Hardywood Park Gingerbread Stout help.

What's up with the time stamp being off so much? Time is 9:20 pm.

i need to try an extract version of this. I will say it was mighty cool to stumble across this thread and see the JRHB shouted out in here. Been a member since December.

CoopersGoose said:

Had a glass tonight. Bottles overflow with foam. Disappointed in that for sure. Flavor doesn't seem affected. My guess is that I bottled too early. Thinking about dumping remaining into keg to see if I can correct. I've read some having bigger beers take longer to carb, but it's been a while now since I bottled, have to chek notes. This beer has good flavor, not totally off target. Will debate next steps.

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I've had this problem with my last few batches of stout, including Rhoobarb's Damned Kids Oatmeal Stout, Ó Flannagáin Standard, and my own session milk stout. Oddly enough, they all seemed to have reached terminal gravity by the time I bottled, and I used a priming calculator that has otherwise never failed me.

Wondering if some kind of bug got into my system, but I'm glad to know it's not just me.

cooper & eulipion - FWIW, I had beerstone in my stainless conical from probably over a year's worth of batches, which took HOURS to scrub off with BKF and a scrub pad. I then cleaned (PBW or equivalent) and sanitized (StarSan or equivalent) all of my cold/post-boil side equipment. I only, finally did this after four consecutive batches of gushers... they were all infected. I believe I had bugs living in the beerstone deposits that weren't getting cleaned between batches

Good news is that all four batches since then have been fantastic, so I'm confident I got the root cause. Now, I hit my conical with BKF after each batch (which takes five minutes). May be you have a different issue, but what you're describing are exactly the symptoms that had me start troubleshooting (I wasted a lot of time thinking my volumes of priming sugar were off at first).

This GBS recipe is next up in my brew schedule... thanks all for posting info on this extremely tasty beer!

I think if I have a problem, it's probably in the plastic transfer equipment. New bottling bucket, tubing, and bottling wand are probably in order. My Better Bottle is still fairly new and clean as a whistle. Steel conical would be nice. I find it curious that I only have this problem with stouts. IPA, Munich Dunkel, and a couple saisons came out great.

My final gravity reading was 1.024, so I think fermentation was pretty close to complete. This was my first batch in 7 years or so, so I admit I was a bit rusty. Sanitation is something I always take extra precautions with. Cleaned everything with one step - even pre-boil items. Fermenter was cleaned with one step and and sanitized with star sans. I'm confident up to fermentation I was good.

Bottling might have been problematic. Did clean equipment religiously. New tubing used, new bottling bucket, bottle filler was sanitized, following cleaning. That leaves bottles, and caps. Caps were unused but probably 8-9 years old. Sanitized in star sans. Likely not the issue, but worth noting. Bottles were recycled from empties. Definitely had some with mold in them due to them not initially being rinsed. Cleaned well and then sanitized.

If it were contamination in bottles, I'd expect some bottles to be fine, with others producing gushers. Unfortunately, that does not appear to be the case. Seems like the issue is with all bottles. Batch of BierMunchers Centennial Blonde Ale that I made following this batch came out great, although I did keg that batch. If i picked something up, it was likely in the bottling step. I'm going to leave what I have left alone for another 6 weeks and see what happens. Read this issue can happen with bigger beers. Not sure why, but maybe it has to do with higher alcohol content delaying absorption of co2.

Well, finally pulled the trigger on this one yesterday. Wanted to chill it, but got a hole in my chiller tubing that was spraying into the wort, so I ended up pumping it into my no-chill container. Haven't transferred to primary yet, but the trub smelled amazing!!! Nice ginger and molasses character. I'll transfer and get stats on it and post tomorrow-ish.

Transferred to primary and took my hydro sample. OG came in a little low (1.095, 68%), which I should have taken into account. Brew-in-a-bag with a large grain bill usually hurts your efficiency.

That said, hydro sample smells like gingerbread with a molasses-forward bite, and hints of raisins, prunes, and other dried dark fruit. Four ounces of peeled, sliced ginger is very noticeable, but no vanilla (2 beans, split & scraped) or cinnamon (2 tsp ground). We'll see how it is after fermentation.

Recipe:
11 lb Maris Otter
1.5 lb Victory malt
1.25 lb Lactose
1.25 lb flaked oats
1.0 lb Extra Dark crystal
.75 lb Chocolate malt (UK)
3 oz Black Barley

3 oz Challenger (6.9% AA) 60 min
.5 oz EKG (5.9%AA) 60 min (ran out of Challenger, needed to make up the diff.)

