PVC Tower Cooling Solution

Brewer's Friend 728
Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Bradsul - just jerry-rigged a similar setup for my kegerator. Struggled for weeks with too much head on the first, second even third pour, and this fixed it COMPLETELY!

The tower is cold to the touch, the beers are pouring perfectly. Thanks man!
 
I just rigged this up in my two tap kegerator. I used about 12" of copper for each line, with tees oriented like so: -|

The horizontal leg of the tees face the back, and come within a couple of inches of the top of the cold plate running up the back and extending a bit across the ceiling of the refrigerator.

I suspect this will work well, but given that I just finished the job I will have to give it some time to find out.

Thanks to Bradsul for the great idea.
 
jeffmeh said:
I just rigged this up in my two tap kegerator. I used about 12" of copper for each line, with tees oriented like so: -|

The horizontal leg of the tees face the back, and come within a couple of inches of the top of the cold plate running up the back and extending a bit across the ceiling of the refrigerator.
Click to expand...

If you add a brass or copper plate, I used 3/8" x 3 5/8" wide brass soldered the full length on the horizontal copper tubes 17" long each leg. Nylon standoff spacers above the plate for air circulation. You'll increase the surface heat transfer area by a vast amount. American Iron and Brass happened to drop in the street a 16' x 3/8" thick x 3 5/8" slab of brass in front of my dads house, fell off their delivery truck so a freebie for us. A I & B had it insured as it was damaged and to keep it. This I put a piece to use as a increased heat transfer worked great plus used a 3" muffin fan to prevent temp stratification within the keezer as well helped cool the brass plate. First pour the same as others that follow. The electricity used by a muffin fan, the microwave oven or stove run for 5 minutes is way beyond the useage of a 3" muffin fan. Just one traffic light drag race eats more gas money than that muffin fan running for months, you have a night light in your bathroom wasting electricity? Come on if a few pennies breaks your brewing budget your in the wrong hobby.
 
Why spend the money on electricity if you don't need to? That's just being wasteful when it's not at all necessary. My kegerator has been going strong with the original setup since this thread was posted almost 3 years ago without any issues at all.
 
A 3" muffin fan is a drop in the ocean difference in my electrical bill, the Tig welder can eat 131 amps cranked up plus the 1 HP lathe running by hours a week. Ya gots to be kidding me Brad, I don't live under candle light either.
just had to throw this back at ya bro. Leave the house with the front porch lights on for 5 hours eats 14 times more than a small 3" muffin fan. Bring on California's "Brown Outs" yeah baby I have my gas generator to leave my large carbon footprint.
 
Do what you like, I have no interest in arguing with you. Those of us who enjoy being able to conserve our money and resources whenever possible will continue to do so.
 
BrewBeemer said:
If you add a brass or copper plate, I used 3/8" x 3 5/8" wide brass soldered the full length on the horizontal copper tubes 17" long each leg. Nylon standoff spacers above the plate for air circulation. You'll increase the surface heat transfer area by a vast amount. American Iron and Brass happened to drop in the street a 16' x 3/8" thick x 3 5/8" slab of brass in front of my dads house, fell off their delivery truck so a freebie for us. A I & B had it insured as it was damaged and to keep it. This I put a piece to use as a increased heat transfer worked great plus used a 3" muffin fan to prevent temp stratification within the keezer as well helped cool the brass plate. First pour the same as others that follow. The electricity used by a muffin fan, the microwave oven or stove run for 5 minutes is way beyond the useage of a 3" muffin fan. Just one traffic light drag race eats more gas money than that muffin fan running for months, you have a night light in your bathroom wasting electricity? Come on if a few pennies breaks your brewing budget your in the wrong hobby.
Click to expand...

If it does not work as is, I am thinking that I could put 7" brass rod in each of the tees to increase the thermal mass. Alternatively, I could run the copper pipe so that it touches the cold plate (or do the same with brass rod), but I would be a bit concerned that the lines would freeze. Should I be concerned about this, or are they unlikely to freeze?

Also, I really would like to avoid the fan, and keep this entirely passive.

