Single Tier, 3 Pump, BCS-462, Automated Rig

OneHoppyGuy, can you share how you use the Wyse thin client with the BCS? Are you using it in place of a PC or Laptop? If so, how well does it work? Which model are you using? Will it work with a touch screen monitor?
Thanks, Bill

wpshadowens said:

OneHoppyGuy, can you share how you use the Wyse thin client with the BCS? Are you using it in place of a PC or Laptop? If so, how well does it work? Which model are you using? Will it work with a touch screen monitor?
Thanks, Bill

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That's good info to share, but please do so in a location out side of my build thread.

JonW said:

Yes I often have people over on brew days. I don't have my next one on the calendar yet, but I can let you know.

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That would be great. Would love to see that beast in action.

JonW said:

I am personally getting ready to build a new rig that will be very similar to my current setup (but all polished SS) and I will be looking to use the BG14's from Brewers Hardware. I like how they run silent as opposed to my jet engines running all the time.

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Now that I'm at the burner part of the build, I'm slightly worried about blowing myself up. As you look to perfect your design, have you thought about going electric?

Even though I've already welded to your plans, purchased the ball valves and created your gas line, I'm starting to consider the electric option.

603shane said:

Been there / done that, visit our website and/or Facebook page.

Unless you are running NG, your best choice is the BG-14 for 15 gallon batches. If you are automating your burners avoid using low pressure. We have a method that is for more effective and cost efficient and will glad share the information and parts list.

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Thanks. I'll check out FB and send you a PM in case I stick with LP route.

603shane said:

Now that I'm at the burner part of the build, I'm slightly worried about blowing myself up. As you look to perfect your design, have you thought about going electric?

Even though I've already welded to your plans, purchased the ball valves and created your gas line, I'm starting to consider the electric option.

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Gas is actually pretty safe, especially natural gas. Here in SoCal, I'm already at tier 5 on our electric charges (highest tier), so any additional usage is at the highest per kw charge. The cost of natural gas is very low. If outside temperatures made any difference, I might consider electric, but for here, it just doesn't make sense.

Well I'm spoiled and love brewing in climate controlled kitchen with my e-rig, Iif your worried about blowing ur self up with ng you need to realize that without proper precautions electricity can do alot more damage very quickly.

Take the proper precautions and and you will be fine whichever route you choose to go

JonW said:

That's good info to share, but please do so in a location out side of my build thread.

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Sorry Jon, didn't mean to hi-jack your thread. Conversation has been taken off-line. I do appreciate the info you have shared and have learned a lot from it, both here and on the ECC forum!
Bill

JonW said:

I am personally getting ready to build a new rig that will be very similar to my current setup (but all polished SS) and I will be looking to use the BG14's from Brewers Hardware. I like how they run silent as opposed to my jet engines running all the time.

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Jon:

On your new stand are you planning on using Natural Gas or LP? I'm planning on using NG and I hoped to use the BG14 burners. I've been searching the forum for NG recommendation for the best burner. I thought I would build a stand similar to your current stand or your buddy’s and either incorporate your idea of opening up the back of the stand or no gussets and maybe raising the keggles slightly off the stand for air / heat to escape. Atlanta’s weather is mild and I don’t have the space to brew inside with electricity. Thanks for the help.

flounder21 said:

Jon:

On your new stand are you planning on using Natural Gas or LP? I'm planning on using NG and I hoped to use the BG14 burners. I've been searching the forum for NG recommendation for the best burner. I thought I would build a stand similar to your current stand or your buddy’s and either incorporate your idea of opening up the back of the stand or no gussets and maybe raising the keggles slightly off the stand for air / heat to escape. Atlanta’s weather is mild and I don’t have the space to brew inside with electricity. Thanks for the help.

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I'm going exactly the route you're thinking. Staying with NG and either an open back or raised kettles. I'll be mocking up a single kettle mini stand with mild steel to test multiple configurations with the BG14's. Once I've decided on the mounting method of the burners and how the kettles will sit, then I'll finalize my SS stand design.

Because of where I live in Huntington Beach and where I put my rig on brew day, I need really good burner wind shields. I will likely do the raised kettle method since an open back will cause wind issues.

It's kind of funny that some people complain about non-adjustability of the wok burners, but I found no issues with that. Those things rock in most every way. My only complaint is the noise they make. I usually have several people hanging out on brew day and watching a game or listening to music and I'd just like a quieter environment.... thus the BG14's.

Do you use false bottoms in all three of your brew pots?

twalsh said:

Do you use false bottoms in all three of your brew pots?

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No, only the mash tun.

Thanks. In the youtube video you have (page 7) it looked like there was a false bottom in the HLT, which seemed a bit excessive, but also made me wonder if you were using them in all 3.

Thanks again.

twalsh said:

Thanks. In the youtube video you have (page 7) it looked like there was a false bottom in the HLT, which seemed a bit excessive, but also made me wonder if you were using them in all 3.

