Do you REALLY save any money by brewing your own beer?

I know the primary reason to get into homebrewing shouldn't be to save a few bucks on beer. But that's one of the frequent "advantages" I hear, and it doesn't really seem any cheaper. One website I visited even said it's possible to brew a 5 gallon batch of beer for $10-12... maybe 10 years ago???

I just completed my second batch which was EdWorts Apfelwein. The total cost for all the ingredients for that came to only about $16 - so that breaks down to about $8 per "case" of 8.5% hard cider which is great.

But that seems to be the exception. Many of the beer kits I've seen online and at the LHBS go for anywhere from $30-50 (including shipping), and then if you factor in the additional cost of the electricity to run a fridge to keep the fermenter at a constant temperature (lager even more expensive than ale), the cost of the sanitizer solution, etc... it probably comes out to $25, $30, or even more per "case" of homebrew.

So is it really a possibility to brew your own beer for cheaper than commercial beer? Anyone have any good recommendations on either recipe kits, or their own recipes which are cheaper? Again, this isn't my main objective for homebrewing, but it just seems unrealistic to expect to save money by brewing it myself.

Thanks for the advice!

well....


being that most six packs around here are 7-8 bucks. And us AG brewers can do a batch for under 10 bucks.


Yea, I'd say so

nope..........

Are we talking amongst friends here, or are SWMBOs looking over our shoulders?

It's probably a wash at this point (I'm in the hole if you factor in that I drink more now ). The basic gear is one thing, and you CAN save money - but to do things the way I want to do them, I've dropped coin on a fridge, on temperature controllers, on burners, copper for chillers, all kinds of "fixed" costs. Now, the variable cost element is fairly cheap ($15 - $20 of grain, maybe $4 - $5 of propane), but it'll still take a while to pay off all the overhead.

With that said, it's a HOBBY, it's not about the money. Had I taken up restoration of antique cars, for example, I would be much deeper in the hole. It's not the most expensive pastime, but overall, I don't expect to save a lot.

And it really depends on what you're comparing it to. I could buy a 30 pack of Old Style for around $10. I can make 5 gallons of homebrew for $20. All grain is much cheaper than extract brewing. Two-row grain is $.89/pound where I shop. I usually use 10-12 pounds per 5 gallon batch, and then add some specialty grains and hops. I reuse yeast, or use dried. Sometimes the recipes use more ingredients, depending on what I'm making. But I don't think I've ever spend more than $30 for the ingredients for a "regular" batch. So, figure around $.50/bottle for homebrew.

Some of the commercial beers I buy are more expensive, like $7 a six pack. I like good beer, and drinking good beer. I'd rather have two really wonderful beers than 6 of something that I don't love. So for me, I save money by making my own beer. But that's not why I do it. I do it because I'm a beer snob!

We've done a lot of cost analysis here over the past year. If you factor in ingredients, depreciated fixed equipment cost, energy cost, and even a minimum wage labor rate, you're right (way more expensive than buying). However, this is a hobby and we enjoy doing it even at a loss. It's like saying, "is it really cheaper to go to Mexico to play golf than it is to watch it on TV?" Of course not.

That being said, if I stop buying equipment, stop tweaking the brewery, and keep brewing 10g all grain batches for the next couple years, I'll have broken even on equipment costs. That's when it starts REALLY saving at about $20 for 4 cases of premium beer.

In order to really improve your margins you need to do some or all of the following:

• Go all-grain. Malt Extract is tremendously expensive.
• Get a grain mill (Barley Crusher).
• Get a Foodsaver vacuum packaging system.
• Buy grains in bulk.
• Buy hops in bulk, and Foodsave them.

Kits are pretty expensive, but if you buy individual ingredients in bulk, you can save a ton. Now, bulk grain is useless without a grain mill, so that's a bit of an investment...and bulk hops will go bad relatively quickly if you don't vacuum seal them and put them in the freezer, so there's another investment. But these are the steps. I can brew a standard OG ale or lager for around $14.

Of course, few people are doing this to actually put money in the bank. For most of us, any $$ saved by buying in bulk and brewing AG is turned around again to pay for new equipment.

:rockin:

OK, thanks for the information. I'm brand new to homebrewing, so I haven't even started to read up on AG brewing yet... didn't realize it might be cheaper than extract. But that makes sense.

Although I still think the electricity factor could be significant - especially if brewing a lager which needs to sit for what, 4-6 weeks?

Well, again, there are ways around this. Instead of sticking my lager in the fridge, I have a modified cooler in my basement (see my gallery for pictures). I put water in this cooler, and then two ice bottles. In the winter, I change out the water bottles every 3 days and it keeps the temperature at 34 degrees for as long as I want to. (It is a little tougher in the summer, but do-able. I did the Octoberfest the same way)

Yeah, I guess that's one of the disadvantages of living in Phoenix, AZ - very few houses actually have basements out here, and it doesn't get too cold to help with lagering. Oh well.

