RIS Swap ~ Chriso's Beers

I'm sending:

2 08-08-08 RIS (Cap is clearly marked)
1 Pecan Scottish 80/- (Cap is marked "PSA80" on orange dot, the recipe is in my recipe drop-down)
1 D'odd Porter (Cap is marked w/ illegible dark blue dot, BeerXML attached)
1 Tri-Hop Amer. IPA (Cap is marked "AIPA" on yellow dot, BeerXML attached)

to olllllo, Yuri_Rage, and Evan!

and 1 08-08-08 RIS to Warrior.

My boxes are all packed (very tightly, at that) and will go out tomorrow!

View attachment aipa.xml

View attachment dodd.xml

Yuri's disclaimer: I'm VERY honest in reviews. Nothing I say is intended to be offensive or insulting. Like Dude, I think it's a disservice to give a patronizing or overly glowing review unless it's truly warranted.

D'odd Porter

Appearance:
Two finger tan head, dissipates to a thin collar. Clear with deep brown and red tones showing through when held to the light. Slight lacing with wine-like "legs" creeping down the glass.

Aroma:
Roasted malt and chocolate with some indistinct fruity esters. Slight hazelnut or pecan character.

Flavor:
Very unassuming. A bit of sweet malt front, slight roasted bitterness in the finish. The nutty character is evident in the aftertaste. I also get a hint of fruity esters that I associate with a stressed fermentation, a lot like the last porter I brewed with some old yeast that I reused MANY times. Mostly, the flavor is thin and, honestly, forgettable.

Mouthfeel:
Perhaps just a little overcarbonated, which does nothing to improve the thin flavor and mouthfeel. Very light on the palate.

Drinkability:
This beer is very easy to drink, but I expect more from a porter. This tastes and feels like a light English brown that accidentally got a tiny dose of black patent or roasted barley.

The D'odd Porter was actually my 2nd batch of beer ever. It had .5 lb choco and .25 black patent, and flaked oats. I agree that it tasted a bit thin - part of that I attribute to carbonating using brown sugar instead of dextrose, and also the addition of molasses into the secondary.

Pecan 80/-

Appearance:
Clear medium brown with gold highlights. Large bubbled, fast dissipating head.

Aroma:
Holy esters, Batman! A clove laden fruit salad! Some light roasty/nutty malt in the background.

Flavor:
CLOVES! That's almost all I can taste. If I concentrate, I get some really nice, malty flavors that I'd normally associate with an 80/-. The recipe is surely a good one, but the results don't do it justice.

Mouthfeel:
Nicely carbonated and medium bodied.

Drinkability:
I was excited to try this one, but I'm not a fan. This beer is a PERFECT example of clove esters. Chris, get the yeast pitching and fermentation temps under control, and I bet you're capable of brewing fantastic beer.

AIPA

Got a bad bottle. I'm not going to review this one. It's completely flat and has a ton of weird off flavors - leads me to believe this particular bottle has issues unrelated to the batch. The hop aroma is nice, but that's where it ends.

Unfortunately, the AIPA is bad. I hadn't tried any before I mailed them out. After trying one the other night, I realized that my fears were confirmed -- when I bottled it, I grabbed the wrong sealed Mason jar of priming sugar. Instead of the bottle containing enough sugar solution for 5 gallons at 2.8 vols, I grabbed the bottle containing priming sugar......for 2.5 gallons at 1.7 vols. Resulting in .85 total vols. Oops.

I'm curious what off flavors you noted though - I'm not "good" with IPAs yet, and this used Pacific Gem which I hadn't used before, and had some questionable Simcoe (smelled cheesy) in there too. Actually, I had before not used any of the three hops in it, now that I think of it.

As for the pecan, thank you for the constructive comments. I knew the fermentation had caused problems - we made an effort to drink this batch as quickly as possible, and as cold as possible. I thought it tasted OK at low temps, it just doesn't warm up well. I had not yet associated the taste with Clove, I was instead thinking banana - such as a banana nut beer. Clove is a complementing flavor though and I can see why I thought what I did. I intend to build a fermentation cabinet in the next few months - I'm really tired of being so susceptible to temp changes, especially since my house does not have central A/C. One day's change in weather can send the indoor temp of my house from 62 to 87 in 8 hours.

