Electric vs Gas

So I am on the fence trying to decide to go electric or gas for my all grain system. I like the idea of no fumes to worry about going with electric but I have a few questions.....
1. For those of you out there using three heated kettles how much have you seen your electric bill go up?

2. How much longer does it take to get the wort or the HLT water up to temps? Does it take more time compared to when you use gas to get to a rolling boil for the wort?


Ok that should be a good starting point.....

Thanks in advance...

Brew-on

BeerguyNC61 said:

So I am on the fence trying to decide to go electric or gas for my all grain system. I like the idea of no fumes to worry about going with electric but I have a few questions.....
1. For those of you out there using three heated kettles how much have you seen your electric bill go up?

2. How much longer does it take to get the wort or the HLT water up to temps? Does it take more time compared to when you use gas to get to a rolling boil for the wort?


Ok that should be a good starting point.....

Thanks in advance...

Brew-on

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Just do a search on HBT for these answers this horse has been beat to death...the bottom line is electric is way cheaper, and just as fast if not faster...I am still building my build but it is the way to go IMHO, I am sure others will chime in as well, good luck, all the best.

The best part is that you won't likely run out of electricity in the middle of a boil!

I figure that a 5 gallon batch costs me about a third of a propane tank, or close to $7. According to Kal at http://theelectricbrewery.com/ you should expect to use about $1-2 of electricity.

Kal lists these advantages, but there are more benefits than he has listed

What are the benefits of brewing with electricity vs. gas?

There are many benefits to brewing with electricity vs. gas:

• Easier precise control of temperature
• Safer for indoor brewing (no poisonous gases, no emissions)
• Absolutely silent (the bigger gas burners required for brewing sound like jet engines)
• Much more efficient use of energy (our 5500W heating elements produce ~20,000 BTUs of heat and will outperform an 80,000 BTU propane burner)
• No tanks to refill
• Cheaper to run (use $1-2 in electricity instead of approximately half a tank of propane per batch)

We don't know of one brewer who, after switching to electric, wished they were still using gas.

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Thanks TrainSafe!
Have you always brewed electric or did you start out with gas? If so does the rolling boil take about the same amount of time? How about total system price? Does it run the same for a gas system?

Sorry if these have been answered somewhere else on HBT but if you can't ask a simple question here without having to search through tons of older post why bother being a member here......

If you have the existing wiring, or can afford an electrician, or a DIY electrician -- go electric.

Else stick to gas.

I was a Construction Electrician in the Navy so I can handle wiring the outlet. But even better I have a 220 outlet that can be easily swung down to the brew room.

The electrical is the easy part. What scares me would be drilling into some brand spanking new brew pot with a drill! :cross:

S

BeerguyNC61 said:

Thanks TrainSafe!
Have you always brewed electric or did you start out with gas? If so does the rolling boil take about the same amount of time? How about total system price? Does it run the same for a gas system?

Sorry if these have been answered somewhere else on HBT but if you can't ask a simple question here without having to search through tons of older post why bother being a member here......

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I am currently on gas. I use a turkey fryer stand, and it frustrates the heck out of me. I'm in the planning stages of my electric build. Hoping to start construction in the coming weeks.

From what I've seen, the times are roughly comparable. Hard to say precisely because there are a variety of gas burners and a selection of various wattage elements.

With respect to cost, that is the kicker. It depends on if you need to buy new pots, or are just modifying your existing pots. The build is expensive, but everyone who has undertaken it has been very satisfied.

Getting back into brewing after ten years, two moves from Vermont to Colorado and then finally here in North Carolina. In the process of those moves all the brewing gear is gone (long story). So I will be getting everything new!

Just ordered a Rebel Mill grain crusher and next will be a trip to the LHBS to get the carboys,bottles etc. Guess one piece at a time......

Thanks

BeerguyNC61 said:

I was a Construction Electrician in the Navy so I can handle wiring the outlet. But even better I have a 220 outlet that can be easily swung down to the brew room.

The electrical is the easy part. What scares me would be drilling into some brand spanking new brew pot with a drill! :cross:

S

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PM me if you'd be interested in a greenlee punch to make the element holes. You cover postage both ways.

Mike

Thanks Mike!! I have access to a Greenlee set but the offer is awesome!

I have been looking over the Electric Brewery site and it seems simple to add the element hole, its just getting over that initial thought of just spending a bunch on three Blichmann pots...... Do they seal up without any leak issues? How easy is it to clean up after brewing? I am imaging the underside of the element must be a pain to get clean but then maybe it's a newbie thing.....


Thanks again
S

I like my brew rig to run on electric, and my car to run on gas.

And now back to our regulary scheduled programming.....

i did 5Gal batches with a 55000 btu propane burner for a long time...

finaly switched to electricity, i have 2 3000w elements in my kettle making 6000 watts of power... I do 10 Gal with this, and if anything it's a bit faster then my 55000 btu was on a 5 gal batch...

