Thinking about getting a secondary fermenter...

Am thinking about getting another primary fermenter to use as a secondary. At the moment, when I prime the bottles im using carb drops, as I don't wanna disturb the yeast in primary if I mix in the sugar.

I probably wrong, but I think they are making the beer cloudy with lots of additional sediment in the bottle. Regardless they are expensive compared to brewing sugar!

I know most people siphon the beer into the secondary. My primary has a "spigot tap" at the bottom. Would it be possible to use this tap to transfer beer into secondary if done carefully? With or without a hose? If not am thinking perhaps I should use my current fermenter as the secondary, as It would be easier to bottle from?

I dont wanna spend a fortune, but if I got a real secondary glass one, is there much advantage over another plastic one? Most don't have "taps"?

Thanks PS: Bottling from the tap with the "wand" is really appealing to me rather then using a hose....

If you want to do that you can go to Home Depot or Lowes or something and buy buckets for usually like 5 bucks. U can use them as your primary, and rack to your spigoted bucket and bottle from there if you want. That way you wouldnt have a huge investment.

I think in most homebrew equipment kits that are sold there is a regular bucket for primary, a carboy for secondary, and the spigoted bucket for a bottling bucket. Its been a while since i looked into them. What did your kit come with?

Cooper's kit for you too huh?

I would recommend getting a better bottle without a spigot for your secondary... not too much of an investment. Then, after sanitizing your primary fermenter that has the spigot, you can use that as a bottling bucket for a while. That is, until you start brewing a new batch once you move one to secondary. At that point, you may want to look into a dedicated bottling bucket.

Mine is the "Coopers Homebrew Kit". Its a 30L primary, with airlock, lid, spigot. Its pretty smooth plastic so should be ok as a secondary? I have hydrometer etc...

I think I can get a very basic "buck-style" primary for $35-$50 which isn't too bad in NZ. If I did this, my coopers one would be ok as primary?

You won't want to use a spigot to transfer to secondary as the trub will flow right into your next vessel, thus defeating the purpose of secondary. You could get a filter bag to put on the backside of the spigot, but it would probably clog. You'll probably have some sediment in your secondary as well, so the same goes for that. An auto siphon is a cheap and easy way for transferring between vessels.

Wrathbone said:

Cooper's kit for you too huh?

I would recommend getting a better bottle without a spigot for your secondary... not too much of an investment. Then, after sanitizing your primary fermenter that has the spigot, you can use that as a bottling bucket for a while. That is, until you start brewing a new batch once you move one to secondary. At that point, you may want to look into a dedicated bottling bucket.

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Lol how did you know it was coopers???

By better, do you mean plastic still, but without a spigot? Or should it be glass? I suspect I would leave the beer in primary 2-3 weeks, prob secondary 5 weeks max. Am not a very patient person... would I need glass if only in for this duration?

Better Bottle is a brand of Plastic Carboy.. a lot of guys here use them so they dont get
exploding carboys and cut tendons.

perversatile said:

You won't want to use a spigot to transfer to secondary as the trub will flow right into your next vessel, thus defeating the purpose of secondary. You could get a filter bag to put on the backside of the spigot, but it would probably clog. You'll probably have some sediment in your secondary as well, so the same goes for that. An auto siphon is a cheap and easy way for transferring between vessels.

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Hmm so thats probably why I get a bit of sediment when I bottle from the spigot in my primary?

So basically the Spigot is useless, as you don't use it to trransfer to secondary, and someone else said that to get a secondary without one?

EDIT: Oh but ok for bottling I guess

Kiwi_Jonno said:

So basically the Spigot is useless, as you don't use it to trransfer to secondary, and someone else said that to get a secondary without one?

EDIT: Oh but ok for bottling I guess

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Bottling buckets are intended to have the beer mixed with priming sugar before bottling. If you're just going to use carbonation drops the bucket is just one extra step that you don't need. I have heard from some folks that those drops leave some stuff behind. I've never used em, so I wouldn't know.

perversatile said:

Bottling buckets are intended to have the beer mixed with priming sugar before bottling. If you're just going to use carbonation drops the bucket is just one extra step that you don't need. I have heard from some folks that those drops leave some stuff behind. I've never used em, so I wouldn't know.

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I think I'd prefer to use brewing sugar instead of the drops. It wold be a lot cheaper in the long run. And probably clearer beer.

