A Newfound Appreciation for BMC. Really.

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Evan!

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I went over to the neighbor's last night for some sushi, and brought along one of my new summer favorites, the 2005 Bessin Old Vines Chablis. Great stuff. When we finished that, it was on to their stuff---which was mainly liquor (wasn't feeling that) and a case of The Silver Bullet that another neighbor had brought over. Now, I never ever drink American Light Lager BMC stuff. Just not into it. Somewhat of an elitist thing, you know? But I thought, hell, why not...so I threw back 4 or 5 of them.

And after making my own beer for a year now, and appreciating how effing difficult it is to make a simple pilsner, the stuff was actually not bad. Heresy, especially coming from someone who works in a beer shop that won't even stoop to stocking Sam Adams...but seriously, I used to group beer into two distinct categories: BMC, and everything else. But I think that this hobby really helps you appreciate various styles of beer for what they are. I still despise what I see as false advertising, where they get all in-depth about the supposed taste of their beer, but all in all, it was NOT bad stuff. I wouldn't buy it for myself, ever, but I expected much worse.
 
Evan! said:
coming from someone who works in a beer shop that won't even stoop to stocking Sam Adams...

:off:

Wait a minute, the shop you work at won't even "stoop" to carrying Sam Adams? Really?

How friggin' elistist can you get? I wouldn't shop there just because that attitute would piss me off beyond belief.
 
Bobby_M said:
If it weren't for SA, a LOT of people would have never made the jump to craft beers.

True, but I don't think Sam Adams is that great, I mean i'd drink it before a lot of stuff but i think it's over advertised and greatly overestimated.
 
DeadYetiBrew said:
True, but I don't think Sam Adams is that great, I mean i'd drink it before a lot of stuff but i think it's over advertised and greatly overestimated.

We should like SA if for the only reason that they are spending ad money on their homebrew competition and buying homebrew equipment. That was the reason I'm a HBer now!
 
egerrish said:
We should like SA if for the only reason that they are spending ad money on their homebrew competition and buying homebrew equipment. That was the reason I'm a HBer now!

Yeah i wouldn't have entertained the idea of homebrew without seeing the first LongShot commercials... What i was saying is that SA isn't bad, it's good beer, it's just that since i've started homebrewing I've found that my beer tastes better than most of the SA i've tasted, and I've started having other craft and micro brews that do it better than SA. However, SA made it possible for other Craft and Micro breweries to increase business..
 
No, no, it wasn't serious, folks. We don't carry Sam Adams, but that's for better reasons than elitism: simple economics. First off, we have limited real estate. Second, our competition would be grocery stores, most of which can whoop us in price wars due to their size. So we usually can't afford to take up space with too many "mainstream" beers that the grocery down the hill also carries.

As such, I have no problem politely sending people down the hill when they're looking for Heineken or Sam's. You don't waste space trying to compete with the big boys just for the sake of it, you know? I think the most mainstream thing we have right now is Sierra Nevada (not the pale - you can get that at any gas station).
 
Evan! said:
No, no, it wasn't serious, folks. We don't carry Sam Adams, but that's for better reasons than elitism: simple economics. First off, we have limited real estate. Second, our competition would be grocery stores, most of which can whoop us in price wars due to their size. So we usually can't afford to take up space with too many "mainstream" beers that the grocery down the hill also carries.

As such, I have no problem politely sending people down the hill when they're looking for Heineken or Sam's. You don't waste space trying to compete with the big boys just for the sake of it, you know? I think the most mainstream thing we have right now is Sierra Nevada (not the pale - you can get that at any gas station).

Not around here.... Very few stores sell anything less common than Guinness, Harp, Smithwick's, or the like. There's only a couple here that have a good beer selection, 1 Kroger, Buster's Liquors and Wines, and the 3 Habits.
 
I agree with you, in principle. Really, how many beers have you ever run into that was truly detestible? There are a few, but BMC really isn't all THAT bad. Is it as good as most craft brews? No. Then again, I've tasted an occasional craft beer that made me wish I had a Bud in my hands.

Beer is good. ALL beer is good, with a few exceptions. Hell, in Texas on a hot summer day, drinking a BMC is still better than drinking plain water, right? It's just that, by comparison, some beer is heaven!
 
I'm really suprised that you wouldn't stock the basic Sam Adams - "Boston Lager" Some people won't buy imports because it gets funky in the green bottles. I think SA is transition beer. People go to this who are tired of plain swill.

I would think that a small store would set itself apart with more variety, not necessarily at the volume of big guys. More variety in general.