It's kind of like buying a hybrid car. Costs you more to get into it but the gas (or beer in this case) costs you less.

If you are going to make any significant "capital" investments, a dedicated fermentation fridge is a good one. Find a decent fridge/chest freezer on Craigslist, then drop a little bit of coin ($50 for an old-school analogue) temperature controller, and your beers will thank you for it.

God help me how can I put this without raining destruction down on my head.....again?
I have my first Lager going now. As a broadening of my brewing horizons, I am glad I have the option. But could I live without it? You bet. I have a ton of great ales in my basement.

The fact that they are in my basement and not down at the store is what may be countering the money saving. It is too easy to grab one!
I have even taped up boxes with packing tape to make it more of a pain to grab the contents lol.
But even if I am breaking even, I am drinking much better and much healthier beer!

I don't have a clue if I've saved money or not, but I expect so. Even if I haven't, I can tell you this much: I would miss the gear and the beer a lot more than I miss the money I spent on it.

To answer your question in other words: I don't care. :rockin:


TL

AZ_Brew_Dude said:

Although I still think the electricity factor could be significant - especially if brewing a lager which needs to sit for what, 4-6 weeks?

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I really dont think electricity is that much of a factor. I just bought a huge fridge to ferment in and it is rated at the worst efficiency for similar appliances and it has an anual cost of $36. With the fridge set to the lowest setting it was in the low 40's which is still too cold. With a temperature controller and set to run at lagering temps it will run even less.

The fridge will also be opened less frequently than the standard fridge which means even less run time on the compressor.

The cost of the fridge however will affect your bottom line more than the electricity ever will.

AZ_Brew_Dude said:

Although I still think the electricity factor could be significant - especially if brewing a lager which needs to sit for what, 4-6 weeks?

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Brew Ales, they are better anyway

The consesus around here is that it simply isn't about the money; However, that is a good way to justify it to yourself sometimes!

I have "saved" money in this hobby about the same way as SWMBO "saves" money when she goes shopping.

At one time I kept track of how much I have spent on equipment, most of which is entirely overkill for making good beer. Now, I don't even want to know. I can tell you this, I have A LOT of brewing to do before I even come close to breaking even!

You "can" save money brewing if that is your goal, but the GREAT majority of us on the board like the process and the toys and are always adding new equipment.

I started out by thinking I'd save money, but now I just drink more. Oops.

I dunno abou the folks that are losing money, but I'm saving a ton. When I don't have homebrew on hand I spend 10-15 bucks on beer EVERY DAY. Now, I'm a heavy drinker, luckily my metabolism can keep up with me and I don't get drunk every night, but I do drink a pint or 3 every night.

10-15 bucks a day for 30 days is $300 - $450 a month.

I spent $180 bucks on homebrewing last month, that got me enough grains to brew for 4-6 months. I don't think I will be spending ANY money on homebrew items this month and I have 4 full kegs, 2 batches in bottles and 2 batches in fermenters.

I save a ton of money, my friend. Because I'm all grain. Now, I've probably spent close to a grand on equipment, but that will be made up for in no time, it might already be made up for.

Not to mention the money I save by not going to the bar and having friends over to drink or just having a relaxing evening with my wife and drinking some great beer off my kegs..

Aside from the fact that I can't stop buying new equipment I would actually be saving a little money by homebrewing. I usually drink "good" beer that costs upwards of 8 bucks a 6 pack here in Massachusetts, and I have to say that my homebrew rivals some of the better beer in the fridge at the package store.

I did the math and my 14+ cubic foot chest freezer which held 7 cornies and a Co2 Tank would cost me between 20 and 30 a month to run depending on what I had the temperature set to.

Donasay said:

...I did the math and my 14+ cubic foot chest freezer which held 7 cornies and a Co2 Tank would cost me between 20 and 30 a month to run depending on what I had the temperature set to.

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I guess it's not a high efficiency one, huh? That seems WAY high per month.

I am confident that saving money is not the "primary" brewing motivation for any of the regular users here. Anybody entering the hobby for that reason is bound to be disappointed. Around here, people brew for the sheer satisfaction of making their own beer...which for the most part, turns out much better than nearly anything we can buy. It's a hobby, not a means of saving money.

Ingredients aside, I'd have to brew an awful lot to pay off my investment in equipment! Sanyo fridge, spare fridge in garage, Co2 tank, regulators, kegs, tower, faucets, lines & fittings, sanitizers and cleansers, carboys & caps, buckets, thermometers, refractometer, hydrometer, airlocks, strainers, siphons, coolers, turkey fryers, pots, propane, water filters, spray bottles...I could go on and on. By the time a batch is finished, I bet I've spent a dollar just on vodka for the airlock! And if you value your time at all (I do!) that means most of us are drinking some of the most expensive beer on the planet!