As for pitching levels..... well, I need to get over my fear of DME and starters and Pyrex. I'm a weird dude with weird hang-ups.

I think my problem with starters is the same problem I have with priming sugar - I hate boiling things, then waiting for them to cool. Well, that combined with the fact that my kitchen is a pig-sty and I hate doing anything beer related in there for fear of infection. I need to build a clean room. Then I can just spray the counter, wall, and everything else with StarSan before beginning. Maybe with an electric hot plate for boiling, I could have a yeast culturing room!

"Tri-Hop" American AIPA

I'm with Yuri here. Can't review it too much, just like I wouldn't score a corked bottle of wine. Next time, I'd suggest verifying that a batch is okay before sending it off. Just my .02, I'm by no means offended or upset.

There's a tiny hiss at uncapping, virtually no carbonation at pour, and the color is a burnt orange with a little haze. The aroma is faint and has hints of overripe fruit. On the palate, there's a definite medicinal flavor with a woody hop flavor buried far underneath it all.

But the ass-kicker, for me, is the pithy bitterness that lingers on your palate for a good 45 seconds after you swallow. This isn't a hop bitterness---this is the kind of bitterness you'd get from eating a whole fresh orange peel. Otherwise I might be able to drink this!

I saw your recipe and I don't know what the problem might be. Underpitching yeast? High/variable fermentation temps? Spoiled ingredients? Not sure, but what I do know is that this is not a problem that is caused solely by the lack of carbo. I'd brew the same recipe again, make sure your cell count is adequate at pitching, make sure you keep close tabs on your fermentation temps, and see what happens. Hopefully this is a fluke!

AIPA:

Nothing too much to add to Evan! and Yuri's comments other than:
Got a bit of band-aid.
Where is the malt?
On the plus side... good clarity??!

Pecan

Appearance:
Dark copper with fine clarity. Medium head that remained.

Aroma:
Cloves, light caramel sweetness with slight medicinal aroma. A little acrid. As it warns the cloves fade revealing some lactic qualities.

Flavor:
Getting a strong bitter sourness on the foretaste, definate band aid and some nuttyness on the aftertaste. Definate lactic profile

Mouthfeel:
Adequate carbonation and body,

Overall:
Time has not been kind. This style of beer needs to stand up for a long term storage and really needs long cool fermentation. My thought is that you have all of the hard stuff down but if you don't have the fermentation and brewspace worked out, then you're leaving too much to chance.

Chriso-

I do not remember the pecan having any off flavors when trying at the lincoln lagers meeting in April.

I do however remeber it being a it thin and the pecan nuttiness was very evident in the taste. It is interesting to see how these guys perseve it and how it aged.

Pecan Scottish 80​

Uncapping / Pouring / Aesthetics: Standard hiss, plenty of carbo with a quickly fading head, and a dirty rusty brown color.

Aroma: Slightly acidic-smelling, with a faint bit of nuttiness and plenty of roasty qualities. There's nothing here that stands out on the nose, everything just runs together. It's not unpleasant, but it doesn't give me much to go on, like a painting that's been rained on.

Palate: At first, I thought it was off. There's acidity from the nuts, I suppose, but it reminded me of a few of my infected beers. There's a nuttyness and a definite abrasive mouthfeel from the sharp carbonation. But as it warmed up, a nice malty sweetness evolved to balance out the acidity, and it got much more belgian...it started to remind me of those belgian brownish-red ales from little joints like De Dolle, after aging in my cellar for 3 years. The nuts, I think, add some oxidative qualities, like an aged Belgian. By the end, it was great!

Proximity to the Style: No way, dude, no freakin' way, not even close

Overall Impression: I wasn't sure what to think of this beer at first, but once I envisioned it as an old bottle of DeDolle (which I think might be a little infected), I loved it. Weird that way. I enjoyed the bottle, I didn't get bowled over by pecan flavors, and was pleasantly surprised at the end. I wouldn't brew this batch again, if I were you, though, because I'm thinking it might be a fluke, and in terms of scottish 80 shillings style, it's definitely flawed.

SCORE: 30/50​

​

D'Odd Porter​

Uncapping / Pouring / Aesthetics: Off-white head, 2 fingers high, tight bubble matrix, lasting head retention. Color is dark brown to black with slightly reddish brown edges.