I would have to agree with you in some way. A silver bullet out on the lake, after watersking, when its 95'F will be my choice over a SA. I wouldn't think twice about it at all. If I was eating lunch at the Marina, in AC, with a big burger, I'd pick the SA.

:mug:
 
I love beer. I met "good" beer when I spent a summer in Germany after high school 17 years ago. I can still remember the first Hefe-Weizen I had in a Biergarten on a hot summer day. It was amazing... and the seven minute pils, just perfect. And then, some magical potion from a monastary in Bavaria that, to this day, has never been equalled in my opinion.

When I got home, I found that the BMC stuff just wasn't the same (when I had the opportunity to drink it, since I was still underage)... but there was a homebrew store nearby, so I checked it out. I did my research and found out that the pilsners that I was so fond of were a little impractical for me to brew properly. So I brewed some amber ale... (extract). It was a very drinkable beer, and now I fell in love with darker beers.

I went through a period of time where I snubbed BMC.... "I drink 'real' beer, I'd proudly proclaim"... and I still generally reach for a Long Trail Ale before a Miller Lite. But I'll tell you what Bud and Miller make pretty damn good beers (I don't think as highly of Coors, but I appreciate thier consisntency). I think Budweiser is a fine beer, and the light beers are great when I'm working outside on a hot day, or if I'm out fishing or something like that. I find it to be an excellent replacement for gatorade when playing sports. They can be refreshing.

As a brewer I can appreciate how challenging it is to make such a delicate beer. And BMC all do it consistently, which is even more challenging.

We're beer people... beer is good. We can appreciate the beer we like without slamming people for liking thiers, that's why we're so much better than the wine snobs.
 
man I'd kill for a BMC right now....I'm at work but they are letting me use a table saw to cut wood for my lager chamber here (cool huh?) and it's hot as HELL outside.

hey jfliv same thing happend to me pretty much...I went to Germany when I was 17 and realized how good beer could actually be. Before that the only thing I'd ever had was miller lite (my parents) and the occassional corona.

I'm also in the same boat as others beer = good some beers are better but everything has a place. (i'm taking a philosophy class right now and it's kinda cool looking at "beer philosophy")
 
Evan! said:
No, no, it wasn't serious, folks. We don't carry Sam Adams, but that's for better reasons than elitism: simple economics. First off, we have limited real estate. Second, our competition would be grocery stores, most of which can whoop us in price wars due to their size. So we usually can't afford to take up space with too many "mainstream" beers that the grocery down the hill also carries.

As such, I have no problem politely sending people down the hill when they're looking for Heineken or Sam's. You don't waste space trying to compete with the big boys just for the sake of it, you know? I think the most mainstream thing we have right now is Sierra Nevada (not the pale - you can get that at any gas station).

(with out knowing all the details...)
so you think it is better not to carry the beer that people want and come into your store and ask to buy it? I dont think most people go from store to strore trying to find the best price on a 6 pack of sam adams when the pricing difference is $1.50. In fact, if I went into your store to get some beers, and I wanted sam adams for some reason, and you did not have it, that would probably piss me off enough to not come back to your store. You may have some rare/great beer, but there is also a huge market of people who drink sam adams types (one or two steps up from bmc) beers. I think that you should, as a beer store, be able to figure out a way to get into that market, instead of sending customers away. personal opinion though, and like i said, i dont know all the details.
 
You guys need to let the SA thing go. Evan! clearly explained why they do not carry it. I'm going top quote him b/c it appears that no one read it.

Evan! said:
We don't carry Sam Adams, but that's for better reasons than elitism: simple economics.

First off, we have limited real estate.
Second, our competition would be grocery stores, most of which can whoop us in price wars due to their size.

So we usually can't afford to take up space with too many "mainstream" beers that the grocery down the hill also carries.

As such, I have no problem politely sending people down the hill when they're looking for Heineken or Sam's. You don't waste space trying to compete with the big boys just for the sake of it, you know? I think the most mainstream thing we have right now is Sierra Nevada (not the pale - you can get that at any gas station).

If I go into a specialty store, I'm going there for a specific reason. To obtain what I cannot in the regular stores. To see brands that I have not heard of or expect to see.

If I go to a cheese store, I don't expect to see brands I can get in the grocery store. If I go to a specialty wine store, I don't expect to see the big selling wineries. I expect to see boutique wineries.

If I go to an collectors music store I expect to see a vast collection of Velvet Underground and early Lou Reed. I do not want to see several copies of some of the best selling records (ie. Framton comes Alive, Drk side of the moon, etc)
 
I did read evans reasons, which he explained well and I responded to his reasons...and no, we dont need to let the SA thing go, its a good conversation.