Thanks again.

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Wow, you don't miss a thing! Yes, at that point in time I was using a false bottom in the HLT. Reason for it is that when I did a double brew day, I would take the MLT off the rig to clean it out and slide the HLT over in place of the MLT. I could then get it filling and heating while I cleaned the first MLT. Once cleaned, the MLT would go back in place of the HLT. It was just for allowing overlap of stuff to maximize time.

I no longer do that as I use the tippy dump now to quickly dump the MLT and I rinse it in place.

Jon, I've been reviewing also using HSIs on the burners. If the burner goes out, does it automatically relight?

The_Canmancan said:

Jon, I've been reviewing also using HSIs on the burners. If the burner goes out, does it automatically relight?

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No, not with my setup. You can get automated gas valves with flame rectifiers that will sense and re-light. It's never been an issue for me and I don't run the system unattended.

The_Canmancan said:

Jon, I've been reviewing also using HSIs on the burners. If the burner goes out, does it automatically relight?

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I use the honeywell S8910U ignition model with my hsi's with flame rectification. It works really well

3 BCS outputs to 3 120V SSR's for the gas valves. Jon, I see that you have the gas valves plugged into the outlets numbered 16,18,and 20. My 3 gas valves are 120v with two wires. I want to know how and if there might be a better way to get power the gas valves rather than using the outlets?

rkjones1953 said:

3 BCS outputs to 3 120V SSR's for the gas valves. Jon, I see that you have the gas valves plugged into the outlets numbered 16,18,and 20. My 3 gas valves are 120v with two wires. I want to know how and if there might be a better way to get power the gas valves rather than using the outlets?

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You can just hardwire them. I only used outlets for convenience. I did have a brew day where a solenoid on a gas valve failed and in about 5 minutes I was able to swap a solenoid from a different valve and plug it into the proper outlet for continued operation.

For a newbie, this is just plain amazing! I'm not a welder or techie or electrician.... BUT have gotten so much logic from this detailed thread that my learning curve has been drastically reduced! Thanks, Jon

zzzzzzzzz said:

For a newbie, this is just plain amazing! I'm not a welder or techie or electrician.... BUT have gotten so much logic from this detailed thread that my learning curve has been drastically reduced! Thanks, Jon

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Thank you for the kind words, I appreciate.

Hey JonW, just put the finishing touches on my system that borrowed quite a few ideas from yours. At first I didn't want to do 3 pump but I'm beginning to want it now. What did you use for an enclosure for the expansion board?

chappyman7 said:

Hey JonW, just put the finishing touches on my system that borrowed quite a few ideas from yours. At first I didn't want to do 3 pump but I'm beginning to want it now. What did you use for an enclosure for the expansion board?

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There is no expansion board. Do you mean the BCS or the relay board? The relay board is in a project case. Both are mounted under the stand. My lower shelf is sealed w/ silicone around the tubing, so no drips get to anything under the shelf.

Ah yes I meant relay board thank you. Great work. Hoping to get mine fine tuned this evening and get some photos up. Cheers!

Question for you guys - has anyone tried using aluminum t-slots for a build? Any downsides? Right now I have a TopTier, but am liking this design better

T-slot:

chiefwigms said:

Question for you guys - has anyone tried using aluminum t-slots for a build? Any downsides? Right now I have a TopTier, but am liking this design better

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There's several people that have made rigs from this. Check out this thread and there should be a few in there: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/show-us-your-sculpture-brew-rig-46578/

JonW said:

There's several people that have made rigs from this. Check out this thread and there should be a few in there: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/show-us-your-sculpture-brew-rig-46578/

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yup - found um... apparently the more prevalent term is 8020 or strut..

by the way - awesome build!!!

JonW said:

The power supply you get really depends on how much current you need. I used 12V ball valves for the liquid side, but I used 120V valves for the gas solenoids because the 12V ones needed a lot of current. 12V solenoids need something like 800 mA, so for 3 valves, you need 2.4 amps. That's a lot of 12V current. Instead, use the 120V gas valves and trigger them with an SSR just like the pumps. They will only need a couple of milliamps to trigger. The 12V ball valves only use something like 40 mA to operate. A single 1 amp 12V power supply can run all the ball valves and relay board, with plenty of current to spare.

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I am purchasing a 12v 1A power supply. Would you look at the attached pdf and see if I am wiring this correctly?

View attachment 8 channel relay module board.pdf

Yeah, that looks good.

I wired mine the same, but with a little twist. I actually cut traces on the board and hardwired the input feed for the common pin to 12V + (pos) and then wired the actual common terminal to 12V - (neg). You also have to cut the trace to make this work - I used a dremel to cut it. The reason for this is so I didn't have to use a terminal strip or wire nut and it made the attachment of each valve to the 3 terminals a cleaner setup. I'm not advocating for others to do it this way, I'm just showing how I accomplished it.

