Serving Pressure vs. Force Carb Pressure

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jpm5171988

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Hello all. I am new to kegging and just have a couple questions. How many psi do you use when serve your beer? Im assuming its low, like 2-5 lbs? If this is the case and you have lets say 10 lbs of pressure sitting on the beer (for force carbonation), do you lower the pressure when you are serving the beer and then turn the pressure back up to 10 lbs when you are done? Or when the beer is finished carbonating do you turn the pressure down and leave it down? Any advice helps, thanks!
 
Hello all. I am new to kegging and just have a couple questions. How many psi do you use when serve your beer? Im assuming its low, like 2-5 lbs? If this is the case and you have lets say 10 lbs of pressure sitting on the beer (for force carbonation), do you lower the pressure when you are serving the beer and then turn the pressure back up to 10 lbs when you are done? Or when the beer is finished carbonating do you turn the pressure down and leave it down? Any advice helps, thanks!
 
Well, where you are going to carbonate and serve your beer depends a lot on what type of beer it is and what temperature you are going to serve at. Here is a link to general style carbonation levels vs temperature.
http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php

Ideally you should try to serve at the same carbonation that is ideal for the beer. Then the beer is always at exactly the right carbonation level. What you need to do here is manipulate the length of your serving line so you don't get to fast a pour which causes excess foaming.

There are beer line calculators out there to figure correct beer line length based on inside diameter of the beer line and if the beer has to flow uphill for any significant portion of the trip, and if the line is chilled or not. If you don't want to run all the stuff through the line calculator here is a basic down and dirty estimate assuming you are using standard 3/16 inside diameter beer line and the line is inside your fridge or kegerator and chilled. The general rule of thumb is about 1 ft of length for every 1 psi of pressure. This will get you ballpark most of the time.

So long answer short. If you are carbing at 10psi use 10 ft of 3/16 line for that you keep chilled in the fridge or kegerator and you should be pretty close.
 
I put it on 20 for the first couple of weeks or so and then serve at 3. I also release all of the pressure before upping to the serving point.
 
If you have the right beer line length, like around 10-12 feet, the beer line will be be your natural pressure drop from the keg at higher pressure to your tap at lower pressure.
 
jpm5171988 said:
Hello all. I am new to kegging and just have a couple questions. How many psi do you use when serve your beer? Im assuming its low, like 2-5 lbs? If this is the case and you have lets say 10 lbs of pressure sitting on the beer (for force carbonation), do you lower the pressure when you are serving the beer and then turn the pressure back up to 10 lbs when you are done? Or when the beer is finished carbonating do you turn the pressure down and leave it down? Any advice helps, thanks!
Click to expand...

Refer to this chart to find the correct carbonation values for the type of beer you are serving.

http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php

If you are serving Lagers, Ales, Ambers, (most beers) then you'll want to set the pressure to a setting that will put your carbonation level in the GREEN color. The exact setting will vary depending on your beer/keg temperature.

For example, say you are storing your beer at 38-degrees F. (as Micromatic recommends) then you'll want to set your C02 regulator between 8-11 PSI. Once you hook a new keg up, have the regulator set to the above setting and leave it alone for 1-2 weeks while it slowly carbonates to the carbonation level you have set on the regulator - which in this case is 8 to 11 PSI.

Once it fully carbonates, leave the regulator set at 8 to 11 PSI ... DO NOT change the regulator setting to a different "serving pressure" because if you do, the beer will carbonate or de-carbonate to match whatever you have now chosen as the new "serving pressure" if given enough time.

In other words, there is no separate "serving pressure" that you select after the beer is fully carbonated. Leave the regulator set at the target pressure that will keep you in the green according to the chart I linked to above.

Hope this helps.
 
+1 to the set it and forget it method. I'm new to kegging too and have used it very successfully. I only have 6' lines and so far, no foam issues. Typically I set it at between 8-12 psi and its good after about 2 weeks. Not sure what exactly I'm doing right, but its working great.
 
For my system and temp, I set and forget at 11 and serve at about 8-9. Ideally I would figure out the line length that would completely balance it so I would carb and serve at the same psi.
 
Brewing Clamper said:
Yeah, what he said... I keep my kegarator at 40F, about 12PSI on my kegs and the lines are just over 10'. Pours perfectly!
Click to expand...

Me too. I don't have a different "serving" pressure- what a pain that would be!

I want a beer- I'd have to open the kegerator, turn off the gas, purge the keg, reset to a low pressure. Then, I want a different beer. Do the same thing for that keg. When I'm done for the night, go back and turn up the pressure on the kegs I just used. Ugghh.

