Another LHBS Rant

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Bernie Brewer

Grouchy Old Fart
Joined
Feb 2, 2006
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Location
Eldorado, WI
OK here's the deal: I had to be in Sheboygan today (that's in Eastern WI for you non Cheeseheads) on unrelated business, and I also would like to brew tomorrow if possible. So I do a search to find the nearest LHBS to Sheboygan so I can pick up some ingredients for brewing. My search yields a hit: Grapes, Grains, and Beans in Manitowoc, about 1/2 hour north of where I was. Sounds good, I'm in business, right? Well I get there, and I ask the proprietor if they have any 50# sacks of two-row that they can sell me.
Answer: "No, but we can get it." Well, I'm from out of town, I won't be coming back, so I'll just get enough for this couple of batches and call it good. So I need, for starters, 30# of 2-row.

"Oh, my goodness no, we don't have that much on hand! we only order 20# at a time!" She opens the little barrel and there's maybe 5 pounds of 2-row in there.
That's all you have, I say? "Well, yes", she says " Most homebrewers only brew 5 gallons at a time, so we don't go through that much."

I told her that since most 5- gallon batches use close to 10 pounds of 2-row that she is only able to keep two customers happy at a time at that rate.


Honestly, what self-respecting LHBS only has 20# of BASE MALT on hand at one time???? That's ridiculous!!!! Grrrrrrrr! I told her not to expect to be in business much longer if they keep that up........


The irony of it all is, this LHBS is only two blocks from one of Budweiser's biggest malting plants!!!!! And they only carry 20# at a time! Sheesh! Ok, rant over..........
 
My LHBS is pretty much an extract only shop. I'm sure they'd special order if the demand was there, but there doesn't seem to be a big interest in homebrewing here in "paradise". One of the big reasons I'm waiting before I try AG.

I think some LHBS's would do far better if they carried a wider range of products and actively promoted the hobby instead of just carrying enough to call themselves a LHBS. I understand it costs them money, but....

Special order doesn't do jack for you when you are on brew day and realize your missing something.

I plan on being at the point in a year or so, where I will have enough supplies on hand that if I get the itch to brew, I'll be able to throw something together with what I have.
 
Yeah, I can more easily buy pool filters (but not the kind the Monster Mash uses) and knick knacks at my LHBS than actual brew supplies - it's a pool supply shop, gift store, gaming shop, and HBS.

They actually quit stocking grain almost altogether, but they are pretty willing to take special orders. I'm going to see about ordering a 55 lb sack of 2-row through them - if it's less than $50, that's better than I've done online.
 
Sounds like they don't do much business and it also sounds like they don't know what they are doing. We have had a few folks post on here about LHBS that don't know what the heck they are doing. What is going on?
 
And curiously enough- the LHBS that seemed stunned when I asked about milling the grain (a 5 pound bag on the shelf) is in the state of ..........Wisconsin. They didn't have any yeast, either, beyond a couple of leftover lager yeasts.

Maybe the Wisconsin stores that are the "bait, gas, deli" stores are trying to break into the HBS game thinking it'll be an easy way to make extra cash. I don't know- I still have to either order online or drive all the way to Appleton (2 1/2 hours each way!).
 
If I want anything but Extracts and DME or specialities grains I have to order it online.
My LHBS has the dried yeast hung in nail hooks above the counter so you can see whats in stock. Been the same stock for that last year or so..

I can pick up carboys, funnels, Irish moss, caps.... at the LHBS for the same price as online, and not have to pay shipping, so there is a bright side..
 
McKBrew said:
My LHBS is pretty much an extract only shop. I'm sure they'd special order if the demand was there, but there doesn't seem to be a big interest in homebrewing here in "paradise".
Well you do have the Kona brewing co....the maker of the absolutely killer Kona coffee porter( at least I think that's the name:D). I'd have a hard time brewing if I could get my hands on that year round


Dan
 
isn't there an online shop that sells with FREE SHIPPING over a certain dollar amount???buy 100 pounds at time of base, won't it keep??
 
I'd rather buy (and do buy) from a homebrew shop that only stocks small quantities, than one that has large quantities of stuff that they can't sell, and which gets stale!
I call them about 1 month before I need something, and let them know what I want. If they have it in stock, I pick it up. Otherwise, they order what I want, and I pick it up a few weeks later.
I once made the mistake of buying 10 lbs of rancid crystal malt from another store.

