Pliny the Elder Help!

Hi All, I'm brewing Pliny the Elder today using this recipe, but I didn't notice that the pre-boil volume was 8 gallons. So I've only calculated enough grain for about 6 gallons. I'm using:

11 lbs 2-row
8 oz Carapils
8 oz Crystal 40L
1 lb Dextrose

I think I need at least 2 more pounds of 2-row to get the desired O.G. (1.071) at a decent boil volume (pre-boil O.G. what, like 1.052 or so?). I don't have time to go to the LHBS today, but I do have some Pale LME kicking around. How much should I add to get the desired O.G.?

Oh I want to brew this one, I'll be interested to see what responses you get.

Batinse said:

Hi All, I'm brewing Pliny the Elder today using this recipe, but I didn't notice that the pre-boil volume was 8 gallons. So I've only calculated enough grain for about 6 gallons. I'm using:

11 lbs 2-row
8 oz Carapils
8 oz Crystal 40L
1 lb Dextrose

I think I need at least 2 more pounds of 2-row to get the desired O.G. (1.071) at a decent boil volume (pre-boil O.G. what, like 1.052 or so?). I don't have time to go to the LHBS today, but I do have some Pale LME kicking around. How much should I add to get the desired O.G.?

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Do you have beersmith? If so you can use the dilution tool to figure what gravity of wort the extra 2 gallons need to be to get you to your desired gravity? What is your planned efficiency? I can figure it out for you if you know what the gravity will be from your mash as it stands.

Thanks chriswilkes,

I use Brewtarget, not beersmith, and I can't get the numbers to work right now--it doesn't seem to calculate for dilution. My usual efficiency is between 75 and 80%. I'd love it if you could give me a hand with the numbers...thanks!

Batinse said:

Hi All, I'm brewing Pliny the Elder today using this recipe, but I didn't notice that the pre-boil volume was 8 gallons. So I've only calculated enough grain for about 6 gallons. I'm using:

11 lbs 2-row
8 oz Carapils
8 oz Crystal 40L
1 lb Dextrose

I think I need at least 2 more pounds of 2-row to get the desired O.G. (1.071) at a decent boil volume (pre-boil O.G. what, like 1.052 or so?). I don't have time to go to the LHBS today, but I do have some Pale LME kicking around. How much should I add to get the desired O.G.?

Click to expand...

I brewed this yesterday. If you have the room for 8 gallon boil
15.5# 2row
.75# cara-pils/dex
.75# crystal 40
.90# Corn sugar

this based on 70% eff.

I put your recipe in to beersmith using 75% eff and 1# dme addition brings the OG to 1.075

When I put those grains into Beersmith I get about 1.074 with a 75% efficiency for 5 gallons. If you try to adjust for hop loss, I added 1 gallons which makes your estimated OG of 1.062. You would add 2 gallons of 1.095 wort to get that total to 1.070. I hope I did that right, Im not super sure I used the dilution tool right.

so use your LME to make a 2 gallon batch of 1.095 wort and that added to 6 gallons of 1.057.

Beersmith says 5.3 pounds of pale liquid malt extract in 2 gallons yields 1.095 wort.

Again, Im not confident I am doing this totally right but it is a start, hopefully someone else here can verify it. It seems like a lot of LME to add.

Thanks for the help--except I don't have that much LME! I may just add what I have and hope for the best. I'll see what I get for a preboil volume and s.g. and go from there.

You could boil with just the 6 gallons of wort you collect and then after the boil top up with whatever wort/water you need to hit your gravity, that is probably the best solution.

Well, I ended up with just under 6 gallons of 1.065 wort in the end. I had less LME than I thought, so only added a bit less than a pound. Not a bad efficiency hit, and the beer still smells and tastes incredible. I'm looking forward to it!

Thanks for the help here.

I've brewed my Pliny clone 15+ times. This is what works for my system (I've changed the grain bill slightly):

14lb 2 row
0.5 C20
0.5 Wheat (or carafoam depending on what I have)
0.7 Corn sugar

Collecting 8 gallons, boiling for 90 minutes gets 5 into the fermenter (1 gallon lost with hop debris). OG = 1071 and usually finishes around 1012 / 1011. I've no idea what the efficiency is as I've never bothered to work it out, but I do have a little equipment loss (it's a ghetto HERMs set up).

Use a huge starter.

Ludovico said:

Use a huge starter.

