All Cascade Ipa Recipe...Help me find one.

I have quite a bit of Cascade hops and I'd like to make an Ipa. I'm having a bit of trouble finding a good recipe though. I also have quite a bit of Willamette at hand.

Can you guys point me in the diriection of a good recipe for an all cascade Ipa?

Thanks,
J

Making a good IPA recipe is so easy that you can do it yourself. A starting point that will make a good IPA is: OG 1.065, 90-95% 2-row, the rest Crystal (and/or perhaps some other stuff you might have at hand; some wheat malt can be good, and why not some mildly toasted malt as well?); 1-1.5oz C-hops @ 15 min, 0 min and as dry hop, in addition to as much as you need at 60 minutes to get ~65 IBU. US-05 yeast is good. Ferment below 65 F, rising towards the end to get good attenuation. This "recipe" hasn't failed me yet.

Willamette is said to enhance the flavour of Cascade, so you could try using some of it @ 15 minutes in addition to the Cascade.

Ok, this is what I've come up with

13 lbs 2 row
1/2 lb Amber malt

All Cascades are 5.4%

2 oz Cascades FWH boiled 90 mins
1 oz Cascade 30 mins
1 oz Cascade 20 mins
1 oz Willamette 15 mins
1 oz Cascade flame out
1 oz Cascade Dry Hop in keg

Here are the #'s
Og: 1.067
IBU: 64.9

I figure I'll pitch 2 packs of Nottingham just because I like that yeast. I may use US-05 if they're out of Nottingham at the LHBS.

What do you think? Do I need to improve anything?

Not bad. I'd change the hopping, though. I'm not one for adding hops at 30 minutes, unless you need more bittering. Flavor and aroma come from late hops. I'd add the flavor hops starting at 15 minutes, and move the 30 minute addition and 20 minute additions to 15 minutes or later.

I like hops at 15, 10, 5 and 0. That will give you big hops flavor and aroma, to balance out the bitterness.

Are you a fan of amber malt? I use it in one of my IPAs, but usually I don't care for it. I'd probably not use the amber malt, but use up to a pound of crystal malt. If you like it, though, that's fine.

HalfPint said:

Ok, this is what I've come up with

13 lbs 2 row
1/2 lb Amber malt

All Cascades are 5.4%

2 oz Cascades FWH boiled 90 mins
1 oz Cascade 30 mins
1 oz Cascade 20 mins
1 oz Willamette 15 mins
1 oz Cascade flame out
1 oz Cascade Dry Hop in keg

Here are the #'s
Og: 1.067
IBU: 64.9

I figure I'll pitch 2 packs of Nottingham just because I like that yeast. I may use US-05 if they're out of Nottingham at the LHBS.

What do you think? Do I need to improve anything?

Click to expand...

Looks good, I'd just move the 20 minute to between 5-10 minute. Also, you might like this recipe, just throw in some willamette, keep w/e other malt you want to use besides 2-row and you don't need the orange zest or coriander: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f66/cascades-orange-pale-ale-84558/

I've never actually done FWH myself, but others say the perceived bitterness from 60 minutes FWH is the same as for 20 minutes boil. Assuming that's right, I'd do a normal 90 minutes addition instead, unless you want a really smooth bitterness. You'll get enough flavour and aroma from the other additions.

Then there's the Amber malt. There are several types. I've only used a British one, from Thomas Fawcett, around 60L, and it's fairly strong and roasty. I wouldn't use more than 3-4oz in an IPA (if any). I would use some crystal, though, to get a sweeter backbone.

Nottingham is a fine yeast for an IPA, in my opinion.

Yooper, I just added your post into the recipe file I use for my all Centennial. I may want to try your hop schedule.

BTW - I did not get up to the Sylvania this year. If I do not bicycle to Montana, I think the UP is on the list.

Gammon N Beer said:

Yooper, I just added your post into the recipe file I use for my all Centennial. I may want to try your hop schedule.

BTW - I did not get up to the Sylvania this year. If I do not bicycle to Montana, I think the UP is on the list.

Click to expand...

Let me know- we'll be around all summer, aside from one trip to Canada. We have a decent place on a lake if you need some time out of the wilderness, and we can show you around.

I've been doing FWH for alot of my beers, and I like it. I'm not sure I notice a huge difference, but I like the idea of a smoother bitterness. I do most of my IPAs and APAs with the hop schedule I suggested, though- bittering hops early (60 or FWH) and then late additions for the flavor and aroma. It's great with centennial hops.