-a.
 
Dude said:
That does suck. So what did you end up doing?

Nothing. I was only at that shop because I happened to be in that part of the state yesterday, and I was running errands. I didn't have time to go up to Appleton, which is where I normally go, so I never got any ingredients to brew with. I'll try to get up there this week sometime and maybe brew next weekend, if SWMBO doesn't give me a honey-do list.....:eek:
 
We have some decent shops in the Milwaukee area. Good selections of yeast and grain.

I'm trying to work an angle for 50 lb bags of 2-row. I order a lot of bakery ingredients for work like sugar, flour, etc. My distributor delivers to me twice a week and is down in Chicago every two weeks to pick up ingredients at Cargill.

I'm pretty sure I can special order some 2-row and have it delivered right along with my other ingredients.
 
Yooper Chick said:
And curiously enough- the LHBS that seemed stunned when I asked about milling the grain (a 5 pound bag on the shelf) is in the state of ..........Wisconsin. They didn't have any yeast, either, beyond a couple of leftover lager yeasts.

Maybe the Wisconsin stores that are the "bait, gas, deli" stores are trying to break into the HBS game thinking it'll be an easy way to make extra cash. I don't know- I still have to either order online or drive all the way to Appleton (2 1/2 hours each way!).

I just got all my stuff for my first AG in Appleton on Friday. It's a good shop. But, if you're driving from the UP, why not just go to the LHBS in Green Bay? It's still a long drive, but it will save you at least 70 miles round trip. I've been there once, and it seems like a nice place. I went there because they had the weldless kettle thermometer I wanted in stock. While there, I also bought an immersion chiller (impulse buy).

http://www.houseofhomebrew.com/?
 
Bernie Brewer said:
Nothing. I was only at that shop because I happened to be in that part of the state yesterday, and I was running errands. I didn't have time to go up to Appleton, which is where I normally go, so I never got any ingredients to brew with. I'll try to get up there this week sometime and maybe brew next weekend, if SWMBO doesn't give me a honey-do list.....:eek:

Hmmm...I was under the impression you were near Milwaukee.
 
Dude said:
Hmmm...I was under the impression you were near Milwaukee.

I'm in Fond du Lac, Bernie. I've been to just about every LHBS North of Fond du Lac. I go mostly to Homebrew Market in Appleton due to their proximity. I've been to Grape, Grain, and Bean once. My wife dragged me up to some mega kitchen supply store that was closing it's doors, and lo and behold, there was a HBS. I thought it was a decent shop. The people there were really helpful, too. I wasn't there to buy ingredients, but I did buy Palmer's book, and a bottle sanitizer. So, as far as equipment, I thought it was actually a very good shop. They also had MLTs prebuilt (5 gallon variety round Gott style...pretty expensive, but at least they had some). I think you're right, though, it sounds like they taylor to the extract brewer. Most of their grains are probably ordered for steeping purposes.

But, my favorite HBS experience was at Point Brew Supply in Stevens Point. It's quite a haul for me to go there, but it's really worth it if you have some free time. The owners there are so helpful, and their prices are in line with the online megasites. And, I guarantee they have enough grain for whatever your needs. They do business online also, if you don't mind paying a bit for shipping. I've only been there once, but I'd like to go again.
 
I got charged $2.50 a pound for wheat malt yesterday. $75.0 for 3 pounds ! There happens to be a malting company right in town and I could have bought it for $0.40 a pound or $22 for s 55 pound bag.
 
greg75 said:
I just got all my stuff for my first AG in Appleton on Friday. It's a good shop. But, if you're driving from the UP, why not just go to the LHBS in Green Bay? It's still a long drive, but it will save you at least 70 miles round trip. I've been there once, and it seems like a nice place. I went there because they had the weldless kettle thermometer I wanted in stock. While there, I also bought an immersion chiller (impulse buy).

http://www.houseofhomebrew.com/?

Thanks- I might go there sometime. Actually, GB and Appleton are about the same distance from me- a little southeast to GB and a little southwest to Appleton. I mostly order online, unless I'm going to Appleton anyway.
 
greg75 said:
But, my favorite HBS experience was at Point Brew Supply in Stevens Point. It's quite a haul for me to go there, but it's really worth it if you have some free time. The owners there are so helpful, and their prices are in line with the online megasites. And, I guarantee they have enough grain for whatever your needs. They do business online also, if you don't mind paying a bit for shipping. I've only been there once, but I'd like to go again.


