Munich Helles 2011 1st Place HBT- Light lager- Augustiner Lagerbier Hell

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Ok I bought all the stuff to make this lager but it wet be ready in time for my occasion in march, could I possibly use a ale yeast on this recipe, would it turn out?

He-brews,

You certainly can use an ale yeast..... but it won't be a lager. Ale yeasts have a bit of a fruitiness and some esters that lager yeasts avoid.

It certainly will be good but will probably be more in the line of a cream ale instead of a Helles.

Brew it up. No harm at all!
 
I have been gradually dropping my primary to lagering temperature (39F) after my D Rest, what is the minimum I really need to lager this for at 39F? The beer tasted good when I took a gravity sample after the D Rest, I cant imagine it needs too long of a lagering time. Also, the hydrometer sample I stuck in the refrigerator cleared up within a week, this makes me think that I could get this lagered in less than 2 weeks if needed?

Two weeks will be fine. Sounds like you did everything perfectly.
 
I brewed 10 gallons of this yesterday and aside from accidentally adding a full pound of melanoidin instead of the 0.25 (ugh!), I think it turned out great. Ended up with a bit higher efficiency and mashed closer to 150 (still having a pain in the ass nailing down my temps due to the varying weather outdoors). It's in my fermentation fridge at 51 degrees. Will update more when it comes to tasting.

Sounds good Taco. Maybe the extra melanoiden will actually improve the beer! Keep us posted.
 
Thanks man I think I'm gonna brew it up Friday morning I have an Irish yeast that I washed about a month ago what do u think about using that?
 
Thanks man I think I'm gonna brew it up Friday morning I have an Irish yeast that I washed about a month ago what do u think about using that?

I think it's going to work out great and you'll make a fine beer.

Off topic but if you normally brew with tap water try using mostly R.O. or distilled.

Of all the changes I've made to my process over the years- water is by far the most important. I can't express this enough to any brewer.
 
Yes I have an RO/DI unit that's really brand new but how much of this water should I use? I bought 5 gallon of spring water for this beer and so I would have another fermenting vessel, lol.
 
Brew day went fairly smooth, although I accidentally added my 60 minute hops at the 90 minute mark. I decided to continue with 90 minute boil. My Og clocked in at 1.057 so maybe the extra ibus won't be too noticeable. Cooled wort to 51 and split a 4L starter between my carboys. Hoping for activity in the morning!
 
Brew day went fairly smooth, although I accidentally added my 60 minute hops at the 90 minute mark. I decided to continue with 90 minute boil. My Og clocked in at 1.057 so maybe the extra ibus won't be too noticeable. Cooled wort to 51 and split a 4L starter between my carboys. Hoping for activity in the morning!

Good job! You are fine with the 90 minute addition. Hop utilization is rarely over 30% overall and the additional 30 minutes will not affect the beer at all. You could boil those hops all day and not get over 30% utilization.

Your temperatures and starter volume are excellent.

Keep us posted and throw some pictures up when available.
 
I will say this: the Wyeast 2308 (equivalent of the wlp838) produces quite a prolific sulfur smell.
 
Did anyone check mash ph that used a Munich profile? Does not seem that there is enough dark malt to set the mash with that high of a carbonate level. Or did you add acid? I would like to make this and my house water is real close to Munich profile.

I had the same question. I've never gone for a profile as naturally alkaline as Munich, and no matter how I mess with the numbers in Bru'n Water, I end up with a mash pH that's too high.

Would the best approach be to mimic the Munich ions and then adjust with lactic acid down to a suitable mash pH?
 
I had the same question. I've never gone for a profile as naturally alkaline as Munich, and no matter how I mess with the numbers in Bru'n Water, I end up with a mash pH that's too high.

Would the best approach be to mimic the Munich ions and then adjust with lactic acid down to a suitable mash pH?

I finally gave up. I now use all R.O. water and add 10 grams of gypsum and 6 grams of Calcium Chloride. That brings the PH to 5.58. The only thing out of range is magnesium and I'm not concerned.

NOTE: I'm no water expert but these numbers work for me in EZ Water.
 
I finally gave up. I now use all R.O. water and add 10 grams of gypsum and 6 grams of Calcium Chloride. That brings the PH to 5.58. The only thing out of range is magnesium and I'm not concerned.

NOTE: I'm no water expert but these numbers work for me in EZ Water.

I usually use all RO. 10grams of gypsum I feel is alot for this beer. I think 10 grams Calcium Chloride 5 in mash and 5 in kettle would be better. In my opinon. The calcium chloride will enhance the maltyness of the brew.

Also If you are using RO there is no Mg in the water or the your additions unless your adding epsom salt

I am going to brew this this coming weekend I will be using RO and 5 and 5 of C.C.
 
I just got this on tap and started carbing it up so I figured I would give it a taste, it couldn't be that good after only a week of lagering and little to no carbonation, right?

Besides being a little cloudy and undercarbed, this beer is amazing. Its exactly what I wanted, a lighter easy drinking beer with flavor.

I am going to give it another week to carb up and clear a bit more but I will post pictures then. Thanks for the great recipe!
 