I like my system! Keg a beer. Put it in the kegerator with the others. Drink whatever I want whenever I want out of any faucet. When a keg is empty, take it out and keg a new beer. Repeat.
 
I've been cranking up to 25-30 for a 24 hours at 40ish degrees, testing, then usually dropping to 20 for another 24 hours. I'll then release pressure from the keg when it's at a good carb level, and drop psi down to 5ish for serving. It'll stay at 5ish psi for the duration of the keg, I don't crank it back up between servings. That would keep pressure in the keg at the higher psi level.
 
I initially pressurize to 53 PSI and stick it in the fridge overnight.

The next day it should be at 15psi or so. You can pump it back up to 50 PSI for 3 hours or so and have perfect carbs, or just leave it on the gas at 12-15psi and it will be perfect on the next day (48 hours total)

The initial burst of 53psi is almost completely diffused into the liquid in 24 hours, why not do that initially?
 
Chipman said:
I've been cranking up to 25-30 for a 24 hours at 40ish degrees, testing, then usually dropping to 20 for another 24 hours. I'll then release pressure from the keg when it's at a good carb level, and drop psi down to 5ish for serving. It'll stay at 5ish psi for the duration of the keg, I don't crank it back up between servings. That would keep pressure in the keg at the higher psi level.
Click to expand...

I was doing something similar, but at 5psi the beer started to lose carbonation.
 
Yooper said:
Me too. I don't have a different "serving" pressure- what a pain that would be!

I want a beer- I'd have to open the kegerator, turn off the gas, purge the keg, reset to a low pressure. Then, I want a different beer. Do the same thing for that keg. When I'm done for the night, go back and turn up the pressure on the kegs I just used. Ugghh.

I like my system! Keg a beer. Put it in the kegerator with the others. Drink whatever I want whenever I want out of any faucet. When a keg is empty, take it out and keg a new beer. Repeat.
Click to expand...

So for something like a wheat beer that carbs at 23psi at 40 degrees...you would carb and serve this at 23psi? I would assume that you would need a longer line to serve this beer, no?
 
h22lude said:
So for something like a wheat beer that carbs at 23psi at 40 degrees...you would carb and serve this at 23psi? I would assume that you would need a longer line to serve this beer, no?
Click to expand...

That's nearly 3.5 Volumes of CO2. That's a bit much for me, but yeah, if you want to have that I would definitely recommend a longer beer line! I prefer my beers around 2.5 VoCO2 and I don't worry about changing that depending on style.
 
Brewing Clamper said:
That's nearly 3.5 Volumes of CO2. That's a bit much for me, but yeah, if you want to have that I would definitely recommend a longer beer line! I prefer my beers around 2.5 VoCO2 and I don't worry about changing that depending on style.
Click to expand...

That is going by http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php if you have a highly carbonated wheat beer.

Most of my beers will be 2.5 volume of CO2 ale and lagers with an occasional low carbonation porter or stout. I was just asking to know that answer just in case I make a beer that needs high carbonation.
 
JPM - If you'd like to download my beer chart in my signature you can play around with carbing/serving temp, desired CO2 for your style, and what PSI would be required. You can then also play around with balancing your system (length of servining line needed for your system).

If you have any questions please don't hesitate to ask.

cp
 
This site give a lot of explanation and calculations for figuring line length, so you dont have to change the psi.

http://***********/stories/techniqu...-balancing-your-draft-system-advanced-brewing
 
Bobby_M said:
That's exactly why "serving pressure" should be stricken from brewing vocabulary. Balance the serving line and Chart equilibrium pressure = Serving pressure.
Click to expand...

Exactly. In a properly balanced system, you serve at the same pressure you carb at. My primary regulator is pretty much always set at 12 PSI (I have dual regs for the occasional hefe or other beer that wants a few more bubbles).
 
h22lude said:
So for something like a wheat beer that carbs at 23psi at 40 degrees...you would carb and serve this at 23psi? I would assume that you would need a longer line to serve this beer, no?
Click to expand...

23 psi may be a bit hot, but if that is how you like it. Unfortunately the best answer to this question is to spend a bit more money. I will often enough have a hef, saison, belgian, etc that should be carbed at a higher level. I keep my keezer at 38 degrees. After my main regulator which I keep around 10-11 psi, I feed down to a secondary regulator that I will set at a higher level, say 15-18 psi. I then use 15 foot lines to dispense from these higher carbonated kegs.

I also have a split before the first regulator into my keezer that comes right off the co2 bottle regulator. I keep the co2 bottle regulator at 20-25 psi. I use this first line if I am short on time and need to get something up to carbonation in 2 or 3 days.