I LOVE electric brewing... would never go back...

Thanks for the info G Brew
What made you double the elements?

It was insanely difficult for me to come to terms with the idea that was going to drill a hole in a perfectly fine keggle. Now I can't get my buddy to it. It's that window where it's half done and you have a hole in a quality product and you think, "I did that." lol. Your not done! It'll work!

I'm looking at Stout's pots right now.... Looks like they will customize all three pots for an electric system. Anyone out there in Electric Brewery-ville use them?

BeerguyNC61 said:

So I am on the fence trying to decide to go electric or gas for my all grain system. I like the idea of no fumes to worry about going with electric but I have a few questions.....
1. For those of you out there using three heated kettles how much have you seen your electric bill go up?

2. How much longer does it take to get the wort or the HLT water up to temps? Does it take more time compared to when you use gas to get to a rolling boil for the wort?


Ok that should be a good starting point.....

Thanks in advance...

Brew-on

Click to expand...

1. I haven't noticed any increase in my electric bill to speak of, maybe a couple of dollars.

2. I have a 5500 w element in my HLT- so it's FAST. I can bring 10 gallons of water up to 180 degrees in 10 minutes or so. For my BK, I have a 4500 w element and I can bring my wort to a rolling boil in a really quick amount of time (the most I've ever done is a 10 gallon batch, starting with 12 gallons of wort). I never timed it, though. When I was using propane outdoors, on windy days I could barely get a rolling boil in 45 minutes. So, it's much faster for me.

I'm using keggles for the HLT and BK so I'm limited to about 13 gallons in a boil so maybe a bigger BK would be nice.

Thanks Yooper!
You have tons of pics! Which pics are of your most recent rig? Did you make the controller yourself? I am looking to brew either 5 or 10 gallon batches so I am guess 15 gallon pots should cover all that.
So many things to figure out... Like what kind of stand to get??

BeerguyNC61 said:

Thanks Yooper!
You have tons of pics! Which pics are of your most recent rig? Did you make the controller yourself? I am looking to brew either 5 or 10 gallon batches so I am guess 15 gallon pots should cover all that.
So many things to figure out... Like what kind of stand to get??

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lschiavo (http://iam.homebrewtalk.com/lschiavo) made this controller for me. I'm NO electrician, and he owns an electrical contracting business, so he was a natural.

My stand is just a piece of modular shelving that stood "as is" for a long time and then was modded last spring by lschiavo and myself. Here's the most current photo:



But as always, changes happen and now we're adding a keg MLT with a tippy dump instead of the cooler. I love the cooler, but it maxes out at 23 pounds of grain. I am going to work it so I can swap MLTs, as making a 5 gallon batch of mild with a grain bill of 6 pounds would get lost in a keg MLT!

That's cool that you got someone to build the controller for you!
Thanks for the update!

BeerguyNC61 said:

Thanks for the info G Brew
What made you double the elements?

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2 reasons...
1. when i went to buy my element the store had no 5500 ones... only 3000 and 4500... so i bought 2 3000s.. i've seen guys use 2 4500s which will bring wort to a boil really fast, but at 9000 watts, you're maxing it on a 40 amp breaker.. almost need a 50 amp.. and a huge cable... I allready had everything to wire 30amp...

2. I figured this way i can brew temporarily without a controller.. 1 element on for low, and 2 elements on for high... i still have no controller at the moment and it works fine... also 2x3000 gave me an extra 500 watt from going with one 5500


but I do plan on getting a PID and SSR when i get to it.. but this was a quick way to get electric, AND to move to 10 Gallon Batch without having to buy a new propane burner

I'm a former propane guy who switched to electric last fall and absolutely love it. I can't imagine going back to propane. It's faster to heat than propane (if you're using 220), and is absolutely silent too. It's great. Kal's Electric Brewery website is great too, but you don't have to spend that kind of bling to go electric. My setup cost about $600 to build (I already had the MLT, keggle and kettle), but it could be done for probably $300-500 if you are clever.
If you have an electrical background you should have no trouble putting an e-brewery together, and you won't regret it if you build it. The only thing I use propane for any more is boiling a decoction for a decoction mash. There's lots of good build threads in this forum too - take a look around and find a build that inspires you and then just copy it. That's mostly what I did.

Nice brew-shed Bigljd! Thanks for the info....

For those of you that boil indoors, do you do anything to vent the steam created during the boil? I considered doing an electric setup in my basement which has about 7 ft ceilings but I always wondered if the steam would leave stains on the ceiling in the basement.

