Counterflow Chiller Tutorial

mjb1962853 said:

Thanks to Bobby_M and others for posting ideas here. I found this thread after I made my CFC. Apparently great minds think alike !

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Nice clean looking build.

So has anybody used this one:

Where You're The Brewer!

Is the quality & operation of it comparable to the ones you guys are building? I thought I saw someone post a picture of it earlier in the thread.

I haven't seen what the brewer's apprentice builds other than the pic further up in this thread. It's certainly comparable in design. At $70, you're really close to a Shirron plate chiller though. It's a tough call.

Bobby_M said:

I haven't seen what the brewer's apprentice builds other than the pic further up in this thread. It's certainly comparable in design. At $70, you're really close to a Shirron plate chiller though. It's a tough call.

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Anyone want to contribute to the debate between a plate chiller nad a counterflow? I've heard that it's much easier to plug up a plate chiller. What are the benefits?

mattyg said:

Anyone want to contribute to the debate between a plate chiller nad a counterflow? I've heard that it's much easier to plug up a plate chiller. What are the benefits?

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I bet if you try searching for it you will find many threads on it already rather then pulling this thread off topic.

You're right, sorry about that. The instructions in this thread are great for anyone that wants to make one of these counterflow chillers.

I managed to clog mine with whole hops. I guaran-damn-T that unclogging a copper tube CFC is easier than a plate chiller. A bit of full blast h2o and I was back in business. With a plate chiller...

I would argue that you need some level of whole hop straining no matter what style of external exchanger you use. Even something like a 16x16 stainless mesh would be fine for either. The stainless chore boy scrubber would be another option.

I decided to build this and my local store only had 50' sections of copper and 50' hoses. So I cut the hose in half. Due to my stupidity/inexperience whatever you want to call it I now have a 25' CFC and 20-23' of rubber hose/copper tubing. Would a CFC thats only 20' following these directions be enough or should I just save the materials for something else? I was hoping to make a second one and sell it to help offset my costs.

Yunus said:

I decided to build this and my local store only had 50' sections of copper and 50' hoses. So I cut the hose in half. Due to my stupidity/inexperience whatever you want to call it I now have a 25' CFC and 20-23' of rubber hose/copper tubing. Would a CFC thats only 20' following these directions be enough or should I just save the materials for something else? I was hoping to make a second one and sell it to help offset my costs.

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Just use the remainder of your materials. I have a friend who has a 23' one and it works just as good as my 25' CFC. I'd make it, then put it up for sale! Cheers!

Others on this thread have built 20' ones with good results. I think you can even get down to 16' but it really depends on the temp of the cooling water on how short you can really make it.

So I finally got around to doing the last steps in building this. Sliding the copper reducer over the copper line was really really difficult. I ended up having to take a drill bit to the reducer to make it work. But I have tested it and everything works well, no leaks.

I did not put a second reducer/fittings at the top though. I just let the water come out of the hose however it wants to and the copper line extends about 12" past the end of the hose. Any problems with this style of setup?

The rate of cooling does depend on length (surface area). but it's also a function of the mass flow rate (lb/s) of both the wort and the cooling water.

Mass flow rate = density x avg. velocity x cross-sectional area of tube/annulus

Wow, I read through all 23 pages of this thread. There's some great stuff here. I was looking for some ideas on installing quick disconnets to the wort side of my CFC (recently built using this very tutorial). Just wondering what's worked well for others before I go and start ordering parts.

Thanks

Scott.

zombeer said:

Wow, I read through all 23 pages of this thread. There's some great stuff here. I was looking for some ideas on installing quick disconnets to the wort side of my CFC (recently built using this very tutorial). Just wondering what's worked well for others before I go and start ordering parts.

Thanks

Scott.

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I use a male QD on the wort inflow and a 1/2" barb on the output. The hose on the output stays on at all times, which is the only reason there is not a QD on it. I really like the QD, especially since all the rest of my equipment has them. Much better especially when using a pump.

I'm building one of these very soon. Thanks Bobby for your imagination and ingenuity. You helped me convert my kegs, and now you are helping me with a CFC. Two questions for everyone though...

