Spice, Herb, or Vegetable Beer Coconut Porter 1st Place in 2nd Round 2011 HBT Comp

The following is a cut & paste from Beersmith so forgive me if things are illegible.

Normally when I make this beer I use 10-12oz of flaked unsweetened coconut, but I could only find a single 8oz package after going to 3 different stores. Apparently, there was a run on coconut that day. I will point out that in the scoresheet notes they felt like it needed a bit more coconut flavor, and I agree. This is a good beer, but I prefer it with a bit more coconut in there.

I would also add that in the three times I have made variations of this recipe, the head retention has been pretty poor, and additionally in this last one I felt like the body was a bit lacking and a couple of judges agreed. So I would recommend adding 6-8oz pound of carapils to the steeping grains.

Recipe Specifications

Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Boil Size: 6.41 gal
Estimated OG: 1.054 SG
Estimated Color: 30.7 SRM
Estimated IBU: 35.5 IBU
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:


Amount Item Type % or IBU
6 lbs Light Dry Extract (8.0 SRM) Dry Extract 79.89 %
10.1 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 8.39 %
10.1 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 8.39 %
4.0 oz Carafa Special II (415.0 SRM) Grain 3.33 %
2.00 oz Goldings, U.S.2009/05/22 [4.50 %] (60 minHops 32.1 IBU
1.00 oz Williamette 2009/05/22 [4.80 %] (5 min) Hops 3.4 IBU
8.00 oz Coconut (Shaved, Toasted) (Bottling 7.0 daMisc
1 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04) Yeast-Ale

Steep grains as desired (30-60 minutes)
Coconut should be toasted lightly in a pan before adding in secondary.

I'm looking at doing a coconut porter in the next month or so and this one really stands out to me.
I prefer to convert it to all grain because my attempts at extracts haven't yielded great results. Here's what Beersmith gives me (not including the actual 12oz coconut):
Any feedback?


BeerSmith 2 Recipe Printout
Recipe: Coconut Porter
Brewer: Jason
Asst Brewer: Yellowjackets in nest nearby
Style: American Brown Ale
TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 7.14 gal
Post Boil Volume: 5.72 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Bottling Volume: 4.55 gal
Estimated OG: 1.065 SG
Estimated Color: 36.4 SRM
Estimated IBU: 24.3 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 82.5 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
15.6 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 2 7.9 %
15.6 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3 7.9 %
6.2 oz Carafa II (412.0 SRM) Grain 4 3.1 %
1.42 oz Goldings, B.C. [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 21.9 IBUs
0.71 oz Willamette [4.80 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 6 2.3 IBUs
1.0 pkg SafAle English Ale (DCL/Fermentis #S-04) Yeast 7 -
10 lbs 0.2 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 81.0 %


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 12 lbs 5.6 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 15.46 qt of water at 168.2 F 156.0 F 45 min

Sparge: Batch sparge with 2 steps (1.19gal, 3.57gal) of 168.0 F water

I am not sure why the amounts of the specialty malts are all about 50% higher. That doesn't look right to me. What is your efficiency set to?

What is your boil off rate? You are apparently boiling off over 2 gallons per hour according to that recipe.

Also as I said in my first post, I would add about 8oz of carapils, and 8oz of flaked barley or flaked wheat. I haven't brewed this recipe again since I posted this, but plan to make those changes next time I brew it.

Although, if you are mashing at 156F you might get enough body from that without having to do the carapils. However, I don't think it would hurt anything to add the carapils to this recipe, either.