I know. I think I'm the one that pointed you in that direction(sorry 'bout the bad pun:eek: ) If you want to go again sometime PM me. If I'm not busy, I'll go with.


EDIT: you prolly didn't know it was me- I was ablrbrau back then, I have since changed my handle and you prolly didn't know. BTW I haven't seen you around the site in awhile- where you been????
 
I hear you. I drove 30 mins to the LHBS here in salt lake and got there at 6:29 when they close at 6:30. And low and behold they dont open the door and pretend to not see me. Ok I know understandable they need to close.... did I mention it was to buy a new vial of yeast to replace the one they sold me that bombed in the starter
 
I've said it before, I'll say it again. Anyone in the Albany, NY area - Hennessy Homebrew Emporium :rockin: They'll sell you a 55-lb bag of base malt walking in off the street. Hell, they'll mill it for you, no problem whatsoever, if you want.

The homebrew place in Northampton, MA? They act like they're doing you a favor if they mill you 10lbs of base malt without phoning the order in ahead of time. Usually I haven't finalized my recipe (or decided which one to brew) until I'm in the car going over the mountain.... plus freakin' $3 dry yeast... but hey, at least they're always closed when I'm in town, so I never have the opportunity to waste money there... :rolleyes:
 
SpecialEd said:
I hear you. I drove 30 mins to the LHBS here in salt lake and got there at 6:29 when they close at 6:30. And low and behold they dont open the door and pretend to not see me. Ok I know understandable they need to close.... did I mention it was to buy a new vial of yeast to replace the one they sold me that bombed in the starter

That would piss me off to no end. I'll call them up and ream them out.
 
The thing about LHBS's ordering stuff is that anyone can order from morebeer or AHBS and probably get it for less. There's no way the LHBS is going to be able to compete unless they can give you the one thing the internet bigboys can't--the ability to purchase something today, right now.

I guess some of these places must figure there is no way they can keep 20 different malts on hand and fresh, so they just punt and stock malt extracts and a few specialty grains.

It's got to be a pretty tough business to make money in, actually.
 
Bernie Brewer said:
EDIT: you prolly didn't know it was me- I was ablrbrau back then, I have since changed my handle and you prolly didn't know. BTW I haven't seen you around the site in awhile- where you been????

Yes, I remember you now...I thought maybe I had located another local. And, yes, you definitely were the one that pointed me in that direction.

I've been MIA partly because of my wife's work hours changing, and me doing a lot more of the Mr. Mom thing, along with my own fulltime job. But, mainly, the weather's been kind of uncooperative since I got all my AG equipment in order. Literally the day I bought my chiller and keggle thermometer, is when winter finally started. Now that spring's finally here, I'm going to attempt my first AG this weekend, assuming nothing earth-shattering happens between now and then. I got all the grains on Friday, so I'm all ready to go, but thought it would be the perfect time to get some last second AG pointers.

It's good to be back!
 
cweston said:
The thing about LHBS's ordering stuff is that anyone can order from morebeer or AHBS and probably get it for less. There's no way the LHBS is going to be able to compete unless they can give you the one thing the internet bigboys can't--the ability to purchase something today, right now.

I guess some of these places must figure there is no way they can keep 20 different malts on hand and fresh, so they just punt and stock malt extracts and a few specialty grains.

It's got to be a pretty tough business to make money in, actually.

Actually, since it's so easy to buy online I think the only way a LHBS can compete is by being the BEST in customer service. And give good advice, born of experience. That's why I'll drive to Appleton when I can- 5 hours by car roundtrip. For the expert advice, the recipe books he has there, the samples, and the customer service. I can go in to buy $20 worth, but leave with $100 worth of stuff. (Or lots more, but don't tell my husband!)

Maybe a small LHBS can't carry 20 different malts and keep them fresh- but they can keep basics and offer substitutions if possible. That's something I'd willing pay more for.
 
Yooper Chick said:
Actually, since it's so easy to buy online I think the only way a LHBS can compete is by being the BEST in customer service. And give good advice, born of experience. That's why I'll drive to Appleton when I can- 5 hours by car roundtrip. For the expert advice, the recipe books he has there, the samples, and the customer service. I can go in to buy $20 worth, but leave with $100 worth of stuff. (Or lots more, but don't tell my husband!)

