Help, My Stout went all wrong!

I am trying to figure out where I went wrong, someone help me... I am getting ready to start my very first AG Stout, but I need to learn where my mistake was with my partial mash so I dont make the same mistake again.... When bottling night came around instead of a nice colored good smelling brew I got a chunky, burnt smelling septic style juice that was even hard to siphon from the firmenter to the bottling bucket. As hard as it is to say, I think this one my stink as brew... Here's where I think I went wrong... 1. I didnt do a second firmentation (I added my clarifier, and my stabilizer to the priming mix @ bottling) 2. I waited a week after the bubbling stopped to bottle. 3. I cooked my wart for 2 hours. Someone help

oh I forgot to add that on the backend it was a little sour tasting... And before anyone asks yes I sanitized everything before I started.

glad to see your finaly aboard the brew train bro i think this board will have us up to spead in no time oh and as far as your stout goes 1.the boil time of 2 houres was a bit long which can acount for the chunky texture id shoot for an houre but then again i dont know weather you used dme,grains or syrup

Chunky septic juice is not caused by overzealous boiling, unless you burned the fermentable sugars into charcoal on the bottom of your brewpot.... My guess is, somewhere, you forgot to sanitize something. You can brew pretty good beer from pretty mediocre ingredients if you keep everything clean. So, back to basics. Which sanitizer did you use? How did you use it? What strength etc.

I use chlorinated TSP (the pink powder) and I rinse everything 3 times and work with wet stuff. Exposure to air is maybe 20 minutes max on any particular piece of equipment. Sanitized rubber gloves help.

If you haven't mastered making beer simply, why are you adding clarifiers and stabilizers? Forget that crap. Hops, barley, yeast, water. KISS

stouts can be tricky. often more viscous and acidic due to the darker roasted malts. maybe just give it some extra time in the bottle to mellow and age.

give us some details on the partial mash you did?

I'm calling this one an infection. Do you have a wort chiller? Did your fermentation get off to a quick start? Did you do a starter?

Totally sounds like an infection to me. Even if you sanitized everything, there could be wild yeast or something in the air that made its way in. I personally spray my place down with Oust or other air sanitizer before I start.

i think your beer got the HIV too. thorough sanatation is paramount.

My Wort recipe was as follows....
6lbs. DME
1lb. Chocolate Malt
1lb. Dark Roasted Malt
1lb. dark brown sugar
1 1/2 ounces of Cascades
1 oz of Hallartau

Fairly simple recipe I thought, do you think the sourness could be from the acidity of the darker malts? If so then some time in the bottle with Amylace should fix that problem right? This was my first attempt at a stout, I have had great success with red and brown ales so I thought I would really go for it this time and test myself. I love stout and I dont think people really apprieciate a good beer especially here in america. Thanks to prohibition everyone loves Buttwiper.... oh well, anyway back to original problem, I sanitized with bleach, and rinsed 3 times and didnt give my firmenter more than 20 minutes of airtime before I started. The firmentation started within 6 hours of the yeast being added to the wort and went strong for 3 days then died to almost nothing (maybe the mix was too hot?). Gloves are a good idea, I think I will get me some of those. So based on that what do ya'll think

Don't know if this caused it, but I really don't like using bleach for sanitizer. IMO, rinsing out the bleach with water defeats the purpose of sanitizing, since tap water can have bacteria. I much prefer Star San - it's a no rinse sanitizer.

In your first post you said you used a stabalizer. What is that used for in beer? I know it is used in wine but it is not supposed to be used in beer. Also that's a lot of chocolate malt, and roasted malt and brown sugar. I'd check your choice of the amoumt of your ingredients. To clean I use bleach without any trouble if you rince well with HOT water. To sanitize I use star-san like alemonkey. Also did you steep those cracked grains? They aren't meant to be boiled to advoid leaching of tannins into the beer.

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I went with a nonrinse sanitizer for the AG, and I took my time (made sure my wife was gone the whole day so I didnt feel hurried). I made a Honey-Cinnamon Stout, the color is Black to say the least but it has a very pleasent aroma, and the wort tasted wonderful I can only imagine what it will taste like after the firmentation. I used 2lbs raw honey, and 1 lb of dark brown sugar as my fermentables in this batch to accompany my grains. I also kept it simple, using basic ingrediants. When the 1 stage is over I will give you guys an update, I think I will definately use a carboy for stage 2 just so I can keep an eye on things (just an excuse to go shopping). I guess the only question I have for this one is what kind of clarifier do you guys recommend for a stout? I do not want to rob any of the color, or flavor.

Honestly, what do you need a clarifier in a stout for? I have made some really wicked stouts and porters, and the only thing I've ever used was a bit of bentonite in one. The others I've just let condition in secondary for 2 or 3 weeks, then bottle, and let stand for a month. No issues at all. Except that everyone drinks my stout and I gotta make a lot more.

I wouldn't bother with a clarifier either. The only thing I ever use is Irish Moss in lighter colored beers. I've found that with a good boil and quick cooldown it clears up naturally after a couple weeks in the fermenter

Your recipe sounds like it will be very tasty, but I wouldn't be surprised if it needs to age a long time. I made a pretty big Strong Ale a couple of years ago with a full pound of brown sugar. It took a year to taste decent. It's now over 2 years old, and I just remembered that I have a few bottles in the closet. Cracked open a couple last night and it was excellent. I think any time you use a lot of sugar it needs extra aging to get rid of that funky sugar taste.