I started raising the temp to 68 the other day for a diacetyl rest, 9 days after pitching. The gravity was at 1.020 and I'm assuming the yeast will still be working on the last bit of attenuation to get me down to 1.012. Is this about the same fermentation schedule others have been seeing?
 
I just got this on tap and started carbing it up so I figured I would give it a taste, it couldn't be that good after only a week of lagering and little to no carbonation, right?

Besides being a little cloudy and undercarbed, this beer is amazing. Its exactly what I wanted, a lighter easy drinking beer with flavor.

I am going to give it another week to carb up and clear a bit more but I will post pictures then. Thanks for the great recipe!

You are very welcome. I'm thrilled that you are enjoying the beer.

I guarantee that the last pint you pour will be the very best.
 
I started raising the temp to 68 the other day for a diacetyl rest, 9 days after pitching. The gravity was at 1.020 and I'm assuming the yeast will still be working on the last bit of attenuation to get me down to 1.012. Is this about the same fermentation schedule others have been seeing?

Taco,

Yes, the beer could have been pulled a few days earlier when the yeast were more active. They will still look for things to eat and raising the temperature will give them a boost. Check the gravity in a few days. It should have dropped. If not, you can gently stir up the yeast and keep the fermenter warm. They will finish but it may take a while.
 
Last night I drew the first pint off this batch...Worth the Wait! Excellent flavor, beautiful color - really nice lager. After tasting this, I put in my grain order for a full 10 gal batch.

Congrats on the first place.

Is your beer sweet or dry? The style guidelines state the beer is supposed to be very malty/dry, but not sweet. I have done a one of these and have a new batch in the fridge.

The first Helles Boch (HB) was really good and won a second place in a large competition. However, I determined it was too sweet for the style guidelines (and my hop IBU was too low). I thought it might be because I mashed at 154F like you. I did some research and determined that from 154F and up you start getting the sugars that don't ferment as well creating a sweetness.

My HB in the fridge was mashed at 142F and appears much drier. I know I'll get a very dry beer that is malty, but can't make any judgments until it is done.

What is your opinion on using 154F vs lower temps for mashing? Do you think your beer is to style guidelines? I ask because I might have made an error on my first attempt, like pulling it off of fermentation too soon etc. (yes I did the D-rest), and haven't made enough batches to have an experienced opinion.

I personally loved my Boch using the 154F for mashing, in fact, I prefer a sweeter beer if that's the cause. However, I'm now trying to make mine to style for a better placement in competitions.

Your thoughts?

Cheers :mug:
 
i like to leave the primary for 4 weeks. then rack to kegs, force carb. and lager for 4 more weeks. when i make lagers i make a ten gallon batch and keg it into one 5 gallon keg and two 2.5gallon kegs. this is really nice b/c once i crack into that last 2.5gallon keg its been lagering for 2 plus months at that point and is usually the best of the batch.
 
I brewed 8 gallons of this on Christmas Eve day, no decoction but used melonoiden malt. After primary, I put 3 gallons directly into a keg which sat for less than a week to lager before putting it on tap. I am a tad over 5 weeks after brewing this and its very clear and the taste is getting better each day. I can only imagine how the 5 gallons that are still lagering will taste! I think the minimum time from grain to glass is 5 weeks so if you want to make a relatively quick lager, try this recipe out. I love that its an easy drinking lager that has actual taste to it, perfect for those people who do not like anything too dark. I plan to bottle up a growler of this to take to a super bowl party.

I highly recommend!

4NdJrbB.jpg
 
Here I am 15 days after brewing this up. After 7 days at 51 degrees, my air lock activity had nearly stopped and checking my gravity showed me a reading of 1.028 so I raised the temperature to 62 for a diacetyl rest for 4 days and then I began lowering the temperature over the past 4 days to cold crash. I made a mistake by not taking a gravity reading after the 4 day diacetyl rest I guess. Today I pulled the carboys out to prepare to transfer for lagering for a month. I took a gravity reading today and it was at 1.021. The expected FG should be 1.012. Should I let the carboys warm up to the mid 60s and see if I can get the gravity to drop? It tasted good, although a tad sweet. I couldn't detect any buttery or off flavors. It actually tasted quite clean. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!
 
Here I am 15 days after brewing this up. After 7 days at 51 degrees, my air lock activity had nearly stopped and checking my gravity showed me a reading of 1.028 so I raised the temperature to 62 for a diacetyl rest for 4 days and then I began lowering the temperature over the past 4 days to cold crash. I made a mistake by not taking a gravity reading after the 4 day diacetyl rest I guess. Today I pulled the carboys out to prepare to transfer for lagering for a month. I took a gravity reading today and it was at 1.021. The expected FG should be 1.012. Should I let the carboys warm up to the mid 60s and see if I can get the gravity to drop? It tasted good, although a tad sweet. I couldn't detect any buttery or off flavors. It actually tasted quite clean. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!