4 oz Ginger, fresh, peeled, and sliced - 15 min
2 tsp Cinnamon, ground - 15 min
2 Vanilla beans, split & scraped - 15 min
2 lb Wildflower honey - 5 min

2 packs US-05

Mash: 156 for 60 min
Mash-out: 170 for 15 min
Boil: 60 min

Good luck! Didn't notice any lactose in your recipe. The one thing my initial attempt lacked was that thick full bodied richness and noticeable sweetness that the GBS has. I upped the recommended amount of lactose in the recipe to bring this out, hopefully. It will be interesting to see how it matures. I'm guessing this will be ready around the mid summer timeframe? Best of luck!

Oops, you're right. Edited. There was 1.25 lb of lactose.

Any update on the second take of this fantastic beer?

Should be bottled this week.

Okay, just bottled, a little later than expected.

OG: 1.095
FG: 1.032
ABV: 8.27%

Didn't quite hit my target gravity, but the remains of the bottling bucket taste pretty good. Maybe a hint of plastic bucket, but it's hard to tell with everything else going on. Hopefully it'll get better with carbonation and conditioning. Anyone else brew/rebrew this yet?

Eupi keep us posted. I had to throw my batch out due to a nasty contamination that caused a few bottles to explode. Swear it had something to do with the lactose addition. Maybe I didn't boil long enough, 15 min, to kill all natural bacteria in it. It was funny watching me play EOD team leader.

Bummer! This is the first beer I've put in secondary in a long time, and I'm hoping I didn't contaminate it. I'll give it a few more days and check on it. Usually leave in in the bottle for three weeks before drinking, but I'm impatient...

15 minutes should have been enough time to kill anything. When my beer is over-carbed, I always wonder if it was an inaccurate calculator, or if I got an infection during racking. I've changed out my racking equipment fairly recently, so hopefully I'm good.

Any updates, fellas?

MadGus said:

Any updates, fellas?

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I'll crack one open at lunch and let you know! I shared it with someone who had tried the original (I still haven't yet), and he said that, especially for someone who had never tried it, I came pretty close. Said there was something different about the ginger (I used organic grocery store ginger instead of baby ginger).

Aroma: Ginger is very strong, with a layer of molasses just underneath.

Appearance: Black, no haze, but nearly opaque with ruby highlights shining through. Low-lying tan head.

Flavor: Ginger and a ton of roast. Might need to cut back on roast a bit. Bitterness is smooth, with little-to-no hop flavor. Roast and slight plastic in the aftertaste, though I'm not sure if it's from too much roast or infection, or both. Also, I had some chiller water leak into the kettle which may have had chlorine/chloramine in it. No vanilla, honey or cinnamon. Fairly clean finish, aftertaste fades quickly.

Mouthfeel: Smooth, medium/medium-full body with slight roast-based astringency(?). Could use more carbonation.

Overall: Pretty tasty, but I might add honey and ginger to secondary, seek out baby ginger, and cut back on roast. Also, up the vanilla and cinnamon.

I still haven't tried the original yet, but I'll crack a bottle after my move in a couple weeks and adapt my recipe from there.

As a standalone beer (not a clone): while there was a bunch of Victory malt, it didn't taste particularly "malty," and wasn't particularly sweet. May add some lighter crystal malt, maybe some aromatic.

Hey guys, been following this thread for a while and planning on taking a run at GBS on the 22nd with a buddy of mine. Here's the recipe we're planning.

OG - 1.112
FG - 1.033
ABV - 10.46%
IBU's - 55
SRM - 34

Chocolate malt - 12 oz
Roasted Barley - 12 oz
Victory - 12 oz
Carapils - 6 oz

Extra light DME - 12 lbs
Lactose - 1 lb

Warrior 2 oz at 60 min - 35 IBU
Nugget 2 oz at 20 min - 18 IBU
Challenger 1 oz at 5 min - 2 IBU

Wildflower honey - 2 lbs at 10 min
Fresh ginger root - 5 oz at 5 min
Vanilla beans - 5 beans split and scraped
Cinnamon sticks - 3 whole sticks at 5 min

Wyeast 1728 Scottish Ale with 3L starter on stir plate
Safale US-05 - 1 sachet

I have been steeping the grains for 45 min recently and then washing them into the brewpot so it turns into more of a partial mash. May have gotten a little carried away with the OG so was going to throw in a sachet of US-05 just to be sure. We wanted the gingerbread flavor to come through but not for it to be "spicy" or overly sweet. Figured it would probably be ready around christmas time.

