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New to the forum and have a question about burnt mead. Does Champagne yeast produce more or less alcohol then using ale or wine yeast? Plus loving what I am seeing in this thread.

Champagne yeast is a type of wine yeast, and is indeed a fairly hardy yeast...generally a champagne yeast will tolerate up go ~18% ABV, and will ferment to dryness. Still, there are other wine/mead yeasts that will dry up similarly: wyeast dry mead, lalvin 1118. There are also some very hardy ale yeasts too, such as wyeast Trappist high gravity, that could easily get a mead up to the mid teens. The bottom line is to check the manufacturers info on the strains of yeast you're interested in, and see if it will do what you want.
 
Great, thanks for the info. I am starting a batch this weekend and wanted to get an idea of what I would be dealing with if I used champagne yeast. :rockin:
 
I don't like my mead too sweet... how sweet is it? I remember making a prickly pear mead with 20lbs of honey.. and it was too sweet.... 14 lbs of honey I liked better...

so you boiled honey for about 2 hours... would u recommend 170 mins like another member did?

I never heard of zinc fortified yeast... is that dead yeast? .1 g? that's a very little, what kind of scale did u use? So that gets boiled right?

Something that always confused me about yeast nutrients (extract). I have some, looks like salt, it's white and crystalized. But isn't there bacteria in it that can contaminate the mead? Are we supposed to boil it? I remember I threw some in while boiling another mead... and it boiled over!!! DOH!!! are we supposed to boil it? If you boil it... is it bad? But if you don't you introduce contaminates... still confuses me...

thanks




The official recipe from 2008 Nov/Dec Zymurgy page 46. Article starts on page 45 - "Mead: Party Like its 1949"

18.5 lb light honey
4.0 g yeast extract or yeast nutrient
0.1 g zinc fortified yeast as nutrient
3 Tablespoon yeast (40g) dried champagne or mead yeast (Prise de Mousse recommended)

Target original gravity 1.130 - 1.138
Approx Final Gravity 1.028-1.038
Alcohol 14 to 15% by volume

Add honey to pot. Do not add water. Gently boil the honey until dark and tastes caramelized.

Add 1 gallon of water, zinc fortified yeast and blend into the "scorched honey" Stir until dissolved well.

Blend hot honey and water mixture to 2 gallons of cold water and add to your primary.

Top up to 5 gallons total volume. Aerate extremely well and add dissolved yeast nutrient (yeast extract)

When temp is below 80 F add re hydrated yeast. Ferment between 70-75 F

It may take 3 weeks to 3 months to finish primary.

Rack and transfer to secondary. Store at cooler temperatures Rack off sediment after six months to a year. Bottle when clear and all fermentation ceased. Cork in wine bottles for long term aging.
 
Last week, my DH purchased enough honey for me to make a 6 gal. batch, which I'll split between two primary buckets to begin. He's promised to buy me enough honey the first of each month to start a new batch each month.
I believe I boiled my honey for right around 2 hours. As I have to split this, I'll probably boil each batch separately.
Now, we'll see if I can manage to keep him from drinking the entire lot!
 
This technique definitely sounds like it would produce some very tasty results. Just curious, but was I the only one who immediately thought of adapting this to make a candy-apple cyser?

I just dove in with that one today. The caramel notes come out well in the must. It's going to be a while before I can comment on the taste. One word of caution though. My wife and daughter were literally sickened by the smell of the caramelized sugar/honey mixture in the house. Best do it outside next time.
 
Hello to all , My name is Levi I started making mead about 6 months ago .I have finished a gallon of bochet . i cooked it for 90 minutes . I also use fleischmens active dry yeast its a bread yeast that you can get at wall mart. i have had alot of luck with this yeast. the only other one that i have used is the EC 1118 i didnt like the way that batch turned out. it was squashy tasteing .
 
Has any one considered adding say New Mexico Chiles to this? Typically NM Chiles are roasted anyway as it really enhances the flavour. It seems to me a burnt carmelish flavour would mix very very well with a NM Chile undertone. If no one has tried this I may have to and keep you all up to date.
 
Just got done making up a 1 gallon batch of this. I used some old honey I had laying around that had gone all crystallized and SWMBO wanted to throw out mixed with a pound of orange blossom (added after "burning" the old stuff). I boiled on the stove for just about 1 hour. I didn't want to get to the burnt stage, but it is pretty dark with reddish notes. I stopped when I noticed that the steam was actually slightly smokey.

