Rough Start

Am on my second beer and things have not gone very smoothly. My first was an Irish Red that was great through both fermentations but I mistakenly used half the corn sugar before bottling so it was terribly flat. After realizing my mistake I rebottled the reaming beer(90%) and added the rest of the sugar. Its been tough waiting but I do feel that it will now be a solid beer.

After rebottling the red I brewed an 80 schilling Scottish Ale that was a partial mash. Everything went great until I realized the immersion chiller had leaked hose water into the wort. I tried to fix it but that made it worse. This stopped the cooling so I waited awhile to pitch the yeast. Now I have strong banana smells coming from the air lock cap. I was going to rack to the secondary after a week then two weeks in there before bottling of another two. Do you think this will turn out ok and not to banana? What can I do to help the situation?

Leave it in primary for one month to allow the yeast maximum time to "clean up" the off flavors. That is about all you can do at this point. It will probably clean up quite nicely.

Thanks, Drummerboy. Has this happened to you?

apcoach said:

Thanks, Drummerboy. Has this happened to you?

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Not this exact problem. I don't use a cooler (yet) but I believe that banana esters are caused by high fermentation temperatures. Since the esters are already there, lowering temps will stop further ester production, but the only way to remove the existing ester's is with aging. Bottle conditioning will work, but bulk aging (on the yeast cake) will work better. I suspect a one-month primary will go a long way to getting rid of that pesky banana flavor

After a month then on to the secondary or straight to the bottle? Can't thank you enough.

If you do a 3 to 4 week primary, then you will not need to secondary. Try not to transfer too much of the "trub" and yeast at the bottom of the fermenter when you rack to your bottling bucket to keep the bottled beer clear, and you should be good to go.

I appreciate the advice. My only concern is that I would have to wait a month before I brew my next batch since I only have one primary.

Well, give it 2 weeks at least on the yeast cake then, and rack to secondary after that.

Ageing it is solid advice though. Some yeasts just give off banana smells, and it doesn't mean anything at all is wrong with beer. I have a belgian dark strong that gave off banana (smelled wonderful) but none of that flavor is in the beer. But then again, I aged it for 2 months in primary before switching to a keg and cellaring it.

Sounds like it would be wise of me to get another primary!

apcoach said:

Sounds like it would be wise of me to get another primary!

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That's exactly how I got to 3 5G carboys and 3 6G carboys. ;-)

They come in handy if you buy filtered water from the machine at the supermarket.

What's the ferment temps?

The fermentation began at 75 when I pitched the yeast. Worried about the banana esters after about 24 hours I wrapped the primary in a wet towel moved to a cooler place where the external temp has read 66 ever since.

jbaysurfer said:

That's exactly how I got to 3 5G carboys and 3 6G carboys. ;-)

They come in handy if you buy filtered water from the machine at the supermarket.

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Will the filtered water carboys work for fermentation? Do you replace the lid or go with the one provided?

apcoach said:

Sounds like it would be wise of me to get another primary!

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Yep..

I have 4 Buckets, one 6.5 G carboy and 3 5 G carboys.

Do you just buy them at the homebrew store in your area?

So I started this thread expressing worries over my first two beers. Friday I tried the Red Ale after 6 days post-rebottling (first bottling was with only half the sugar due to a mis-measurement). It tasted very good and had jumped considerably carbonation. Another week or two in the bottle and I think it will be very good.

On the other front, my serious concerns over the banana smell in the primary of my Scottish Ale were eased when I tasted the brew while transferring to the secondary. It had a sweet start but dry finish and definitely tasted like the Scottish Ales I've had. I think the alcohol is a little low due to the amount water that dripped in during the immersion cooler-leak.

All in all, I feel much better and am eager to brew my next batch this week. On a side note, does anyone have a suggestion for an uncomplicated beer to brew that would be a logical step given the Irish and Scottish I have already done. Thanks.

So I started my third batch, an English brown ale. Everything went perfectly including the ice bath which got the wort to 68f before pitching. But, it's been 31 hrs and still no bubbles in the air lock. I thought storing it in my basement would be wise because the temp is steady at 65f. I I just moved it upstairs where it is 72f. Am I screwed?

apcoach said:

So I started my third batch, an English brown ale. Everything went perfectly including the ice bath which got the wort to 68f before pitching. But, it's been 31 hrs and still no bubbles in the air lock. I thought storing it in my basement would be wise because the temp is steady at 65f. I I just moved it upstairs where it is 72f. Am I screwed?

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Have you checked the Gravity?