The beer I'm drinking right now (literally at this moment) is this pale ale:

5 lbs Pale Malt 45.45 %
3 lbs Vienna Malt 27.27 %
2 lbs Munich Malt Grain 18.18 %
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L 4.55 %
8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (4.55 %

1.00 oz Cascade [7.50 %] (60 min) (First Wort Hop)
0.50 oz Cascade [7.50 %] (30 min)
0.50 oz Cascade [7.50 %] (15 min)
1.00 oz Cascade (homegrown) (10 min)
0.50 oz Cascade (homegrown) (5 min)
0.50 oz Cascade (homegrown) (0 min)
1.00 oz Cascade Dry Hop 7 days

The reason for the .5 ounce at 30 minutes was to get me to 46 IBUs.

The different malts give it more balance. It's a nice APA. If I was going to make it an IPA, I'd use more base malt and lose the Vienna and Munich, and up the IBUs.

YooperBrew said:

Not bad. I'd change the hopping, though. I'm not one for adding hops at 30 minutes, unless you need more bittering. Flavor and aroma come from late hops. I'd add the flavor hops starting at 15 minutes, and move the 30 minute addition and 20 minute additions to 15 minutes or later.

I like hops at 15, 10, 5 and 0. That will give you big hops flavor and aroma, to balance out the bitterness.

Are you a fan of amber malt? I use it in one of my IPAs, but usually I don't care for it. I'd probably not use the amber malt, but use up to a pound of crystal malt. If you like it, though, that's fine.

Click to expand...

Alright, taking your advice Yoop this is what I've come up with.

Ok, this is what I've come up with

13 lbs 2 row
1 lb crystal 60
All Cascades are 5.4%

2 oz Cascades FWH boiled 90 mins
1 oz Cascade 15 mins
1 oz Cascade 10 mins
1.5 oz Willamette 10 mins
1 oz Cascade 5 mins
1 oz Cascade flame out
1 oz Cascade Dry Hop in keg

Here are the #'s
Og: 1.069
IBU: 62

2 packs of Nottingham Rehydrated

What do you think? Do I need to improve anything?

I also have about 2 oz of Northern Brewers that I've had sitting in the freezer for a while and I'd like to get rid of them. Do you guys think I should add those as an addition instead of some Cascades?

I ddn't run it though my software, so I'll trust your numbers. It looks good.

I love northern brewer hops, but I'm not sure how I'd incorporate them. Walker has an IPA that I did a few years ago that used cascades and NB hops that was wonderful! I'd check out his recipe and see what you think. My version of his recipe was this:

12 lbs 2 row
1 lbs caramel 20L

1.00 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (60 min) Hops 19.9 IBU

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (30 min) Hops 5.1 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (30 min) Hops 3.8 IBU

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (25 min) Hops 4.6 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (25 min) Hops 3.5 IBU

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (20 min) Hops 4.0 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (20 min) Hops 3.0 IBU

0.25 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (15 min) Hops 2.5 IBU
0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (15 min) Hops 3.3 IBU

0.25 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (10 min) Hops 1.8 IBU
0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (10 min) Hops 2.4 IBU

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (5 min) Hops 1.3 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [5.50 %] (5 min) Hops 0.9 IBU

0.25 oz Cascade [6.40 %] (0 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -
0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.50 %] (0 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -

1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] (Dry Hop 10 days) Hops
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, I know that hopping looks like a pain but it's not. You just take all of the hops (except for the bittering hops) and mix them up in a bowl, and throw them in every 5 minutes, roughly estimating the amount. My notes say that this beer is: Balanced, with a citrusy aroma. Nice bitterness. Excellent beer.

See, that looks awesome b/c it saves some of my Cascades and I also get rid of some hops that are about to start losing their qualities. Now since those hops are of higher %'s than mine are, should I just shoot for the IBU's that I haven't added up and adjust my hop quantities to achieve that or should I just use those amounts and not worry about my %'s?

Thanks,
J

Oh yeah, what about using Whitbread yeast? I think I have some washed 1099 in the fridge.

Update:

I plugged in Walkers recipe using my AA and I changed one thing. I added 1/2 oz of Willamettes at 15 minutes.

Og: 1.064
IBU: 60.4

I think this sounds great.