Brew because you enjoy the process and and satisfaction of making, drinking and sharing your own high quality beer. There is no other reason.

No, but it's better, more enjoyable, and the ladies dig it.

Greg

If you're going to talk about it from a pure economics perspective, you HAVE to factor in your time and energy costs too. They're very real and ignoring them is just false rationalization (we all do this no matter what our hobby is)

If you run propane, you probably get two brew sessions out of a 20lb tank right? $7-8 per brew. I run nat gas and spend about $4-5 per session.

It takes me about 5-6 hours for a batch. Even at $6/hr, that's another $30 in labor.

So for me, a typical grain bill is about 20lbs on a 10gal. Base + specialty cost average out to a typical $1/lb for $20. Hops are now up at about $2 an ounce and I average 2-4oz per batch for about $6. Dry yeast, negligable cost.

So,
$25 materials
$ 5 energy for the brew
$ 5 energy for ferment control (rough guess)
$ 5 energy for keg refrigeration for this amount of beer (highly dependent on how fast you consume 10g).
$30 minimum wage labor (I haven't worked this cheap since I was 14).

$70 for 4 cases of micro if you'd work for minimum wage.

Yes, we'll all concede that this is a hobby and we enjoy it so the labor doesn't count. Well, if all you care about it the economics between buy vs. make (which I get from the OP's words), you cannot ignore it. When companies work out the buy vs. build, inhouse vs. outsource choices, they would never factor in how much they enjoy the work.

I would say it depends on the brew and your style of brewing, how much you've invested in your equipment and so on. I have just about as basic a setup as one can get but it suits me just fine and I make some pretty good, inexpensive beer with it.

I just brewed and bottled a Westmalle Trappist that I paid over 6$ for a 11.5 oz bottle in a craft brew store. My cost to make it comes out to .96 cents per 12 oz bottle. I'm not a mathematician but I would say that's a huge savings...

This hobby save my FRIENDS a tremendous amount of money.
If that's your angle, go buy your friend a starter kit.

olllllo said:

This hobby save my FRIENDS a tremendous amount of money.
If that's your angle, go buy your friend a starter kit.

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So true. My friends supply their own ingredients (well ok they give me the money for some of mine) but I supply all the equipment, knowledge and time.

A 12 pack of anything decent up here costs about $25CDN so to get the 42 bottles of homebrew for ~$30CDN worth of ingredients is a pretty massive savings for them.

Omar at Surly Brewing in the Twin Cities says that it's a myth that you can save money by brewing your own beer - but his reasoning is that it would have been a whole lot cheaper for him to buy some beer than to open a brewery :-D

I figure in raw materials I'm spending $15-$20 for my 5gal batch of stuff I would spend $8-$12 per six for. However I have spent a considerable amount buying stuff for the hobby and it does take a considerable time. In addition I now drink more beer than I used too and when I buy beer I usually buy more expensive beer. So I am sure this hobby is costing me money.
Now if you compare the cost of making extract kits compared to buying cases of macro brew then you will definitely come out behind, but if you and your friends/family are heavy drinkers and you usually buy microbrews then it is possible to come out ahead in a fairly short time home brewing.
Bulk buys, all-grain, yeast washing and bottle scavenging can all help to reduce your per brew costs.

I just wanted to comment on the propane use. I get 5 - 7 full boils on a 20# propane can so even with the expensive $24 exchange the per batch costs is under $5. I have a basement which is 68F in the summer and 58F in the winter, I only brew ales. So currently the only beer being cooled is what I am drinking. I'm guessing you need a fridge just to brew ales in AZ .

Yooper, it is unlikely you are saving energy using your cooler vs fermenting in a temp controlled chest freezer, but you are definitely saving upfront cost.

Craig

I don't undershtand it...my home brew costs me like 70 cents a bottle...... What I used to drink cost $1.00 a bottle........I am drinking as fast as I can......Already this year I have saved over $30,000.00 (.30 / bottle times ten thousand....yeah sounds right) but I am still in the hole! I quit my job so I could drink more homebrew to save more money.....but it just aint workin! Where am I goin wrong??

The moral: do NOT drink homebrew to save money.

Bobby_M said:

If you're going to talk about it from a pure economics perspective, you HAVE to factor in your time and energy costs too. They're very real and ignoring them is just false rationalization (we all do this no matter what our hobby is)

If you run propane, you probably get two brew sessions out of a 20lb tank right? $7-8 per brew. I run nat gas and spend about $4-5 per session.

It takes me about 5-6 hours for a batch. Even at $6/hr, that's another $30 in labor.