Thanks for the input.
 
bradsul said:
Do what you like, I have no interest in arguing with you. Those of us who enjoy being able to conserve our money and resources whenever possible will continue to do so.
Click to expand...

That's why we below ya Brad have an eye on your oil reserves, LOL!

On another note when we started to have power shortage problems in Calif. years ago we went on minimum energy useage, water, gas and electric in the household. Later on they wanted everyone to cut back by 10% more. I was already at the bare minimum and hammered by going over this reduced demanded amount many times with multi tier rate increase fines. For being a Mr. nice guy I got big overcharge utility bills way over the amounts used vs being wasteful in the first place. Being a IBEW wireman I understand how these idiots think hence I use what I damn well please in energy. Sorry not to start a pissing war or OT, had to state my reasons. BTW the 3" muffin fan I use draws 190 mA a big energy wasting fan of 22.8 watts or three 7 1/2 watt night lights. Add a few cell phone chargers plus the TV's red off LED i'm way over the top. Thanks Brad, not to be OT. Carl.
 
BrewBeemer said:
That's why we below ya Brad have an eye on your oil reserves, LOL!
Click to expand...

Not to mention all that lumber they got up there. I think we could invade and take over without even firing a shot. Do they even have an army? There aren't even many people up there at all. It would be like exploiting the new world a second time. And Beaver too! Now, tell me, is there a man among you that doesn't like beaver? Let's roll, it'll be a cake walk.
 
Well catt, if they're from the eastern part just take their small sample plates they call dinner and pour some Heinz 57 all over the top, they will drop like flies in shock, not a shot fired.
Beautyful country but too wet for my liking riding scooters.
I telling ya I got hammerered big time with utilities being Mr. Nice and i'm not a tree hugger or hater. If one wants to save energy how many BTU's are wasted during a boil or the fermenting fridges, carbon foot print big time.
We can't have coal fired electricty in Calif but buy electricity from out of state that does, makes no sense. I stiil romp on my 68 F250 PU, 520" MPI in the planning stages the 482" is too small. I must go run over a few more electric cars, i'm off.
 
While I've read through the vast majority of this thread with great interest, as I'm getting ready to implement this passive tower cooling solution, forgive me if this has already been brought up, but just came to mind.

While the copper tube conductive conduit wrapping the beer lines into the tower does seem to make a significant improvement, the point was brought up that the taps would still be warm, if only for the first pour. I haven't even implemented this yet, but this seems plausible. So here's what comes to mind.

Why not run the beer up to the tap in metal lines, rather than vinyl? You would obviously have to have some sort of adapter to switch back to vinyl tubing after a short run inside the refridgerator. I don't think you would need copper. You could probably use the same type of line that attaches to the tap. The thing is I don't know if there are readily available connectors or if I would have to thread the ends myself.

This seems like it would also accomplish cooling the tower passively, but all the way up to the tap. Of course, you would be inefficient at the tap, as it itself is not insulated. But maybe instant cold pours at any time. Any thoughts?

Thanks for the post!
 
phlip said:
While I've read through the vast majority of this thread with great interest, as I'm getting ready to implement this passive tower cooling solution, forgive me if this has already been brought up, but just came to mind.

While the copper tube conductive conduit wrapping the beer lines into the tower does seem to make a significant improvement, the point was brought up that the taps would still be warm, if only for the first pour. I haven't even implemented this yet, but this seems plausible. So here's what comes to mind.

Why not run the beer up to the tap in metal lines, rather than vinyl? You would obviously have to have some sort of adapter to switch back to vinyl tubing after a short run inside the refridgerator. I don't think you would need copper. You could probably use the same type of line that attaches to the tap. The thing is I don't know if there are readily available connectors or if I would have to thread the ends myself.

This seems like it would also accomplish cooling the tower passively, but all the way up to the tap. Of course, you would be inefficient at the tap, as it itself is not insulated. But maybe instant cold pours at any time. Any thoughts?

Thanks for the post!
Click to expand...

You could run stainless steel lines and get some cooling that way. Certainly more than with plastic lines, but I believe that stainless is a fairly poor heat conductor among the metals. Copper is out though, because it should not come into contact with finished beer.
 
