very little carbonation, but has head

Already i have yet to find the answer to my problems on here. I have kegged 4 beers now and neither of them have been up to the correct carbonation. I have done the set it and forget it method, the 30 psi, and different pressures.I actually did 30 for a couple of days then 25 for 1 then to 18 for another 2-3 days. The keg is cold when carbonating. Whenever i pour the beer the first one usually has some good head but the beer is usually somewhat flat. Second one has less head and still pretty flat. I know everyone will say, line length, leak, and all the other things people say. I have checked everything and none of the "solutions" people say work. I do pour from a picnic tap so I back the pressure down to about 4 or 5 psi. Yes obviously there is carbonation because of the head, but i just dont understand why the beer is flat. Can someone give me something that finally works other than the usual answers you find if you search about the topic. I would greatly appreciate it!!

Put it at serving pressure, and temperature for 2-3 weeks as per this chart. Depending on the beer's temperature, in the keg, will determine what PSI you set it to for the entire time. IMO/IME, jerking around with all the different pressure sets is the source of your issue. This has worked for me, time and again. It's also how a lot of people do it.

I have tried that. I get the same results ;(

monkey1 said:

I have tried that. I get the same results ;(

Click to expand...

Temperatures of the beer and psi you're using?? Also, how long are your gas lines??

40 degrees. Line is about 4 feet. That's why I run it at 4 or 5 psi. Fills a class at a good speed.

monkey1 said:

40 degrees. Line is about 4 feet. That's why I run it at 4 or 5 psi. Fills a class at a good speed.

Click to expand...

Four foot of gas or beer line? You should have long enough beer lines (3/16" ID) to serve at normal pressure for the CO2 volumes. Sounds like your setup is all out of whack.

Yes 4 foot beer line. I know I should have a longer line but your saying serving it at a lower psi to compensate for the short line will do a solidly nothing.

monkey1 said:

Yes 4 foot beer line. I know I should have a longer line but your saying serving it at a lower psi to compensate for the short line will do a solidly nothing.

Click to expand...

I'm using 10' beer lines (3/16" ID) without issue. I also have my beers at serving pressure for the entire time. At 40F, that's in the 10-14 psi range. With a dual body regulator, I feed two manifolds that feed my four kegs. Browns and porters at lower pressure than my pale ales and IPAs.

The lower pressure is sapping the carbonation OUT of you beer. Its actually doing more harm than good.

Sounds like you've only had the beer kegged for about a week or so? I usually set my guage to about 18-24 psi for about a week and then drop it down to 10-14 and it takes 2-3 weeks on average for the beer to hit the right carbonation.

I don't think time is the issue I have carbed for multiple weeks at 15 on another beer. So when I drop the beer down to 5 psi it does kill the carb? Why would that happen? I'm only dropping it down to serve and then when I store I put it back to the right psi.

opteek said:

Sounds like you've only had the beer kegged for about a week or so? I usually set my guage to about 18-24 psi for about a week and then drop it down to 10-14 and it takes 2-3 weeks on average for the beer to hit the right carbonation.

Click to expand...

IMO/IME, better off just using the correct serving pressure from the start. No adjustments needed, at all. Plus, you don't need to release pressure from the keg this way. I suppose if you have ONE keg, you can do that, but I serve four from one tank, fitted with a dual body regulator.

Also, IME, the line length calculation tools work for some people, but are bunk for others. IF you used one and you have to put the pressure to 4-5 psi in order to get a decent pour out of the tap, it's bunk. I'd rather have a few seconds longer pour time and have it at the correct pressure than have to crank the pressure to <1/3 just to avoid a glass of foam.

monkey1 said:

I don't think time is the issue I have carbed for multiple weeks at 15 on another beer. So when I drop the beer down to 5 psi it does kill the carb? Why would that happen? I'm only dropping it down to serve and then when I store I put it back to the right psi.

Click to expand...

You're F'ing around with it when you don't need to. You're purging the keg, once you set it to the LOW pressure, then trying to replace what you purged by cranking it back up.

Look at it this way. You started driving on a trip going 100mph. Then shortly into it, you wised up and went down to about 80mph. Then you took a break and decided to drive at 15mph for a while, then go up to 70mph. Does that sound smart to you??

IF you have to turn the pressure DOWN just to serve, your system is F'd UP... It's just a fact of things. You should NOT need to turn the pressure DOWN just to serve from the keg.

Yeah definitely it would be better. But I'm still wondering why it's like that. You said it's taking the carb out of the beer. Is actually doing that and why? Or is it just a guess. I will eventually get a longer line but I honestly don't see it changing anything raising the psi to serve. There has to be a way to serve out of a 4 foot line for parties and stuff. I mean you get sanke keg and use a ****ty pump tap and 2 foot line, it will usually come out fine after the usually ****ty foam first pour

You cannot compare a commercially carbonated brew, in keg, to what you're doing. They carbonate in a huge vessel/tank then fill the kegs under pressure. You're then pouring a glass of foam before using a hand pump that is probably putting about 3-5 psi of pressure into the keg. You also have to drink that fast, since it will taste like ass after a while due to oxidizing the beer with atmospheric gasses.