So in effect I can run at 3 different pressures inside my keezer depending on which lines I hook up. Of course this requires 3 regulators which is the down side, but it keeps life simple for carbing different styles.
 
Some carb, ferment, condition, lager, etc... in separate units than they serve in. Typically not a big difference in temp, but if you're carbing at a certain temp and want to be to style or your preference for that particular beer you may be serving it at a higher temp. My porter can be carbed much colder than I would prefer to serve it at for instance. You may be lagering one beer while carbing another in that same vessel. Once the carbing is complete you'd then transfer that beer to your serving vessel.

An example, if you carb at 35 degrees and want the beer to have 2.5 volumes co2 then you set it at 10 PSI in your carbing vessel. If you then go to serve that beer in your serving vessel and it's set at 40 degrees you would then need to adjust to 12 PSI in order to stay at 2.5 volumes of co2.

Most people do not have this kind of setup, but it's not all that out of the ordinary.
 
I'm pretty new to kegging myself. For my last two beers, IPA and Hefe, I have force carbonated at about 40psi for about 1 and a half days, release the pressure and bring up to serving. It's usually pretty close to perfectly carbonated and from there just let it naturally carbonate a little more at the +\- 10psi service depending on beer style.

May not be the perfect way to do it but it's a fast way if your in a pinch.
 
Another benefit of the set and forget method is that the extra time will let the beer condition, settle and clarify a little before serving.
 
Yooper said:
Me too. I don't have a different "serving" pressure- what a pain that would be!

I want a beer- I'd have to open the kegerator, turn off the gas, purge the keg, reset to a low pressure. Then, I want a different beer. Do the same thing for that keg. When I'm done for the night, go back and turn up the pressure on the kegs I just used. Ugghh
I like my system! Keg a beer. Put it in the kegerator with the others. Drink whatever I want whenever I want out of any faucet. When a keg is empty, take it out and keg a new beer. Repeat.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a damn good plan.
 
don't mean to resurrect a 4 year old thread, but I have just started digging into the balancing act/proper serving pressures/etc and didn't want to start a whole new thread.

Some of this is straight-forward (set and forget), but some is pretty confusing.

Why would you change line length? Then if you have different styles that call for different carb levels, wouldn't you need different sized lines for each? I can't picture having a "stout" line and a "berliner" line and an "IPA" line...

If you serve at a PSI different than that which is in the keg (impossible to know?) then wouldn't that throw off a pressure gradient?
So if you carbonate, say, a berliner at 25 PSI for a week, then wouldn't you have to also serve it at 25 PSI? If you changed the regulator down to 12 PSI, to accommodate a 10' line, wouldn't that throw off the pressure?
Would it be enough to cause excess foam or flat beer?

If you set it and forget it, say around 14 psi or so, how do you achieve varying levels of carb? Say one week I have a stout, one week I have a berliner? I need the stout around 2.0 vols, and the berliner way up around 3.4.

Our CO2 tank has multiple uses - purging, CO2 transferring, use with the bottling gun, and carbing. Would it be best to just get another tank/regulator for carbonation alone, or does it matter?
I feel like it'd be a royal PITA to have to disconnect a beer mid-carb to purge/xfer/bottle another beer, and then hook it back up to continue carbing.

Also, if another tank/regulator is best, where can I find them cheap? I think our regulator was like $100+. Not really trying to spend that much.


I'm probably over-thinking this, just having a hard time wrapping my brain around it.
:drunk:
 
StopTakingMyUsername said:
don't mean to resurrect a 4 year old thread, but I have just started digging into the balancing act/proper serving pressures/etc and didn't want to start a whole new thread.

Some of this is straight-forward (set and forget), but some is pretty confusing.

Why would you change line length? Then if you have different styles that call for different carb levels, wouldn't you need different sized lines for each? I can't picture having a "stout" line and a "berliner" line and an "IPA" line...
Really you could just use the longest line needed for maximum carb level you want to serve at - the beers carbed lower would pour a little slower but otherwise no big deal.

If you serve at a PSI different than that which is in the keg (impossible to know?) then wouldn't that throw off a pressure gradient?
So if you carbonate, say, a berliner at 25 PSI for a week, then wouldn't you have to also serve it at 25 PSI? If you changed the regulator down to 12 PSI, to accommodate a 10' line, wouldn't that throw off the pressure?
Would it be enough to cause excess foam or flat beer?
Yes, you'd get likely get foaming in that situation. Hence the idea that you shouldn't distinguish between equilibrium (carbing) pressure and serving pressure - they should the same, and you need to balance your system to accomodate that.