Argh! I purchased a couple of 7" long, 1/2" brass rods to put into the copper tees, but I neglected to factor in that the od of 1/2" id copper pipe is 5/8". The rods are too small to fit snugly into the tees. I was hoping to try to dry fit them. Would soldering work with that much space? I suppose I could just wrap it in aluminum foil for a tighter fit.
 
Solved! I had 10" of 1/2" copper pipe left over, cut it into two 5" lengths, dry-fitted into the tees, and slid the brass rods into the copper. There is not enough room in the refrigerator for the rods to fall out. I will probably need some more insulation in the tower to get the vertical copper pipes to fit snugly enough that the weight with the brass rods does not pull them down. More insulation should help the tower cooling anyway.
 
All kidding aside, a large tower or better yet a coffin that's deeper to allow for the longest shanks available installed, add a brass or copper plate double nutted centered in the tower or coffin for air flow to absorb the heat with a muffin fan drawing cold air from the bottom of your keezer. This more exposured surface area the colder your taps. A small muffin fan draws very little compared to your keezer compressor running, your foam problems solved. Sorry pissing around will gain you nothing but foam and displeasure. Sorry Brad those 2" to 3" muffin fans run forever as well draw about zero in electricty. You turn on a light at night to see, that draws 5 times more than a muffin fan in mA of current running for hours. Done replying.
 
Nothing to be sorry for, your solutions, while I'm quite sure they work, have absolutely nothing to do with the original problem this solution was designed to solve. That would be cooling the lines in the tower when you have no space in the fridge for fans etc. This has been working for me with no issues for almost 3 years, I'd call it a complete success. If it's not complicated enough for you, there's not much I can do about that.
 
Brad, up in your area you need a heater to keep the keezer from freezing your bier lines. We went thru many changes in the California central valley that gets rather hot, a fan with good insulation was the only answer to cure first tap foam. We screwed around for months before adding a fan pushing cold air from the keezer bottom in a corner a dead space behind the cornys. I called my friend and this keezer draws 3.6 amps on the run, the added muffin fan current draw isn't a factor in comparison.
We even took the complete refrigeration system out of a office 5 gallon water cooler then straightened out the expansion coil into a long parallel loop then shoved it up the tower. This worked great as the cooler temp sensor was installed to maintain temps but the added 1 amp compressor cycling way more offen than the keezer was too much vs using only a muffin fan.
 
What if I wanted to do this, but run it one floor up - like an 8' rise from my basement fridge to my kitchen counters? Any idea how to keep that cool? It is a full size fridge, so there is a bit of room - plus a freezer on top.
 
I purchased 10' of 1/2"ID soft copper, and I figure 2' for each of the hoses will give me 16" inside the keezer from the tower.

I am going to secure the pipe with cable clips.

What am I doing wrong?
 
Garyius said:
I purchased 10' of 1/2"ID soft copper, and I figure 2' for each of the hoses will give me 16" inside the keezer from the tower.

I am going to secure the pipe with cable clips.

What am I doing wrong?
Click to expand...

I didn't need that much inside the kegerator. I also too a noodle (the pool variety) and wrapped that around the copper for additional insulation. Mine has worked great for almost a year now.
 
wow tons of great info here. wasn't liking the fan option this opened a whole new option. any more pics from people who have done this. I'm a "visual learner" LOL.
 
i have a single tap and was thinking of doing this. i was wondering if it would be a better idea to run two copper pipes to allow cold air thorugh one? or would the one copper pipe be sufficent enough to cool it down?
 
Easiest way to cool your Beer Dispenser Tower is to insert a long cooling gel pack in the tower, smug against the lines. The cool air inside the kegerator is cool enough to keep the gel pack cold for as long as the system is cooling the kegerator. The gel chemicals don't require extremely cold temps to keep the lines in the mid 30's range.
 
Just my 2 cents...but I tried the copper pipe method, exactly as shown in the first post...and it didn't work. At all. I had pipe drop into the fridge about 4" and even put a "t" on the end and sent a piece of copper another 6" across the top of the fridge and it still wasn't nearly cold enough.