Lagers are slow, and 7-days are not enough time, especially if you didn't have enough yeast. Don't confuse lager yeast with ale yeast. The airlock will slow, but give it time. Sometimes Some yeast is highly flocculant and may have fallen out and is dormant. My Lager did the same once, but I left it at 50F longer and rousted the yeast every day. It took a while, but it came down to 1.012. Check out my yeast rouster below. If you don't have a conical, get to the bottom with a sterilized object to stir up the yeast every day.

Roust your yeast:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/rousing-up-sleepy-yeast-portable-co2-charger-348505/
 
I pitched a decanted 1 gallon starter split into to carboys so hopefully I had enough yeast. Do you think gently stirring after I get it back up into the low 60s will kick start the yeast again, even after I had cold crashed them for the last 4-5 days?
 
I just took another reading after nearly 7 days at 63 degrees and my gravity has dropped to 1.019. Do you think I should give it more time at this higher temperature or do you think it is probably as low as it will go?
 
I brewed a slight variant on this 4 weeks ago. I used Wyeast 2565 (Kolsch) at a controlled 61F, letting it rise for the second week to 68F before crashing to 36F for two weeks.

Bottled today and the sample was amazing. I look forward to trying this after it's carbed to get a better idea of its final profile... but very excited based on the crisp, clean, and malty sample I had today.
 
I brewed this beer on 2-17-13. On sunday i am gonna put temp up to 69 degrees but my ? is how long at that temp. How long should i put it back at 51 Degrees b4 I cold crash? This is my 1st lager so any advise would b helpful. thanks. :mug:
 
Barleyman,

You don't necessarily have to do a diacetyl rest. Open the fermenter(s), check the gravity and see if you can smell, taste or sense diacetyl in the sample. No butter= no problem and you continue on with the lager fermentation.

I always perform a D-rest but many don't. For me it's approximately one week at the primary temeperature (49-52 for a lager) and then one week at basement temps.

After that you can return the beer to a lager temperature or rack to secondary and age it for as long as you like.
 
So, in retrospect, this beer turned out very clean flavor and clarity-wise, but accidentally using the whole pound of melanoiden has made this thing a malt bomb.
 
I was looking for a beer to brew with the white labs platinum strain WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. Any thoughts on this? Also I plan on brewing 5 gallons of this, should I just cut all of the ingredients in half?
 
I was looking for a beer to brew with the white labs platinum strain WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. Any thoughts on this? Also I plan on brewing 5 gallons of this, should I just cut all of the ingredients in half?

Any answer to this question for people who have brewed 5 gal?
 
I am going to get the ingredients for this today. I plan on using the WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. I cant wait to try it!
 
I was looking for a beer to brew with the white labs platinum strain WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. Any thoughts on this? Also I plan on brewing 5 gallons of this, should I just cut all of the ingredients in half?

I would cut everything in half except maybe the melanoiden out of convenience since we are talking about 2oz vs 4oz...not a huge difference. I've used melanoiden up to 5% of total grain bill before and it was fine. I've also used WLP860 when it was first released and it's a fantastic yeast. Mild sulfur smell while fermenting in primary, but that is expected. Flocculates well and left a clear, clean beer.
 
Joe...looking at the grain bill a little closer i'm surprised you were using pale malt instead of German Pilsen malt which would be closer to style. Also, why the 90 minute boil? Is DMS a possiblilty with pale malt, or is it that all malt has DMS precursers but pilsen/pilsner malt just has a higher percentage? Anyways, just trying to exapand my knowledge and looking forward to brewing your recipe. I was stationed in Bad Aibling, about 90 minutes south of Munich for six years; Augustiner is my absolute favorite Helles. That is right after Hacker-Pschorr, Andechser, Weihenstephaner, Spaten, Paulaneer, Ayinger, oh never mind...I like them all. :mug:
 
Joe...looking at the grain bill a little closer i'm surprised you were using pale malt instead of German Pilsen malt which would be closer to style. Also, why the 90 minute boil? Is DMS a possiblilty with pale malt, or is it that all malt has DMS precursers but pilsen/pilsner malt just has a higher percentage? Anyways, just trying to exapand my knowledge and looking forward to brewing your recipe. I was stationed in Bad Aibling, about 90 minutes south of Munich for six years; Augustiner is my absolute favorite Helles. That is right after Hacker-Pschorr, Andechser, Weihenstephaner, Spaten, Paulaneer, Ayinger, oh never mind...I like them all. :mug:

Hey Jay-DW,

I used to brew a lot of beers with mostly Pilsner malt but I never did care for the intense graininess I experienced. One day I was brewing a Standard American Lager but only had 4 pounds of Pilsner. I used that grain and finished the bill with 2-row.

That SAL won Best of Show out of 94 beers. I haven't looked back and have not brewed a lager with mostly Pilsner since. Several pounds of Pils gives you a bit of the classic Pils flavor and aroma without the graininess.

No reason for the 90 minute boil other than that's just how I roll. 90 minute mash and 90 minute boil. One reason may be that I like to add my hops after the hot break has been established. That means at least a 75 minute boil so I just go 90. No real need.

Love your "favorite" beer selection.

I'm not being cliche or silly when I say- than you for serving our country. My dad served in the Korean War from '50 to '54. I appreciate your efforts.
 
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