I haven't had an IPA on tap all year, so I'm really looking forward to brewing this!

I may use the Whitbread yeast, but I haven't decided what do you think?

HalfPint said:

13 lbs 2 row
1 lb crystal 60
All Cascades are 5.4%

2 oz Cascades FWH boiled 90 mins
1 oz Cascade 15 mins
1 oz Cascade 10 mins
1.5 oz Willamette 10 mins
1 oz Cascade 5 mins
1 oz Cascade flame out
1 oz Cascade Dry Hop in keg

Here are the #'s
Og: 1.069
IBU: 62

Click to expand...

Don't get the same numbers for what you posted, IBU are way off . I used the AA numbers for Willamette that I have on hand.
I have promash set at -65% for FWH which is the correct setting.

<Rager setting for Hop IBU Formula>


ProMash Recipe Report

Batch Size (Gal): 5.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 14.00
Anticipated OG: 1.075
Anticipated SRM: 10.3
Anticipated IBU: 39.3
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes


13.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row)
1.00 lbs. Crystal 60L

Hops


56g.Cascade FWH
28g.Cascade 15 min.
28g.Cascade 10 min.
42g.Willamette 10 min.
28g.Cascade 5 min.
28g.Cascade 0 min.
28g.Cascade Dry Hop

Houblon said:

Don't get the same numbers for what you posted, IBU are way off . I used the AA numbers for Willamette that I have on hand.
I have promash set at -65% for FWH which is the correct setting.

<Rager setting for Hop IBU Formula>


ProMash Recipe Report

Batch Size (Gal): 5.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 14.00
Anticipated OG: 1.075
Anticipated SRM: 10.3
Anticipated IBU: 39.3
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes


13.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row)
1.00 lbs. Crystal 60L

Hops


56g.Cascade FWH
28g.Cascade 15 min.
28g.Cascade 10 min.
42g.Willamette 10 min.
28g.Cascade 5 min.
28g.Cascade 0 min.
28g.Cascade Dry Hop

Click to expand...

Hmm, I hope BeerSmith is telling me the right #'s. Here are what my AA of the hops are:
Cascade 5.4%
Willamette 4.5%

If I take the FWH setting off of Beersmith for that 2 oz bittering addition, I still get 56.8 IBU's. I'm wondering which one of us is wrong here. I'll run it through Beer Tools and check my #'s.

I have been using the -65% for FWH for several years now per Denny Conn`s numbers.

http://forum.northernbrewer.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=68733&start=15#p634283
http://forum.northernbrewer.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=70476&hilit=first+wort+hopping&start=15#p713914

These numbers are closer>
Amount > Name > IBU > Boil Time
------------------------------------
56g. Cascade > 51.3 > 90 min.
28g. Cascade > 6.2 > 15 min.
42g. Willamette > 5.8 > 10 min.
28g. Cascade > 4.7 > 10 min.
28g. Cascade > 3.9 > 5 min.
28g. Cascade > 0.0 > 0 min.


71.9 IBU

Houblon said:

I have been using the -65% for FWH for several years now per Denny Conn`s numbers.

http://forum.northernbrewer.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=68733&start=15#p634283
http://forum.northernbrewer.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=70476&hilit=first+wort+hopping&start=15#p713914

These numbers are closer>
Amount > Name > IBU > Boil Time
------------------------------------
56g. Cascade > 51.3 > 90 min.
28g. Cascade > 6.2 > 15 min.
42g. Willamette > 5.8 > 10 min.
28g. Cascade > 4.7 > 10 min.
28g. Cascade > 3.9 > 5 min.
28g. Cascade > 0.0 > 0 min.


71.9 IBU

Click to expand...

Is that 90 min addition a FWH or is it just added for 90?

HalfPint said:

Is that 90 min addition a FWH or is it just added for 90?

Click to expand...

I just adjusted for a 90min addition instead of a FWH addition.

In my experience, you get plenty of IBUs from FWH, and they can be figured as roughly equivalent to a 60 min boil. I know there is some debate on this, but the IBUs don't just "go away" in a boil.

Well whatever the case Yoop, I'm going to go with that norther/cascade brew you showed me. I'm going to the brew shop today to get the grain/yeast. I'll either brew it today or tomorrow.

I'll let you know how it turns out.