I have never actually used brown sugar before. Was there a particular reason that you used it? I am guessing you wanted to make sure it was a little sweet which would make sense for a stout. Feeback is needed here with this suggestion as I am not as experienced with specialty grains as many here.... but if you want to assure sweetness you could replace the brown sugar with a malt that does not ferment and is sweet... crystal malt for instance gives a sweetness taste. I would lower the 1 pounders to 1/2. Remember you are adding adjunts and not base malts. Recalling what I read... those malts dont ferment which is putting a lot of unfermentables in your beer and they also contribute to the smell you are discribing (1/3 of what you have in there falls in the unfermentables/hard to ferment catagory). If you want to assure yourself of a darker color you could add some black patent malt. I believe you dont want to add any more then 1/2 pound with BPM though. Again BPM gives a burnt smell if used too much.

If somene can assure what I have said makes sense.. much appreciated

Great thanks for all the help here guys, here is how I went on my AG - now again this is my very first AG but from the looks of it - It is going to be beautiful.... I went with:
2lbs Pale Malts
1lb light Crystal Malts
1lb Black Pentant Malts
1/2lb Roasted Barley
2lbs Raw Honey
1lb Dark Brown Sugar
4 cinnamon sticks
1oz Magnum Hops
1oz Fuggle Hops

The reason I use Brown Sugar is because brown sugar has molassas in it which gives a great flavor to stout in my opinion and the sugar aids the yeast to grow in the beginning as honey can take a while to break down. I fully expect this stout to take a long time, but patience is a virtue and if it comes out half as good as I expect its going to be the bomp

i could be wrong but arent you going a little heavy on the adjuncts? my calculation show @ 75 percent utilization youll get 1.019 sg from the 4.5 lbs of grains your mashing and 1.024 sg from the honey/sugar. for a combined sg of 1.043...thats more than 50 percent fermentables from the honey/brown sugar.

Everyone may be overlooking a likely cause....

You didn't do a secondary. You added the priming solution and bottled. Did you kick up or suck up a bunch of the sediment at the bottom of the fermenter? If you had lots of sediment kicked up, the beer would seem chunky, hard to siphon, and would have somewhat of a sour yeasty bite.

Since it sounds like you had good sanitation and a viable yeast, maybe something as simple as better siphoning technique can be the solution.

The good news is, if you siphoned sediment filled beer into the bottles, eventually it will settle back out, probably yeilding a decent brew. You'll just end up with a thicker layer of sediment at the bottom of each bottle.

Good luck!

I agree wuth cgravier. That's a lot of black patent for 5 gallons.

Regarding your recipe, I'm afraid it won't taste much like a stout. I think you need to up your pale malt considerably (6 lbs sounds better). You could probably cut the amount of honey in half, or eliminate it entirely, the brown sugar is fine, the crystal malt is fine. I like to add a bit of Munich malt to add a little malty taste to my stouts and porters, but that's just me. I'm not a big fan of cinnamon in a stout, but if you like that flavor, go for it. As far as the dark malts, I like to use 1/3 lb black patent, 1/3 lb roasted barley, and 1/3 lb chocolate malt. it usually provides plenty of dark color, roasty flavor, and a nice chocolaty taste that I prefer.

another suggestion...if you like the taste of mollasses, why not cut out the middle man so to speak and just add some mollasses? your putting in alot of brown sugar just to get the very little mollasses it has. A 1/2 C. -1 c. of mollasses will really give you the flavor. and if you need to 'help the yeast' which is the realm of mead makers, their is something inherently wrong with your recipe...(imho)

or you could prime with mollasses...

Thanks again, I have only been homebrewing for a few months and I am sure it shows - What little I know I have learned from a couple of classes and a book I am reading. Never did think there was a such thing as too many fermentables. Not that I am going for a rubbing alcohol taste, but I definately want to know I've been drinking. I'll write down these suggestions, and use them on later recipes. Guess I am going to have to start living by less is more. I heard that if you use to much Patent Malt that it gives an astringent taste to the beer, does anyone know if that is true?

On www.howtobrew.com Palmer says a little black patent goes a long way. He says there is very little reason to ever use more than a pound of it. I don't know about astringency, but you don't want your brew tasting like charcoal.

The good thing about home brew is that if you let it sit long enough it tends to mellow and get better. I'm sure it will turn into a great tasting beer, it will probably just need to age a long time with all those adjuncts.

lotsa dark malts will increase your ph toward the acid side, which can give you those harsher flavors. i think it will also accentuate the hops sharply.

i don't think you used too much dark malts, just not enough base malt. with two lbs of roasted/dark malts, i'd aim for about ten lbs of pale malt. that way you are not above 20% adjuncts.

and definately give the stout a spell, even if only two weeks in the secondary.

the last stout we made was on xmas eve, it was as follows

ten lbs pale malt
one lb chocolate malt
one lb roast barely
two oz ekg full boil

we are just now cracking the bottles and it is a smooth, silky, malty stout. it takes a long time mate

Ok so at the end of everything Valentines night 52 12 ounce bottles of Conditioning Sludge exploded all over my kitchen and inside my wife's china cabinet... Yes I am still alive, and miraculously I escaped with both nuts still intact. The beautiful thing is I learned from my mistake and attacked an AG stout head on that Saturday and I won. Bottled it yesterday and its color, smell etc... is perfect. If it wasnt flat I would drink it now. The biggest mistake I made with the first one was not giving myself enough time, 2nd too much adjunct. The beer stalled on me, I didnt take a final reading and bottled it while it was half way through firmentation. (ALWAYS TAKE A READING). I will post some pics later of the stout I just bottled. I am going to let it sit for several months before I touch it. This weekend I am brewing a Belgian Strong Blonde Ale.