First All Grain BAtch - Wary of boil volume

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The_Brewzer

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Hi all,

I am planning to do my first all-grain batch this weekend, and I downloaded the Beersmith software to help out. I'm not sure I am doing it or reading it correctly though. It is telling me that for a batch size of 5 gallons, I would need 4.64 gallons of water to mash, plus a sparge volume of 4.48 gallons. Somehow this equals a preboil volume of 6.52 gallons (not sure where the other 2 and a half gallons went), and a full gallon and a half will boil off to make a batch size of 5 gallons? Does this make sense to anyone else? This is for a mash of about 12lbs of grain, BTW.
 
Trub loss, mash tun dead weight, grain absortion. Theres a section where you enter your own equipment, its probably set at default.
 
Sounds about right. Grain absorbs a pretty large amount and boil off rates are subjective to your system ( kettle surface area, altitude ect..). If its your first all grain don't worry about the details so much as focus on your process. It will take 3 or 4 batches to dial in your particular setup. If your volumes are off a bit it's not the end of the world, it'll just throw your gravity off a point or 2 in either direction. There's a pretty big learning curve in the move to all grain so don't sweat the small stuff. People have brewed for thousands of years without all the tools and calculations we have now! Good luck and cheers!!!
 
Second the other responses... You will tend to lose .11 gallon/lb of grain to absorption on average. Trub loss and other factors are working against you as well... 5.5+- gallon at the final volume is not a bad thing because by the end of the transfer it will be mixed with everything you don't want in the fermenter.
 
Keep track of your volumes along the way (1st runnings, pre-boil, final volume). Use these numbers to tweak your equipment profile on Beersmith. After a few batches, you'll have Beersmith dialed in to the point where you'll have complete faith in the numbers it gives you.
 
Keep track of your volumes along the way (1st runnings, pre-boil, final volume). Use these numbers to tweak your equipment profile on Beersmith. After a few batches, you'll have Beersmith dialed in to the point where you'll have complete faith in the numbers it gives you.

Yep, measure, measure and then measure some more. Here's what I did to figure out what I was getting out of my system.

Find a way to measure the liquid in you boil kettle. I use a stick with half gallon increments marked on it that I can just stick into the boil to see how much is in there when I start the boil and when I end the boil. This is also helpful for getting your water volumes right off the bat for the mash and sparge.

Next, mark off your carboys with half gallon increments. I do some small batches so I start all the way down at two gallons but most people could start at four and go up to the full six.

Know all this you can keep track of grain absorption, how much you should get out of your mashtun, your boil off rate and any trub loss.
 
Also, Beersmith may default to finishing the boil with 6 gallons in the kettle. Assuming you have a 6 gallon fermenter or larger, after leaving behind 1/2 gallon in the boil pot, you will have 5.5 in the fermenter. After racking, you will leave behind another 1/2 gallon, giving you roughly 5 gallons of finished product.
 
Be sure to configure the equipment profile in BeerSmith for your equipment. Since this is your first brew you will have to guess at your losses.

For comparison on my rig for 5 gallons finished beer in bottles I would calculate my volumes as follows.
Batch size = 5.0 gallons (finished beer)
Grain Absorption at .12 gallons/lb x 12 lbs = 1.44 gallons
Lauter dead space = .25 gallons
Preboil volume = 6.55 gallons
Evaperation .8 gallon/hour
Trub loss in Kettle .5 gallons
Volume into fermenter = 5.25 gallons
Fermenter trub loss = .25 gallons

5 gallon start + 1.44 grain loss + evaperation .8 + trub loss kettle .5 + lauter dead space .25 + fermenter trub loss .25 = 8.25 gallons total water required

Hope this helps explain some of the losses.
 
Yep, measure, measure and then measure some more. Here's what I did to figure out what I was getting out of my system.

Find a way to measure the liquid in you boil kettle. I use a stick with half gallon increments marked on it that I can just stick into the boil to see how much is in there when I start the boil and when I end the boil. This is also helpful for getting your water volumes right off the bat for the mash and sparge.

A yard stick and a little math works well too.
 
Thanks for the thread guys. I've moved to all grain brewing, and I've got a bunch of new equipment that I'm not really of. Not sure how much my new 13 gal kettle will boil off an hour, over my 7.5gallon, and not sure how much my MLT will retain through the mashing and lauter process.

