BIAB Brewing (with pics)

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I don't think 142 is a problem in terms of efficiency. But if the temperature and wetting of the grain were uneven that could definitely be a problem. this is not a huge amount of grain for a BIAB but it is a pretty big grain bill. When I do big stouts, and especially If I am doing over 5 gallons at a time, I use two bags, each of which fill about half of my keggle. That way I can actually lift the damn thing when it is time to pull the grain. Also helps with wetting and stirring. I definitely think you are better off adding the grain to the bag in the pot. Much better wetting. I didn't notice whether you did a sparge or a mash out but both of those things help, especially with a big beer.

Hope that helps.
 
ClemTiger0408 said:
I attempted BIAB for the first time today, going from extract brewing. It did NOT go well. I was trying to make this: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f78/holly-christmas-ale-145580/

My pre-boil efficiency came out to be around 57%, unfortunately. I have two theories based on what I observed today.

1. Bag Size: I used a 5 gallon paint strainer from Lowe's

2. Mash Temp
Click to expand...

I did this recipe a few weeks ago: http://www.rebelbrewer.com/shop/red-beaver/three-sheets-belgian-tripel-kit/ it says it has a 1.081 OG and my OG was 1.080 so I feel satisfied with my BIAB.

However that brew day my 10.5 gallon stock pot was found to have a couple pin holes in it so I had to use my smaller 7 gallon turkey pot. So I did a 2 pot method, in my turkey pot I heated 4 gallons to strike temp (162 I believe was what I went for) and I did a pretty solid 90 minute mash at 149F with the temps staying pretty good. Stirred the mash up real good about 3 times during the 90 minutes, I did give it a little heat about 2/3 of the way through as it was dipping towards 145 so I heated it to 150F and let the mash finish.

At the end of the mash I heated up another 3 gallons in my 4 gallon pot to 180. At the end of the mash I pulled my bag out, put it over a bucket while I poured the mashed wort into another bucket, then I put the bag back into the 7 gallon pot and poured the 180F sparge over it, and stirred it up good and let it rest about 10 minutes. I started a boil of about 2 gallons of the wort in the kitchen since no way would the 7 gallon pot hold it all without a massive boilover. I then pulled my bag out, and squeezed the everliving bejeesus out of it (I used my stock pot with basket for this, the pinhole was 4" off the bottom so it was fine for this). Luckily a 5 gallon bucket just fits into the basket for the stock pot so I put the bag in the basket, put a bucket of water on the bag, then I pushed down till my palms hurt, really squeezing the bag.

Then I boiled what I guess was about 4 gallons of wort in the 7 gallon turkey pot, doing the hop schedule as the recipe called, ended with just a hair over 5 gallons, just over the line on the bucket, and 1.080. It wasn't pretty but it worked.
 
Brewitt said:
When I do big stouts, and especially If I am doing over 5 gallons at a time, I use two bags, each of which fill about half of my keggle. That way I can actually lift the damn thing when it is time to pull the grain. Also helps with wetting and stirring. I definitely think you are better off adding the grain to the bag in the pot. Much better wetting. I didn't notice whether you did a sparge or a mash out but both of those things help, especially with a big beer.

Hope that helps.
Click to expand...

Does help, thanks. When you use two bags, do you clip the bags to the side of the pot and just have them sort of side by side? Even though I have a 10 gallon kettle, I still worry it will get cramped when I have a 14# grain bill.

Additionally, does it make it harder having two bags with a pulley system? It took me like twenty damn minutes yesterday just trying to tie a knot to be used by the pulley.
 
My first BIAB was 17 lb grain bill in a 10 gallon pot. It was a couple inches from the top, but it worked fine. I didn't use a pulley, but I suspended it over the pot with a rope tied to a ladder. Now I use a metal grate from a grill and just lift it up until some of the wort drains out and then stick the grate under the bag/on top of the top to drain the rest. Works well.
 
Lots of ways to skin a cat, so to speak. I used to do the rope routine. Used the grate approach as well. Then I started doing 10 gallon batches in my keggle so I had two problems: volume and weight. That's when I started doing a sparge and using two bags. I do my mash with the two bags each clipped around half the pot. Then I can lift them one at a time by hand into a bucket with holes nested in another bucket. I pour a gallon or so of sparge water over each and press to squeeze. The squeezate (my word) goes back in the pot and the boil is on.

Now when I do five gallon brews I use one bag except for a big 9% stout or something similar. Either way I hand transfer into the sparge bucket.

The message here is look at all the suggestions then do what works for you.
 
Like not even hosed it off? It's getting boiled in the next batch, but why not rinse it off?

I usually throw mine in a load with the towels I used during brewing with Tide Free.
 
wilserbrewer said:
Perhaps this thread will help you
Click to expand...