So id there anything to look out for when buying a secondary/carby? So no spigot, do they all have an airlock 23-25L should be enough I think, as even though the primary is 30L, the beer is only 23L. Wouldn't need any head room in the secondary?

Kiwi_Jonno said:

I think I'd prefer to use brewing sugar instead of the drops. It wold be a lot cheaper in the long run. And probably clearer beer.

So id there anything to look out for when buying a secondary/carby? So no spigot, do they all have an airlock 23-25L should be enough I think, as even though the primary is 30L, the beer is only 23L. Wouldn't need any head room in the secondary?

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I started with a 5 gal glass carboy and moved to better bottles. They're easier to clean and not a huge health hazard.

if you want to get a secondary, go with a glass carboy or better bottle. if you can swing the extra money, go better bottle since theyre plastic and lighter and less likely to shatter. they probably wont have an airlock, but theyre about 2 bucks at most LHBS's. the best way to rack to your secondary is with an auto siphon (which is worth its weight in gold!)

there are a lot of people on this site that will say secondaries arent even necessary, and proper cold crashing/gelatin will clear your beer just as well as a secondary will. its really personal preference

Here's my take on it:

Your current primary (with spigot) could be converted to a bottling bucket by purchasing another ale-pale. I got mine for 9bux from my LHBS. Ferment your beer in this new primary, siphon over to your bottling bucket on top of priming sugar (boiled etc.) and bottle from there. You won't need another airlock because the one you have will probably work just fine. I would recommend getting two buckets for extra beery goodness.

I'm not sure what all your kit came with, but to convert over to this new method you will need a racking cane, length of tube and some would suggest an auto-siphon, but I've found a turkey baster works fine to start a siphon.

Hope i've helped

I am going to better bottles for beer and using glass for meads. I have noticed cracks in two glass fermentors in the last 6 months and it's a bummer to have to keep buying those things.

I almost always use a secondary, if for no other reason than so I can add more hops for aroma and give the beer plenty of time to clear out and condition. But most of my beers are about 6.5% alcohol. If you are making lighter beers three to four weeks in a primary is OK. Last 4.5% beer I made was great and stayed in one fermentor for 3 1/2 weeks.

For a single batch you should have a primary, a secondary, and a bottling bucket if you aren't kegging.

With one additional fermenter you can have two batches going at once, or if you're nuts like me you can have three relaxing in secondaries in the basement with one in the primary upstairs.

And I'm using buckets and carboys I purchased eight years ago.

Here's the deal. After the first 7-10 days you want to pull the good stuff off the yeast, and you do not want that first 7-10 day fermentation to have happened in a hardware store 5gal bucket or you may end up with a big mess. I've had 5 gallon batches in 6.5 gallon buckets threaten to lift their lids as the foaming yeast plugged the airlock outlets.

After the majority of fermentation is done you siphon the good stuff off the yeast into a secondary, the purpose being that the now dormant yeast continues to settle.

Finally you siphon that into your bottling bucket and forget your "drops". Boil enough water to dissolve 3/4 cup corn sugar, do so and mix it into the bucket. Stir well without aerating and bottle.

As far as a plastic vs glass, glass will last longer though I've accidentally broken two carboys and that's no fun at all to clean up.

Anything like a spigot is just one more thing to clean and one more place to harbor spoiling microbes, keep it simple.

Sorry for being long-winded, but I just want to help.

Thanks for all the advice!!!

Just have a few questions... what do you mean by "better bottles"? Are you meaning not the PET 750mL ones im using? Or is better bottle the secondary?

Regardless, the auto-siphon sounds like a good idea.

RangerG, what did you mean by "I am going to better bottles for beer and using glass for meads."? What are meads?

Maine Homebrewer... "After the first 7-10 days you want to pull the good stuff off the yeast, and you do not want that first 7-10 day fermentation to have happened in a hardware store 5gal bucket or you may end up with a big mess."

If I used my current fermenter it would be ok as a primary, then used a glass secondary, then transferred back to the clean primary to bottle?

Thanks again for all help

Kiwi_Jonno said:

Thanks for all the advice!!!

Just have a few questions... what do you mean by "better bottles"? Are you meaning not the PET 750mL ones im using? Or is better bottle the secondary?

Regardless, the auto-siphon sounds like a good idea.

RangerG, what did you mean by "I am going to better bottles for beer and using glass for meads."? What are meads?