Atleast I was on the right track, I figured I would get a CPVC stick, and mark it with gallons, and record all my volumes before, and after. Will do this for 2-3 recipes, and then be able to calculate it.

Downloaded the trial Beersmith software, it's pretty confusing just playing around with it, but I anticipate getting used to it, and getting it set up for my gear. Couldn't figure how to change all that, and I'm pretty damn computer literate!
 
Once you make a couple of batches, you'll get the hang of the software and predicting your volumes.

You could always try boiling 7 gallons of water first in your pot, to see what the boil off is in 90 minutes, as that seems to be one of the issues for most brewers with new pots. If you start with 6.25-6.5 gallons in the boil kettle, though, you may find that works best as you can always add more liquid later but it's a pain if you've got too much!
 
Once you make a couple of batches, you'll get the hang of the software and predicting your volumes.

You could always try boiling 7 gallons of water first in your pot, to see what the boil off is in 90 minutes, as that seems to be one of the issues for most brewers with new pots. If you start with 6.25-6.5 gallons in the boil kettle, though, you may find that works best as you can always add more liquid later but it's a pain if you've got too much!

I thought of doing that as well.

Filling my pot up with water, measuring out my stick while doing so for the brew pot, then boiling it. Once I reach the boil, time it out at 30, 60, and 90 minutes.

Figure that should give me some idea going in, what I'm working with.
 
Wow, lots of good information here. Thanks for the responses! Looking forward to seeing what happens with this. It is more or less a "kitchen sink" beer to clear out some stock, so I thought I would play around with it and see what happens. :mug:
 
Thanks for the thread guys. I've moved to all grain brewing, and I've got a bunch of new equipment that I'm not really of. Not sure how much my new 13 gal kettle will boil off an hour, over my 7.5gallon, and not sure how much my MLT will retain through the mashing and lauter process.

Atleast I was on the right track, I figured I would get a CPVC stick, and mark it with gallons, and record all my volumes before, and after. Will do this for 2-3 recipes, and then be able to calculate it.

Downloaded the trial Beersmith software, it's pretty confusing just playing around with it, but I anticipate getting used to it, and getting it set up for my gear. Couldn't figure how to change all that, and I'm pretty damn computer literate!

Watch all the videos on how to use the software. This will give you a feel for how things work. It will take a while to get comfortable with it and also to dial in all the variables.

Once you get your equipment profile dialed in you should find the program to be invaluable. I have done a dozen brews on it and have gotten it dialed in pretty well. I am now getting very close to predictions. Even the ones that were off turned out very nice.
 
Watch all the videos on how to use the software. This will give you a feel for how things work. It will take a while to get comfortable with it and also to dial in all the variables.

Once you get your equipment profile dialed in you should find the program to be invaluable. I have done a dozen brews on it and have gotten it dialed in pretty well. I am now getting very close to predictions. Even the ones that were off turned out very nice.

Yeah, I looked at some of that today, and put a recipe in that I got from my homebrew store.. Some of the numbers aren't adding up, but I'm assuming thats just the "efficiency" that BS uses to calculate. Everything is pretty spot on, save for the fact they only line up when I put 80% efficiency in.

It'll still be beer in the end, so I'm gonna use it tomorrow and put all my physicals in and see what it all comes out to be with what I get. It seems easier once I played with it for an hour.
 
Be sure to get your equipment profile and mash profile set right, as that is where you will find potential issues.

Took me a bit of time to do, but finally got BS2 configured for MY system.
 
Agreed.

I guessed, and I guessed right based off reading and taking a stab at what I had in my kettle and mash tun. I hit all my numbers spot on, with Beersmith. I think I'll end up buying the software..

Using a recipe from a brew store, I input it and got a bit of conflicting numbers on OG and whatnot. As well as boil volumes. Using a CPVC stick I made to measure volume in my kettle with water earlier, I was able to figure loss at my boil over 30-60-90 minutes, and confirm the right amount in my primary. BS2 was closer than my recipe was, and everything was right.

It's a bit of a learning curve to understand that just getting away with 4 gallons in the boil for extract, boiling down one leaves 3, and topping up with 2 to make 5.. I had to collect close to 7.5 gallons of wort, not freak out that the OG was lower than I expected, and understanding that I was boiling for 90 minutes. Hit the gravity right, and ended up at 5.5 in the fermenter like I wanted in BS2.. Will have roughly 5 gallon in the keg when I'm done.
 
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