught style clone?
 
The best part is... I'm starting to go through this thread again to find an altered recipe, and the answer to my strike question was on the first page.
 
I just picked up a copy of the BYO 250 clone special. There's one in there but it needs modified a bit and the souring done. Gonna brew it this weekend to try it and if it's good I'll post it up
 
I have altered this recipe quite a bit, and so far I've left out the sour. To get this to a Guiness draught taste you need to thin it, and lighten it. What I have done is go with an extremely long protien rest (75min at 135F), and Sachrification (45min at 153F). Cut the roasted down to .25 lbs and then add carafa II to make up the difference. I also use .75lbs of rice hulls because I use a RIMS. I would no less than .50lbs of rice hulls if I were you or you will get a stuck sparge.
 
Kitemanks: I have to brew the original recipe posted today as I already placed and received my order for the grains.

Can you tell me what you think I should mash at? 152 or 154? And for 45minutes or 60?

I'm not sure how to do a long protein rest and a Sachrification.... maybe you can enlighten me on that? I am using a 10gallon drink cooler to mash in.

Thanks man! Heating up the water now!
 
Nothing can screw up a brew day like changing procedures last minute. I would do what you had planned on, and take really good notes. Then you can begin to vary anything next time, after your base line brew. In that way you wont wonder what the original recipe tasted like.:mug:
 
I do have two other questions if anyone feels like helping!

I've never done a 90 minute boil, do I still add the bittering hops at 60?

And I've never mashed less then 60minutes... am I missing something with only mashing for 45?
 
just boil for 30 min before starting the hop additions.

As for the mashing: typically, conversion is done in 30 or less minutes (some say 10!), and especially at higher mash temps conversion happens quicker. so 45 minutes is more than enough time. You can mash for 60, but it won't get you anything more.
 
In addition what Bjorn Brewer said you might want to get some beer software. In the boil time on the hops you can vary the time boiled to see how it affects bitterness. Usually not much from the original number, but its nice to see and play with. You can usually boil the hops the whole time without much of a change.
 
Yeah I got brew smith awhile back, pretty sweet software.

Brew session went great. I even lost a quart of the first runnings as I left the ball valve open on my smaller cooler. Still came out spot on with OG on my second AG! Pretty excited. I think that puts my eff above 70%.

I decided to follow Bobby_M's primer to a T.
 
Do you think 72 degrees is to high to let this clean up the rest of the way? Majority of the fermentation was done at 63, and I'm down to 1.020. Problem is my main area for fermenting is down to 54 and will be until friday (when it warms back up around here).

I've heard this yeast can drop out rather easily below 60. Since most of the fermenting is done would I still pickup off flavors at this point with a higher temp?
 
I really have no info on that. I always ferment all my ales at room temperature, around 68-70F. Even if the yeast starts to hybernate with a cooler temperature it should wake up when the temperature comes back up. Often fermentation activity raises the temperature in the vessel as well. If it were me I would move it some where warmer while you think the temperature would cause problems, a shower works well. If your using glass just wrap the carboy in a towel to keep it from getting any light.
 
The BYO 250 clone guide suggests using Wyeast 1084 Irish Ale at 72°F... seems like a high temperature for fermentation - will likely cause a lot of esters...

Have you guys tried various fermentation temperatures and have opinion on the best temperature to go for?
 
How does this one look for partial mash? I know my SRM sucks but don't know why it's that low

[size=-1]BeerSmith Recipe Printout - www.beersmith.com[/size]
[size=+2]Recipe: Guinness Draught[/size]
Brewer: Brian
Asst Brewer:
Style: Dry Stout (Irish)
TYPE: Partial Mash
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications

Batch Size: 5.25 gal
Boil Size: 6.56 gal
Estimated OG: 1.046 SG
Estimated Color: 27.2 SRM
Estimated IBU: 37.7 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
Code:
Amount        Item                                      Type         % or IBU      
2.00 lb       Dark Dry Extract (17.5 SRM)               Dry Extract  28.86 %       
3.30 lb       Pale Liquid Extract [Boil for 15 min]     Extract      47.62 %       
1.00 lb       Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM)                Grain        14.43 %       
0.63 lb       Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM)                  Grain        9.09 %        
2.00 oz       Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %]  (60 min)    Hops         33.3 IBU      
1 Pkgs        Irish Ale (White Labs #WLP004)            Yeast-Ale

Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Medium Body, No Mash Out
Total Grain Weight: 1.63 lb
Code:
Single Infusion, Medium Body, No Mash Out
Step Time     Name               Description                         Step Temp     
45 min        Mash In            Add 4.50 qt of water at 159.4 F     154.0 F
Notes:
Put CRUSHED grains in bag and Steep in 4.5qt (1.13 Gal) of water in turkey fryer for 45 min.
While that's steeping Heat 5 gallon of water in BK. When Steep over take 1.25 Qts of water from brew pot and add to "grain tea". Then put strainer over brew pot and grain bag in strainer. Pour Grain tea through strained grain bag. Top up BK to Starting water lvl for boil

Keep timer going while stiring in LME.
To get the sourness of guiness. 1 Week before brewing put 24oz of Guiness in a bowl and sit it on the counter for 4 days to get sour. Freeze until brew day, On brew day remove and thaw. When there is about 10 mins left in your Boil put the sour guiness in the kettle.
 
Ok I kinda screwed up. I forgot I was brewing this tomorrow and forgot to set out my 2 pints of guinness to sour. I have em out now. is there anyway to speed up the souring process seeing as I don;t have 4 days?
 
you can sour the beer while yours is in the primary and then after several days, boil the soured beer, cool and add to the fermentor. (that's actually how Guinness does it, except it's soured mash, not beer)

I've never tried it this way, but I bet it wouldn't suck. Beersmith also suggests this method.
 
Going to keg this this weekend, can someone help me figure out how to carb it?

I have 2 systems, a CO2 setup with 2 kegs (1 carbing, 1 priming in the carboy), and a nitro/beer gas system.

I really don't want to have to use my CO2 to carb, and I'd rather not prime since I want exact results.

Is it recommended that i get a Diffusion stone? Or can I use the set it and forget it method with nitro by setting the PSI to serving... 30 or so.
 
Going to keg this this weekend, can someone help me figure out how to carb it?

I have 2 systems, a CO2 setup with 2 kegs (1 carbing, 1 priming in the carboy), and a nitro/beer gas system.

I really don't want to have to use my CO2 to carb, and I'd rather not prime since I want exact results.

Is it recommended that i get a Diffusion stone? Or can I use the set it and forget it method with nitro by setting the PSI to serving... 30 or so.

Here is what I do with my nitro tap and they come out great and get better over time with the "Cascade" effect. After I rack to my keg I drop it in my kegerator and put it on CO2 for 24 hrs at 30 PSI and then switch over to my nitrogen at around 28 PSI. No shaking at all! Nitrogen does not dissolve (as easily) in beer and with a 75/25 beer gas mix it will take a few weeks to be carbed
 
I think that sounds easy. CO2 at 30psi for 24 hours, then Beergas at 28psi for 2 weeks?

That would give it a couple weeks to condition as well
 
I know that some people who naturally carb in kegs will cut the dip tube about 1" short to avoid sucking up sediment. I was just letting you know that natrually carbing is closer to what guinness is actually doing...I really don't think it matters if you're pushing with Nitogen anyways.
 
I think that sounds easy. CO2 at 30psi for 24 hours, then Beergas at 28psi for 2 weeks?

That would give it a couple weeks to condition as well

Yeah it really is. Give it a few hours on beergas and you will be good to start pooring. But yes after a day or 2 it is fine. In regards to clogging your restrictor plate I forgot to mention before I go over to beer gas I take off the restrictor plate and pour a pint to get rid of the settled sediment and then put on the restrictor plate. BAM! Guinness in your garage!
 
Looking forward to this one, brewing it to commemorate getting a keezer built! Even got a Guinness tap handle and faucet to dispense with! Going to brew sunday and hoping this comes out good.
 
Wow, I can't believe how awesome this stuff tastes. And it's only been kegged for 4 days!

Couldn't resist and had to pull my first pint ever off nitro... I can't believe I have this in my basement.
 
Wookiemofo,

The closer to 150F you get the drier the beer will be, The 152F works out good for me. If you find its to dry in your opinion bump the sarach. conversion up a couple of degrees. Thats the main effect of the mash temp on this recipe.... When you couple that with the long protien rest (the beer thins out) the taste gets really close.
 
Yeah I'm gonna pull another pint tonight, after thinking about it last night I may want it a little drier. I have to go back and look at what my mash temps were.
 
Whirfloc here... gave it a full test this weekend with a buddy of mine. It does have a bit different taste but it's real similar, and real good.

The main thing I noticed is it doesn't seem as dark as guinness. It still has the same red tone, but a lot more light seemed to pass through my beer then a pint of guinness. Not sure what attributes to that.
 
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