Catch-all thread to discuss brewing 100% brett beers.

I thought it might be helpful to have a single thread for people discuss all things related to brewing an exclusively brett beer rather than a bunch of disjointed threads discussing what is essentially the same subject.


I'll get things started:


I had a two month old vial of ECY B. Custersianus sitting in the fridge that I've been meaning to get around to using. after scouring the web for info on starters for 100% I was just as confused as I was when I set out. the only constant I came across was " make a big starter",.

I figured; 'well, my vial is two months old, has no info regarding projected initial cell count, so I'd better do a multi-step". started out with 1.5 liters of 1036 wort, pitched whole vial two days ago. visible activity has been slow at best.

not sure where to go from here...

pitch another two liters of wort at the same gravity? that's the direction I'm leaning at the moment.

A single thread ... I think you are trying to boil the ocean, and it will not fit in the pot.

Re. your situation, yes, using Brett as a primary yeast needs a big starter. Of similar size to a lager, or about 2X what you would use for a regular ale yeast.

Once it is awake, it will tend to work just like any normal sacc yeast.

I feel like most of these threads just go over and over the same issues and it becomes redundant.

re: my starter.. it's pretty inactive. I'm gonna try to step it up again and see what happens.

I agree, lager sized starter. From what I've read anyway, have only done one 100% brett beer. Definitely a slow process, I let the vial of WLP650 go for a week, slowly adding sugars every couple of days. No stir plate (in use at the time), not sure of the recommended aeration/agitation method.

For my all brett beers (Sat. or Sun. brew-day), I go with a 1L 1040 starter mid-week, let that ride 2 days, put that in the fridge overnight to sediment the brett, take it out of the fridge and do another starter, this time 1.5 L 1040, let that roll overnight or over 2 nights (depending on how the timing has worked out), and pitch that whole starter into my beer. If I was really good about planning, I cold crash the second starter so I can pitch just the slurry, but my planning isn't often perfect.

I always get fast starts and great ferments with this method. If you don't see great activity on the first starter, you may on the second. Have fun.

2 days is not enough time for brett starters. I'm not sure about all species, but a good rule of thumb for brux is 7 days minimum on a stir plate at warm (75-80) temps.

I only have experience with Brettanomyces bruxellensis trois. Initially, when you look at the vial, you have VERY LITTLE sediment. I made a weak starter of about 500 mLs of 1.024 gravity and let it sit at room temp for 7 days. Crashed cooled it for 2 days, then added about a liter of 1.040 wort. 7 days again and crash cooled. I brewed a beer a few days after starting to crash cool and collected about a liter of wort after running through a plate chiller and added that to my slurry of Brett for an overnight starter before pitching it all into the batch. Fermentation took off after about 5 hours and fermented out in about 10 days.

This was an interesting beer. It was a 100% Red X grainbill with no finishing hops. Only used about 15 grams of Warrior for bittering. The fruitiness from the yeast was amazing! It was like I tossed in a bunch of galaxy, amarillo, and nelson (but I didn't).

I have also heard about underpitching this yeast to get more of the fruity esters. Don't know if I underpitched or not. There was a lot of yeast slurry in the starter.

Cheers!

I'll be bottle conditioning a couple all Brett golden ales in a few weeks. I thought I read somewhere on the intraweb to use a little more priming sugar for all Brett beers because the yeast doesn't create as much CO2 as regular yeast. Is this true or not?

ggorospe said:

I'll be bottle conditioning a couple all Brett golden ales in a few weeks. I thought I read somewhere on the intraweb to use a little more priming sugar for all Brett beers because the yeast doesn't create as much CO2 as regular yeast. Is this true or not?

Click to expand...

If anything, you should use less with Brett beers unless you're already sitting near 1.000 FG because Brett will consume sugars that the primary yeast did not.

still building up my starter of B. Custersianus. it's been a bit slow to get going. just last night I descanted off the spent wort from the 500 ml starter, and racked 2l's of fresh 1040 strength wort onto the yeast cake. visible signs of fermentation were quick to appear, but still not exactly a vigorous ferment. I'm
thinking I'll step it up one last time from here and take my chances cell count-wise.

the all Brett I started on Sunday went hard Monday & Tuesday, but active fermentation dropped quite drastically. I pitched 1400 mL of ECY04 @ 64F on Sunday. by the Tuesday morning, it hit 74F. ambient temp is about 62F. it's still very cloudy.

ggorospe said:

I'll be bottle conditioning a couple all Brett golden ales in a few weeks. I thought I read somewhere on the intraweb to use a little more priming sugar for all Brett beers because the yeast doesn't create as much CO2 as regular yeast. Is this true or not?

