Easy Stove-Top Pasteurizing - With Pics

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
You can use regular beer caps on champagne bottles, at least the ones I buy. You could open the bottles you've already corked and re-cap them.

For what its worth, I've never tried to pastuerize in champagne bottles, I hope it works out for you.
 
Well the concept is identical, so there should be no difference with a Champagne bottle compared to a regular beer bottle, except for the extra pressure allowance.

I put the 8 remaining bottles into the fridge for the night to give me time to decide what to do. As far as the four modified bottles, I think they will be fine for now. They seem to be holding the pressure so I might just keep an eye on them for now.

The bottle cap idea is an intriguing one, except that means I have to invest in a bottle capping system. Not overly expensive, it's just that I have no other usage for one. I bottle strictly 750ml bottles and will be upgrading to kegs soon. And besides, the uncorking is half the fun of a good cider.

It will have to wait until tomorrow regardless, so maybe another option might become available before then.

Thanks!
 
I have some cider that I started fermenting in November that I'm about to get around to bottling(long conditioning, can't hurt, right? :)) and I want to backsweeten and pasteurize...

One thing I'm confused about: won't the CO2 not be dissolved in the cider immediately, meaning that I might get "gushers" from the bottles when I'm testing them to see if they're appropriately carb'd?
 
Well the concept is identical, so there should be no difference with a Champagne bottle compared to a regular beer bottle, except for the extra pressure allowance.

The champagne holds a larger volume and its glass is thicker than a typical beer bottle. Both of those potentially impact the transfer of heat from the water to the cider. You're right, the concept is the same, but I'm suggesting that using champagne bottles means that you may have to carefully adjust your process.

Best wishes!

Jim
 
I have some cider that I started fermenting in November that I'm about to get around to bottling(long conditioning, can't hurt, right? :)) and I want to backsweeten and pasteurize...

One thing I'm confused about: won't the CO2 not be dissolved in the cider immediately, meaning that I might get "gushers" from the bottles when I'm testing them to see if they're appropriately carb'd?

That makes sense, but it hasn't been my experience.
 
Ok, I found out the hard way that Champagne bottles don't accept standard beer caps. Only their Belgian siblings do. So now I am back to where I began, without a solution. The only thing I can come up with is to grab a dozen beer bottles from somewhere and just transfer everything to bottles and begin again. At that point I'll need to revisit this idea to find a way for my Champagne bottles to work.
 
Sorry, Naked, didn't mean to mislead you. The champagne bottles sold here in the USA take standard beer bottle caps, at least the ones I bought at my local homebrew store.
 
No, no. No worries Pappers, I have always thought the same myself. And to be honest, a capper will find usage in my brewing closet so it wasn't a wasted purchase. I appreciate the suggestions as you can tell I'm running out of my own currently.
 
i believe belgian champagne-style ale / kriek / lambic / etc bottles also take the larger (is it 29mm?) caps. this is of course no use to you now unless you want to get yet another piece of kit you may never use again. or you can go down the poor man's route and bottle in plastic? i would hate to do it, but worse things have happened.
 
Nakeddog, what problem did you have with the capper. Cap too small? If so the 29mm cap will probably take care of the problem. If you're using one of the hand cappers, you may need to flip the plates in the throat to get it to fit around the neck of the bottle. At least that's what I have to do.
 
Cap and capper were too small for the Champagne bottles. As I don't typically cap, I was unaware of the two different sizes of caps. For now, I just have stuck all the remaining unpasteurized bottles into my new kegerator build and am holding them at ~35*F until I either finish building my tower, or figure out something else to do with them.
 
This is fantastic info.

It seems like this mainly pertains to standard cider, though, so I want to clarify: will this work fine with apfelwein that's been fermented very dry (around 1 or lower). I am bottling a batch this weekend and, for a variety of reasons, wasn't able to halt it at a sweet FG so I want to back-sweeten half of it by adding AJ concentrate and still bottle carb it. Can I just sweeten to the desired level, add priming solution in addition to the concentrate and then monitor the carbonation and pasteurize when it's at the desired carbonation level?