Ha ha this thread will help tie a knot ... You crack me up. Almost snorted my coffee.
 
thughes said:
I got my bag from Jeff 3 years ago. Never put mine in the washing machine, just toss it over the chain-link fence in the backyard and hose it off when I get done brewing. 500+ gallons and it's holding up fine. YMMV.
Click to expand...

...Just got a bag from Jeff in the mail today and am looking forward to using it. Man, it's a nice bag. Stitching is flawless and plentiful, IMHO, and it's far nicer than I expected. I hope to report back on it after use number 20! ...or 30
 
Great walkthrough! I'm doing my first all grain on my stove top with 2.5 gallons. I have to modify a bit but this helped me understand the processes.

What is your equipment? I see the blickman, but what size etc? Did you find a deal for it somewhere?
 
Hi y'all. I'm about to do my first BIAB in a couple of weeks. I've got a 15 gallon kettle and all my equipment. I didn't ready through all the pages but here are my questions. As far as recipes go, do I just pick up an all grain recipe kit or do I need specific BIAB recipe kit? Also from the posts I did read it looks like I just have to double mill the grains for certain beers. But how do I figure out which recipes need to have the grains double milled? Thanks in advanced for the help.
 
justsome1 said:
Hi y'all. I'm about to do my first BIAB in a couple of weeks. I've got a 15 gallon kettle and all my equipment. I didn't ready through all the pages but here are my questions. As far as recipes go, do I just pick up an all grain recipe kit or do I need specific BIAB recipe kit? Also from the posts I did read it looks like I just have to double mill the grains for certain beers. But how do I figure out which recipes need to have the grains double milled? Thanks in advanced for the help.
Click to expand...

Just about any recipe can be done BIAB style, recipes don't change with brewing method.

BIAB allows you to use a fine crush, just be sure that all the grain pieces are well fractured, and NO, almost no whole kernels of grain are present. This will dictate the need for a double crush.
You don't want a coarse crush with whole grains remaining.
 
Walzenbrew said:
Great walkthrough! I'm doing my first all grain on my stove top with 2.5 gallons. I have to modify a bit but this helped me understand the processes.

What is your equipment? I see the blickman, but what size etc? Did you find a deal for it somewhere?
Click to expand...

I'm still using my 10 gallon Blingman kettle but any type of kettle will work. If you plan to brew high gravity beers I'd recommend at least 15 gallon kettle. Soon I'll be updating my brewery to use either a larger boil kettle or perhaps multiple mash kettles since I brew a good amount of high gravity.

If you mainly brew 5 gallon batches at OG ~1.070 or less then you should be fine with a 10 gallon kettle.
 
I have scoured most of this forum and thanks to all that have contributed, for anybody that wants to go all grain and wants to save some time/money this works great.

One thing I don't see mentioned is why traditional all grain has water/grain ratio that you try to stick within, but BIAB doesn't "require" this. Can anybody explain why that is? Does using less water for BIAB for larger grain bills affect conversation/efficiecy?

I'm mainly asking because I've just about got my first year of brewing under my belt and have started building my schedule for this year and want to do a few brews that have large grain bills. I did a couple big beers last year but as extract so I'm hoping to keep consistency when going to AG.
 
Nothing wrong with keeping a water to grain ratio, most people don't though because they only have one pot, and one way to add hot water to the mash/sparge, so they just get an over sized pot and dough in with the full volume of strike/sparge water. If you have other means to introduce water, hot or not, by all means do it. Try it both ways, adding water after the mash and doughing in with your full water volume. Decide what you like to do
 
241 said:
Nothing wrong with keeping a water to grain ratio, most people don't though because they only have one pot, and one way to add hot water to the mash/sparge, so they just get an over sized pot and dough in with the full volume of strike/sparge water.do
Click to expand...

Doesn't that change the water chemistry - pH buffering in particular?
 
Good question, and the answer is probably yes. But full volume mashes are the norm in BIAB land... as per this tutorial

I'm just starting to work on water chemistry and purchased a ph meter. Last BIAB brew I did the ph was 5.5
 
241 said:
Good question, and the answer is probably yes. But full volume mashes are the norm in BIAB land... as per this tutorial I'm just starting to work on water chemistry and purchased a ph meter. Last BIAB brew I did the ph was 5.5
Click to expand...
Also agreed that this is a good question. From playing around with Brunwater and EZwater spreadsheets it appears so. I just did my first batch where I tinkered with the water and will let you know.
 
bolus14 said:
I have scoured most of this forum and thanks to all that have contributed, for anybody that wants to go all grain and wants to save some time/money this works great.

One thing I don't see mentioned is why traditional all grain has water/grain ratio that you try to stick within, but BIAB doesn't "require" this. Can anybody explain why that is? Does using less water for BIAB for larger grain bills affect conversation/efficiecy?