Click to expand...

I've come across something similar, their reasoning for the extra sugar was that after extended aging in secondary to let the brett do its thing, there is less dissolved CO2 and therefore you need the extra sugar to account for what most priming calculators assume is still there for CO2 at bottling. I have also read that a way around that is to feed the brett a bit of priming sugar in secondary for a few days or a week to let it replace some CO2 and then you can work with standard priming calculators.

Thorpe429 said:

If anything, you should use less with Brett beers unless you're already sitting near 1.000 FG because Brett will consume sugars that the primary yeast did not.

Click to expand...

In my experience, I have never had a 100% Brett beer finish lower than 1.010. Adding Brett after a sacch strain in Primary, then I've definitely had the Brett continue to get the gravity close to 1.000.

I have never heard the tidbit about using more priming sugar in a 100% Brett Beer, but I did notice that mine have never really carb'd up as much as I thought they would. Hmmm...

Clint04 said:

In my experience, I have never had a 100% Brett beer finish lower than 1.010. Adding Brett after a sacch strain in Primary, then I've definitely had the Brett continue to get the gravity close to 1.000. I have never heard the tidbit about using more priming sugar in a 100% Brett Beer, but I did notice that mine have never really carb'd up as much as I thought they would. Hmmm...

Click to expand...

Yes, agreed. Originally missed the "all" part of the description for the Brett golden ale.

going to step up my starter of b. Custersianus tonight...

last step was 2qt's at 1.040.

I'm going all in at a gallon this time. OG 1.040.

plan to brew tommorow, maybe sun.

Thinking of a saison style grist, pils/wheat/Munich/acid malt.

noble hops. always.

sort of a kitchen sink beer here.....
but I have high hopes...

68% efficiency
single infusion
double batch sparged

5 gallon batch

40% pils / 15% Munich / 14% marris otter / 8% white wheat / 8% golden candi syrup / 8% acid malt / 4% melanoidin / 2.5 % crystal rye

90 min boil

2 oz's of 4.1%AA Hallertau at 60min
1 oz of 3.2%AA Styrian Goldings at 15 mins
1 oz of 3.2% AA Styrian Goldings at 10 mins
1/2 oz of 7.2% NZ Hallertau at 5 mins
1/2 oz of 7.2% NZ Hallertau at 180f for 10min rest

for 37.8 IBU's

chilled to 65f - Pitched 1liter descanted from 1 gallon starter of ECY brett Custersianus.

OG 1.060

forgot to mention,

mashed at 150f



I had to adjust the mash pH up to 5.0 from 4.3 by slowly adding baking soda until I hit the mark.


pH of wort in fermentation bucket was right on the money at 5.0 pH as well.

so I just checked my gravity for the first time since brewing the 100% b. Custersianus and was very dissapointed to see that I'm only down to 1.020.

I've rarely seen fermentations that stall at the level decrease more than a few points. I was aiming for 1.008 at the MOST. I guess I'm just gonna let it sit for a month, but my guess is the odds aren't good that I'll see a 12 point reduction at this stage in the game.

BootsyFlanootsy said:

so I just checked my gravity for the first time since brewing the 100% b. Custersianus and was very dissapointed to see that I'm only down to 1.020.

I've rarely seen fermentations that stall at the level decrease more than a few points. I was aiming for 1.008 at the MOST. I guess I'm just gonna let it sit for a month, but my guess is the odds aren't good that I'll see a 12 point reduction at this stage in the game.

Click to expand...

My experience with Brett-B (White Labs) is that it doesn't attenuate well; 65 to 75%. I now mash low and add some sugar to help it come in at a reasonable FG.

The first time I used it, I think it went from 1.060 to 1.020. I moved the beer over onto part of a cake of PacMan to try and get it lower. Worked fine, didn't get any funky flavors from the Brett.

Calder said:

didn't get any funky flavors from the Brett.