I can see that--I've never had a decent LHBS, so I've never relied on them for advice (I get that here, mostly). It just seems like such a niche market: no wonder most of these places combine HB supplies with other businesses. It'd be a great business for a retired military person or something, I guess: you get to deal with the hobby you love and maybe make a little coin.
 
I guess I've never realized it, but I am lucky to have a LHBS in town, a 4 minute drive away. If that doesn't work, there are 3 more within 45 minute or so drive from my house.

I STILL end up buying a lot of equipment online or through eBay- even with shipping included, it can be cheaper than my primary LHBS
 
cweston said:
The thing about LHBS's ordering stuff is that anyone can order from morebeer or AHBS and probably get it for less. There's no way the LHBS is going to be able to compete unless they can give you the one thing the internet bigboys can't--the ability to purchase something today, right now.

I guess some of these places must figure there is no way they can keep 20 different malts on hand and fresh, so they just punt and stock malt extracts and a few specialty grains.

It's got to be a pretty tough business to make money in, actually.

That may be mostly true, but one of the LHBS in CO Springs had better prices for ingredients than any place I've seen online (some equip may be higher). Sometimes they were out of one thing or another, but there's always a substitute, and you end up trying something new which I never mind.

Plus I loved going in and just shooting the bull about beer/wine and brewing in general, drinking a sample brew while I was picking out my ingredients. I really miss having that place close by!
 
OK, so i can get 55 lbs at the LHBS with tax for roughly 50$. why would i spend an extra 50$ to ship ups from the net suppliers??

HEY BIRD I Grew up in Sheffield--berkshires! HOLA. weened on SCHLITZ from our PACKY (massachusetts speak here).

Couldn't agree more with CUSTOMER SERVICE. We have a different local Buffalo place that sells wine supplies and gifts. I asked the owner about Beer supplies and now I'm a KNUCKLE DRAGGER:confused: UP HIS! I'll go the extra 25 miles to North Tonowanda, and get homemade sausage on the way!!!
 
Well I tried a new source for my homebrewing needs this week and ordered an American Wheat kit from a place a couple hours away. They charged me 20 bucks for shipping (I checked the ups site and it would have cost them 10 bucks to ship to me) and they sent it in a beat up reused box (so that didn't cost them anything. They shorted me a couple ounces on my steeping grains (only 1/2 lb was called for) and the hops were well beyond their prime. So I ended up sprucing it up with some hops I had lying around. I'm sure it will be fine, but you can bet your A$$ I won't be giving them any money from now on. Plus the guy I talked to didn't seem to know his A$$ from his elbow..Oh well, that's what I get for living in the middle of nowhere:D


Dan
 
Dan - If you haven't before, give austinhomebrew a shot next time. Their prices aren't bad, shipping is a flat $6, and their stuff comes packaged well. You would just probably want to order earlier in the week to get things in time to brew on the weekend, but I bet it'll get there faster than you'd expect. If you've got any questions, give them a call. The guys I've spoken with there know their stuff. No reason to put up with that crap like you did last time!
 
Lil' Sparky said:
Dan - If you haven't before, give austinhomebrew a shot next time. Their prices aren't bad, shipping is a flat $6, and their stuff comes packaged well. You would just probably want to order earlier in the week to get things in time to brew on the weekend, but I bet it'll get there faster than you'd expect. If you've got any questions, give them a call. The guys I've spoken with there know their stuff. No reason to put up with that crap like you did last time!

AHB normally gets all of my business, but they were taking a long time shipping my order (compared to their previous ship times), which was why I ordered a kit from a closer retailer. I had planned to brew that weekend and wasn't going to be let down:D.
I guess AHB was training some new people and were swamped with orders so it took 4 days from my initial order to ship it, when normally it takes them one day. I made my order based on their previous shipping times and kind of got stuck in a hard place. But they almost always get my business, just based on their customer service and their kits can't be beat. I've also found that their crush on the grain is consistent and well done. I will be placing orders earlier from now on, just in case.


Dan
 
Actually, I noticed the same thing on my order last week. I ordered on Wed morning, but it didn't ship out until Fri afternoon, arriving Mon. :( Whereas, I had ordered in the afternoon before and it shipped that day. I think I'll just order earlier from now on, too.
 
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