1. I'm not quite sure how quick disconnects attach to the set-up. Both to the spigots and to the chiller. They sound almost like a necessity if wanting to be economical in the brew day. I don't know where to get them, don't know what they look like, and don't know how to set them up. Anyone got pics of how they are connected and part numbers for some brass or SS versions? Plastic sounds too easy to contamination to me.

2. More for Bobby but if anyone has any ideas...why do you think the coils of a chiller has to be lower than the inputs and outputs of the wort and coolant? Is it a pressure thing? Or is it a syphon/contact thing with both the wort and coolant? I don't want to have to wait 10 hours for my first 10 gallon batch to cool to room temp.

You can attach male QDs to your boil kettle and then clamp a high temp hose to your chiller with female QD (that has a hose barb on it). That way you only need one set of QDs.

The part numbers from mcmaster.com are on my website Equipment

Thanks mano! Appreciate it.

I built a 25 foot cfc based on this thread, but used the compression fittings since I had little soldering experience at the time. I put quick connect fittings on the coolant side of this as well as a small ball valve to control the water from the faucet. My tap water is running about 50 degrees, so I really need to throttle back the water to get the output into the carboy around 65 degrees.

I am using gravity, so the flow is pretty slow, and dialing the temp takes some time since changes of the flow of coolant take about 20 seconds to register on the thermometer.

bzomerlei said:

...My tap water is running about 50 degrees, so I really need to throttle back the water to get the output into the carboy around 65 degrees.

I am using gravity, so the flow is pretty slow, and dialing the temp takes some time since changes of the flow of coolant take about 20 seconds to register on the thermometer.

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bz, that set-up is sweet. You got a close up of the connection with that thermometer?

Skrimpy,
No picture, but I can describe it for you.

The thermometer has 1/2" male pipe threads with a 2" probe, it goes into the side of a brass 1/2" female T. The other side of the T has a barbed fitting that goes into the neck of the carboy. The bottom of the T goes has a compression fitting for the copper coming from the chiller.

Brent

Anybody ever tried using the braided PVC tubing with their chiller to recirc for about 10 min.? Will this tubing hold up under boiling temps until I can get my silicone? Thanks for the help.

illinibrew04 said:

Anybody ever tried using the braided PVC tubing with their chiller to recirc for about 10 min.? Will this tubing hold up under boiling temps until I can get my silicone? Thanks for the help.

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With anything vinyl I would be afraid of off flavors being extracted at 212F. If you're looking to sanitize the chiller, just plug the outflow and pour some sanitizer into the chiller using a funnel. Let the sanitizer sit in there until you're almost ready to chill the wort. I did this for several brews before finally switching to silicone tubing, and it worked fine.

Thank you for this thread. It helped me make this:





I put four feet of hose on each end, with a FGH on one of them. This way, I can hook it up to my faucet, and drain it in the same faucet. Thank you for the info.:rockin:

mjb1962853,

You could put a bucket inside the bucket, attach some fittings and recirculate ice water through, or put another copper coil inside the bucket with some ice water before sending the superchilled wort to the fermenter.

I followed the tutorial and made my CFC the other day. Thanks Bobby!!!

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/5111/cfc.jpg

I love this hobby! It feeds my need for beer AND building crap!! Love it!
Thanks for the help from everyone on this thread

Hightech therm.



Probably need to wrap some clear take around the piece of Aluminum. Wish I made the copper pipe longer, but ran out of scrap and had to settle for AL.

I went to the LHBS this weekend to show off my chiller, and the owner offered to trade me a chiller for $100 worth of supplies, so I'm going to make my second one this week. I just have to make it narrower with more copper sticking out and less garden hose on the ends. Thank you again for helping me get more supplies. I'm going to buy an 8 gal. pot with the trade in so I can do full boils.

Sweet build. This just may be my next project.

AKchill said:

I went to the LHBS this weekend to show off my chiller, and the owner offered to trade me a chiller for $100 worth of supplies, so I'm going to make my second one this week. I just have to make it narrower with more copper sticking out and less garden hose on the ends. Thank you again for helping me get more supplies. I'm going to buy an 8 gal. pot with the trade in so I can do full boils.

