Old world/traditional. I did 2# of d2 and 1#of d1. Everything was pretty much the same otherwise. IBU (Iowa Brewers Union) open. The apprentice actually scored my beer higher originally but you can see that he erased numbers and lowered them. There were comments about a lack of hop aroma and flavor from one of them, which we all know is not a part of this style. But all listed fusels as a problem. Again, Rochefort (I've never had Westy) has more fusels than my beer as do the vast majority of quads I've had (and I drink a lot of them). I'm not sure what to think about the results to be honest. I can taste what they are talking about but I disagree with their belief about the style, at least the commercial representation of it.
Belgian Dark Strong Ale The Pious - Westvleteren 12 style quad - multiple
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Old world/traditional. I did 2# of d2 and 1#of d1. Everything was pretty much the same otherwise. IBU (Iowa Brewers Union) open. The apprentice actually scored my beer higher originally but you can see that he erased numbers and lowered them. There were comments about a lack of hop aroma and flavor from one of them, which we all know is not a part of this style. But all listed fusels as a problem. Again, Rochefort (I've never had Westy) has more fusels than my beer as do the vast majority of quads I've had (and I drink a lot of them). I'm not sure what to think about the results to be honest. I can taste what they are talking about but I disagree with their belief about the style, at least the commercial representation of it.
Brewskii
Well-Known Member
rjwhite41 said:
BTW... Thanks for this info... Things got busy and I still haven't got my materials together yet. Informative vid though. Thx
Nierika
Well-Known Member
Looks like mine finished out at 1.024 (my OG was way over). It's pretty tasty coming in at 10.4%. I haven't started the cold conditioning yet.
I have a bunch of Palo Santo that I have from my travels to Peru. I was thinking about throwing some into the secondary, but I'm not sure how much or what method. They are in large chunks and pieces about the size of a finger. I'm guessing that I should soak them for a while in vodka or everclear to sanitize. Do I leave the pieces whole or chop them into smaller pieces to increase surface area? Any thoughts on amounts or techniques is appreciated.
I have a bunch of Palo Santo that I have from my travels to Peru. I was thinking about throwing some into the secondary, but I'm not sure how much or what method. They are in large chunks and pieces about the size of a finger. I'm guessing that I should soak them for a while in vodka or everclear to sanitize. Do I leave the pieces whole or chop them into smaller pieces to increase surface area? Any thoughts on amounts or techniques is appreciated.
bottlebomber
Well-Known Member
Is it toasted at all? You might consider toasting it lightly to bring out some flavor
I've used Palo Santo once in an RIS and my experience is that a little goes quite a long way. I used about 0.25 oz in 4 gal and it added a nice subtle flavor/aroma without dominating. The RIS was 13.5%ABV and I didn't actually sanitize the wood before adding, which may have been risky but it turned out well. I also left the wood as one whole chunk instead of chopping. Let us know how it turns out in this brew and how much you end up using, I'd be curious.
I bottle the traditional yesterday and it was wonderful. Can't wait until it is fully ready to be drunk.
How long do you age it in the bottle before drinking it? I plan not to touch it for a least 2 months.
I have a new world fermenting right now, looking forward to compare them both as well as with the original.
How long do you age it in the bottle before drinking it? I plan not to touch it for a least 2 months.
I have a new world fermenting right now, looking forward to compare them both as well as with the original.
Brought mine the theZapps beer festival exctly 2 months from brewday, and everyone loved it! Kinda sad to see the keg drained that day, but is was a pleasure to share this great beer with all those folks.
jpoder
Well-Known Member
IMHO, as long as possible! I brewed both the new world and old world versions in January last year, and they keep getting better...
Which one do you like best? and did you compare them to the original?
If so what are you conclusions.
I put most of the bottle in a hard to reach place to be able to resist as long as possible.
What category are people entering this in?
The obvious choice is 18E- Belgian Strong Dark Ale, since it has Westy 12, St. Bernardus, Rochefort 12, etc. listed as classic examples of the style. However, some internet sources and the actual BJCP guidelines also list 16E- Belgian Specialty Ale as a place for Trappist Quads.
Those with competition success with this beer (saq), what category did you use? I'm leaning towards 18E since 16E is broad.
The obvious choice is 18E- Belgian Strong Dark Ale, since it has Westy 12, St. Bernardus, Rochefort 12, etc. listed as classic examples of the style. However, some internet sources and the actual BJCP guidelines also list 16E- Belgian Specialty Ale as a place for Trappist Quads.