Click to expand...

you'll never get any funk when using brett as your primary strain. funky flavors only come when using brett in secondary, after sacch: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f127/understanding-brett-flavors-298943/

yeah. I wasn't expecting any funk; but I also wasn't expecting such crap attenuation, esp considering the size of the starter I pitched, ( and my mash temp),.

I guess I'm left wondering what to do now? 3711? another strain of brett? wine yeast?

BootsyFlanootsy said:

yeah. I wasn't expecting any funk; but I also wasn't expecting such crap attenuation, esp considering the size of the starter I pitched, ( and my mash temp),. I guess I'm left wondering what to do now? 3711? another strain of brett? wine yeast?

Click to expand...

You didn't grow the yeast up properly. Brett starters need 7-10 days on a stirplate. You should have done that twice, probably 1l and then 3 or 4 if you have the equipment. So you underpitched and pitched weak yeast that hadn't completed fermenting your starter. I'd say it did pretty well getting to 1.020. I suspect if you wait, it will continue dropping slowly for a month or two. A big active 3711 starter will probably rip through the rest of the fermentables. Another Brett strain could do all sorts of stuff. Wine yeast will do nothing.

did you read this thread before making that comment? I built up a starter that was over a gallon by the time all things were said and done, and did so over the course of a week and a half.

I made an all Brett L golden ale back in April. Built up starter for 7 days on stir plate. There was an average take off time when I pitched- don't remember it being quick, but don't remember it lagging too long. After10 day sit dropped from 1.050 to 1.020 and slowed to a crawl for another couple of weeks. Ferm temp was 67 and ramped up to 74 over the first couple days and kept it at 74 to help attenuate. After 4 weeks the gravity was 1.014, after 8 weeks 1.012. The smell was awesome- tropical fruit. I was concerned that the gravity was too high so I pitched some dregs from goose island sofie to help finish the beer and after another 2 months the FG came in at 1.009 and stayed steady for weeks. Kegged and let it sit for another month or 2. I noticed the tropical smell dissipated some and when I gave it a taste- got big leather taste and some funk. Not really enjoyable. Came back after another month and it seemed less but still there and again not enjoyable. This was back in august. I am about to go back and give it another try but this will be the last try. It's been 8 months now. Don't know what the f*^k happened. I understand leather and barnyard funk are descriptive factors of Brett but it tasted like I'm drinking a leather infused beer that was shoved up a horses ass to preserve it.

BootsyFlanootsy said:

did you read this thread before making that comment? I built up a starter that was over a gallon by the time all things were said and done, and did so over the course of a week and a half.

Click to expand...

I did read it, missed the third step. Each step should have been 7-10 days. No need to get pissy, just trying to let you know for next time.

I was thinking of adding some Lactobacillus to my all Brett I just did. it was brewed on 11-17-13 with an OG of 1.056 SG on 12-01-13 was 1.010. would it be too early, too late, or just not a good idea in general?

how many IBU's was it?

BootsyFlanootsy said:

how many IBU's was it?

Click to expand...

41.7 IBU (appox.) all Nelson Sauvin.

TNGabe said:

You didn't grow the yeast up properly. Brett starters need 7-10 days on a stirplate. You should have done that twice, probably 1l and then 3 or 4 if you have the equipment. So you underpitched and pitched weak yeast that hadn't completed fermenting your starter. I'd say it did pretty well getting to 1.020.

Click to expand...

This must depend on the strain and/or the supplier. I've done a number of Brett beers, and have never done 2x 7 - 10 day starters with a stirplate. I typically use the White Labs Brett C., and do 2x 3-4 day starters without stirring - 1/4 gallon, then 1/2 gallon for the second step.

Using this method I've always gotten fast starts, and attenuation similar to common sacch. strains within a couple of weeks. I've never had one of these beers stop any higher than 1.012 and most are in the range of 1.008 to 1.010. These beers always taste very clean and fruity, and always judge well in comps.

Billy-Klubb said:

I was thinking of adding some Lactobacillus to my all Brett I just did. it was brewed on 11-17-13 with an OG of 1.056 SG on 12-01-13 was 1.010. would it be too early, too late, or just not a good idea in general?

Click to expand...

I don't expect you will get anything. With the high alcohol it will be slow at best (year+), and with 40 IBUs, it may do nothing.