Do not get worked up over the airlock... It may or may not bubble... does not mean a stinkin' thing! The airlock cannot tell you if you have fermentation. All it can tell you is that there is (or is not) air pressure escaping through the airlock. Air could be escaping somewhere else (bad grommet, bad bucket seal, etc.), OR it is POSSIBLE (but not likely) that there is a problem. We really need to know gravity readings to be sure.

Also, after checking that gravity, you will probably want to put it back in that 56 degree basement. That cooler temperature is going to make a much better finished beer, even though it will probably take longer to start fermenting (and probably longer to finish, too!)

Thanks, Seth. This morning I awoke to major activity in the airlock (just about 40 to 43 hours). Now that it is going, should go back to the basement or will the temperature swings be bad until the fermentation slows down?

apcoach said:

Thanks, Seth. This morning I awoke to major activity in the airlock (just about 40 to 43 hours). Now that it is going, should go back to the basement or will the temperature swings be bad until the fermentation slows down?

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Get it back in the basement. Cooler is better (for the most part) when fermenting most styles. I would rather have the beer exposed to one temperature swing while fermented cool. That is probably way better than fermenting warm.

I did last night. So it fermented like crazy for between 16-18 hours in the 72f laundry room before i moved it down to the 65f basement where, after 9 hours, it is still going strong. The airlock bubbles every second. I'm so excited for this beer I can't stand it. The big decision now is whether a small amount dry hopped Pearle will go in the carboy.

And officially, the Irish Red Ale is good. I just had one tonight after almost three weeks back in the bottle after being rebottled with more sugar. I had a great brewing moment tonight......i brewed a beer that is good to drink.

Bottled that Scottish today I was so worried about due to the leaking wort chiller. I drank a shot glass of it and it is amazing!

apcoach said:

Bottled that Scottish today I was so worried about due to the leaking wort chiller. I drank a shot glass of it and it is amazing!

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Excellent! I know it is hard at first, but remember, the beer almost makes itself...

Now that you have a pipeline going, it will be easier to RDWHAHB!

Thanks, Seth. To an earlier comment of yours, The bottled Scottish ale is now in the 65 f basement. Is that too cold?

apcoach said:

Thanks, Seth. To an earlier comment of yours, The bottled Scottish ale is now in the 65 f basement. Is that too cold?

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That depends on how quickly you want it to carbonate... When fermenting the beer 65 is almost ideal for most yeasts. For carbonating and bottle conditioning, 65 is a little cooler than ideal. Most people here recommend 3 weeks at 70 degrees for carbonating/conditioning. Beer will carbonate and condition at 65 degrees, but it could take a week or 2 longer than it would at 70. You mentioned in an earlier post that you have a laundry room that stays at 72 degrees. Putting the bottles in there will speed up the process significantly, compared to that 65 degree basement.

If I were in your shoes, I would use the cool basement for all primary and secondary fermentation. I would carbonate and condition for 2 to 3 weeks in the warmer laundry room, then return the bottles to the cooler basement for any extended storage.

Having access to a cool basement like this is an idea scenario for a brewer... The cool basement will help the beer ferment "cleaner" and will increase shelf life of the finished beer, and the warmer laundry room is perfect for helping speed up the carbonation and conditioning...

Great stuff, thanks again!

My Pleasure!

My brown ale has been in the secondary for two days in the 65f basement. I came down this am to find that one my kids left the light on right above it all. Wondering how damaging that will be.

apcoach said:

My brown ale has been in the secondary for two days in the 65f basement. I came down this am to find that one my kids left the light on right above it all. Wondering how damaging that will be.

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Flourescent or incandescent?

Incandescent

apcoach said:

Incandescent

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No worries.

Today I am brewing a two hearted ale clone. The brew went well, 30 minutes. But since then it has taken me 2 hours to get 5 gallons to boil. At least 0ne hour of which had 7 lbs of dme in it. Do you see any problems with that?

Also, I am adding centennial hops every 15 minutes. Should I keep them all in the kettle until I'm done or take out te old when I add the new?

apcoach said:

Also, I am adding centennial hops every 15 minutes. Should I keep them all in the kettle until I'm done or take out te old when I add the new?

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Do not worry about how long it takes to get to a boil. The large quantity of DME just makes it harder to get the bioil started (raises the boiling point) As long as you can get it to boil and keep it boiling, you are OK.

Leave all the earlier hops additions in the kettle as you add more hops later in the boil. 60 minutes of boiling hops produces bitterness. Boiling hops for between 15 and 40 minutes adds a combination of bitterness, flavor and aroma. Any hops added with less than 15 minutes of boiling remaining are basically only for aroma.

Recipes with multiple hops additions like that are attempting to create a "more complex hops profile" where you have a combination of the correct level of bitterness, a pleasant hops aroma, and flavor.