Wyeast 3711 v. 3724 -- tasting notes

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heywolfie1015

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Having now made a saison with both 3724 and 3711 (EDIT: using the same grain bill, mash schedule, and hops), I was surprised at the marked differences between the two brews. Thought I would start a thread on the differences I noticed to see if others found the same.

3724:
Everything about this yeast is big: the flavor, the pepper, the spice, the frustration in getting it to fully attenuate... Super tasty and unique; classic farmhouse ale.

3711:
Although containing the traditional saison characteristics of spice, citrus, and pepper, the overall experience produces a much more mellow and (relatively) malt forward saison. Spice and pepper take a backseat to citrus and silkiness in the mouthfeel. Also super tasty, but makes for a more...contemplative beer.

So, what do fellow HBTers think? Agree/disagree? I love both strains, but will probably use them to different effect in the future. In my mind, it will be split up by time. End of spring/beginning of summer: 3724. End of summer/beginning of fall: 3711.
 
Got my 3711, making starter tonight, and brewing this weekend. I will also be interested in checking out what everyone has to say. From what I understand 3711 just loves to attenuate at most any temperature--can you say bone-dry saison mmm.
 
Got my 3711, making starter tonight, and brewing this weekend. I will also be interested in checking out what everyone has to say. From what I understand 3711 just loves to attenuate at most any temperature--can you say bone-dry saison mmm.

I took me from 1.054 to 1.000. I'd say that is pretty good attenuation. The surprising bit is how smooth it is given the attenuation.
 
thanks for the notes. i'm brewing up a 3711 saison tonight. i'm going for a low gravity one and i'm not making a starter to try and stress the yeast into throwing a bit more pepper/spice character into the beer.
 
My saison I make with 3711 is definitely citrus forward with undertones of pepper, spice and I swear I taste a little Orval style funk under it all. Can't say anything about your 3724 notes since I haven't used it, but I think you're pretty on about the 3711.

I might try to do a 3724 brew and harvest the yeast for that. Once I have stock of both yeast, I might start one with 3724 and then pitch 3711 just as the 3724 slows down just to see how it comes out. More of the spice of the first yeast with the citrus and attenuation of the second.
 
I swear I taste a little Orval style funk under it all.

You know, that's a really interesting observation. On the back end, I also tend to get some funkiness. I can't quite identify it either, but it really is quite nice.

I might start one with 3724 and then pitch 3711 just as the 3724 slows down just to see how it comes out. More of the spice of the first yeast with the citrus and attenuation of the second.

I was reading some threads on the 3724/3711 combo. Frankly, it sounds awesome. I might have to do that for my next saison, just to try it. One suggestion I saw was to originally pitch 3724 to get the Dupont-style pepper, and pitch 3711 3-4 days later (when 3724 notoriously slows down) to bat cleanup.
 
You know, that's a really interesting observation. On the back end, I also tend to get some funkiness. I can't quite identify it either, but it really is quite nice.

Good. I'm glad you tasted it too and it just wasn't my own wishful thinking. :D

I was reading some threads on the 3724/3711 combo. Frankly, it sounds awesome. I might have to do that for my next saison, just to try it. One suggestion I saw was to originally pitch 3724 to get the Dupont-style pepper, and pitch 3711 3-4 days later (when 3724 notoriously slows down) to bat cleanup.

Exactly what I was thinking. Just as the 3724 starts to peter out and flocculate early, throw in a good starter of 3711.
 
i moved brewday to tomorrow, so I'm gonna do a starter and I'm curious what temp you guys mashed at? i know 3711 will go low no problem, so I don't want to mash at ~150 if I can avoid it. i was thinking of trying 153-154, whaddya think?
 
I mashed at 149 for 90 minutes, but only because I really wanted to ensure this thing got "saison dry." Given the performance I've seen reported elsewhere, a higher temp should be fine, but I can't speak from personal experience.
 
I mashed in at 150 and let it drop a few degrees from there. But my recipe is a "mostly mash" and uses 4.5 lbs of LME so I wanted to get my mash side a little dryer to offset that.
 
You know, it's funny, but 3711's attenuation ability is making me rethink my saison recipe. Since I went from 1.056 to 1.000, I now have a 7.5% ABV beer on my hands. Way more than I was expecting. I might have to reduce the grain bill in the future to come in under 1.050, just so I have a more sessionable brew! :drunk:
 
i brewed the saison up today and ended up at exactly what i was shooting for: 1.042, given this yeast, that should end up around 5% ABV, which will be perfect. i mashed at 153, i'll be interested to see what it does. i loved the way the starter smelled and decided to add a late cascade addition to bump the citrus. will post back with results.
 
Brewed on Sunday with 3711 and cant wait to sample it. This will be my quickest beer ever, I am planning to keg it at 2 weeks.
 
got mine bottled up, i definitely pick up the orval/brett funk... it's not so much a funk, but it's nice to have in there. carbed up super quick in the bottles, it's a little young but is a very quenching beer during our heatwave right now. mine ended up at like 1.003, i mashed at 153. quick turnaround for a very nice beer. i'll try to get a picture of it up tonight.
 
Brewed on Sunday with 3711 and cant wait to sample it. This will be my quickest beer ever, I am planning to keg it at 2 weeks.

Funny, I was looking at my 3711 Saison today before work and was thinking that it really looked ready to keg even though it will only have been 2 weeks as of Fri. The yeast tore through the wort and was active for 7+ days but now has stopped and the temps have stablized.