I'm mainly asking because I've just about got my first year of brewing under my belt and have started building my schedule for this year and want to do a few brews that have large grain bills. I did a couple big beers last year but as extract so I'm hoping to keep consistency when going to AG.
Click to expand...

I found this today on Braukaiser's site:

The thickness of the mash doesn't seem to effect the fermentability of the wort that is produced but thinner mashes can significantly improve the conversion efficiency. As a result brewers who see low efficiency from their mashing may try to use a thinner mash (3-4 l/kg or 1.5 - 2 qt/lb) as they were shown to convert more starches.
Click to expand...

Link here:

http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.ph...ity_and_efficiency_in_single_infusion_mashing
 
bolus14 said:
One thing I don't see mentioned is why traditional all grain has water/grain ratio that you try to stick within, but BIAB doesn't "require" this. Can anybody explain why that is? Does using less water for BIAB for larger grain bills affect conversation/efficiecy?
Click to expand...
There is a good podcast on BIAB on the Beersmith website with Pat Hollingdale, who is one of the early adopters/contributors to the BIAB method.

http://beersmith.com/blog/2011/02/24/brew-in-a-bag-biab-down-under-beersmith-podcast-10/

On this topic of mash thickness he says the difference for BIAB vs traditional 3 vessels brewing is the sparging. In 3 vessel you sparge (dump hot water) over the grains to rinse out the sugars. With BIAB you have all you water in the mash already which Pat calls a "passive sparge". Basically the thinner mash allows the sugars to be rinse away a little more easily then a thick mash. It is worth a listen.

For what it's worth, it seems most BIABers get about 70% efficiency, which is what you will find most AG recipes are based on. Don't let the efficiency number become a pissing match or some elusive pot of gold. 70% is good enough for home brewing and a full volume BIAB mash will get you there. :mug:

Chris
 
I have been thinging of using some of my extra BIAB sacks to help filter/separate the hops from the wort during the boil. Is there any danger (negative effects) of using a BIAB voile cloth during the boil?
 
Using the material and even the bags is fine as long as they are not hanging on the bottom of a direct fired pot. I would just pull them up and clip them to the side of the pot so they are off the bottom. In fact, I just use a smaller version of my voile boiling bag for hops.
 
Getting ready to brew this afternoon. Doing BIAB and no chill, this will be my first no chill so we'll see how that goes.
I'm making the Deception Cream Stout from these forums with a couple modifications.
Outside temp is supposed to reach 30 about 2 hours after I plan to start, which should be about when the boil finishes and I start to cool.

I have a couple questions though. Do I cool in the kettle or in the fermenter? After the boil do I give it time for some proteins to settle or just dump it all in the fermenter?
Anybody have a rough idea how long it will take to cool to about 65°?

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Home Brew mobile app
 
Do I cool in the kettle or in the fermenter?
Click to expand...
Cool in the kettle.
After the boil do I give it time for some proteins to settle or just dump it all in the fermenter?
Click to expand...
Lots of opinions on this from "dump it all in" to "whirlpool and get none in the fermenter". I remember they talked about it on the Basic Brewing Radio podcast and I think the results were a little mixed, but that it didn't make a huge difference. For me, if I'm harvesting the yeast, I will at least try to filter some of the break material out just so the yeast is cleaner. But most of the time, I just dump most of it in.
Anybody have a rough idea how long it will take to cool to about 65°?
Click to expand...
What method are you using? I use an ice bath and an immersion chiller and it will probably take less than 10 minutes with how cold it is and how cold the water is.
 
I may dip the kettle in snow. If I use my chiller I can normal cool in 10-15 without an ice bath. I'm just avoiding hooking my hose up outside. So I'll just keep I'm the kettle till around 70° then siphon to fermenter and pitch. I figure I'll lose a couple degrees during the siphon too.

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Home Brew mobile app
 
Well brew is done. All in all not a bad brew day. Ended up whirlpooling the wort and keeping the top off slightly to cool. Did that off and on while cleaning up, eating dinner, and other things. Ended up taking about 3 hours to get it to 67°. Pitch WLP002 from a previous porter. Its on the high side of the temp range bit I'm going to let it ride.

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Home Brew mobile app
 
ChrisL_ said:
There is a good podcast on BIAB on the Beersmith website with Pat Hollingdale, who is one of the early adopters/contributors to the BIAB method.

http://beersmith.com/blog/2011/02/24/brew-in-a-bag-biab-down-under-beersmith-podcast-10/

On this topic of mash thickness he says the difference for BIAB vs traditional 3 vessels brewing is the sparging. In 3 vessel you sparge (dump hot water) over the grains to rinse out the sugars. With BIAB you have all you water in the mash already which Pat calls a "passive sparge". Basically the thinner mash allows the sugars to be rinse away a little more easily then a thick mash. It is worth a listen.