Aroma: Tons of roast, toast, and chocolate. No hop aroma. A slight subtle coffee thing. Over top of everything, though, there's an oxidized quality to it. If I didn't know better I'd swear this was a couple years old. I've had a case of really old Brimstone Big Ale that I got for free when I worked at a wine/beer shop (8+ years old), and it's super oxidized...this has many of those notes, like sherry and figs.

Palate: I get a touch of the oxidation here, but not nearly as strong as on the nose. There's lactose/cream, chocolate, roast, and peanut butter (?). No hop flavor, but I love the depth of the palate. I swirled it in my mouth and it just coats everything and gives me a lot to think about. Just enough bitterness from the style to catch the sides of my tongue, too. Nice. Odd, though, that the tasting notes on your stat sheet said "very heavy". The first thing that I got from this beer when I tasted it was a cleanness and light mouthfeel. Not bad things, mind you, but the last thing I was thinking was "heavy". I wonder if it's dried out in bottle?

Proximity to the Style: The oxidation on the nose is off, but the rest of it is great. Very clean, crisp, roasty, chocolatey, even creamy.

Overall Impression: I'm a fan. The oxidation on the nose is certainly a flaw, but luckily it doesn't follow through to the palate, and I love tasting this beer more than smelling it. Very enjoyable overall.

SCORE: 38/50​

​

Updates:

1) The AIPA is still bad. I pulled one out of the closet the other night (there was riff-raff downstairs, blocking the way to my kegerator, and I wanted my solitude dammit!) .... At room temp, it was almost undrinkable. I can't describe it, it's not medicinal, in fact it's almost like out-of-control fusel and solvent tastes. Evan, I like where you're going with Pithiness... but I'd even say it tastes like the kind of pithy bitter that goes all the way down the back of your throat, into your gut. My stomach hurt a bit after drinking this, in fact. You're right though, that puppy is one clear beer! If only I could consistently get my reg'lar beers that clear!

JC, I'm probably gonna use you as a guinea pig to figure out these off flavors, heads up! (Seriously I'm bringing some to the next meeting.) So thanks for being good sports and trying it anyways, and I'm sorry that it's such a piece of crap. On the bright side, I can taste all 3 of the hops I put into it. I'm thinking the spoiled Simcoe may have been part of it. I really need to determine whether that Simcoe is usable, or ruined, and if it's ruined, I need to sell it off to someone who needs debittered hops.

2) I shipped 2 more packages to BierMuncher and DeathBrewer.
Each contained:
2 - 888 RIS Clearly marked cap
1 - Dryhop Honey Wheat - marked cap DHW, recipe is in my drop-down. Used Galena and Cascade in the boil and Saaz for the dry hopping. One of my favorite brews I've produced. Brewed December 07, kegged in January 08, and BMBFed in March 08.

Thanks in advance for your reviews of my 888 and my other brews!

Chriso said:

Updates:
...I shipped 2 more packages to BierMuncher and DeathBrewer.
Each contained:
2 - 888 RIS Clearly marked cap
1 - Dryhop Honey Wheat - marked cap DHW,...

Click to expand...

Thanks for the bonus beers. They're chilling nicely as we speak.

I think I'll give that DHW a sampling tonight if I can find 30 minutes of peace and quiet.

As promised...Dry Hopped Honey Wheat

Appearance - Moderate to dark amber color. Fair clarity. Good 1/2 inch head of light beige. Head appears to lace nicely.

Aroma - Not a lot jumps out. There is some maltiness initially but not a powerful whoosh of hops you might exoect from a dry hopped ale. The smell is nice. I don't know the ABV, but it has a nice sippable alcohol aroma.

Flavor - Nice strong maltiness and an immediate bitterness to balance. This has almost a belgian zing to it. Bottle conditioned I believe. Smooth down the palate and no lingering bitterness. Again, the late/dry hop isn't obvious...but were it missing, maybe then I'd notice that it was missing. Overall very flavorful and tasty. This is a rich enough flavor that it is a sipper.

Mouthfeel - Good. Good carbonation. On the high side which is good for this style. Again...something about this beer reminded me of a Belgian Strong. There was a definite alcohol warming on about the third sip . I likey.

Overall - Very nice beer. Though the dry hop didn't come through, this is a solid wheat beer with a nice malt tone and plenty of wheat beer characteristics.