I am anxious to try it and may have to rethink things. I was planning on the usual 3-4 weeks in primary but I question if there is much/any benefit in waiting longer. Montanaandy
 
There is a definite benefit to waiting longer. I and a few other homebrewers on this board have noticed a strong sharpness from 3711 while still green. It took my 1.062 OG saison 2 months to really settle in and get great. Just my .02.
 
There is a definite benefit to waiting longer. I and a few other homebrewers on this board have noticed a strong sharpness from 3711 while still green. It took my 1.062 OG saison 2 months to really settle in and get great. Just my .02.

Duly noted. Well I will still plan on taking a gravity reading and see where I am at. Thanks for the input. Montanaandy
 
There is a definite benefit to waiting longer. I and a few other homebrewers on this board have noticed a strong sharpness from 3711 while still green. It took my 1.062 OG saison 2 months to really settle in and get great. Just my .02.

I'm glad to hear this. While I really like the brew I made with 3711, it was a little intense and I've had it aging for a few weeks now. I intend on trying it again in a month or so.
 
There is a definite benefit to waiting longer. I and a few other homebrewers on this board have noticed a strong sharpness from 3711 while still green. It took my 1.062 OG saison 2 months to really settle in and get great. Just my .02.

Good to know! I was wondering about that. It finishes so quickly it makes it tempting to bottle right away. I think I will bulk age for 5-6 weeks then give it another 3 weeks in bottles.
 
I just kegged a Pacific Saison AG kit from AHS. I used Wyeast 3724. The first week in primary my beer stayed in the 80's (I don't have temp control for fermentation) The weather cooled things off the last two weeks in primary so I was a bit worried. My hydrometer read 1.010 and the beer was nice and clear so I went ahead and kegged. Beer tasted excellent! This yeast didn't give me any problems dropping out of suspension or stalling out. I was quite pleased with the results.

Edit: the OG of this beer was 1.044. In the end this beer was a bit phenolic, it was a bit medicinal in the aftertaste but not what I would call "band-aid" tasting. I'm not sure if this came from chlorine in my water or if it was just a by product of the yeast which is typical in belgian yeasts.
 
The last batch of saison I brewed last summer was in the fermenter for nearly a month when I was ready to bottle it, then we had a fruit fly outbreak in my area and they were all over the place and I was afraid to open the fermenter and do anything with the beer. By the time they were gone, it was 2 months in the fermenter for my saison. It was fantastic right from the get-go after I bottled it.
 
There is a definite benefit to waiting longer. I and a few other homebrewers on this board have noticed a strong sharpness from 3711 while still green. It took my 1.062 OG saison 2 months to really settle in and get great. Just my .02.

that may be due to higher gravity. my og was 1.042 and i don't get any sharpness from it. it was in the primary for 10 days or so and has only been bottled for about a week, tastes pretty nice for such a young beer.
 
that may be due to higher gravity. my og was 1.042 and i don't get any sharpness from it. it was in the primary for 10 days or so and has only been bottled for about a week, tastes pretty nice for such a young beer.

Another good point. A lower OG would lend itself to being ready more rapidly than one with a higher OG. I will have to check my notes to see where my OG was at. From what I recall it was fairly high but I may be confusing it with the 3724. Montanaandy
 
I made a goof with my most recent batch. My recipe has an OG of 1.067 and I nailed it exactly. Then today realized that the 1.067 is including the sugar addition I do after fermentation starts to taper off. Trying to decide if I wanna go ahead with that or not. It's only 1 lb after all. :D
 
yeah, I'm leaning towards adding it just because I did last time and it came out perfect. That'll move the OG from 1.067 to 1.076. If it gets down to 1.000 for the FG again I'm going to be a bit :drunk::drunk::drunk:
 
Checked it last night to see how it was doing, the krausen already fell and I missed it. hehehehe I'll check gravity tonight and add my sugar then.

edit: Checked gravity. 5 days for it to go from 1.067 to 1.010. Not bad but still has a little ways to go. Sugar solution cooling and I'll add it on the way to bed. Sample tasted as good as last time!
 
I just bottled my saison that I made with the 3724 strain. OG was 1.065 and the FG ended up being 1.003 with no sugar additions. I drank the leftovers from the bottling bucket and I think this gonna be one my standard brews.

I did not, however, notice any problems with the yeast stalling. I did swirl the carboy once a day for 3-4 days after I noticed the airlock stopped. After that I just let it sit at 75-80 degrees until I bottled, which was 3 1/2 weeks in total.
 
good god, what is it with you people and your high gravity saisons with this yeast!!! i'm consider lowering mine from 1.042 next time! :drunk:
 
I have used both and both make a great beer. I was not impressed with the 3711 at first but after aging it became awesome. Try setting a keg back for a few months and you will be in for a treat.
 
i just opened one of my last bottles from this batch, it's almost 1 year old and tastes REALLY good now.
 
Has anyone added some peppercorn to spice it up? I notice a citrus flavor that dominates that isn't present in the dupont strain and I'd like to get some more spiciness. Anyone have any experience with this?
 
Has anyone added some peppercorn to spice it up? I notice a citrus flavor that dominates that isn't present in the dupont strain and I'd like to get some more spiciness. Anyone have any experience with this?

I've used some Grains of paradise in one and pink peppercorns in another. I liked the pink better. I believe it was 4grams in 5 gallons directly into the wort at knockout.
 
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