Thanks!
 
If you are adding sugar you will need to pasteurize. In addition you should sweeten to taste then add a bottling amount of sugar. Remember the yeast will turn your cider dry again if you don't add the extra.

Open a bottle once every day or two to check on carbonation levels. Once it's perfect then pasteurize. Be careful. I had two explode on me at hot temp last time. Imperfections in bottles. More yeast in some bottles can all cause irregularities.
 
If you are adding sugar you will need to pasteurize. In addition you should sweeten to taste then add a bottling amount of sugar. Remember the yeast will turn your cider dry again if you don't add the extra.

Open a bottle once every day or two to check on carbonation levels. Once it's perfect then pasteurize. Be careful. I had two explode on me at hot temp last time. Imperfections in bottles. More yeast in some bottles can all cause irregularities.

Good deal, that's what I thought.

Can't you pasteurize at a lower heat if you leave the bottles in longer? The apfelwein is going to be ~10% ABV so I don't want to push it so close to its boiling point if I can get the job done at 170 or 180.

Also, does anyone have any more info or stories about using their dishwasher? Couldn't you just do back to back cycles if it's not sustaining the required heat level long enough?
 
I pasteurized at 165 for 15 minutes and had success.

I keep seeing dishwasher comments - the general answer is "no" - they just don't get hot enough - often not even reaching 140 degrees - and not all of that temperature penetrates to the core of the bottle's contents (meaning you won't get 'em all...)
 
I am thrilled to try this out! I have 5Gal of cider in primary right now, and I am going to run a little science project using 3 different carbonation methods including your pasteurization stove top method. If all goes well, I am planning on adding a whole new page to our step-by-step cider website http://makinghardcider.com to feature your technique. Finding a carbonation method that is both inexpensive and predictable has been a major challenge... this just may be the solution! More soon.
 
Can't you pasteurize at a lower heat if you leave the bottles in longer? The apfelwein is going to be ~10% ABV so I don't want to push it so close to its boiling point if I can get the job done at 170 or 180.

Given that the bottles are capped, even if the contents do boil, wouldn't it all go back into solution when cooled?
 
Given that the bottles are capped, even if the contents do boil, wouldn't it all go back into solution when cooled?

I think boiling would explode your bottles. Think of the steam coming out of a teapot that sounds the whistle and picture that pressure on top of the already present carbonation... BOOM!
 
This may of been covered but the pages I read I couldnt find it. Could be a dumb question..

LAst time I brewed cider I could not figure out how to get sweet cider in bottles, so I left in in the keg. I fermented it too warm, and it took around a year to mellow. It was good, but needed that year to become good.

Fermenting and bottling before that original sweetness has gone will obv mean its not in the fermentor for long.

SO, how long do you leave it in the bottles, after pasteurization?
 
I use the pasteurizing for simple, draft-style ciders. Think of Magners or other ciders you would get in a pub. I find that I don't need to age this cider at all. From pouring the cider into a carboy to drinking it is about 2 weeks.

I use store-bought juice, pectic enzyme, and Nottingham yeast. I let it ferment to 1.010, then bottle and prime. Keep track of the carbonation progress, then pasteurize.

The cider is ready to drink right away.
 
I have a batch that is at my preferred sweetness level, but I will not be able to bottle it until at least tomorrow, if not Saturday. I have cold crashed it in the fridge to cease current fermentation, but come Saturday, will I still have enough residual yeast to bottle condition with priming sugar? I used S-04.

Do I need to add in some more neutral yeast at bottling time? If so, what is the best way to go about doing that? Yeast in individual bottles or in the bottling bucket?

Thanks for your help. I definitely am going to use the stove-top pasteurization method once they are carbed to my liking!
 
According to literature that I have, stronger beer bottles can withstand about 3 atmospheres of pressure (or 44 psi). But beer bottles aren't all made the same. The mass of a refillable bottle can be as much as 40% higher than that of their lighter weight cousins. Higher glass mass probably equals higher strength. Champagne bottles are roughly twice as strong and capable of handling about 6 atmospheres (or 88 psi).