For what it's worth, it seems most BIABers get about 70% efficiency, which is what you will find most AG recipes are based on. Don't let the efficiency number become a pissing match or some elusive pot of gold. 70% is good enough for home brewing and a full volume BIAB mash will get you there. :mug:

Chris
Click to expand...

I just did my first brew with BIAB all grain expecting something in the 60%'s for mash efficiency and ended up at 80% mash efficiency. Right now I am prying that it turns out OK and not a grainy astringent brew from milling some of the grain to flower (Yes I was still dialing in the crush).
 
fuzzy2133 said:
I just did my first brew with BIAB all grain expecting something in the 60%'s for mash efficiency and ended up at 80% mash efficiency. Right now I am prying that it turns out OK and not a grainy astringent brew from milling some of the grain to flower (Yes I was still dialing in the crush).
Click to expand...

It'll be great! I get a pretty significant amount of flour in my grist and have never had a problem with graininess or tannins.

Sent from my GT-P3113 using Home Brew mobile app
 
I have some questions about strike volumes and squeezing of grains.

In the beginning of this post, the OP used 7.5 gallons of strike volume for 12.75 LBs of grain and ended up with 6.75 gallons pre-boil. That means a grain absorption rate of 0.058 gals/lb.

Every calculator I see for BIAB assumes a ratio of 0.125. More than double OP.

Last week I did a BIAB using the 0.125 ratio. Admittedly I didn't carefully measure the strike volume. I used 3 2.5 gallon jugs. Not totally accurate, but close enough, right? Anyways, after mashing I squeezed the CRAP out of the bag. Really squeezed that sucker. Everything I remember from extract brewing tells me this releases tannins, but hey OP squeezed!

I ended up with pre-boil volume of just under 7.5 gallons. It meant I had to boil for two hours to get the final volume right. I hit 70% efficiency and hit OG right on, in the end. But I'd like to get better control of volumes.

So does 0.125 assume no squeezing? And is that the best method? What about those tannins?
 
I can't chime about volumes. YMMV, always. What you could just do, is to measure all your volumes/losses for the few first batches. And see from those figures.
As for tannins extraction, it is possible but under 2, simultaneous conditions: high sparge temp (above 170F ), and mash pH above 'optimal' values (5.2-5.6). So maybe above 6 you might to start worrying :)

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Home Brew mobile app
 
ClemTiger0408 said:
I have some questions about strike volumes and squeezing of grains.

In the beginning of this post, the OP used 7.5 gallons of strike volume for 12.75 LBs of grain and ended up with 6.75 gallons pre-boil. That means a grain absorption rate of 0.058 gals/lb.

Every calculator I see for BIAB assumes a ratio of 0.125. More than double OP.

Last week I did a BIAB using the 0.125 ratio. Admittedly I didn't carefully measure the strike volume. I used 3 2.5 gallon jugs. Not totally accurate, but close enough, right? Anyways, after mashing I squeezed the CRAP out of the bag. Really squeezed that sucker. Everything I remember from extract brewing tells me this releases tannins, but hey OP squeezed!

I ended up with pre-boil volume of just under 7.5 gallons. It meant I had to boil for two hours to get the final volume right. I hit 70% efficiency and hit OG right on, in the end. But I'd like to get better control of volumes.

So does 0.125 assume no squeezing? And is that the best method? What about those tannins?
Click to expand...

Fwiw, I usually get 0.06 gal/lbs absorption of water by the grains with my 2-3 gal batches of fairly typical gravity (ie not really big beers). I arrived at that number through trial and error. I squeeze fairly well though not like a maniac and have never had trouble with tannins.
 
ClemTiger0408 said:
I have some questions about strike volumes and squeezing of grains.

In the beginning of this post, the OP used 7.5 gallons of strike volume for 12.75 LBs of grain and ended up with 6.75 gallons pre-boil. That means a grain absorption rate of 0.058 gals/lb.

Every calculator I see for BIAB assumes a ratio of 0.125. More than double OP.

So does 0.125 assume no squeezing? And is that the best method? What about those tannins?
Click to expand...

I've never used the BIAB water volume calculators and learned my ideal strike water volumes through trial and error. The key is to get the correct pre-boil volume in the kettle after you remove the grains. If I start with 7.5 gallons of strike water and intend to boil for 1-hour, I know I'll need at least 6.5 gallons in the kettle pre-boil (assuming a 1-gal per hour boil off rate.) If I have at least this much in the kettle after mash out, I don't squeeze. If I don't have this amount in the kettle after mashing, I will squeeze. You'll need to experiment to find the best starting volume of water for your particular setup. Everyone's equipment setup is different. At least the problem you reported (having too much wort in the kettle after mashing) was correctable since all you had to do was boil longer.

No worries about tannins from squeezing. Tannins come from high temperature situations, like boiling the grains, or very high pH. You won't extract tannins from squeezing. Hope this helps.
 

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