Would you guys change anything about the flavor additions? I've heard people putting the vanilla beans in vodka to bring out the flavor some.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Incidently, I also live in RIC and have had the original multiple times.

I'm currently doing a side-by-side. Color is close, original had lower head, but better retention. The original has more prune/raisin flavor, less ginger. Could be caused by age (6 mos) old. Also noticing a bit more cocoa and a smoother, fuller mouthfeel. Ginger is smooth and subtle, cinnamon is very noticeable, and vanilla is just behind.

Mine has a much larger ginger presence, but I'm also getting a hint of plastic (chiller hose leaked a bit into the beer). Vanilla and cinnamon are missing.

Both are good beers, but the spicing makes them very different. Next time more vanilla and cinnamon, less ginger, or baby ginger if I can source it (not in Richmond anymore). Also may up the C-120 or use Special B, but will try changing the spices first. As it is I would call mine a ginger stout, not a gingerbread stout. Will brew again!

Eulipion,

Will be pulling together another batch in the next few weeks to prepare for Christmas. If I find the baby ginger here in Richmond, want me to ship you some? Be more than happy to. Looking forward to my second go round on this one.

CoopersGoose said:

Eulipion,

Will be pulling together another batch in the next few weeks to prepare for Christmas. If I find the baby ginger here in Richmond, want me to ship you some? Be more than happy to. Looking forward to my second go round on this one.

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Thanks for the offer, Coop, but I still have a case left from my last batch. Just couldn't bring myself to drink much of this over the summer. I should be able to find some baby ginger in the new location when I give this another go.

Are you planning to adjust the recipe? I think the base recipe is fairly close, maybe a little more Extra Dark Crystal. To my tastes the spices made the most difference.

Sidenote: I entered this into the Dominion Cup this year. Got a pretty good score, 32 or 34 (can't remember). I'm pretty happy with it.

Yes. I'm going to get a batch going for the winter months. I definitely will adjust the recipe I did. Probably review yours, check my proposed adjustments in BeerSmith and give it a go soon. Hopefully it will be ready, Dec/Jan timeframe.

Okay, just tasted again. I was wrong about the base. I think I'd lower the roast a bit, maybe use some Carafa III. The roast in mine was a bit too strong. Also, less ginger, more cinnamon & vanilla.

Let us know your changes. I think we can get a definitive clone out of it if we keep trying.

Brewed up 10 gallons last weekend, had a nice primary ferment this week, and am ready to rack to secondary and add spices. Couple of questions:

1) How much ginger? 2 tsp per 5 gal? ground or chopped?
2) One vanilla bean per 5 gal? scrape out the bean?
3) Three whole cinnamon sticks per 5 gal?

I've seen many different levels of spicing for this kind of beer, and was also thinking about making a tincture with unflavored vodka (since I didn't add any of these spices during the boil) to reduce infection chances with adding to secondary.

Appreciate any help/thoughts.

OG was 1.088 (about three points shy of what I was expecting from beersmith recipe).

MadGus said:

Brewed up 10 gallons
...
1) How much ginger? 2 tsp per 5 gal? ground or chopped?
2) One vanilla bean per 5 gal? scrape out the bean?
3) Three whole cinnamon sticks per 5 gal?

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I'm not sure how the spices will translate when added to secondary, but I'd recommend weighing out the ginger. I added my spices with 15 minutes left in the boil:

I used 4 oz fresh grated ginger, and it was a bit much. I'd go with, maybe, 2 oz.

I added 2 split & scraped vanilla beans and can barely taste vanilla, but not sure how it'll translate to secondary addition and less ginger.

No advice on the cinnamon, but 2 tsp ground cinnamon didn't come through much in mine. Again, use less ginger and maybe the cinnamon and vanilla will come through more.

Ended up getting 4oz of vodka tincture, split evenly between each of my 5 gallon carboys of beer. Bottled a couple of 12oz'ers so I can check flavor and carb levels in a few weeks, before I give most of this away over the holidays.

Thanks again for your advice guys... this was a fun beer to make.

eulipion2 said:

Okay, just tasted again. I was wrong about the base. I think I'd lower the roast a bit, maybe use some Carafa III. The roast in mine was a bit too strong. Also, less ginger, more cinnamon & vanilla.

Let us know your changes. I think we can get a definitive clone out of it if we keep trying.

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We're looking to brew this in the next couple weeks. Took your recipe and suggestions and came up with this. (lowered ginger/black barley, increased carafa, cinnamon, vanilla). Thoughts? Suggestions?