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That rocks! full boils mean you can switch to all-grain!

I'm planning on making the leap to AG this summer. I think it will be more cost-effective in the long run if I can buy bulk grains. What started out as a Christmas present has turned into an all out obsession. In the future, when my daughter asks why I can't afford to pay her way through college, I'll simply hand her a glass of IPA

Has anyone used one of these to recirculate their wort? You could attach a Y valve at the end with one exit going back to the kettle and another into your fermenter. You could use a pump to circulate the wort until you reach temp and then switch the Y value over to your fermenter.

yes, i recirc. but i just take my tube that would normally flow into the fermenter and put it back into the top of the kettle at an angle just below the wort surface (helps the whirlpool). Just a hint for everyone, if you do this, you can chill down close to the temp of your tap water, but then you must do a whirlpool AFTER you do this chilling, especially if you are drawing off from a low ball valve and returning to top, because you are just sucking trub up to the top over and over.

I'll set up ice-water with a pump for next batch so that after the recirculating to chill whole kettle to under 70, I'll do a whirlpool, settle, then do a single pass chill with the chiller using icewater and a pump through a cooler, rather than the tap water from re-circ period.

AKchill said:

I'm planning on making the leap to AG this summer. I think it will be more cost-effective in the long run if I can buy bulk grains. What started out as a Christmas present has turned into an all out obsession. In the future, when my daughter asks why I can't afford to pay her way through college, I'll simply hand her a glass of IPA

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all-grain is a step you can do for about 45-60 btw, once you have a big enough pot. You just go get a big cooler and some copper pipe. In my case I even used a plastic fermenter bucket spigot and a chunk of vinyl tube to get from copper to outside the cooler. Total cheapness but works beautifully.

for bulk grain you need a mill. not as cheap.

I used my counterflow for the first time last weekend and I am just wondering if I am going to have problems because I absolutely could not flush out all the starsan. I circulated wort, flushed through hot water, then flushed through with starsan and tried to blow it out as best I could with an air compressor. Is the small amount left going to cause issues with corrosion or anything. Im using it tomorrow and just wanted to know if there is any prep I should do.

Hold the counter chiller in front of you then rock it around in a circular motion. Each rock should bring fluid out the exit. After about a minute almost all of the residual fluid should come out. Thats what I do. I also don't flush star-san thru before long time storage. Just boiling hot water to clean out the residual trub. I do use star san on brew day after 15 minutes before chilling the wort. I also circulate a little boiling wort thru.

Star-san does have a warning label that stats use with soft metals is not recommended. You should be fine though. Just don't let copper or aluminum sit it in for like weeks at a time. It will turn really really shinny.

Bobby - I made one of these but am having a hell of a time getting a leak-proof seal between the reducer and the 3/8" pipe. I have solered, re-soldered, and soldered again but always spring a leak. Any suggestions? How about that copper glue stuff?

mrburnsbud said:

Star-san does have a warning label that stats use with soft metals is not recommended. You should be fine though. Just don't let copper or aluminum sit it in for like weeks at a time. It will turn really really shinny.

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And then it turns green and corrodes...

kcinpdx said:

Bobby - I made one of these but am having a hell of a time getting a leak-proof seal between the reducer and the 3/8" pipe. I have solered, re-soldered, and soldered again but always spring a leak. Any suggestions? How about that copper glue stuff?

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Did you get a 1/2" to 3/8" reducer, or 1/2" to 1/4" reducer? In case you don't know, the soft copper tubing is measured in OD and the Pipe and reducer are measured in ID. So you actually need a 1/2" to 1/4" reducer to properly fit around the 3/8" tubing. I actually had to drill out part of the inside of my reducer to get the tubing through because there was a lip that stopped the tubing in the middle.

Also, the 1/2" to 1/4" reducers can be a little hard to find. My local Home Depot did not carry them, but Lowe's did.

If you do have the right size reducers, then I don't know what to tell you. I've never messed with copper glue, but would be a little worried about it holding up to boiling temperatures on the hot side.