Easy Homemade Secondary Regulator

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mendozer

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I bought a secondary off ebay but added two more bodies on for a 4 way setup. It's very easy. If I had known about this source of the regulator bodies, I would have done it all from scratch

Surplus Store

2012-04-05180554.jpg

I went to Harbor Freight for the 1/4" ball valves and quick disconnect; Adventures in Homebrewing for the 1/4" NPT x 1/4" male flare adapters; Home depot for the pipe nipples, and two 1/4" to barb valves came with my original. I will keep one as a spare and am using one for the end of my regulator setup.

keeping a valve on the end will keep the system closed if I have to remove the CO2 tank. that three piece setup you see on the right is the incoming pieces from the CO2 tank.

From right to left:
1. male disconnect hooked up to 1/4" barb and that will come from the primary regulator
2. female disconnect will be sticking outside of my keezer collar
3. hose barb and 1/4" female coupling to be inside the keezer. The coupling will actually be inside the wood as it goes through

This setup is all flare because I wanted the ease and it really didn't cost much more (I'm dirt poor so if I can do it...). I'm not worried about check valves b/c I have in line check valves that will be a few inches from the gain-in disconnect on the keg. The disconnect on the outside makes it easier for maintenance for tank removal. plus i saw the disconnects and they were so cheap so I had to do it b/c it looked like a cool idea

cost:
Initial secondary off ebay: $50 (although if you start from scratch, less)
4 ball valves, 1/4" plug, male/female disconnect set: $19
2 additional bodies plus gauges: $36
2 extra pipe nipples, female hose barb, coupling: $10
Adapters: $12.30 including shipping

total cost (assuming I'm remembering everything): $127.30

If I had done the initial bodies from scratch it would be about $15 less.

that's $113 - $127 for something that costs $140 for taprite, $241 for micromatics, or $210 for the economy one from Beverage Factory. And those are without flares if you wanted them.

Just thought I'd share since it was fun to make and will be a sweet addition to my keezer.
 
Something to think about... those ball valves don't have check valves in them, so always be mindful of pressure changes since the risk of sucking beer back into your lines and regulator is a very real risk. My check valves have saved my butt a couple of times now.
 
I know, that's why I have these for my gas lines. they're cheap and stand up to 150 psi. When I purge or even carb, I do so slowly with me there so make sure there's no suck back (at least initially). The other reason i use the inline check valves is I don't even want beer, in theory, going into my ball valve. They're easier maintenance to clean if something happens. Plus, i thought that suckback could be avoided simply by not filling to high or having rapid pressure changes.

for example on my first purging, i disconnected my gas connector without shutting off the ball valve on the primary reg so the pressure sucked beer into the line. It was minor, but before I went to flares so a PITA!
 
that would make it into a 4-way primary right? sounds doable unless there's some pneumatic science behind why it can't be done and i'm not aware of it.
 
that would make it into a 4-way primary right? sounds doable unless there's some pneumatic science behind why it can't be done and i'm not aware of it.

Ya that's the way I see it. I just looked though, and it seems the max pressure for the body is 300psi. So I guess my question is, if there are four will it hold 1200psi? Or is 300psi still the max? Wouldn't that be too much for the ~800psi in my co2 tank?
 
Thanks for the source for the regulator bodies. I already have everything else I need. Looks like a quick and easy project.
 
Ya that's the way I see it. I just looked though, and it seems the max pressure for the body is 300psi. So I guess my question is, if there are four will it hold 1200psi? Or is 300psi still the max? Wouldn't that be too much for the ~800psi in my co2 tank?

I will have to defer to someone more knowledgeable about pneumatics here. I would guess that you have to have a primary first then secondaries because of the higher pressure. But then again, how else does that other product that you sent work? Those are 4 low pressure gauges
 
If I wanted a set up like the one pictured above, could I also add a high pressure gauge to one end and a high pressure hose from the other end to the tank?

Something like this http://www.kegkits.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=JO60-H4-K4H4BC&Category_Code=WMReg-4

You'd need to use all primary regulators to have that exact configuration. The secondary regulators can't handle the tank pressure, so the tank gauge needs to be on the primary regulator. You can step the pressure down with a primary regulator and then feed a bank of secondaries though.

Ya that's the way I see it. I just looked though, and it seems the max pressure for the body is 300psi. So I guess my question is, if there are four will it hold 1200psi? Or is 300psi still the max? Wouldn't that be too much for the ~800psi in my co2 tank?

Connecting them together doesn't change the pressure rating. No matter how many of them are connected together, the applied pressure should never exceed 300 psi. You need to reduce the tank pressure with a primary regulator first.

But then again, how else does that other product that you sent work? Those are 4 low pressure gauges

Those are all primary regulators, each capable of handling full tank pressure. The low pressure gauges simply measure the output, which has absolutely no relationship to the applied pressure that the body is rated to withstand.
 
I went to Harbor Freight for the 1/4" ball valves and quick disconnect;

That three piece setup you see on the right is the incoming pieces from the CO2 tank.

The disconnect on the outside makes it easier for maintenance for tank removal. plus i saw the disconnects and they were so cheap so I had to do it b/c it looked like a cool idea

FWIW I had issues using that type of QD in my system. They will leak slightly if the hose puts any lateral pressure on the fitting, which can be hard to avoid. Took me quite a while to track down the problem since I was pulling everything out to test for leaks, and not finding any. It was only when everything was tucked away with the hoses coiled that there was lateral pressure on the fitting, creating the slow leak.

Just a heads up to maybe save you all the frustration I went through.
 
Connecting them together doesn't change the pressure rating. No matter how many of them are connected together, the applied pressure should never exceed 300 psi. You need to reduce the tank pressure with a primary regulator first.