I started on propane and went full electric a few years ago. I'd never go back. The length of time is relative to the size of elements used; as is the same with gas. I have 4500W element in the HLT that I supplement with a 1250W RIMS tube to get my mash water up to temp in no time! I boil with a 4500W element. I turn the element on as soon as its submerged and if I'm not careful it'll be boiling before I'm done sparging. I have 50A service to the brew rig and need every bit of that; wish I had 60A. Speed is gonna depend on how much amperage (and 220V) you have available. Electric is just so much more efficient than gas since you directly heat the liquid. You lose a bit of efficiency in wiring, etc. but all-in-all its pretty f*ing efficient.

cperry7467 said:

For those of you that boil indoors, do you do anything to vent the steam created during the boil? I considered doing an electric setup in my basement which has about 7 ft ceilings but I always wondered if the steam would leave stains on the ceiling in the basement.

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I don't; but if I did I certainly wouldn't want 1-2 gallons of steam pumped into my house!

cperry7467 said:

For those of you that boil indoors, do you do anything to vent the steam created during the boil? I considered doing an electric setup in my basement which has about 7 ft ceilings but I always wondered if the steam would leave stains on the ceiling in the basement.

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I don't boil inside, but I think most people who do will build some sort of ventilation hood that sucks the moisture outside. On a cold, wet day my brewshed ceiling gets covered in moisture and drips from the boil steam, even with the doors open. I think a basement would be even worse without proper ventilation.

This guy came up with what looks like an over-engineered ventless solution, but it shows what people can come up with if you use some creativity:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f170/ventless-condensation-hood-297089/

That's what I figured. Thanks for the info.

cperry7467 said:

For those of you that boil indoors, do you do anything to vent the steam created during the boil? I considered doing an electric setup in my basement which has about 7 ft ceilings but I always wondered if the steam would leave stains on the ceiling in the basement.

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Plan on installing ventilation.... One reason for going electric with me was to be able to brew in the winter, inside my insulated and heated garage... i have not installed ventilation yet (although i'm planing on it)... but the first batch i brewed with the garage door closed, after 30 minutes of boil you could not see 10 feet in front of you, and my ceiling was dripping... a few days later (still not having opened the garage as it was cold outside) the ceiling was still wet and drippy... garage still humid and wet..

I never brewed with the garage door closed again...

so if you're planning on doing this in the basement, i would say you need some form of ventilation above the kettle

Okay all this great info has convinced me that electric is the way to go. I am looking at Stout's pots already built for electric brew but also have come across a system from High Gravity out of Tulsa. I just don't have all the cool tools for a DIY project and want to start brewing soon. So does anybody have either Stout or High Gravity gear for their electric setup? Good, bad or otherwise?


Thanks
S

FYI, 10g batch costs about $2 in electric. I've done the math several times on here.

BeerguyNC61 said:

That's cool that you got someone to build the controller for you!
Thanks for the update!

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Not just someone that was me

My suggestion: First go with propane then switch to electric. You will hate me for the suggestion once you go electric but I guess I can live with that

LOL at the "that was me" !

Not a hater so I will dive right into electric! I will continue using my propane gas grill if that makes you feel better .....

BeerguyNC61 said:

LOL at the "that was me" !

Not a hater so I will dive right into electric! I will continue using my propane gas grill if that makes you feel better .....

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I can accept the propane grill. I have one myself and it's actually searing me some steaks right now. IMO, you will not regret electric and I have converted from the Dark Side.

Just finished up grilling some chicken.......
Now all I have to do is figure out what configuration for electric I want. My first piece of equipment arrived today....Rebel Mill Grain Mill..... woo too....

lschiavo said:

I can accept the propane grill. I have one myself and it's actually searing me some steaks right now. IMO, you will not regret electric and I have converted from the Dark Side.

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Propane grills = extract brewing - Bring it yooperman!

Charcuterie FTW! :rockin:

passedpawn said:

Propane grills = extract brewing - Bring it yooperman!

Charcuterie FTW! :rockin:

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Extract brews win awards too. Sadly, I have not won awards from my propane grill.

I googled that weird word...sounds interesting...

lschiavo said:

Extract brews win awards too. Sadly, I have not won awards from my propane grill.

I googled that weird word...sounds interesting...

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It just means cooking over coals. I switched to that 2 years ago, made a world of difference in my cooking. Seriously. Probably shouldn't have mentioned extract - I have experience there that I won't go into here - commenting on that usually brings the riot.

passedpawn said:

It just means cooking over coals. I switched to that 2 years ago, made a world of difference in my cooking. Seriously. Probably shouldn't have mentioned extract - I have experience there that I won't go into here - commenting on that usually brings the riot.

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Yeah, let's not riot. I've actually never won an award for either cooking or brewing but I suppose you have to enter a contest or something if you expect to.

I really battled my inner caveman when I filled my first propane tank this year. I'm not sure I can beat him next time.