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+1. I do 2 vials WLP001 in 2 liters, and step up another liter 5 hours before pitching so they're ready to go to work when pitched. I get 83% attenuation.

A lot of hassle though: the last batch I used dry yeast (Safale-05) for the first time. It will be interesting to see how that turns out.

Batinse said:

Well, I ended up with just under 6 gallons of 1.065 wort in the end. I had less LME than I thought, so only added a bit less than a pound. Not a bad efficiency hit, and the beer still smells and tastes incredible. I'm looking forward to it!

Thanks for the help here.

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I had some efficiency and boil off issues when I brewed a similar grain bill a few weeks ago (used the PTE kit from morebeer.com. I also wound up a few points short (1.067). Not noticable in the finished product. As long as you pitch big and let this one dry out, it's a phenomenal beer.

Mine spent 3 weeks in the primary, a week in the secondary with the dry hops and another 3 weeks in the bottle (as of yesterday). I don't have regular access to the real thing, so it's tough to do a comparison as to whether I hit it as a clone or not. But it's one of the better beers I brewed and from my memory of PTE, it's more than in the ballpark.

spiny_norman said:

+1. I do 2 vials WLP001 in 2 liters, and step up another liter 5 hours before pitching so they're ready to go to work when pitched. I get 83% attenuation.

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I don't think 2 vials is necessary. But then, I am a cheap bastid! The last time I made this clone (albeit a slightly stronger version), I used one vial, stepped the starter up from 1 liter to 4 liters over the course of a week, chilled, decanted and pitched. Had fermentation in a couple hours and 87% attenuation overall. 1.082 down to 1.010.

I made a 2L starter with Whitbread Ale Wyeast 1099. It went to work pretty quickly (although I'm currently fermenting pretty cool for 1099: 62-64 °F).

Sir-Brews-Alot said:

I don't think 2 vials is necessary. But then, I am a cheap bastid! The last time I made this clone (albeit a slightly stronger version), I used one vial, stepped the starter up from 1 liter to 4 liters over the course of a week, chilled, decanted and pitched. Had fermentation in a couple hours and 87% attenuation overall. 1.082 down to 1.010.

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I also don't think you need to spend the extra on a second vial of yeast if you make a starter. I made a 1 liter starter, then ramped it up another liter after 24hrs, for a total of two liters after 48 hours. This worked out perfectly the last two times I made this brew. The one I have in the carboy now is dry-hopping, with an calculated/expected 9% ABV. After 2 wks in fermenter, my FG was 1.016. I expect it to come down a bit more, but it doesn't matter at this point.

So my Pliny has been bubbling away for quite some time now and I'll be racking and dry hopping in a week or so. I wanted to use gelatin in this beer, but I'm a bit confused as to how to proceed in combination with the dry hopping schedule. I've read here that many people dry hop for two weeks then throw the gelatin in and wait another two weeks, but I don't want to dry hop this for more than 14 days. I'd consider throwing in the gelatin after a week, but the Pliny, as you know, has a second dry hop of four days towards the end of the schedule and I don't want the gelatin to interfere with that. Will it? Should I throw the gelatin in before I dry hop? Should I rack a second time and add the gelatin? What do you think?

This is what I do:

If I do a second dry hop (I usually don't) 4 days after second dry hop I'll crash cool to around 35. The next day I'll prepare the gelatin (boil 1 cup water to sanitize, cool to around 170, add 1 teaspoon gelatin and let sit for 20 minutes), add that to the fermenter and wait another 5 to 6 days and package. Comes out crystal clear every time.

That would leave both dry hoppings in the fermenter for at least a week longer--is there a way to avoid this? I can't crash cool (unless I leave it outside, but even then we're at around 10*C right now, but does that stop the dry-hopping process too, or at least minimize it?

If it was me, I'm not sure I'd bother adding gelatin if I couldn't cold crash as from what I hear it's not as effective. You could just package right away, but after 4 days the second dry hops are unlikely to have broken up and fallen to the bottom of the fermenter yet, but that shouldn't be a big deal; you'd just have to rack underneath them. It might not be crystal clear and you might have some hop particles in the bottle, but it will still be a tasty beer

Are you kegging or bottling? Recently I stopped with the second dry hop addition and keg hop instead, which works really well. (I picked this up from a local micro who does an outstanding double IPA which has an incredible aroma. He does a single drop hop addition in the fermenter, and then dry hops the serving tank.)