Ok this should look better, I'm still learning how to use Beersmith 2.0
(Coconut is not listed because I can't figure out how to add it in BS)

Recipe: Coconut Porter
Brewer: Jason
Asst Brewer: Yellowjackets in nest nearby
Style: Brown Porter
TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 6.5 gal
Post Boil Volume: 6.0 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.5 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.2 gal
Estimated OG: 1.059 SG
Estimated Color: 29.2 SRM
Estimated IBU: 31.7 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 79.1 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
10.8 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 2 5.5 %
10.8 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM) Grain 3 5.5 %
5.7 oz Carafa II (412.0 SRM) Grain 6 2.9 %
2.00 oz Goldings, B.C. [4.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 7 28.7 IBUs
1.00 oz Willamette [4.80 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 8 3.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg SafAle English Ale (DCL/Fermentis #S-04) Yeast 9 -
10.3 oz Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 5 5.2 %
10.3 oz Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM) Grain 4 5.3 %
9 lbs 4.2 oz Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 75.6 %


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 12 lbs 4.1 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 18.21 qt of water at 172 F 156 F 45 min

Sparge: Drain mash tun, Batch sparge with 1 steps (4.2gal) of 168 F water

That looks much better. IBUs are correct in this one, too, which I had noticed before but forgot to comment on in my earlier reply.

In terms of process and the coconut, if you can, get 12oz of unsweetened flaked coconut, and toast it lightly in a pan before adding it to secondary. What I do is put the toasted coconut in a nylon mesh bag with a fairly tight mesh (I do NOT think a paint strainer bag would work well) like your typical LHBS hops bag, and make sure it is tied up TIGHT at the top. Otherwise you will end up with a bunch of coconut floating around in your beer, which doesn't drop out in my experience, and then it's a pain to get it packaged without having little coconut bits in it. I usually also weight down the bag with sanitized marbles or stainless steel nuts, etc.

Thanks for the help! It'll be a month or so before I grew but I'll keep this thread updated on my all grain experience.

I have been wanting to try a coconut porter, I think I will try this. I have heard that toasting coconut is tricky. Have you tried buying toasted coconut? If so, did it work well?

I didn't even know you could buy coconut already toasted. I always just find a package of the stuff used for baking at the grocery store, and toast it on the stove right before I transfer the beer to secondary.

I don't think it's tricky, necessarily, and it only takes a few minutes. Just keep the heat at a low to medium level and stir continuously with a spatula. When it starts getting close to the color you want, remove it completely from the heat and keep stirring for another couple of minutes. I guess it probably helps to use a no-stick pan, but the coconut doesn't really stick anyway due to the oil in it, especially if you are constantly stirring it.

Your recipe looks similar to one that I have made before with great success with one glaring change that I am interested in. I roast my coconut in the oven instead of toasting it in a pan. have you ever done it this way before? I'm curious if by toasting it in a pan if you are able to pull out any more distinct roasty/toasty coconut flavor.

I doubt it makes much of a difference to be honest. I like doing it in the pan because I can keep my eye on it and not overdo it. If I stick it in the oven on a cookie sheet (for example), there is a distinct danger that I will keep it in there too long, or that I will obsess over it and open the oven every 30 seconds, which sorta defeats the purpose.

So just to clarify, you're:
* primary for 11 days
* transfer to secondary bucket where you add the 12oz toasted coconut in a nylon bag, for 7 days
* remove coconut then keg/bottle

I will be kegging this beer and letting it sit (room temp) another 2-4 weeks to further condition before I force carb it.
I'm wondering if I should transfer the coconut into the keg also, or is 7 days in the secondary long enough?

That sounds about right. The 11 days primary is more of a guideline than anything else. I basically let it ferment out, then give it another few days to a week or two depending upon my schedule and whatnot.

A week on the coconut should be plenty.

I finally brewed this recipe up last night and the yeasties are already busy at work this morning. 11 more days and they get to meet their new friends, toasted coconut.

Looking forward to seeing how this one turns out. Keep us posted on your results.

Due to an elk hunting adventure, I finally got this brew into secondary with the coconut after 33 days in primary.
I put the pan-toasted coconut into a sanitized hop bag then put that into a keg. I then racked the beer into the keg and purged the O2. I know initially we talked about putting this into a bucket with the coconut but I was concerned about oxidation so I went to keg instead.
Now I'll let it sit for about a week then rack into another keg and start carbing.
I really should've made a couple porters first before jumping right into this coco nut recipe but oh well.
The sample I took had a 1.014 gravity and was dark as hell but clear, not cloudy whatsoever. It tasted a little watery but I guess that's expected at this early stage.