It suggests that bottling an unstabilized cider at an SG of 1.005 or higher in a beer bottle is asking for trouble. Unstabilized cider can be bottled in a champagne bottle at up to SG = 1.010. Both of these cases assume that the cider will continue to ferment to dryness with no pasteurization.

My interpretation of this is that if a 5 point drop puts a beer bottle at a potential for explosion and greater than a 10 point drop puts a champ bottle in that range and heating the bottle (pasteurization) will further increase internal bottle pressure, then (to be safe) the permitted SG drop has to be somewhat less than those levels for bottle conditioning - if pasteurization will follow.

For bottle pasteurization, the recommendation is to avoid beer bottles and to go with champagne bottles - American type that can be capped with standard beer bottle caps. (Though it should be noted that if a champagne bottle is over carbonated, the explosion will have considerably more force versus a beer bottle - should it occur.)

Since I wanted a cider that ended at 1.018, I bottled (in champagne bottles) at 1.023. This allowed a 5 point drop and presumably about 3 atm of carbonation. This also would allow about 3 atm of pressure leeway for pasteurization. (I bottled some in a 10 oz screw cap bottle so that I was able to monitor SG without opening the champagne bottles.)

Another thing to consider is head space. Gas is far more compressible than liquid. Liquid will expand upon heating. If you leave little or no head space, the force on the inside walls of the bottle will be higher and your chance for explosion will be higher. I leave most of the neck of the champagne bottle empty. I know that excess air isn’t a good thing for cider. Though, when I bottle, fermentation carbonation generally bubbles out and I try cap quickly before the head space mixes too much with air. CO2 is heavier than air, so minimizing bottle movement after dispensing into the bottle should minimize the ability of air to get into the head space (but capping quickly is still a good idea).

The pasteurization process I use is to put room temperature cider-containing bottles into room temperature water in a canning pot. The bottles are separated from the floor of the pot by a canning rack. One bottle is uncapped with water and a thermometer in it. I raise the temperature slowly until the test bottle is at 150 F and then shut off the heat (at this point the liquid has pushed up 0.5 to 0.75 inch up the neck from where it started). The bottles are left in the pot for 15 to 20 minutes and then removed. When removed, the bottles are placed onto a towel that is spread out flat onto the counter top. I don’t touch them for at least a half hour. Literature suggests that most cultured yeast will be killed by this process. I have had no referementation or broken bottles using this process.

Hot bottles should not be placed directly onto cold surfaces. Pyrex glass is designed to withstand significant thermal shock. Beer and champagne bottles (to my knowledge) are not. Thermal shock, by itself, and especially if the bottles have defects, can cause a bottle to break and/or explode (if there is internal pressure). This also applies to the reverse: i.e. putting a room temp bottle into hot water. The greater the temperature difference between the bottle and the water bath, the greater the probability the rapid thermal expansion of the glass will cause the bottle to break. Even a defect free bottle, if pulled out of a freezer, will almost certainly break, if placed directly into very hot or boiling water.

Regardless of heat pasteurization method used, it is probably wise to keep some safety related things in mind (at least this is what I try to keep in mind):

1. Keep track of carbonation level. If SG drop or perception of pressure is too great, abort.
2. The process increases pressure inside an already pressurized bottle.
3. Thermal shock and/or physical shock can cause pressurized bottles to explode.
4. Skin and eyes don’t react well to high velocity glass shards.
a. Wear a full face shield or at least safety goggles
b. Wear a thick heavy jacket
c. Wear heavy gloves or thick hot mitts
5. If the bottle explodes, it will be when you’ve become complacent and have taken no safety precautions, are wearing a T-shirt and shorts, have just removed the bottle from the pot with your bare hands and are admiring its clarity.
 
Thanks for both the description of your process (which sounds like it works great) and the reminder about safety. As has been said in this thread, using care and common sense is important.

