Hard Cider Wheat Beer

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uwmgdman

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A friend of mine makes hard cider every fall. He buys ground apples from orchards, presses them and ferments them. Usually the batches are really good. This fall one of his batches turned much too dry for his liking, but otherwise fine and it's been sitting in a secondary since then.

I had the idea to brew a lowly hopped somewhat high FG wheat beer and blend the two 50/50. (5 gallons hard cider and 5 gallons of wheat beer).

Has anyone done anything like this before? I imagine there would be sufficient yeast from the wheat beer to carbonate the bottles (we will be bottling). I do have some concerns.

1) If the cider yeast is too attenuative that wouldn't make for a good idea to bottle immediate after blending the batches (read bottle bombs). That shouldn't be a problem, I would just blend the batches and let them sit for a while to make sure the cider yeast doesn't start working on the beer. Although that cider has likely fallen clear enough where it would have a rather small amount of yeast remaining. I suppose I need to see what kind of yeast he used.

2) Would this taste good? I figure this would be nice to have ready by June, a crisp refreshing hot weather malt beverage, but who knows maybe it would taste like ass. I don't really drink stuff like this so I don't have anything to compare it to. I guess it would be something like Woodchuck meets an American Wheat.

Let me know if you have $0.02 to donate.
Thanks!
:mug:
 
I think you answered question #1 yourself: just let sit a while before bottling. As to question #2, I have no idea, but I would encourage you to experiment. If it turns out great you can sell your idea for $$$. Maybe you should try a small batch of it first.
 
I don't see why it wouldn't at least taste decent. In any case, I'm sure it's worth trying - I think you might be on to something here. One thing though - I don't think I'd blend it 50/50. Maybe 25/75 or 33/66. Darn shame I didn't meet more of you Wisconsin brewers while I was back in Wisconsin myself...you guys seem to be coming out of the wood work now! :cross:
 
I have actually mixed a Hefeweizen and some way too sweet cyder. It was pretty good. I also have Apfelwein on a 3068 Cake (Hop Chunks included) and it is very good so far.
I think that these 2 reference points show that I would like what you're planning. Please try and post back.
 
uwmgdman said:
A friend of mine makes hard cider every fall. He buys ground apples from orchards, presses them and ferments them. Usually the batches are really good. This fall one of his batches turned much too dry for his liking, but otherwise fine and it's been sitting in a secondary since then.

I had the idea to brew a lowly hopped somewhat high FG wheat beer and blend the two 50/50. (5 gallons hard cider and 5 gallons of wheat beer).

Has anyone done anything like this before? I imagine there would be sufficient yeast from the wheat beer to carbonate the bottles (we will be bottling). I do have some concerns.

1) If the cider yeast is too attenuative that wouldn't make for a good idea to bottle immediate after blending the batches (read bottle bombs). That shouldn't be a problem, I would just blend the batches and let them sit for a while to make sure the cider yeast doesn't start working on the beer. Although that cider has likely fallen clear enough where it would have a rather small amount of yeast remaining. I suppose I need to see what kind of yeast he used.

2) Would this taste good? I figure this would be nice to have ready by June, a crisp refreshing hot weather malt beverage, but who knows maybe it would taste like ass. I don't really drink stuff like this so I don't have anything to compare it to. I guess it would be something like Woodchuck meets an American Wheat.

Let me know if you have $0.02 to donate.
Thanks!
:mug:


If the group have suggestions I may have material. I brewed a batch of Ed Wort's Hefeweizen today and ended up with probably a skoshe over 6 gallons of lower-than-intended gravity wort (1.040). I apparently had poor efficiency AND started my boil with too much volume. It doesn't bother me that much. More beer with less ABV is still more beer. :D But I have to face the fact that I may end up with more product than will fit in my corny keg. I was thinking that I might pull off 1-2 gallons after primary fermentation to do something with. No reason why that something shouldn't be an experiment in Hefeweizen-Apfelwein. Anyone interested in discussing possibilities?
 
BakerStreetBeers said:
If the group have suggestions I may have material. I brewed a batch of Ed Wort's Hefeweizen today and ended up with probably a skoshe over 6 gallons of lower-than-intended gravity wort (1.040). I apparently had poor efficiency AND started my boil with too much volume. It doesn't bother me that much. More beer with less ABV is still more beer. :D But I have to face the fact that I may end up with more product than will fit in my corny keg. I was thinking that I might pull off 1-2 gallons after primary fermentation to do something with. No reason why that something shouldn't be an experiment in Hefeweizen-Apfelwein. Anyone interested in discussing possibilities?


Sounds like a perfect opportunity for experimentation to me.
 
BakerStreetBeers said:
. No reason why that something shouldn't be an experiment in Hefeweizen-Apfelwein. Anyone interested in discussing possibilities?
This sounds great. I wonder if the active yeast in suspension would just take right off and ferment the apple juice. Do you add sugar, or just the juice? I am thinking that Candi sugar may fit the bill...just to keep a nice clean flavor?
 
Thanks for the feedback guys. I've got the american wheat going that we're going to use to blend. Since my buddy is wanting to use a batch a cider that he felt is a little weak in both ABV and apple taste, we're going to go with a 50/50 blend and see how it goes. We figure it should be anywhere from pretty good to damn tasty...........either way a fairly crisp, hot weather battling beverage. I'll post an update as needed.
 
Since your in Wisconsin, see if you can get your hands on some Liney's apple spice. I think it's cider and beer mixed.
 
uwmgdman said:
Since my buddy is wanting to use a batch a cider that he felt is a little weak in both ABV and apple taste, we're going to go with a 50/50 blend
Hey! You live in Madison, too!

If you want an independent review of this, let me know... :)

But seriously... if you want to reduce the apple flavor, make the cider with champagne yeast. It leaves a pleasant after-taste of apple, but doesn't have the apple flavor you expect upfront. Could be fun to experiment with...
 
I blended the hard cider and american wheat (50/50) yesterday. The batch of cider my buddy wanted to blend was one that he was a little disappointed with strength both ABV and apple flavor (had it been stronger in those departments we may have gone higher with the beer and less with the cider). The FG on my american wheat was lower than I wanted, 1.007 and the cider FG was 0.998. The blend was 1.002.

The aroma of the blend was more of the beer, the flavor was good, a lot of the cider, but the beer flavor was definitely evident and did a good job of giving a bit more mouthfeel and definitely sweetened up the finish some, took away dry wine-like finish.

I'm going to let these things age for a couple weeks and then bottle. I'll post results when they're ready. But so far seemingly so good.

I did have some concern that remaining champagne yeast that he fermented the cider with would start working on the beer, but as of this morning that hasn't happened. That cider was a few months old and been racked twice so I think most of the yeast had settled out. There was plenty of yeast still in suspension of the beer (Wyeast 1007) so carbonation won't be a problem.
 
z987k said:
Since your in Wisconsin, see if you can get your hands on some Liney's apple spice. I think it's cider and beer mixed.

I've tried it. It's wasn't too bad. This stuff is definitely different. I'm thinking it will be a great hot weather beverage.
 
An update on this experiment. The beer/cider is now carbonated in the bottles and this is something IMO will be best drank fresh, so I'll post a review now.

It's not my favorite, it's rather crisp and fairly tart, as expected. I really don't so much care for the flavor. The flavor is mainly tartness with a some apple and the wheat beer comes through more at the finish.

I hope others enjoy it more than I do. I'll post if others enjoy it more than I.

If I did it again I'll go more beer, less cider.

Just wanted to update.
 
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