Ya that's kinda what I figured, oh well worth a shot.
 
I had one leaking issue and that was due to a bad relief valve. I regularly spray starsan into posts and the QD with no visible leaking
 
Looks good, but it's a leaker for sure.
Those little HF ball vales look like the bodies are one-piece, but they're not. They are pressed together and leak like a *****.
The QD is a bad idea... those are known slow leakers too.
You'll nee a main reg at the bottle, then you can feed your secondaries.
Oh, and the secondaries will vent excess gas (when you turn down the pressure, it will vent the excess). You should install check valves at all the of the regulator "out" ports.
Once you get it gassed up, spray it with soapy water and you will see.
Be aware though... high pressure leaks are not detectable with soapy water (it pushes the soapy water away without making bubbles). For HP tests, you'll need to submerge the HP reg.
I know this because I made almost the exact same setup myself. It was a gas guzzling nightmare.
Sorry.
 
Looks good, but it's a leaker for sure.
Those little HF ball vales look like the bodies are one-piece, but they're not. They are pressed together and leak like a *****.
The QD is a bad idea... those are known slow leakers too.
You'll nee a main reg at the bottle, then you can feed your secondaries.
Oh, and the secondaries will vent excess gas (when you turn down the pressure, it will vent the excess). You should install check valves at all the of the regulator "out" ports.
Once you get it gassed up, spray it with soapy water and you will see.
Be aware though... high pressure leaks are not detectable with soapy water (it pushes the soapy water away without making bubbles). For HP tests, you'll need to submerge the HP reg.
I know this because I made almost the exact same setup myself. It was a gas guzzling nightmare.
Sorry.

like i said before, i had one surprisingly short tank life once due to a bad relief valve on my keg. after that, everything's fine. i tested all my bodies and ports with Starsan and no leaks were detected. I do have check valves on my gas lines as well. and my QD doesn't leak either according to my regular tests (i spray everything down every other month or so. After my initial tank, everything's still fine.

I know HF is cheap ****, but maybe some are made well and others aren't, just like every other cheap thing.

Some Kias from the 90s are still running after all ;)
 
If I wanted a set up like the one pictured above, could I also add a high pressure gauge to one end and a high pressure hose from the other end to the tank?

Something like this http://www.kegkits.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=JO60-H4-K4H4BC&Category_Code=WMReg-4

All of this depends entirely on which CO2 regulators you use.

For example, primary & secondary regulators manufactured by TapRite use the same internal poppet valve assembly and primary & secondary regulators manufactured by Chudnow use the same poppet valve assembly. Secondary regulators from either of these manufacturers can be used as primary regulators. But Cornelius and Norgren secondary regulators can-not be used as primary regulators because they can't handle the additional pressure.

Harbor Freight is great for vises and hand tools that are not used much but per a friend of mine who started packaging their regulators with the lemonaide smashers he sells, they suck and he can't afford to replace the failures, so now he packages Chudnow regulators with his smashers.
 
good to know about those reg brands.

I don't trust HF with any powered or moving parts. but inanimate things like hand tools like you said (or in this case, simple ball valves) i trust em. they're made in China and so are the $10 ones at Lowes!
 
Yeah the only difference between the tap right primary and secondaries is that the high side has left hand thread in the primary model and right hand on the secondary model. My existing primary regulator was right hand thread so to add another in line in needed to use their secondary model. All regulators should be rated and have the rating listed in the body. You should never exceed that pressure
 
still going fine. I'm too lazy to do it now, but if you're planning on making it and keeping it for a long time, I would put silicone sealant on the threads as well as teflon tape. just to be sure for leaks, although I tightened my seals good. Other than that it's holding on and serving me beer :)
 
I also would love to know where the gauges came from. Did some googling but the only ones that measure in the 0-30PSI range i found are automotive fuel pressure gauges.
 
the gauges are from the surplus store linked above. search for "low pressure gauge"
 
The guage port on these regulators is only 1/8" correct? Hard to find bottom mount 30 PSI gauges that are not 1/4" on that site. I may end up with 60 PSI guages as I found some that are a bit cheaper.
 
yes the gauges are 1/8" NPT. only the opening for the pipe nipple is 1/4". So the bodies are from right to left: 1/4", 1/8", 1/4" and the bottom has nothing
 
How did you mount the completed regulator? I don't see any mounting hardware on the regulators. I figure I could just bend some sort of strapping to hang it from the pipe that connects the regulator bodies, but I am wondering if anybody has a more secure way of mounting these regulators.
 
I used that steel pipe tape (the bendable type with holes for screws in the plumbing section) and made a "V" bending around the pipe nipples and screwing into wood. I then screwed that wood plank to my collar. It's totally solid. The other brands of regulators have metal hangers made for this exact use, but these don't (that I know of).

If you're handy, you could made sheetmetal contraptions to do this.
 
I noticed today one of my ball valves has a slow leak. I used my stethoscope to find it since it amplified sound tremendously. Went to Lowes to get another ball valve (decided not to use cheapo HF again) but it opens the wrong way!

But Home Depot's valves open the right way so i'll be getting one of those. And for $9 compared to $4 it better last a lifetime.
 
Do you have a picture off the ball valve you got? Or a link? I want to get some just unsure on what to get.
 
http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/100039...toreId=10051&N=5yc1v&R=100039901#.UTWY16JciS4

notice the flat piece(vertical under the handle) on top is on the female side of the valve not the male side. This means it opens towards the female side, which is important. The male side is going into the regulator body. Lowes' Kobalt one for some reason is the only one I've seen the other way and it would still work with adapters, but I want it right from the get go.
 
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