Using the process, exactly as described in the opening post, I have pasteurized dozens of batches and well over a thousand bottles without a single incident of a bottle breaking or exploding.
 
Do I need to add in some more neutral yeast at bottling time? If so, what is the best way to go about doing that? Yeast in individual bottles or in the bottling bucket?

Thanks for your help. I definitely am going to use the stove-top pasteurization method once they are carbed to my liking!

Hi, I don't know about whether you will need to add yeast, but if you do, I would add it to the bottling bucket rather than individual bottles. Just for the sake of accuracy of measurements. But again, this isn't from personal experience, I haven't had to add yeast before bottle conditioning.
 
I'm so glad to see someone who has actually suggested that pasteurization is NOT a terrible idea! I actually tried this exact method today with a non alcoholic ginger beer that I let ferment for 2 days with dry champagne yeast. I tried 4 12 oz bottles. Unfortunately, 2 of the 4 bottles shot the bottle caps off after about 5 minutes in the pot!! Does your drink just have less carbonation than me? Should I switch to a less robust yeast and pasteurize at say 170 degrees? I think this method is awesome, but I'm just not sure how to adapt it to my situation...
 
I'm so glad to see someone who has actually suggested that pasteurization is NOT a terrible idea! I actually tried this exact method today with a non alcoholic ginger beer that I let ferment for 2 days with dry champagne yeast. I tried 4 12 oz bottles. Unfortunately, 2 of the 4 bottles shot the bottle caps off after about 5 minutes in the pot!! Does your drink just have less carbonation than me? Should I switch to a less robust yeast and pasteurize at say 170 degrees? I think this method is awesome, but I'm just not sure how to adapt it to my situation...

It could be that my bottles are not as carbonated as yours were. I also think your idea of experimenting with a lower temperature makes sense. I've never tried to pasteurize a cider that I've used champagne yeast with, so can't say if that would make a difference. Did you test a bottle for level of carbonation before you pasteurized? That might be good info for you to have as you experiment.
 
I am just finishing off a batch of edworts apfelwein and was thinking about back sweetening with sugar not splenda and bulk aging it in the 1 gallon jugs the applejuice came in. The juice bottles came with screw on lids with the safety pop top. I would like to pasteurize rather than add chemicals to keep the fermentation from starting back up. Could I just heat these with the caps off then add caps and slowly cool kind of like canning to sanitize and seal. Would be kinda neat that the safety pop tops would serve a purpose again. Also anyone know if the flavor of apfelwein suffers from pasteurizing?
 
I am just finishing off a batch of edworts apfelwein and was thinking about back sweetening with sugar not splenda and bulk aging it in the 1 gallon jugs the applejuice came in. The juice bottles came with screw on lids with the safety pop top. I would like to pasteurize rather than add chemicals to keep the fermentation from starting back up. Could I just heat these with the caps off then add caps and slowly cool kind of like canning to sanitize and seal. Would be kinda neat that the safety pop tops would serve a purpose again. Also anyone know if the flavor of apfelwein suffers from pasteurizing?

I don't know about the affect of pastuerizing on apfelwein, I mostly make simple draft-style sparkling ciders and the occassional more complex cider, but have never made apple wine. Others with experience with apple wine might be able to give you more advice.

But to the question of whether this would work, I think it would work fine - as long as you are looking for still apple wine, not sparkling. You would obviously need to adjust the process described in the OP quite a bit - much larger container, etc.
 
I am just finishing off a batch of edworts apfelwein and was thinking about back sweetening with sugar not splenda and bulk aging it in the 1 gallon jugs the applejuice came in. The juice bottles came with screw on lids with the safety pop top. I would like to pasteurize rather than add chemicals to keep the fermentation from starting back up. Could I just heat these with the caps off then add caps and slowly cool kind of like canning to sanitize and seal. Would be kinda neat that the safety pop tops would serve a purpose again. Also anyone know if the flavor of apfelwein suffers from pasteurizing?

what you are describing sounds like rudimentary canning.