Awesome build Jon, I just moved back to Socal after living in Az and Tx for far to long. I'd love to come check out a brew day some time in the future. what club are you in and have you heard of the Brewluminati's they are a no club, club so to speak who has monthly meetings at Out of the Park Pizza in Anaheim Hills the last Thursday of each month. we are holding a club 21A Pumpkin SHowdown competition and all entries to be turned in by November 21st. If you have a some pumpkin beer on hand bottle it up and enter the contest.

-=Jason=-

Thanks Flomaster. Yes, I've heard of Brewluminati. I'm in Brewcommune. Some of the luminati guys used to be in our club. We're meeting at OPP this month on the 19th. Our meetings are open for any brewers to attend - you don't have to be a member. Come by and check it out.

Awesome build! I'm modeling some of my build on your detailing - one question - are the glowfly wired series or parallel?

bodhi314 said:

Awesome build! I'm modeling some of my build on your detailing - one question - are the glowfly wired series or parallel?

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Parallel. Technically, you could use a separate output for each one and only have them fire with their respective burner, but I just wired them together so that when any burner fires, they all ignite.

Done

JonW said:

I started having some intermittent problems with my spark igniters. I swapped them out for the hot surface igniters (HSI's) and they are working great. They are powered by 120V, so I wired all three of them to a single SSR. The BCS powers them up 5 seconds before opening the gas valve and continues to keep them on for another 5 seconds after the valve is opened. They are working flawlessly. I'm now going to suggest these to anyone doing an igniter system like mine.

You can search ebay for "Honeywell Hot Surface Igniter". Model number is Q3200U1004.

This is the one I used:

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Jon, any idea how much amperage the glow plugs pull? I looked on Honeywell's site and couldn't find that information.

lgoolsby said:

Jon, any idea how much amperage the glow plugs pull? I looked on Honeywell's site and couldn't find that information.

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Each one was about 1 amp. At that level, I decided to just wire them all together on one SSR and have them fire at the same time regardless of which burner valve was opening.

I am sure you get asked this a billion times... I hope you will or can give me just a minute of your time. I am building a brew stand very similar to yours and bsomogyi (Coloradoan).. What interests me most about yours is your similarity to mine in that I want to control fermenters and serving units as well from my BCS. I plan to separate the brew stand from the BCS and thus I need a way to connect the Stand to the BCS. I know you use CAT5 for your connections.. I was wondering if you could explain that set up to me? How many connections and to what are they connected.. I plant to have 6 valves (liquid) and 2 valves (gas) for HERMS set up.. Your brewstand (as I remember it) has the pumps plugged into 110 outlets on bottom of stand.. Do you have relays also on the stand that provide power to outlets? I assume the cat 5 provides power to valves when switched on by BCS? Any info is greatly appreciated..

Bru-noob said:

I am sure you get asked this a billion times... I hope you will or can give me just a minute of your time. I am building a brew stand very similar to yours and bsomogyi (Coloradoan).. What interests me most about yours is your similarity to mine in that I want to control fermenters and serving units as well from my BCS. I plan to separate the brew stand from the BCS and thus I need a way to connect the Stand to the BCS. I know you use CAT5 for your connections.. I was wondering if you could explain that set up to me? How many connections and to what are they connected.. I plant to have 6 valves (liquid) and 2 valves (gas) for HERMS set up.. Your brewstand (as I remember it) has the pumps plugged into 110 outlets on bottom of stand.. Do you have relays also on the stand that provide power to outlets? I assume the cat 5 provides power to valves when switched on by BCS? Any info is greatly appreciated..

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My current configuration is a bit different as I now have a BCS-460 mounted on the wall for the kegerator, fermenter and smoker and my BCS-462 is permanently mounted under the bottom shelf of my rig. However, I will explain the setup as I previously had it with the 462 mounted in the wall cabinet and controlling the kegerator, fermenter and brew rig.

On my rig, I have 7 SSR's that control (3) 110V pumps, (3) 110V gas valves and 1 SSR for the burner igniters. There is also an 8 channel relay board that controls the 6 liquid ball valves and the audible buzzer/alarm. There are also 4 temp probes on the rig.

I have the BCS wired to 3 Cat-5 data jacks. One jack for the SSR's, one for the low voltage relays and 1 for the temp probes. Basically, I wired from the BCS to 3 jacks on the wall and wired the stand from the relays/probes to 3 jacks on the stand. I then use Cat5 cables to connect the two.

There is no "power" going across the cat-5 wiring - it is the low level outputs from the BCS only. I have a single 110V cord on the stand to plug it in and it provides power to the SSR's and a 12V supply mounted under the rig.

Do you have a part list for the build interested in a build with motorized valves, just finished a glycol chiller for my fermenter looking to build a nice brewery in the garage and love your setup...

I will be heavily copying this design, but will be building a strut version of the stand. Thanks for all the great ideas.