I guess its different here....we do not have beer in grocery stores (well only "3/2 beer" but not too many people buy it) . So we have lots of liquor stores that sell everything. We dont have "specialty beer stores" but our liquor stores have great selection. I guess the whole liquor store business is a bit different state to state. Its just interesting to me....
 
I didn't mean to start a big thing, but the aside about Sam Adams jumped out at me reading the original thread. Besides, there's not much else to say regarding the original post; BMC has its place in our lives - yes, it does!
 
Jay52 said:
Really, how many beers have you ever run into that was truly detestible?

Rolling Rock. Keystone. Heineken. Hofbrau Lager. Abita Amber. I can't stomach any of them (and hell, we carry the last two!).
 
BMC is great for playing Beirut (Beer Pong) I can't imagine playing that game with a heavy beer.

It really is about hand-eye coordination!
 
Yeast Infection said:
(with out knowing all the details...)
so you think it is better not to carry the beer that people want and come into your store and ask to buy it?

Believe me, if enough people asked for it, then we'd make space for it. But the vast majority of people come in and see our massive selection, and any thoughts of Sam Adams quickly fade.

I dont think most people go from store to strore trying to find the best price on a 6 pack of sam adams when the pricing difference is $1.50. In fact, if I went into your store to get some beers, and I wanted sam adams for some reason, and you did not have it, that would probably piss me off enough to not come back to your store.

Again, if I showed you something that is better than Sam Adams for the same price, and you still got pissed off and refused to come back, then, oh well. Can't please everyone.

You may have some rare/great beer, but there is also a huge market of people who drink sam adams types (one or two steps up from bmc) beers.

Like I said before, there might be a "huge market" for that particular brand, but there's not enough demand in our store to carry it. At the same time, we have plenty of beers that cost about the same as Sams, and are as good or better. So why would we carry it?

I think that you should, as a beer store, be able to figure out a way to get into that market, instead of sending customers away. personal opinion though, and like i said, i dont know all the details.

Usually, the only people who actually come in looking for something in particular and end up leaving are the ones looking for BMC. It's not very often that I can't convince someone who is looking for Sam Adams or Heineken that we have something as good or better, but with a different name on the bottle.

And, as I said before, since space is limited, there are some things that it's not worth trying to compete with the big boys on. They'll always be able to outprice us, and we always have a price match guarantee. Hell, we could try to "get into" the Olde English 800 market if we really wanted to, but why?
 
Yeast Infection said:
I did read evans reasons, which he explained well and I responded to his reasons...and no, we dont need to let the SA thing go, its a good conversation.

I guess its different here....we do not have beer in grocery stores (well only "3/2 beer" but not too many people buy it) . So we have lots of liquor stores that sell everything. We dont have "specialty beer stores" but our liquor stores have great selection. I guess the whole liquor store business is a bit different state to state. Its just interesting to me....

You'd be surprised at the selection of even the dumpiest grocery stores around here. Even most gas stations have some Sam Adams, Hoegaarden and Guinness.
 
It's just that he explained the market they are trying to capture and the strategy that his work has decided upon and the physical limitations and how Sam Adams does not fit that criteria.

Substitute the words Gasoline and Gas station in his reasoning and you'll see what I mean.

We don't carry gasoline, but that's for better reasons than elitism: simple economics.

First off, we have limited real estate.
Second, our competition would be gas stations, most of which can whoop us in price wars due to their size.

So we usually can't afford to take up space with gasoline that the gas station down the hill also carries.


EDIT: I guess EVAN! covered it. So now I'm beating the dead horse! :D
 
good enough for me....we dont have specialty beer stores around here....so its just kinda of a wierd concept to me. But it seems like it works in your area. (sorry if I came off argumentative)
 
Yeast Infection said:
good enough for me....we dont have specialty beer stores around here....so its just kinda of a wierd concept to me. But it seems like it works in your area. (sorry if I came off argumentative)

When it comes to getting good beer in grocery stores and having liqour stores like this one http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/2341/
that has 100's of available beers, I have to remind myself of how spoiled I am.
 
olllllo said:
If I go to an collectors music store I expect to see a vast collection of Velvet Underground and early Lou Reed. I do not want to see several copies of some of the best selling records (ie. Framton comes Alive, Drk side of the moon, etc)

Been watching High Fidelity lately? haha, that movie is great.