Nicely done.

I did a side-by-side tasting, so I'm going to do an intentional double-post in both Chriso's and Evan!'s threads.

First impressions:
All – dark, nearly jet black color with deep tan head. Ruby highlights when held to the light. Poured at 52°F and warmed about 10° before the end of the tasting.

Chriso:
Medium head, somewhat large bubbles, diminished quickly. Little to no lacing.

Nice aroma – sweet chocolate background with roasted malt most prevalent.

Pleasant chocolate and roastiness up front. Not as complex as the others – the flavor remains fairly constant across the tongue until the finish. Acrid tannin flavor at the end.

Nice, creamy mouthfeel. Well carbonated.

Evan!:
Lots of head, very persistent. Great lacing.

Very rich aroma. Lots of sweet chocolate, vanilla, and coffee. Most inviting of the three.

Sweet vanilla, chocolate, and toffee up front, then toasted nuts. Not as roasty as the others. Balanced bitterness. Hints of raisin after a few sips.

Very creamy, carbonated perfectly. Velvet.

Yuri:
Slightly darker than the others, making it VERY black. Medium head, very fine and dense bubbles, diminished quickly. Slight lacing.

Aroma much like Chriso's, but with dark raisin/plum notes added.

Nice chocolate and roasted coffee up front. Raisin and molasses as it washes back. Assertive bitterness at the finish.

Smooth and creamy. A bit undercarbonated.

Final impressions:
Evan!'s was the sweetest and easiest to drink (either the highest FG or the best water profile management). SWMBO really liked the dark fruit notes in mine. The acrid bitterness in the finish of Chriso's made it a bit rough overall, though it was still a pretty good beer. Chriso and Evan!, the 888's were easily the best of the beers you sent.

All – quite similar beers, but subtle variations made for rather different experiences with each. All of the beers hid the high ABV quite well – no alcohol aroma or burn. The recipe is a sure winner, though I'll probably cut the bittering hops slightly if (when) I brew it again. I really enjoyed this tasting session. Easily an award winning RIS, IMHO!



Left to right: Chriso, Evan!, Yuri

ok, i actually tasted this on 08/08/08 and took notes, but have been too busy to post. i have 15 minutes to kill before i leave work and i happened to have the notes in my pocket!! sorry for the late response. You should know, i'm not judge but here goes:

RIS 08/08/08 (brewed 01/13/08)

Aroma: Pleasant chocolately nose, roasty
Appearance: Nice Thick Foamy brown head. Leaves nice lacing as head dissapates.
Flavor: Rich, Roasty...somewhat bland aftertaste. Nice chocolate as it warms. A little too bitter (possible astringency but probably just hops)
Mouthfeel: Creamy, maybe slightly low on carbonation
Overall: Very good RIS. Bitterness from hops(grains?) could be improved.

I've only had one bottle. Can't wait to try it again.

DHW (brewed 3/30/08)

I figured this was an american wheat, but wasn't sure when i reviewed it

Aroma: Nice, balanced hop/malt aroma. Slight floral aroma
Appearance: Nice lacy head, beautiful bronze color, a little hazy
Flavor: Fantastic balance. On the hoppy side, but nice malt flavor. A bit thick.
Mouthfeel: Smooth, nicely carbonated
Overall: I like it!! can't say it enough...wonderfully balanced!

All in all, i really like your beers. Keep up the good brewing! perhaps we could plan a personal swap soon!

Cheers

RIS Served at 55F
Aroma:
Chocolate with slight coffee.

Appearance:
Bottle poured nice viscous deep black color with slight mocha head. Head dissapated midway.

Flavor:
Roasty and chocolatey in the fore.
Some dark fruitynotes in the mid palate.
Finishes with a bitter slightly astringent and powder-like sensation.
Alcohol is well masked.

Mouthfeel:
Carbonation is right on as is the body.

Overall:
This was a good beer and within style. Find out the source of the astrigency because this was the only flaw that might be a deal breaker for some. Oh and perhaps the head retention.


Did you perhaps not vouraluf completely? Grains get too hot? Oversparge? I had a similar problem with a wheat and tanninc extracted.

Interesting,

I had the second bottle of Chriso's RIS last night during the track and field.

I didn't pick up on any astringency.