Those with competition success with this beer (saq), what category did you use? I'm leaning towards 18E since 16E is broad.
18E. The kinds of quads that fit into 16E would be more like Pannepot or things that are more like Belgian Barleywines (Scaldis Ambree), basically things that stray pretty far out of the entirety of cat18.
I'm kegging my most recent batch that has been in primary for 3 weeks where it will condition for a bit before getting tapped.
I'm kegging my most recent batch that has been in primary for 3 weeks where it will condition for a bit before getting tapped.
18E it is then, thanks for the replies. I picked up a bottle of St. Bernardus 12 last night for comparison and my realized westy clone was way undercarbonated. Luckily i have a few more days until entries are due, so i can still jack up the psi.
cercueil
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the recipe Saq. I searched high and low for a good Ommegang Three Philosophers clone and didn't come up with anything. I figured I needed a really good quad as a base and ran into this recipe. I added 48 ounces of Vintners Sweet Cherry Puree after about 5 days of fermentation. Its about 3 months old now on tap and its unbelievable. The cherry flavor is not overpowering and you still get to enjoy the great quad flavor. Thanks again for a great recipe and a great job talking about mashing low to get the attenuation and dryness that this needs.
sockmerchant
Well-Known Member
My slightly modified version of the "New World" has been close to two months in the bottle now. Really damn good. One of the better brews I've made I reckon.
I've been having one bottle a week to see how it develops. Quite remarkable how it changes really. If i keep having one a week it will last into next year. Should be interesting
The biggest difference probably came from my home made candi sugar which turned out pretty damn dark
Cheers!
I've been having one bottle a week to see how it develops. Quite remarkable how it changes really. If i keep having one a week it will last into next year. Should be interesting
The biggest difference probably came from my home made candi sugar which turned out pretty damn dark
Cheers!
bigbopper
Well-Known Member
brewed this on "the big brew day".missed sg by a few points but had a solid week of fermentation(blow off tube went nuts for 4 days) cant wait to try this.will keg 5 gal. and bottle 5 gal. any specifics on bottling ?
BuffaloBeer1
Well-Known Member
This looks great. I was hoping to brew this next weekend, however, had some questions about this. The highest gravity I have brewed thus far has been a 1.075. I have never used a starter, and have never had any problems getting down to the FG. I usually use either a dried yeast or Wyeast smack packs. Here are some of my questions.
1) I only have 6.5 gallon buckets for fermentation fitted with airlocks. Do I need to worry about blowing off the airlock with this one?
2) I was planning on substituting about 3lbs. of DME due to constraints on the amount of grain I can fit. Would it be beneficial to hold that off until after the fermentation dies down a little, then mix up some wort with it, add it to the primary and restir things? My thinking, is that might help get it down to the FG while not having to worry about exploding yeast.
Thanks for any help.
1) I only have 6.5 gallon buckets for fermentation fitted with airlocks. Do I need to worry about blowing off the airlock with this one?
2) I was planning on substituting about 3lbs. of DME due to constraints on the amount of grain I can fit. Would it be beneficial to hold that off until after the fermentation dies down a little, then mix up some wort with it, add it to the primary and restir things? My thinking, is that might help get it down to the FG while not having to worry about exploding yeast.
Thanks for any help.
thatjonguy
Now with 57.93% more awesome!
Anyone think the Belgian extract from Williams would be the best to try to duplicate this with speciality grains? (damn apartment life)
BuffaloBeer1
Well-Known Member
I got to be honest with everyone who talks about avoiding all-grain in an apartment. I live in an apartment size flat, and have switched over to all-grain for the last 5 batches and will not switch back now (perhaps some partial mashes if need be). Essentially I have a 5 gallon igloo water cooler, and an 8 gallon pot. The most recent batch I did was 13.5 pounds of grain and I had 75% efficiency. What convinced me to do it was reading the Easy Stove-top Partial mash thread by Deathbrewer, along with his all grain version. I say just go for it; at least try partial mashing it.
BuffaloBeer1
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the feedback. I have been hesitant to try a starter, or blow off tube, having never done one or talked to people who have. You've confirmed what I've been trying to avoid. I'm going to give a go next weekend.
thatjonguy
Now with 57.93% more awesome!
BuffaloBeer1 said:
Ok you convinced me. SWMBO is powerless against the logic of the internetz!