Sounds delicious...

UPDATE:
I pulled the coconut hop bag out of the keg after 8 days, put the keg in the fridge at 44F and began carbing. (I didn't rack to another keg).
Now after about 11 days I pull a sample glass and... folks we have a winner!

Here's what I found. This beer retains its head very well, indeed better than any of the few beers I've made so far. I didn't expect this because of the oils in the coconut but whatever, I'll take it.
By far the most outstanding trait is the aroma. Fresh toasted coconut! I hope this aroma lasts in the keg and in bottles because I will certainly be entering this into some competitions.
The taste seems well balanced, just the right amount of coconut. I made a beer float using chocolate ice cream last night after dinner and wow... what a feeling enjoying this treat all made by me! (Can you tell I'm still new to this hobby?)
Another week of carbing is only gonna improve this beer.

Thank you so much for sharing this recipe and helping me along the way weirdboy.

This is the first beer I've made that is SO good I'm actually not wanting to share it with friends. Is this a natural progression for a homebrewer?

I've had this beer on tap for a couple weeks and have discovered something unexpected. Many people do not like coconut flavor!
Since I'm still new in the hobby many of my friends are always asking what's next on tap. When I finally came out with this coconut porter many people say "oh I don't like coconut." WTF? I thought everyone liked coconut!?
Anyway, more great beer for me. But this has led to me wanting to make a regular porter for my friends to show off my growing skills. Since this batch turned out so great I'm considering doing the exact same recipe except leave out the coconut at the end.

Good to hear you enjoy it, and I too have friends that don't like coconut.

Admittedly, I don't like coconut, either. But it is very specific...the flavor of raw coconut (e.g. on a Mounds bar or coconut cake) just tastes awful to me. There is something in the coconut flesh that just rubs me the wrong way. But, I really like the flavor of coconut milk in e.g. Thai food, or coconut water, or the coconut flavor you get in something like this.

Do you think the weak head retention is due to the coconut oil?

UPDATE:
Been on tap for about a month now and it's slowly been losing it's coconut aroma and flavor. The beer itself is still a great porter, just reducing that wonderful aroma.
Any suggestions?

More coconut.lol

Wow, I dunno. I haven't had a big problem with losing coconut aroma or flavor. What I have noticed is that the flavor doesn't fade exactly, but it blends more with the beer rather than being distinctly separate from the flavor of the porter, if that makes any sense. I guess what I am saying is that the flavors just meld more as time progresses.

Maybe that's what's going on. Before, it was a distinct and noticeable coconut aroma exactly like it smells after you toast it. Now, I'm the only one that even knows it's coconut, everyone else just says it's the best porter they've ever had but none can identify coconut specifically as an aroma or flavor.
Keep in mind these are serious beer tasting rookies though.

About 6 weeks in keg and the coconut flavor and aroma is virtually gone. Luckily I bottled a few after only a couple weeks in keg so this weekend I was able to compare the bottled version with the keg version and sure enough, the bottled version retained its coconut flavor and aroma.
No one has experienced this before?
My initial plan would be to leave the coconut in the keg longer but I'd like to get to the bottom of where the flavor and aroma is going. Did the coconut flavor compounds settle to the bottom of the keg so they were drawn off first? I never shook the keg so I'm not sure.
Any helpful feedback is desired because otherwise this is a seriously good beer.
If no solution is found then I'll try making it again and just bottling the entire batch.

Wow, that is bizarre. I have not experienced that. I had a keg last year that tasted nearly identical to the bottles that I did from the same batch, maybe 5-6 months after brewing.

Currently brewing a toasted coconut brown ale. Had kona's last month... Kinda what's making me do it. I'm going to try 1.5 to 2 lbs of unsweetened toasted coconut in the secondary (5gals) for a week or two. Hope it turns out well!

bwinnie said:

Currently brewing a toasted coconut brown ale. Had kona's last month... Kinda what's making me do it. I'm going to try 1.5 to 2 lbs of unsweetened toasted coconut in the secondary (5gals) for a week or two. Hope it turns out well!