J

YooperBrew said:

In my experience, you get plenty of IBUs from FWH, and they can be figured as roughly equivalent to a 60 min boil. I know there is some debate on this, but the IBUs don't just "go away" in a boil.

Click to expand...

The debated ended for me after reading everything I could find on the subject and then taking the next logical step: Side by side tests

Brew the same recipe with 1 batch using traditional hopping & 1 using FWH to identical IBU numbers.

Next take a beer of known IBU and compare your homebrew results.
example: Houblon Chouffe = 59 IBU compared that to your HB of the same IBU.
Does your HB match up to the known example?

Repeat till your happy with the software settings ( IBU % )

I find that (-65% for FWH) makes me happy with the resulting beer.
But hey its homebrew and we can make it anyway we like
-------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.ahaconference.org/presentations/2008/DennyConn.pdf

IBU Analysis Results
• Here are the HPLC (High Pressure Liquid
Chromatogrpahy) results of the brews: The alpha-acids
are not bitter though they contribute to bitterness units
value. The humulinones are oxidized alpha-acids and
are slightly bitter.
• Beer Iso-alpha-acids Alpha-acids Humulinones
• A (FWH) 24.8 3.5 1.9
• B (60) 21.8 4.7 1.8
• Thanks to Bob Smith at S.S. Steiner


--------

IBU Analysis Results
• Gas Chromatography by Scott Bruslind at
Analysis Laboratory
• Beer IBU
• A (FWH) 31
• B (60) 28.7


-------------
FWH Conclusions
Although the FWH beer was measured to have approximately 10% more IBUs than the 60 min.
beer, taster’s comments often found the FWH beer to have less
bitter character and a “smoother” bitterness

Houblon said:

&#8226; A (FWH) 24.8 3.5 1.9
&#8226; B (60) 21.8 4.7 1.8
&#8226; Thanks to Bob Smith at S.S. Steiner


--------

IBU Analysis Results
&#8226; Gas Chromatography by Scott Bruslind at
Analysis Laboratory
&#8226; Beer IBU
&#8226; A (FWH) 31
&#8226; B (60) 28.7


-------------
FWH Conclusions
Although the FWH beer was measured to have approximately 10% more IBUs than the 60 min.
beer, taster&#8217;s comments often found the FWH beer to have less
bitter character and a &#8220;smoother&#8221; bitterness

Click to expand...

Yes, that's what I said. Pretty close to equal in IBUs, but "smoother". I don't know if I think it's all that much smoother to me, but I'm happy with figuring the IBUs as a 60 minute addition.

Alright, I went to the LHBS during lunch and this is what I think my final recipe is going to be. Help me if you think I need to change something.

12 lbs 2 row
1 lbs caramel 20L

1.00 oz Cascade 5.4% FWH 60 min boil

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.8%] (30 min)
0.25 oz Cascade [5.4 %] (30 min)

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.80 %] (25 min)
0.25 oz Cascade [5.4 %] (25 min)

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.80 %] (20 min)
0.25 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (20 min)

0.25 oz Cascade [5.4 %] (15 min)
0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.80 %] (15 min)
0.50 Willamette [4.50 %] (15 min)

0.25 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (10 min)
0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.80 %] (10 min)

0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.80 %] (5 min)
0.25 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (5 min)

0.25 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (0 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -
0.25 oz Northern Brewer [8.80 %] (0 min) (Aroma Hop-Steep) Hops -

1.00 oz Cascade [5.40 %] (Dry Hop 10 days) Hops

US-05 rehydrated and ferment at 65* for 2 weeks. Transfer into keg onto the Cascade dry hop. Sit for ten days then let chill in kegerator on gas for 2 weeks before beer bonging the entire batch! :rockin:

Here are the #'s I'm getting from Beersmith

OG: 1.064
IBU: 64.2

Does this sound good? If I need to make any changes let me know.

Thanks,
J

Your final looks GREAT! If you like Munich grains, add some. Personally, I love a munich grained IPA!! Balances well with cascade hops. Anyway, I would try that recipe you have there, it looks very nice.

Well, what I posted is what I've got on hand, so I'm just going to run with it. If I have the time, I'm going to brew tomorrow, but if not, I will be brewing on Saturday or Sunday. I'll let you know how my brew day goes.

J

Alright, I've got about 30 mins left in the mash. I hit my temps perfect and should start the boil here in about an hour.

So....... How did it come out?