The whole time I read this thread I thought to myself how much BMC sucks. I won't touch the stuff, it doesn't taste good at all, who cares if they're consistant. I'll take a cold icewater on a hot day over a BMC anyday....shoot...I'd take room temp tap water over it.
I won't say that this world doesn't have a place for it, but it'd be a better world if it wasn't here. If you ask a regular BMC drinker what his favorite beer is he'll quickly say one or the other and can point out a million reasons why the other two suck. While most everyone on this forum agrees that they all taste like piss. I'm proud to be a beer snob and certainly glad that I can differentiate a damn good microbrew over the mondo corporation piss water!
 
I can't believe how much of a fuss you guys are making over Sam Adams. I've yet to have a single one of their beers that I really like. I'd like to try Oktoberfest and Utopias out of curiosity. My impressions:

Boston Lager: Overrated. A little hoppy, but mostly less taste and more filling.
Hefe: Flavorless.
Cherry Wheat: Cough syrup.
Black Lager: Flavorless.
Summer Ale: Not bad - average.
Brown Ale: Yuck. Watery nothing.
Winter Lager: Eh. A little biting on the palate.
Cranberry Lambic: Neither cranberry nor lambic.
Old Fezziwig: Not bad - the spice notes actually come through alright

Now, I would like to thank Sam Adams for opening up the American beer palate slightly. But seriously...can't they start brewing some GOOD beer?

EDIT:
Forgot about the homebrewer support from SA - they really are a decent company, I just haven't been overly impressed by their beers.
 
What an argument. Basically what it all boils down to is that for everyone who likes a specific beer, two people are against it, one person has never had it, Three people like Budweiser, one likes Coors, and two people will never shop at the store where Evan works. Did I cover it?

Just sharing my completely useless opinion. I won't knock Sam Adams because of their support of homebrewers and since I've only had about three of their beers I can't really profess to be a Sam's expert.

I personally like the Black Lager, and the Oktoberfest is one of my favorite beers period.

I also think that BMC must be making better beer because alot of long time HBT's are starting to say it is good. (Doesn't mean I'll be running to the store to get some anytime soon), but Evan I would definately shop at your store.

After the end of this rant McKBrew has recieved the support of one, the total hatred from two, and someone has vowed to curse my next batch of brew.
 
Yuri_Rage said:
I can't believe how much of a fuss you guys are making over Sam Adams. I've yet to have a single one of their beers that I really like. I'd like to try Oktoberfest and Utopias out of curiosity. My impressions:

Boston Lager: Overrated. A little hoppy, but mostly less taste and more filling.
Hefe: Flavorless.
Cherry Wheat: Cough syrup.
Black Lager: Flavorless.
Summer Ale: Not bad - average.
Brown Ale: Yuck. Watery nothing.
Winter Lager: Eh. A little biting on the palate.
Cranberry Lambic: Neither cranberry nor lambic.
Old Fezziwig: Not bad - the spice notes actually come through alright

Now, I would like to thank Sam Adams for opening up the American beer palate slightly. But seriously...can't they start brewing some GOOD beer?

EDIT:
Forgot about the homebrewer support from SA - they really are a decent company, I just haven't been overly impressed by their beers.

I'm not a huge SA drinker either, but I did pick up their Summer Mix pack just this weekend and threw some back. The old lady likes wheats and fruit wheats a lot and she's had their Boston Lager and found it "not bad". I had never had the Boston Ale or Pale Ale and I enjoy the Summer Ale, so it made a good purchase IMO.

I will concur that the Cherry Wheat tastes like cough syrup after one, Boston Lager isn't my favorite Lager, and I've had better Hefes, but... I find the Boston Ale and, especially, the Pale Ale pretty enjoyable (I didn't see these on your list, so wanted to get your thoughts if you forgot them or urge you to try them b/c they are decent IMO). As noted, I also enjoy the Summer Ale on a warm one and have used it to turn on a few more friends to "craft-style" beers just in the past month or two...
 
^ I can't speak to the others on your list (never had them), with the exception of the Winter Lager. I had this I think twice this past winter and I found it fairly decent compared to the other beers on tap at the place I drank this (Texas Roadhouse both times I believe)... By no means exceptional, but different, and pretty good for a lager to me...
 
SilkkyBrew said:
I find the Boston Ale and, especially, the Pale Ale pretty enjoyable (I didn't see these on your list, so wanted to get your thoughts if you forgot them or urge you to try them b/c they are decent IMO).
I haven't had either of those, but I'd certainly give them a try. I don't HATE Sam Adams, and I'd really like a beer from them that I can truly enjoy.
 
I did a couple of threads lately about BMC. The long and short of it was that while I don't seem to like High Life I confessed that I really like Miller Lite. I don't know what it is, but it just has really good flavor to me. Totally different from any homebrew, brewpub brew or micro-brew, yet still good tasting to me. There's nothing at all wrong with that in my book.
 
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