It's like trying to compare how a standard diesel engine to a F1 race car engine.

I understand that it's best to serve at the right pressure. But I'm still wondering why it isn't carbonated at my ghetto setup. How is it possible for all of the beer to be almost flat when I have a pretty solid pour with the right amount of head. I've actually had some other beers with very little head and it's still flat. It's not like it's getting the co2 knocked out

monkey1 said:

I understand that it's best to serve at the right pressure. But I'm still wondering why it isn't carbonated at my ghetto setup. How is it possible for all of the beer to be almost flat when I have a pretty solid pour with the right amount of head. I've actually had some other beers with very little head and it's still flat. It's not like it's getting the co2 knocked out

Click to expand...

What's the beer line ID you're using??? If 1/4", that's another issue.

Do this... Get some 3/16" Bevlex beer line. Enough to set up your taps at 1' of line per PSI of CO2. Get MFL ball lock (or pin lock if that's your keg typ) and the swivel nuts to match. Connect up the new lines to the liquid QD's and posts. Put the kegs at serving pressure (per the chart I linked to earlier) and leave them alone for 2-3 weeks. Then pour a pint without dicking around with the regulator.

It's 3/16. Im more worried about my current line length because that's what im going to be serving mostly. I will get a longer line eventually. Obviously when I serve with a line that's not cold it will screw with the first pour as always so I'm not worried about that. There has to be a logical explanation to why it does or doesn't work.

monkey1 said:

It's 3/16. Im more worried about my current line length because that's what im going to be serving mostly. I will get a longer line eventually. Obviously when I serve with a line that's not cold it will screw with the first pour as always so I'm not worried about that. There has to be a logical explanation to why it does or doesn't work.

Click to expand...

Yeah, your system is NOT balanced, or it's in SNAFU mode... Take your pick. It sounds like you're also in denial about the line length being at least a contributing factor here. Since you've tried just about everything else BUT changing the line length... Also, IME, how long the line is doesn't hurt a pour IF you have it set correctly. At the pressures I have MY kegs at, 10' of line gives me a good pour under all of them. Not too fast, not too slow, and I don't have carbonation issues. Or blasting glasses of foam out. If you put your kegs back up to 12-14 psi and left them there, what would you get? If the answer is glasses of foam, then your lines are TOO SHORT...

I'm leaving the dead horse now. Good luck getting your system balanced.

Haha no I'm not I denial I just asked why or why not it doesn't work when I have the right pressure set on it. I was simple asking for a real answer on it. If you need 10' for your psi what's to say 4' won't work for 4-5 psi. I mean that should be somewhat balanced with the line and pressure right? It's just strange how it's a good pour and it's not carbed correctly. If anyone could help me on this other than the same answers he gave I would appreciate it.

monkey1 said:

Haha no I'm not I denial I just asked why or why not it doesn't work when I have the right pressure set on it. I was simple asking for a real answer on it. If you need 10' for your psi what's to say 4' won't work for 4-5 psi. I mean that should be somewhat balanced with the line and pressure right? It's just strange how it's a good pour and it's not carbed correctly. If anyone could help me on this other than the same answers he gave I would appreciate it.

Click to expand...

4' beer lines would work great if you like your beer carbonated to 4-5psi. Your 4ft lines will not work because even though you lower the pressure to 4-5psi, your beer is "over carbonated" for that pressure. As your beer is moving (agitation), it drops carbonation naturally trying to match the 4-5psi pressure in your system, so by the time it hits the glass, your beer is only at carbonation levels equal to 4-5psi.

Think of it this way, take a cold bottle of coke. Open it up and drink some. Put the cap on, shake it up, and put it back in the fridge. Come back in an hour and have a taste of the coke. It's going to have a lot less carbonation, and your basically doing the same thing with your keg of beer.

No doubt you've got good money and time into your setup, so why drink bad beer for the sake of $10 of hose. Go buy it and you'll be much happier when the only time you need to touch the system is to refill the kegs!

Antler said:

4' beer lines would work great if you like your beer carbonated to 4-5psi. Your 4ft lines will not work because even though you lower the pressure to 4-5psi, your beer is "over carbonated" for that pressure. As your beer is moving (agitation), it drops carbonation naturally trying to match the 4-5psi pressure in your system, so by the time it hits the glass, your beer is only at carbonation levels equal to 4-5psi.

Think of it this way, take a cold bottle of coke. Open it up and drink some. Put the cap on, shake it up, and put it back in the fridge. Come back in an hour and have a taste of the coke. It's going to have a lot less carbonation, and your basically doing the same thing with your keg of beer.

No doubt you've got good money and time into your setup, so why drink bad beer for the sake of $10 of hose. Go buy it and you'll be much happier when the only time you need to touch the system is to refill the kegs!

Click to expand...

thank you that seems like a logical explanation. Now i will def try a longer line, I just didnt understand why 4 feet didnt work. thanks Ill try it and report back