To do canning safely, you have to have your canned goods covered in a rolling boil for at least 10 minutes, depending on your acidity, elevation, etc. Wort isn't THAT acidic. So not only would you likely have to boil longer, you would likely have to can in a pressure cooker to be safe.

do I think it would work? yes. Do I think it would give you botulism, not likely. Would the FDA say this method is safe and effective (as you describe it) - no.

Why not call it a day and back sweeten with truvia or stevia. 100% natural, and non fermentable.
 
what you are describing sounds like rudimentary canning.

To do canning safely, you have to have your canned goods covered in a rolling boil for at least 10 minutes, depending on your acidity, elevation, etc. Wort isn't THAT acidic. So not only would you likely have to boil longer, you would likely have to can in a pressure cooker to be safe.

do I think it would work? yes. Do I think it would give you botulism, not likely. Would the FDA say this method is safe and effective (as you describe it) - no.

Why not call it a day and back sweeten with truvia or stevia. 100% natural, and non fermentable.

I don't think he's trying to can. Rather, I think he just wants to kill the yeast so that he can backsweeten with a fermentable sugar.

With alcohol levels like apple wine (which I assume is going to be around 10% abv +) there is no need to worry about random bacteria or preserving generally. All of those things you worry about with canning don't apply.
 
I don't think he's trying to can. Rather, I think he just wants to kill the yeast so that he can backsweeten with a fermentable sugar.

With alcohol levels like apple wine (which I assume is going to be around 10% abv +) there is no need to worry about random bacteria or preserving generally. All of those things you worry about with canning don't apply.

I disagree - this is exactly canning (whether they are aiming to do so or not). Heating up the liquid, putting a cap on it and creating a seal with a vaccum (see the cap comment they made), letting the liquid cool. The only difference is that he/she doesn't follow any of the canning rules for safe sterility in canning.

As for the ABV, unless the abv, I have heard unless you are well up there, more like ~%15 you should rely on alcohol for sanitation.

Like I said, will it kill you... likely not. Would I do it, no.... COULD it provide an environment for botulism? I would say certainly, especially if everything isn't sterile prior to doing so, not sanitized... "sterilized".

Why not heat your bottles as you describe, let them cool to room temp, then cap. you would avoid the sterility issues you create otherwise.
 
Cidah, I don't can, so maybe I'm missing the point. No one ever worries about botulism with the handmade bottled hard cider or beer we make and I don't see where that is a concern with his process. We (beer and cider makers) only sanitize, not sterilize.

He is suggesting, as I read it, to:

1. make still hard cider
2. heat it (not boil it) in a bottle to kill the yeast
3. backsweeten with sugar
3. cap it

I don't see where the danger is here. I'm assuming he's sanitizing his bottles, like any homebrewer would. Are you concerned about wild yeasties/bacteria in the air? Or that wild bugs have survived the fermenting process and are just in his cider? Sorry if I'm being dense.
 
Cidah I am a bit confused. I can rack to bottling bucket and bottle in sterilized bottles no problem...but pasteurizing adds danger? I just want to kill the yeast so my back sweetening doesn't turn into bottle bombs. wouldn't this do the trick
 
I think that Cidah might be worried about the warm environment present in the bottles. The C. botulinum spore needs to be heated to a certain temperature (can't remember off the top of my head) to be killed otherwise the anaerobic and warm conditions in the bottle will start their germination which inherently will produce the toxin.
 
I think that Cidah might be worried about the warm environment present in the bottles. The C. botulinum spore needs to be heated to a certain temperature (can't remember off the top of my head) to be killed otherwise the anaerobic and warm conditions in the bottle will start their germination which inherently will produce the toxin.

This is the part that concerns me.

I believe the PH of the cider would probably block botlulism - as long as your PH is 3.8 or less. However I would be checking that ph. ciders from sweet apples can be insipid and have rather low acid, high PH - (I have seen up to 5 - those were crap ciders).

anyway, I *think* I might have read somewhere that botulism prefers 4.6 or lower value, higher acid PH (>4.6), but unless you know your PH, I would be cautious.