Maine Homebrewer... "After the first 7-10 days you want to pull the good stuff off the yeast, and you do not want that first 7-10 day fermentation to have happened in a hardware store 5gal bucket or you may end up with a big mess."

If I used my current fermenter it would be ok as a primary, then used a glass secondary, then transferred back to the clean primary to bottle?

Thanks again for all help

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a "better bottle" is a brand of carboy - they're just like the glass ones, but plastic.

using your current for primary, sanitizing, then as a bottling bucket should be fine. your secondary could be glass, or could be a Better Bottle - again, the plastic brand name.

Oh gotcha now! Will see if the "Better Bottle" brand is avail in the local HBS. Thanks for your help.

For the price - are glass or stainless steel ones really a lot better? As are a lot more exp im sure.

stainless steel?? are you talking about a conical fermenter? lol

Wrathbone said:

using your current for primary, sanitizing, then as a bottling bucket should be fine. your secondary could be glass, or could be a Better Bottle - again, the plastic brand name.

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That's how I do it. Following the advice I received here, I transferred into my secondary using the spigot and used my primary as a bottling bucked. I bottled this batch last night and it's as clear as apple juice.

Maine Homebrewer said:

Here's the deal. After the first 7-10 days you want to pull the good stuff off the yeast, and you do not want that first 7-10 day fermentation to have happened in a hardware store 5gal bucket or you may end up with a big mess.

Click to expand...

This may be one of those areas of brewing where opinions differ, but I think there's a growing consensus towards leaving beer in primary (and hence on the yeast) for longer than 7-10 days. I know a lot of the introductory guides to brewing recommend getting beer off the yeast quickly, but many people (on here and elsewhere) find better results by leaving beer alone for two weeks or longer. The worry about leaving beer in contact with yeast is autolysis, but that doesn't happen for a long time, and is much more of a theoretical worry than a legitimate concern; there is also a benefit of leaving beer on yeast for a few weeks, as it gives the yeast a chance to clean up some of the less nice by-products of fermentation. My own preference would be to leave the beer alone for at least two weeks, and double that if I don't need the space in the fermenter.

I am not a fan of carb tabs. They work fine I suppose but they leave little floaties. Ultimately this detracts from overall presentation. Doesn't really affect the taste but it's weird drinking beer with little white floaties in it. The hemming and hawing when a friend asks why the beer has floaties in it isn't very much fun either.

I started leaving the beer in primary for 3 weeks and then transferring it to secondary for one week at room temperature and 1 week in the fridge if I am kegging. If I am going to bottle I leave it at room temperature in secondary for 2 weeks as I don't want all the viable yeast to drop out before bottling.

Been out to a local HBS. I was wondering if the Coopers Kit Set fermenter is "better bottle" or just normal plastic?

Cost wise I thinking if I got another primary fermenter with the spigot and airlock and used the best one (it or the coopers one) as a secondary... I know it might not be AS GOOD, but is there any major problem in doing this? I would also by a hose to syphon.

Thanks for any comments...

Leaving for my Home Brew Store soon, any feedback on my lastest post?

You could use either as a secondary, but I doubt you will be able to get the Cooper's fermenter on it's own, without buying a whole kit. Therefore, I would recommend getting a carboy, whether a Better Bottle or a glass one.

Wrathbone said:

You could use either as a secondary, but I doubt you will be able to get the Cooper's fermenter on it's own, without buying a whole kit. Therefore, I would recommend getting a carboy, whether a Better Bottle or a glass one.

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Just been to the shop, I saw two possible solutions...

One was a 25L Vinamat Vinballon carboy for $49.95, with 2x lids one suitable for an airlock, and one normal lid. Im not sure if this is for spirits or beer but it seems ok? Has no spigot.

The other was a Brigalow 25L $89.95 but was a whole kit, with a fermenter with spigot and airlock. It came with hydrometer, extract, bottle lids, hose etc tho I already have that stuff. The fermenter seemed good quality tho.

Any thoughts? I will upload photos and post the 2x pics of them....

Here are the two pics. The are taken from a cellphone but aren't too bad quality . The Brigalow kit pic shows whats in it, im sure some of you have seen this one before? Please click on the links if pics don't load below...

http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k318/Kiwi_Jonno/M01A0008.jpg
http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k318/Kiwi_Jonno/M01A0009.jpg