I didn't get the toasted marshmallows smell folks have talked about. More of a sickly sweet mixed with melting plastic/chemical. :eek: Before you ask, yes I was using a metal stirring implement. The taste was closer to the toasted marshmallow though. This should be interesting.

I'm guessing (half full crystallized honey jar) I had about 2.5# of honey in 1 gallon. OG came in right at 1.100, though I think that may be off due to not mixing well enough before taking a sample. Also added 1 tsp each of yeast energizer and yeast nutrient. Yeast used was D47. I'll post pics of what I have in the morning.
 
So, I'm kinda late to the game here, but thought I'd say hi! (And this is my first post)

I put on a small, 1 gallon batch of Bochet today, as a result of reading about it here. Brought it to almost black on my stovetop - it took about 30 mins for me.

I'm really curious to see how it turns out. My husband loves charred/burnt taste. Me? Not so much. The blackened honey didn't taste all that hot to me, but the house smells wonderful - like toasted marshmallows.

Should be interesting, either way!
 
Hey! I just started my own batch and I just wanted to drive home that the slow cooker is the best way to go! You can't do a really big batch without some finagling but it's probably worth it because of how easy and clean it is. No boil overs, no crispy sticky pans. Just blackened honey in as little time as overnight. Good luck boiling!
 
Hey! I just started my own batch and I just wanted to drive home that the slow cooker is the best way to go! You can't do a really big batch without some finagling but it's probably worth it because of how easy and clean it is. No boil overs, no crispy sticky pans. Just blackened honey in as little time as overnight. Good luck boiling!

What you lose out on however is the incredibly intoxicating smells that go along with cooking it. Those smells are well worth the elbow grease needed to clean my kettle.
 
What you lose out on however is the incredibly intoxicating smells that go along with cooking it. Those smells are well worth the elbow grease needed to clean my kettle.

Shouldn't take much elbow grease - put some hot water in and let it soak a bit. Should come right off!
 
What you lose out on however is the incredibly intoxicating smells that go along with cooking it. Those smells are well worth the elbow grease needed to clean my kettle.

I don't know about that. I make chicken stock in my crock pot overnight and it always wakes me up early in the morning because it makes the whole house smell so good.
 
So,
I made a 1 gallon batch last summer and have been letting it age a bit. It is very clear and the color of black coffee. The flavor is horrible though! Very strong, melanoidin flavors with an orange-oil like after taste. Doesn't taste acrid, burnt, but not palatable.

I've tried some experiments with back-sweetening, acid blend, etc. and I can't find anything that makes sense. The only thing I have tried that even comes close is to dilute with spring water (~5%) and to sweeten with ~2% honey.

Are you doing anything to the bochet post fermentation?
 
so I'm sitting here drinking a glass of this as I type this from a batch I made last may.
I made a two gallon batch, ( fermented in separate one gallon jugs), and fermented with wyeast sweet mead yeast. I "burnt" the honey water mix over a firepit in my back yard and used the method of placing sample drops on a white surface until they reached the desired blackened color. It is VERY sweet. The hydro sample was at 1.040, ( down from 1.100'ish), so it's not very high on the booze, but there's enough to notice it. It's hard to describe the taste, and equally as hard to say whether or not I like it. It smells amazing. To say it's complex is putting it lightly. It smells smokey and sweet at the same time. The taste is another thing all together. It almost tastes like flat cola, with a bit of rum in it. There are certainly notes of caramel apples and toasted marshmallows, but predominantly, flat cola. So, all in all, at this point in its age I'd say I doubt I'll be making this mead again. Though, it IS good, and in some weird way I AM enjoying it.

BTW, it looks like flat cola too.
 
I agree. I made some about a year ago myself and I just racked it to another 1 gallon jug for like the 4th time. I still don't care for it, it's much too sweet and the complex flavor is hard to define. I guess at some point this summer I'll put it into some 375ml bottles and put it away somewhere. Maybe some future generation will appreciate it...
 
So perhaps carb it up you are saying?

I may transfer a gallon to a fresh keg and carb it up. I will still have 4 gallons to do whatever I wish with
 
It sounds like this is coming along just fine. Complex at 1 year of aging. I wonder what it'll be like next May.;)
 
OK, so don't kill me. I haven't read through the whole thread. Has anyone tried using an oven to get good caramelization of the honey without risk of burning (or constant stirring)? What I'm thinking of is setting a sturdy pot full of honey in the oven at 240-250 for several hours, or until done. Anyone try this, or shall I be trailblazing here? I'm tempted to try.
 