So for me, a typical grain bill is about 20lbs on a 10gal. Base + specialty cost average out to a typical $1/lb for $20. Hops are now up at about $2 an ounce and I average 2-4oz per batch for about $6. Dry yeast, negligable cost.

So,
$25 materials
$ 5 energy for the brew
$ 5 energy for ferment control (rough guess)
$ 5 energy for keg refrigeration for this amount of beer (highly dependent on how fast you consume 10g).
$30 minimum wage labor (I haven't worked this cheap since I was 14).

$70 for 4 cases of micro if you'd work for minimum wage.

Yes, we'll all concede that this is a hobby and we enjoy it so the labor doesn't count. Well, if all you care about it the economics between buy vs. make (which I get from the OP's words), you cannot ignore it. When companies work out the buy vs. build, inhouse vs. outsource choices, they would never factor in how much they enjoy the work.

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I get close to 4 batches off one 20lb propane tank. *Edit-and usually enough after 4 to heat up my next batches strike/sparge water* Wage labor is not going in, I'd be spending my time doing some other hobby. It's dumb to calculate something you enjoy, a hobby, as work, like you should be getting paid for it. I work during the work week. If I didn't enjoy brewing, then yea, I'd calculate labor. My ferment control is the fact that my house stays at 65ish F all the time.

I think the point is that if you're going to cite a price / bottle then you have to factor in all of the variables. Otherwise you will arrive at the number you want and not the actual cost.

There is another cost... Opportuntity.
You could buy micro AND go skiiing during the time it takes you to brew up an AG batch.

bradsul said:

...A 12 pack of anything decent up here costs about $25CDN so to get the 42 bottles of homebrew for ~$30CDN worth of ingredients is a pretty massive savings for them.

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With today's exchange rates that $25 US too! That's pricey, I hope it's good beer!

olllllo said:

There is another cost... Opportuntity.
You could buy micro AND go skiiing during the time it takes you to brew up an AG batch.

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Seems to me that brewing your own is actually saving you money in that case.:rockin:

It can go either way, I think. I've had months where I bought little trinkets (like the laser thermometer) that were totally frivolous and thus, didn't save any money by homebrewing. Also, homebrewing tends to get you more interested in beer, and then you buy more beer (for research of course) and you spend more money on homebrewing AND commercial beers than you did when you just bought beer.

At the moment, however, I am saving money. This is because I can brew a good batch of my beer for around $24 (that's counting spring water, fresh yeast, 3 oz. pellet hops, pale malt, 2 lbs of specialty grains). I drink about 1-2 beers a day, so that batch will last me about 20-40 days. Since I'm trying to save money now, I'm only drinking homebrew. Previously, I bought about 1 beer a day (say, 3 dollars for a pint), so that means that if I drink one homebrew (60 cents a pint) per day instead of a commercial, I save $2.40/day for 40 days = $96.

I agree with most everything people have said on this thread. You CAN save money, if you have to, but most of us don't HAVE to save money. And it's more fun to buy more ingredients or equipment, which is where we lose money. I'm a hobbit and don't like technology much, so my all-grain equipment looks like I ripped it off from a 1970's camping trip. but it works perfectly for me. My mash tun cost me $17.

When I have more money, I will let myself go back into the red a bit. But for now I know I'm saving a little over what I would have been spending on commercial brews.

Sorry for the confusion but I don't know how many times I have to say that I know that labor doesn't factor in when you ask yourself whether or not you should take on a hobby. The problem is, that's NOT the question the OP asked. If it had been, "is homebrewing worth the effort?" or "does homebrewing cost a lot of money?" you could argue that yes it's worth it and that it doesn't cost a lot of money.

The question was, "do you really save any money by brewing your own beer?" and in my mind that is a buy vs. make question for which the answer should include all costs both obvious and somewhat hidden.

None of use are brewing for the cost savings (unless you're bad at math).

Why is it that we must think of this hobby in these terms? It's really rediculous when you compare it to other hobbies you have. It's kind of like saying I spent $1200 in "labor" on a recent 3-day motorcycle trip I took (or ski trip, cruise, etc.)

Gas cost me a fortune and I ate through 1/2 a set of tires, paid for 2 nights in a hotel, bought some grub, and HAD to buy some good beer to relax with in the evening.

I would never try to add in $ for my time, and even though my MC gets 40+ mpg, I'm not trying to calculate how much $$ I saved (spent) based on the distance we rode. We had fun. What else is there to say?

Bobby_M said:

None of use are brewing for the cost savings (unless you're bad at math).

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It's funny, the girlfriend asked me if it was really worth it to brew my own instead of buying it at the store. There's one time up front costs (beer fridge, taps, c02 tank, kegs, line, blah blah blah), but when you look at the other costs, it's much more cost effective to brew than buy in this country.