Calder said:

I don't expect you will get anything. With the high alcohol it will be slow at best (year+), and with 40 IBUs, it may do nothing.

Click to expand...

good to know! thanks!

moti_mo said:

This must depend on the strain and/or the supplier. I've done a number of Brett beers, and have never done 2x 7 - 10 day starters with a stirplate. I typically use the White Labs Brett C., and do 2x 3-4 day starters without stirring - 1/4 gallon, then 1/2 gallon for the second step.

Using this method I've always gotten fast starts, and attenuation similar to common sacch. strains within a couple of weeks. I've never had one of these beers stop any higher than 1.012 and most are in the range of 1.008 to 1.010. These beers always taste very clean and fruity, and always judge well in comps.

Click to expand...

I think different strains work differently. I've had poor attenuation with WLP650 (brett B), and I have made large stepped starters with week intervals.

BootsyFlanootsy said:

so I just checked my gravity for the first time since brewing the 100% b. Custersianus and was very dissapointed to see that I'm only down to 1.020.

I've rarely seen fermentations that stall at the level decrease more than a few points. I was aiming for 1.008 at the MOST. I guess I'm just gonna let it sit for a month, but my guess is the odds aren't good that I'll see a 12 point reduction at this stage in the game.

Click to expand...

I had the same problem using all Brett C
Finished the beer off with French saison yeast. At least I got a drinkable beer and not a dumper

I should clarify that when I say my strain-of-choice is Brett. C., I mean Brett. Claussenii, not Brett. Custersianus.

Also should clarify that its a fantastic strain for 100% brett beers in my opinion.

I bumped the heat up, it's down to 1.011'ish.

VERY cloudy still, seems like it will need finings and cold conditioning.

BootsyFlanootsy said:

VERY cloudy still, seems like it will need finings and cold conditioning.

Click to expand...

time & cold should clear it. every 100% brett that i've seen has been crystal clear, with the exception of one that was massively dry-hopped. i'd hold off on the finings especially if you're planning on lagering the beer anyways.

I find that my brett beers clear up under pressure as well. Every time I've bottled a cloudy brett beer it's clear after a few weeks for whatever reason.

What is everyone's experience with aging / cellaring 100% Brett-fermented beers?

I've brewed a few Brett Pales that have been wonderful out of the gate, lots of fruit flavor and unique aromatics. After six weeks or so the fresh flavors and aromas start to drop out, so I've made sure to drink them in a timely fashion.

One batch of 100% Brett Pale I bottle conditioned with a secondary strain of Brett and managed to achieve some wonderful horse-funk after only a few months. But I'm wondering how the beer would age without the addition of a secondary strain, specifically 8, 12, even 16 months down the line.

Currently fermenting is a 1.100 SG Wheat-Wine with a 100% Brettanomyces blend. After three weeks its nearly fermented out (1.018FG), bright and fruity, yet still expectedly hot with the high ABV. After six months mellowing in the cellar, I wonder how she'll taste?

Bearfoot said:

What is everyone's experience with aging / cellaring 100% Brett-fermented beers?

I've brewed a few Brett Pales that have been wonderful out of the gate, lots of fruit flavor and unique aromatics. After six weeks or so the fresh flavors and aromas start to drop out, so I've made sure to drink them in a timely fashion.

One batch of 100% Brett Pale I bottle conditioned with a secondary strain of Brett and managed to achieve some wonderful horse-funk after only a few months. But I'm wondering how the beer would age without the addition of a secondary strain, specifically 8, 12, even 16 months down the line.

Currently fermenting is a 1.100 SG Wheat-Wine with a 100% Brettanomyces blend. After three weeks its nearly fermented out (1.018FG), bright and fruity, yet still expectedly hot with the high ABV. After six months mellowing in the cellar, I wonder how she'll taste?

Click to expand...

Something like a pale ale, I wouldnt really want to cellar. The wheatwhine sounds perfect for it though! I would love to have something big like that and ferment half with a sacc strain only, and half with a brett strain only and see where it goes.

NuclearRich said:

I would love to have something big like that and ferment half with a sacc strain only, and half with a brett strain only and see where it goes.

Click to expand...

That was the original plan. My brett starter was just so fragrant and excited...whispering sweet nothings in my ear for the week prior. Had to pitch the whole thing.