I've switched to the pc fan method (very easy to do and very inexpensive)...and even though I won't have a keg in the fridge to try it out until the end of the week...the tower is already unbelievably cold to the touch (still have to add some insulation to the tower "cover"). I shouldn't have any warm first pour issues again!

I'll post comments once I get my newest and fullest corny!

Later.

Jon.
 
JohnnyGunn said:
Just my 2 cents...but I tried the copper pipe method, exactly as shown in the first post...and it didn't work. At all. I had pipe drop into the fridge about 4" and even put a "t" on the end and sent a piece of copper another 6" across the top of the fridge and it still wasn't nearly cold enough.

I've switched to the pc fan method (very easy to do and very inexpensive)...and even though I won't have a keg in the fridge to try it out until the end of the week...the tower is already unbelievably cold to the touch (still have to add some insulation to the tower "cover"). I shouldn't have any warm first pour issues again!

I'll post comments once I get my newest and fullest corny!

Later.

Jon.
Click to expand...

If your trying to make the tower cold this method won't work. You have to add insulation to the inside of the tower. The added benefit for me is that in 100 degree Alabama summers my lines stayed perfectly cold in my garage keezer without the thermal load and condensation that the fan method would bring.
 
DSC_0131.jpg


DSC_0132.jpg


This is my setup, which works great. I have the copper pipe extending about 1/2' into my keezer and about halfway up the tower. My beer lines are insulated w/ Styrofoam. The keezer is set to 38F. I have never had problems with warm or foamy beer. It might be the copper or Styrofoam. It could be that the lines just aren't long enough, and the beer contained within is negligible by the time the cold beer from the keg is entering the lines. But I am extremely happy with the setup either way.
 
I goes to show that each setup is different...because my copper pipe method of cooling my lines did absolutely nothing. I had my 3/16" beer lines running inside a 1/2" copper pipe, insulated with spray foam inside a 2" ABS pipe, that went about 3/4 of the way up my tower. Total distance from inside of fridge to shank was about 18".

I'm glad it's worked out for so many others though. The main thing is that we each get to enjoy great beer in the comfort of our home...how ever we cool it!

Later guys!
 
In the RC hobby when you have plastic parts that you want to paint a common option is to dye them. For this you get Rit Dye for clothing from almost any store anywhere for about $1. 50 add it to boiling water and mix well then take off heat add parts and let sit for a while. I wonder if that would work here. You have all the basic colors to choose from. I'm thinking you can just sand the surface clean with some fine grit sandpaper and dye it and it will produce a very smooth consistent finish. It may be a pretty matte finish though so if your in to gloss you can just hit it with some clearcoat at that point.
 
Marshall081 said:
In the RC hobby when you have plastic parts that you want to paint a common option is to dye them. For this you get Rit Dye for clothing from almost any store anywhere for about $1. 50 add it to boiling water and mix well then take off heat add parts and let sit for a while. I wonder if that would work here. [...]
Click to expand...

fwiw, in my RC modeling days I used the Rit dye technique to tint plastic parts - typically canopies - and for that it was pretty effective. But as for ending up with anything opaque (I'm assuming you're thinking about dyeing a plastic tower) not so much. You just can't get the density of color needed.

That said, a tinted tower might suit someone's fancy...

Cheers!
 
tint/dye on a pvc tower could be very cool. krylon plastic spray paint is an option for opaque, but a limited color range.
 

Similar threads

sadbuttrue1982
Need help with keezer part list
Replies
18
Views
1K
Yesfan
Yesfan
Classywolf
Inwall tap system
Replies
2
Views
274
day_trippr
day_trippr
Deadalus
American Chestnut Keezer with Iron Pipe Tower
Replies
1
Views
756
Deadalus
Deadalus
T
Splitting Trunk Line Glycol
Replies
1
Views
313
Torero97
T
K
3 tap tower with long tap handles
Replies
2
Views
539
day_trippr
day_trippr
InkBird 300

Latest posts

Back
Top