Recipe:
11 lb Maris Otter
1.5 lb Victory malt
1.25 lb Lactose
1.25 lb flaked oats
1.0 lb crystal 120
.75 lb Chocolate malt (UK)
1.5 oz Black Barley
1.5 oz Carafa II

3.5 oz Challenger (6.9% AA) 60 min

2 oz Ginger, fresh, peeled, and sliced - 15 min
2.5 tsp Cinnamon, ground - 15 min
3 Vanilla beans, split & scraped - 15 min
2 lb Wildflower honey - 5 min

2 packs US-05

Mash: 156 for 60 min
Mash-out: 170 for 15 min
Boil: 60 min

would also like to brew this, looking for some input to joshreid's recommendations:fro:

Looks great! I think we're still trying to hash this out by trial-and-error, but every iteration gets us a little closer to an actual clone. Let us know how it turns out!

eulipion2 said:

Looks great! I think we're still trying to hash this out by trial-and-error, but every iteration gets us a little closer to an actual clone. Let us know how it turns out!

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At 70 IBUs you don't think that's too high? I saw a couple other recipes on here were in the 50's.

reidjoshua said:

At 70 IBUs you don't think that's too high? I saw a couple other recipes on here were in the 50's.

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Sorry, didn't notice the IBUs. According to Hardywood's website, GBS has 55 IBUs, so I'd shoot for that.

thanks

I have not seen anyone mention how Hardywood introduces the Ginger and Honey to this beer. From watching the video on the making of it, it looks like the honey ginger and vanilla beans are all added to the finished imperial milk stout. "Pumped into our Imperial Milk Stout" is what Patrick states as he is adding the peeled and puréed ginger to a pot of steaming honey that I assume is mixed with water. Then they show him cutting the vanilla beans. So what I gather on this is the same thing I do with my flavored stouts. Ferment them out. Cold condition for a few weeks to drop out as much yeast as possible. Then add your flavorings for whatever duration you desire. Then rack off or filter into keg or bottling bucket. If you are bottling you will of course have problems with all the honey, since it was used to back sweeten the final stout. Just some useful into I picked up from a little research from their site. Cheers!

ditch said:

Then add your flavorings for whatever duration you desire. Then rack off or filter into keg or bottling bucket. If you are bottling you will of course have problems with all the honey, since it was used to back sweeten the final stout. Just some useful into I picked up from a little research from their site. Cheers!

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IIRC, I think this was their problem last year. Overcarbed due to adding honey too close to bottling. When I get around to rebrewing this, I may boil the honey, ginger, and spices together and add to secondary, but I'll let it ferment out before bottling. Adding to the kettle is easier though.

Honestly, I think the amount of ginger is more important than when it's added.

reidjoshua said:

We're looking to brew this in the next couple weeks. Took your recipe and suggestions and came up with this. (lowered ginger/black barley, increased carafa, cinnamon, vanilla). Thoughts? Suggestions?

Recipe:
11 lb Maris Otter
1.5 lb Victory malt
1.25 lb Lactose
1.25 lb flaked oats
1.0 lb crystal 120
.75 lb Chocolate malt (UK)
1.5 oz Black Barley
1.5 oz Carafa II

3.5 oz Challenger (6.9% AA) 60 min

2 oz Ginger, fresh, peeled, and sliced - 15 min
2.5 tsp Cinnamon, ground - 15 min
3 Vanilla beans, split & scraped - 15 min
2 lb Wildflower honey - 5 min

2 packs US-05

Mash: 156 for 60 min
Mash-out: 170 for 15 min
Boil: 60 min

Click to expand...

Took a similar version for a spin yesterday. Upon tasting a sample of the wort I can report the spice mix is damn near spot on. It's maybe a little on the strong side but I suspect it will fade somewhat after fermentation.

Only difference in mine is I used 1.5# of oats (accidentally bought that much), only 3oz of challenger and I added 1.5oz of carafa III

Thanks for putting in the work on this guys. I'll report back with notes after fermentation. Obviously it won't be done for a few months but I should have a good idea of where the spice blend sits after a few weeks.

Curious, how things are coming along here? I was looking to put together a clone of their Farmhouse Pumpkin but saw this thread. Now I'm inclined to brew this now to get some age on it for Xmas and brew the Farmhouse later. So what's the latest news on recipe, tips, technique?

Can anyone muster up an extract recipe for those of us who aren't all-graintastic yet? Please and thanks...


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