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Cool! I too have considered a coconut brown ale.
I'd be interested in your feedback on the longevity of the coconut flavor and aroma in the keg.
I should've asked first, do you plan on kegging or bottling or both?

Unfortunately I do not have the capacity to keg, so I will be bottling. Going to rack the beer to the secondary onto the coconut this weekend, so it will be awhile before I can comment on longevity of the flavor. I'll try and let you know.

JasontheBeaver said:

Any helpful feedback is desired because otherwise this is a seriously good beer.
If no solution is found then I'll try making it again and just bottling the entire batch.

Click to expand...

Absolute guess on my part and I have zero experience with this so anyone is free to shoot the whole thing down.

We dry hop beers. I know many folks who place hop balls in their kegs to continue maximum hop flavor throughout the life of the keg. Why not "dry coconut" the keg? Get one of those SS tea balls and fill with toasted coconut and drop into the keg prior to carbing. Actually, you could purge the keg now of CO2 and drop a ball in.

In fact, I know there have been a few DIY plans for various hop backs on here. You could fill a hop back with coconut. There are tons of ideas if you want to go crazy!

I just made this and that's exactly what i did. Tossed 1lb of toasted coconut into a paint strainer bag then into the keg, It's been in there for a week and is delicious already. Just hoping it doesn't clog the dip tube.

Oh my goodness...just racked into a corny on top of 12oz of toasted coconut...it smells and tastes incredible already...can wait for the next 2 weeks to hurry by so i can start drinking this

I am going to be brewing a coconut cream ale (AG) and am planning on putting in 1/2lb of toasted coconut in the mash, 1/2lb at flame out, and then 1.5 lbs in the secondary. Do you think that would be too much? I want a fairly strong flavor aroma, but don't want it to be obnoxious coconut flavor.

2.5 lbs of coconut sure sounds like a lot to me. Also just FYI with that much fruit you are probably going to have a significant amount of absorption...you might want to scale your recipe up to 6 gallons or so.

I will scale up to account for absorption. I have never brewed with coconut, so I am unsure of how much to use. I read another post of one guy saying he did 2lbs in the secondary and that it was a good flavor but tapered off over long periods of time. I just want to make sure it sticks around. How much would you suggest?

I had no problem detecting the coconut in my beer months after brewing using less than a pound. It really depends on how much coconut flavor and aroma you are going for. I have no trouble believing that SOME of the coconut is going to fade over time, in the same way that dry hops will fade over time just because the beer gets older. Taste a fresh IPA a week after dry hopping and the same beer again at a month, and it will have much less hop punch than it did a few weeks before.

Maybe start with a pound, see how you like it at that level and keep some bottles around for a few months to try at different stages. Then, use that to determine what you do on the next batch. Personally, I use 10-12oz as I wrote in the recipe. I like being able to clearly taste the underlying style without the beer being overwhelmed by the fruit. A lot of people like their fruit beer to be dominated by the fruit, but that's not really my thing. There is a lot to be said for balance.

I think i will take your advice and
Start small and add to taste. Thanks for the suggestions.

Has anyone tried this with a extract? I was thinking about using an extract to control the flavor, absorption, and head retention. Any thoughts?

absolutbmc said:

Has anyone tried this with a extract? I was thinking about using an extract to control the flavor, absorption, and head retention. Any thoughts?

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For what it's worth, I just found a few old bottles of this beer stuck in the back of a closet, and popped one last night to try it out. They are from a batch I made two years ago. Head retention and flavor were absolutely fine.

I ended up using 3lbs of real coconut and the flavor is awesome. It has only been in the bottles for 2 weeks and
I havent sampled since bottling day do i can't comment on head retention yet, but i have one chilling right now for sampling later tonight. There is a bunch of sediment in the bottom of the bottles though.