OK, so don't kill me. I haven't read through the whole thread. Has anyone tried using an oven to get good caramelization of the honey without risk of burning (or constant stirring)? What I'm thinking of is setting a sturdy pot full of honey in the oven at 240-250 for several hours, or until done. Anyone try this, or shall I be trailblazing here? I'm tempted to try.

I dont know about that, the honey is very volatile. If you wanted to try it I would say put in a cup to test it out and see what you come out with.
 
OK, so don't kill me. I haven't read through the whole thread. Has anyone tried using an oven to get good caramelization of the honey without risk of burning (or constant stirring)? What I'm thinking of is setting a sturdy pot full of honey in the oven at 240-250 for several hours, or until done. Anyone try this, or shall I be trailblazing here? I'm tempted to try.

GuldTuborg, I'd test it first but it sounds like a good idea. I had actually considered this earlier today when I read through the post.

I roast garlic about twice a week (I love garlic!) and have been experimenting with different additions to it. One of those has been honey. After 40-45 mins in the oven at 400 degrees, the honey comes out a very dark amber color. I imagine longer times would produce the black honey that you're looking for in this recipe.

But I would definitely give it a few test runs with different temps/times to see what works best.
 
3 dog brew - I'm in the same boat as you. I assume I cooked mine too fast and just really burnt it. I was thinking about blending it with a porter or darker beer, to uniquely add a roasted flavor.
 
If I'm reading wikipedia right, sucrose caramelizes at 230 F and fructose caramelizes at 320 F. Has anyone tried heating to caramelize the sucrose, but keep the fructose. If so, how did that affect the honey?
 
Just tasted mine after 1.5 years of fermenting/aging. It is fairly tasty but still a bit harsh. I am going to split and strip a vanilla bean and add that to a growler then fill with the burnt mead. I think the vanilla will really mellow out the bitterness that is lingering right now, if so I may reserve a gallon or two with no beans (I made 5 gallons) and bean up the rest.
 
I wanted to add to this thread today as I've just finished wrapping up my first bochet mead! There's some things that I've discovered, which I think I've seen hinted at on other pages/sources, but I think they bear repeating (read: big safety issues!):

1) when honey boils, the apparent volume increases DRAMATICALLY! 18 lbs of honey is a couple inches in the bottom of my kettle...once boil hit, the level of "liquid" is at *least* 4 to 5 times higher! Bottom line: you need a MUCH bigger kettle than you might think...

2) the boil requires constant attention to fiddle with the heat level, and needs to be stirred almost constantly to prevent even further rises in the boil and subsequent boil over.

3) Boiling honey is damn f*&King hot! And it likes to splash up and out with the bigger bubbles...my ring and pinky fingers will tell you that you would be well served to wear some sort of protective glove, or probably even better, a *really* long spoon.

4) When you add the water at the end of the boiling, DO NOT add it quickly. I mean this...literally add it like an ounce or so at a time. When water hits hot honey, it boils instantly and sprays damn f*&King hot boiling honey everywhere.

5) Do this outside, but be prepared to battle the bees, wasps and other assorted insect fiends...it would help to have a partner just to shoo/swat them away.

All in all though, my brew was very successful, and I'm really excited at how this will turn out. It smells awesome, is a beautiful shade of mahogany brown, and the hydrometer sample tastes like drinking a perfectly roasted marshmallow....
 
GuldTuborg said:
OK, so don't kill me. I haven't read through the whole thread. Has anyone tried using an oven to get good caramelization of the honey without risk of burning (or constant stirring)? What I'm thinking of is setting a sturdy pot full of honey in the oven at 240-250 for several hours, or until done. Anyone try this, or shall I be trailblazing here? I'm tempted to try.

Guld, did you end up trying this? If so, I'd love to hear about your results (especially if it's to the tune of "huge mess--don't try"). Thanks!
 
So I bottled my bochet today...it cleared really well right in primary (just under 3 months from date of brew), so I went straight from there. It's a nice dark reddish brown, still smells awesome, and tastes just as good! I really can't wait to see how this one ages out...
 
I've been to the point of almost drooling while reading this thread. I am fairly certain that means I should make some!
 
I've been to the point of almost drooling while reading this thread. I am fairly certain that means I should make some!

You should make some. :)

I'm drinking batch two and its reputation grows. I've been at larger brew events and had strangers come ask me about it.

Batch three is in the fermenter (10 gallons)
 
I just made an one gallon batch since all of my carboys are tied up but it doesn't seem to be fermenting. I rehydrated some EC-1118 and pitched it with some nutrient and energizer and I've got nothing. Anyone had any problems with it not fermenting?
 

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