Sanitized is not Sterilized. To sterilize you would have to boil your bottles for ~10 minutes.

I understand the risk may be low - just made me nervous and concerned so I threw my opinion out. The poster can certainly go forth and concur.

In conclusion, the PH *SHOULD* protect you from botulism - but I would want to know the PH at bottling.
 
Did a search and found this thread https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/botulism-50389/ where botulism in beer, wine, cider and mead is discussed pretty thoroughly. In addition to the usual banter, there is some very good information. Bottom-line, I am not worried at all about the possibility of getting botulism from handmade beer or hard cider, including pasteurized hard cider.

Cidah, I appreciate your bringing up a topic I had not thought about at all! That's one of the great things about HBT!
 
Did a search and found this thread https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/botulism-50389/ where botulism in beer, wine, cider and mead is discussed pretty thoroughly. In addition to the usual banter, there is some very good information. Bottom-line, I am not worried at all about the possibility of getting botulism from handmade beer or hard cider, including pasteurized hard cider.

Cidah, I appreciate your bringing up a topic I had not thought about at all! That's one of the great things about HBT!

Pappers - thanks for the good read - I will check it out. And imagine - we were all able to share opinions and be civilized about it - now that is just good stuff all around :)

much appreciated!

EDIT:

To sum it all up - looks like PH and Hops are the biggest deterrent to botulism (possibly alcohol). I have heard a lot of controversial information about the alcohol part. Many reliable sources claim the percentage is so low in most beers it doesn't serve as a protector like we intuitively think. The information on that link, while not a scientific journal, seems pretty reliable compare to what I have read in the past.

However - if you save extra wort for starters (all grain brewers like me) - you need to pressure cook (can) it to remove risk of botulism. At first glance this seems like a great way to handle wort for starters though - open a jar, and add sterilized wort to your yeast starter. No boiling, letting cool, etc. (how I currently do it)

If anybody has done this please let me know - I would love to try it - I pretty much only can thinks that are acidic, or that don't need pressure canning (but I have a 22qt pressure cooker I could use).
 
Wow. good read. Great stuff guys.

On a new topic, I believe i have found a remedy to the fear of exploding bottles during pasteurization (aside from the precautions that have been discussed here a hundred times).
I have built a "blowproof" steam pasteurizer.

Its a 15.5 sanke with the rings cut off of both ends. I then split it in half lengthwise and added a 5.5 inch stainless filler panel then welded the two halves back together after putting a perforated rack across the bottom to sit my bottles on. I cut a hinged door in the top to put my bottles in and added a latching closure and a thermometer.

I then welded some legs on it so it sits above a propane two burner stove i bought from harbor freight.

I bottle in 32oz bottles so i designed it so i can pasteurize a 5 gallon batch at one time. It holds 25of the 32 ounce-rs. I add a gallon of water to the bottom of the chamber. crank up the heat to bring the chamber temp to 180F then back off the burners to maintain that temp and hold for 30 min. Then i cut the heat and let them cool overnight.

Hard to visualize i know. I can e-mail pics to anyone interested. e-mail me at [email protected]. I haven't upgraded my account yet but i wanted to share this with all of my fellow "pasteurizers" out there.

Cheers
Dusty
 
Hi Pappers, excellent thread full of great information!

Also, thank you for maintaining and keeping such an active role in it after all this time!

I have a couple of 1 gallon batches that I am fermenting out and letting clear but I intend to back sweeten with some filtered 100% AJ once they have cleared and pasteurize using your method once they have carbonated.

my question is, since I am making such small batches, I dont want to prematurely drink all of my cider while I am testing for the right level of carbonation so is it reasonable to think I could just re-cap them after I pry them open and pasteurize later?

I know I will loose some of the carbonation from the outgasing of the trapped CO2 in the head space but this shouldnt be too much right? I know I wont be able to actually taste for carb levels but I should be able to get a reasonable feel for how well it is carbed by how much it outgases, or at least this is my thinking.
 
Back
Top