CPVC vs PVC

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treesmcgee

treesmcgee

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My buddy recently just built a MLT out of PVC and I read online that the procedure to make a MLT called for CPVC, is there a problem with using PVC over CPVC or is it just a performance aspect or what?

:rockin:
 
CPVC would be the best as it is intended for high temperature usage. But as the manifold is not going to be under pressure, your buddy will be fine. And there isn't likely to be anything leeched from the PVC due to the temperatures involved in mashing.
 
You want the CPVC usually a cream color. PVC will leach Cl gas at high temps. Its a lousy ass plastic in general. I would go with copper if I were him.
 
We'll we've got some conflicting results here, some saying PVC will leech toxic chemicals into his brew, others saying that hes alright! Is this a serious serious problem, or can he hold off for a couple batches?


Edit: And, he mashed a batch 2 days ago and has it fermenting, should we discard this batch because of chemical "leeching" as you guys are stating, or is it okay for us to drink when its done. I'd really like to keep this batch we did because it looked and smelled really good going into the fermenter, but I mean... come on.. chemicals :(
 
treesmcgee said:
We'll we've got some conflicting results here, some saying PVC will leech toxic chemicals into his brew, others saying that hes alright! Is this a serious serious problem, or can he hold off for a couple batches?
Click to expand...

This is PVC
Maximum Temperature: 158°F 70°C
Minimum Temperature: -13°F -25°C
Autoclavable: No
Melting Point: 176°F 80°C
Tensile Strength: 6,500 psi


CPVC is
Max. Operating Temp. (°C) 90 (194*F)
Melting Temp. Range (°C) 220 - 240 (428*F)

CPVC has a softening point of 200*F
So as you see the PVC will start melting at mash temps
 
Thanks for the info FSR. We'll definitely be building a new one, and more than likely with copper tubing, or at least CPVC. Also, as I edited into my last post, we already brewed a batch using this PVC manifold and I wanna know if it is safe to drink. Thirdly, we've got some rubber washers on the inside, to seal the hole we drilled to connect to manifold. I guess my question is if those washers are safe.
 
I used PVC when I didn't know better and my manifold lasted for two batches before it was too warped to work anymore. I didn't have any problems with leeching, but obviously a manifold that lasts is what you want. ;)
 
Yeah I hear that, we decided to make it out of copper. I will have to post pictures of it to ask the question how to seal the hole we drilled. Its a 3/4 inch hole we drilled with a 3/4 inch boring bit, and I was wondering what type of sealant or washers or what not I could use to seal this hole so no wort seeps into the lining of my cooler.
 
Don't have him toss the batch. The temperatures are only going to play hell with the pipe and fittings leading to early failure. They are not going to leech anything harmful out into the beer during the time that the mash is going on. There is more chlorine in the CPVC fittings than there is is in the PVC.

Then again some PVC fittings are better than others I suppose. I use fittings manufactured by the plastic pipe fitting company I've worked for for the last 25 years. My next manifold will be made from fittings made for fire protection systems. Not because they aren't going to let anything nasty get in my wort, but because they will be bullet-proof and a nifty orange color.
 
Saccharomyces said:
I used PVC when I didn't know better and my manifold lasted for two batches before it was too warped to work anymore. I didn't have any problems with leeching, but obviously a manifold that lasts is what you want. ;)
Click to expand...

You didn't have any problems with leaching?

Did you do a chemical analysis on your beer to prove this?

As a chemical engineer I would NOT use pvc or cpvc for anything coming in contact with your beer. Use an FDA approved plastic or you WILL get leaching. Its not only the chlorides that leach out but all the additives (I make chemical additives for PVC) including bromine, antimony, melamine, molybdenum, etc.

I repeat DO NOT USE PVC OR CPVC FOR BREWING!!!!
 
stromam said:
You didn't have any problems with leaching?

Did you do a chemical analysis on your beer to prove this?

As a chemical engineer I would NOT use pvc or cpvc for anything coming in contact with your beer. Use an FDA approved plastic or you WILL get leaching. Its not only the chlorides that leach out but all the additives (I make chemical additives for PVC) including bromine, antimony, melamine, molybdenum, etc.

I repeat DO NOT USE PVC OR CPVC FOR BREWING!!!!
Click to expand...

Isn't cpvc designed for hot potable water? It's in my house as well most houses built in the last 30 years.
 
There have been a lot of things used in construction that aren't good for you.

Like I said, I make plastic additives used in PVC and CPVC and I would never (knowingly) drink hot water from CPVC piping, let alone brew in it.

PEX is the way to go for potable water (the high quality pure PEX, not the cheap opaque stuff).
 
stromam said:
I repeat DO NOT USE PVC OR CPVC FOR BREWING!!!!
Click to expand...

Congratulations on finding a thread from 2008. ;)

This has been discussed ad nauseum and the consensus is CPVC is acceptable at mashing temperatures (~170F). PVC is not acceptable.

Move on...
 
stromam said:
There have been a lot of things used in construction that aren't good for you.

Like I said, I make plastic additives used in PVC and CPVC and I would never (knowingly) drink hot water from CPVC piping, let alone brew in it.

I can understand the PVC objections and I wouldn't allow it my brew system either, however considering all my drinking enters my brewpot through my cpvc supply lines of my home plumbing system I can't see the two foot manifold piping being a major concern. If I recall correctly it's rated for 170 degrees and i didn't use the adhesives for the joints so it cleans up easily too.
Click to expand...
 
lamarguy said:
Congratulations on finding a thread from 2008. ;)

This has been discussed ad nauseum and the consensus is CPVC is acceptable at mashing temperatures (~170F). PVC is not acceptable.

Move on...
Click to expand...

Its called the internet and it allows you to find things from the past.

Someday it might happen to you.

I am simply trying to give some additional insight to the health and safety of my fellow homebrewers that I believe I have the authority to give since I work in the plastics industry making additives FOR PVC and CPVC.

The chemicals that I engineer usually have an MSDS associated with them and many of them you would not consider eating, so why submit yourselves to them if you can avoid it.

If you would still like to use those things for brewing I cannot stop you, but if you choose to heed my advice you will be safer and healthier, and so will your homebrew fans.

There is a reason you will not find any PVC or CPVC in a professional brewery, they are not food safe.

I'm sorry if my comments touched you in a bad place, but as with anything on the internet (again you will learn this in time), you can choose to ignore what other people say.
 
matt2778 said:
stromam said:
There have been a lot of things used in construction that aren't good for you.

Like I said, I make plastic additives used in PVC and CPVC and I would never (knowingly) drink hot water from CPVC piping, let alone brew in it.

I can understand the PVC objections and I wouldn't allow it my brew system either, however considering all my drinking enters my brewpot through my cpvc supply lines of my home plumbing system I can't see the two foot manifold piping being a major concern. If I recall correctly it's rated for 170 degrees and i didn't use the adhesives for the joints so it cleans up easily too.
Click to expand...

Its only rated to 170 based on its ability to withstand its rated internal pressure without rupturing, that doesn't make it food safe.

If you are using cold water from CPVC lines that is much different then mashing at high temperatures. The rate at which chemicals leach out of plastics is a function of temperature and some will not leach out at all at low temperatures.
Click to expand...
 

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