If you set it and forget it, say around 14 psi or so, how do you achieve varying levels of carb? Say one week I have a stout, one week I have a berliner? I need the stout around 2.0 vols, and the berliner way up around 3.4.
You'd need to set a different pressure for each keg (assuming they're all at the same temp) - see below

Our CO2 tank has multiple uses - purging, CO2 transferring, use with the bottling gun, and carbing. Would it be best to just get another tank/regulator for carbonation alone, or does it matter?
I feel like it'd be a royal PITA to have to disconnect a beer mid-carb to purge/xfer/bottle another beer, and then hook it back up to continue carbing.
If just purging and the exact pressure doesn't matter you can run an extra line off your regulator or manifold, then you don't need to disconnect kegs each time. If you want to carb and serve beers at different pressures simultaneously you don't need another tank but you will need more regulators - either dual primaries or some secondaries downstream for each pressure that you want to use. To me it's not that big a deal to carb exactly to style, and I'd rather not deal with changing pressures all the time, so I have 6 lines coming of my primary regulator that I keep at about 2.6 vols. I then have a secondary regulator downstream with a few lines coming off that I keep at 1.5 vols to carb beers going on the beer gas for the stout faucets. I also use those lines for the beer gun since they're already at lower pressure.


Also, if another tank/regulator is best, where can I find them cheap? I think our regulator was like $100+. Not really trying to spend that much.
If you think you're going to want to serve and carb at a bunch of different levels simultaneously I'd look at getting a bank of secondary regulators for inside your keezer. If you've got the tank outside you won't want a bunch of separate lines running in from multiple primaries.
I'm probably over-thinking this, just having a hard time wrapping my brain around it.
:drunk:
Click to expand...

put my thoughts in red
 
Thanks for taking the time to address my over-complications :)

I like to "serve" off of the blichmann, because it gives me the opportunity to purge and blanket a growler or bottle before capping and sending someone on their way with it. It's pretty unnecessary if we're just drinking pints in the garage, but a lot of our stuff would be "to-go" (for friends, or bringing to someone's house, etc). We don't entertain in the garage much lol

Today I had an IPA that I carbed at around 15-16 PSI for a week, and I filled a growler through the Blichmann (10' line, 3/16 diameter + the gun if that counts). I had the regulator set at 12 PSI (from some articles I read).
No major problems, carb consistency is fine. Went a little slow, but no big deal.

I'm guessing if I pushed it at 16 PSI it probably would've been fine. (or a little faster)
Since most of what we'd be serving in growler or to-go bottle would be hoppy beers, I'd probably just leave one tank/regulator around the 15 PSI range at all times.
I could always just bottle condition our sours and dark beers, or run with the manifold/separate regulator idea.


Thank you for clarifying.
 
I bought one of those 2 gallon cannon ball kegs and I have been reading up on PSI and such.

41849-jacked-up-nitro-cold-brew-keg-system-white-1_1.jpg


Mine is set up just like this, with the tap directly attached to the keg instead of having a line on it.

I have a hefeweizen in it right now that I set to 17 PSI @ the 40 degrees mark my fridge is set at to suit the style of beer.

I have 2 questions.

1. Since I am not running a tap line and serving directly from the keg, will I need to lower the PSI so I don't get a glass full of foam or will I be ok?

2. When I set the PSI, it was at room temp and then i put it in the fridge. I haven't checked it for 3 days but from what I have been reading, the PSI likely dropped from the temp drop. Do I need to adjust the regulator back up to 17 PSI?
 
huskers said:
I bought one of those 2 gallon cannon ball kegs and I have been reading up on PSI and such.

41849-jacked-up-nitro-cold-brew-keg-system-white-1_1.jpg


Mine is set up just like this, with the tap directly attached to the keg instead of having a line on it.

I have a hefeweizen in it right now that I set to 17 PSI @ the 40 degrees mark my fridge is set at to suit the style of beer.

I have 2 questions.

1. Since I am not running a tap line and serving directly from the keg, will I need to lower the PSI so I don't get a glass full of foam or will I be ok?

2. When I set the PSI, it was at room temp and then i put it in the fridge. I haven't checked it for 3 days but from what I have been reading, the PSI likely dropped from the temp drop. Do I need to adjust the regulator back up to 17 PSI?
Click to expand...

  1. Only way to know for sure is to try it without lowering the pressure. If you get too much foam, drop the pressure to serve to a couple of psi. You'll need to raise the pressure back up at the end of your session in order to prevent loss of carbonation.
  2. It's the pressure in the CO2 cartridge that drops when you put it in the fridge. If you have a decent regulator, the output pressure will remain the same regardless of temperature.

Brew on :mug:
 

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