BuffaloBeer1
Well-Known Member
Someone had mentioned to me when it comes time to bottle this a few months down the road, I should mix in a champagne yeast a couple days before transferring to the bottling bucket to help with the carbonation. Has anyone had experience with this? or Is the remaining yeast in the secondary sufficient to carbonate it?
BuffaloBeer1 said:
I used half a packet of dry lager yeast in the bottling bucket. You could use champagne if you want but don't add it until you're in the bucket otherwise it will just settle to the bottom of your fermenter.
Just got scores back from a local competition. I used a modified new world recipe. Overall i'm kinda pleased. Received a 36 from both judges. Flavor category is where i got dinged the most, but there were really no outright flaws pointed out. Both of their descriptions matched the style guidlines...oh well.
Suggestions were to increase flavor complexity (i agree- flavor is dominated by sweet malt and dark candi syrup, i used 2lbs of just d180) and slightly reduce alcohol. The later comment i don't totally agree with. The alcohol is warming, but doesn't impact the actual flavor (i.e., no fusels). I personally want a bit of a warming with a quad. One judge mentioned that slightly better attentuation would have made this very close to the best example of the style. I was a couple points higher than my target (FG=1.013-14), so i can see that.
Both said it was a great beer though. I have to agree.
Suggestions were to increase flavor complexity (i agree- flavor is dominated by sweet malt and dark candi syrup, i used 2lbs of just d180) and slightly reduce alcohol. The later comment i don't totally agree with. The alcohol is warming, but doesn't impact the actual flavor (i.e., no fusels). I personally want a bit of a warming with a quad. One judge mentioned that slightly better attentuation would have made this very close to the best example of the style. I was a couple points higher than my target (FG=1.013-14), so i can see that.
Both said it was a great beer though. I have to agree.
bigbopper
Well-Known Member
i kegged this today,my f.g. came in @ 1.010.hopfully not to dry.seems to be my biggest problem this past year all my beers over-attenuating.bonus for kegging day my buddy hooked me up with a 2009 dfh world wide,and a 2010 founders kbs.
I just bottled up my most recent iteration of this recipe. I used legacy hops for their supposed black currant flavors, and ECY09 yeast. I got the attenuation I needed to hit 1.012 with an OG at 1.092. It's smoothly dangerous.
I'm drinking side by side a traditional and a real westvleteren and it is really close. Mine has been in the bottle for just under a month. I'm hard pressed to tell which one is the real deal and which one is the one I brewed.
Good job on the recipe!
Good job on the recipe!
Gothic_Horror
Well-Known Member
For the traditional, you all are doing a decoction, right? Could some kind soul please explain the actual mechanics of how this works with a cooler mash tun/lauter configuration? I understand the principals of a step mash and know what a decoction is, but how would one actually achieve those steps without direct firing.
Thanks!
Thanks!
I'm not set up to do a decoction. I do a simple mash and sparge. I mash at 149 for 90' and I sparge at 171 for 10'.
I swear I'm still drinking the traditional and the real one side by side and it is so close than it is hard to call the real one.
I swear I'm still drinking the traditional and the real one side by side and it is so close than it is hard to call the real one.
Get yourself a pitcher a 2 quart is a good start. I use a 16qt aluminum pot for this by the way. I pull the necessary decoction volume using the pitcher and dump it in the 16 qt pot. I then heat it to the temp I want and then I boil it and add it back to the cooler. It's that easy.
Gothic_Horror
Well-Known Member
That is what I figured, I may have been over thinking it. You will boil your decoction, then add back to cooler which has been sitting for a bit, waiting for the re-introduction of the decoction, with the liquid until you reach the desired temp. Once you reach the temp, what would you do with the remaining liquid in the pot? Drop it back in later before you mash out?
What remaining liquid are you talking about? That's why you pull a specific volume based on the temp and the targeted temp. That will tell you how much to pull and you just add it all back to the mash. That's how I do it at least. I am also lazy in the sense that I don't allow the decoction to sit at mash rest temp before I boil. I just bring it up to a boil then add it back. So what if the enzymes denature in the pot adding them back to the mash will just allow access to the sugars by the non-denatured enzymes in the mash. So while I might now be doing it the "right" way this is how I like doing it, and I do it for a lot of belgian beers especially with brett strains.
clinton69
Member
That's a beer i want to try. Can it be done with extracts?
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