Mini-mash beginner questions

I'm interested in making the switch from all extract to partial mash. I've read Deathbrewer's sticky several times. My questions are:

1) The pic below shows my two brew pots. One is a 40-qt. SS kettle, and the other is an 8-qt. SS pot. Can I do this with the equipment I have? If I wanted to mash 5-6 lbs. of grain, that would require about 2 gallons of strike water, right? So, it seems to me I would have to mash in the big kettle and use the little one to heat the sparge water? Since two gallons of water would fill my smaller pot completely, I would not be able to steep or tea bag the grains in the sparge water, I would have to rely on sparging only, which I assume would decrease my efficiency somewhat?

2) 2 gallons of water in my 10-gallon kettle only fills it up a few inches. If I added 5-6 lbs. of grain to it, would that even be enough to cover the grains and keep them wet?

3) I'm concerned about maintaining mash temp. the pot is probably too big to stick in my oven, and over the course of 45-60 minutes, I would think I'd experience significant heat loss due to the surface area/headspace.

Do I just bite the bullet and buy another (bigger, cheaper) pot? Like a 4-gallon one?

I think you're going to need a bigger pot than the 8 qt (Especially if you want to use DeathBrewer's sparge technique).

I wouldn't be too concerned with Mash temps since you'll be able to add heat if necessary.

For #2, that's probably not enough liquid to accomplish what you're trying to do.

I would work on larger batches and make sure you have another pot (at least 20-24 qt) to replace the 8 qt.

You could also do your mash in a 6 gallon bucket. Just heat up your strike water to about 180 and pour it into your bucket and then stir the water and let it fall to your strike temp. This will pre-heat your bucket. Dump your grain in the bucket (lined with a large grain bag) and stir well. I have a comforter that I wrap all around my bucket and have done this with as little as a 2 degree temperature drop. This would allow you to heat your sparge water and "tea bag" in your large kettle.

Haputanlas said:

I wouldn't be too concerned with Mash temps since you'll be able to add heat if necessary.

Click to expand...

You mean via pre-heated water...like just pour in a few cups of hot (190*)water to raise the temp?

Haputanlas said:

For #2, that's probably not enough liquid to accomplish what you're trying to do.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure I follow you here. Should I be mashing 5-6 lbs. of grain in more than 2 gallons of water?

Haputanlas said:

I would work on larger batches and make sure you have another pot (at least 20-24 qt) to replace the 8 qt.

Click to expand...

I'm planning on doing 5 gallon batches.

BryceL said:

You could also do your mash in a 6 gallon bucket. Just heat up your strike water to about 180 and pour it into your bucket and then stir the water and let it fall to your strike temp. This will pre-heat your bucket. Dump your grain in the bucket (lined with a large grain bag) and stir well. I have a comforter that I wrap all around my bucket and have done this with as little as a 2 degree temperature drop. This would allow you to heat your sparge water and "tea bag" in your large kettle.

Click to expand...

I use food grade buckets to mash and sparge as well. My lauter tun is a standard food grade bucket with lots of holes drilled in the bottom. This fits inside a bucket with spigot and creates a false bottom. I have been using this for a couple of years now and really like it. Easy to clean and cheap. You do have to insulate it somehow with blankets or beach towels but it will hold temp and it really works quite well. Papazian calls this the Zapap.

BryceL said:

You could also do your mash in a 6 gallon bucket. Just heat up your strike water to about 180 and pour it into your bucket and then stir the water and let it fall to your strike temp. This will pre-heat your bucket. Dump your grain in the bucket (lined with a large grain bag) and stir well. I have a comforter that I wrap all around my bucket and have done this with as little as a 2 degree temperature drop. This would allow you to heat your sparge water and "tea bag" in your large kettle.

Click to expand...

JonK331 said:

I use food grade buckets to mash and sparge as well. My lauter tun is a standard food grade bucket with lots of holes drilled in the bottom. This fits inside a bucket with spigot and creates a false bottom. I have been using this for a couple of years now and really like it. Easy to clean and cheap. You do have to insulate it somehow with blankets or beach towels but it will hold temp and it really works quite well. Papazian calls this the Zapap.

Click to expand...

I like these ideas. The drilled bucket is so that you don't have to use a bag? You just open the spigot after the mash is finished and drain into your brew kettle? If I took BryceL's method, I probably wouldn't want to use my fermentation bucket in case it got scratched in the process.

I'm in the same boat. I have a 5 gallon pot and a 2 gallon pot, and plan on doing partial mashes and 3 gallon AG. My plan at the moment is somewhat comical, but should hopefully work.

I'm going to mash using the BIAB method in the 5 gallon pot (and mash out if need be). Then I'll hold the bag up to drain as best as I could. I will then pour that part of the wort into my primary bucket to hold.

I will then put the bag of grain back into the now empty 5 gallon pot, and pour in the sparge water that was heated in my 2 gallon pot (and a third small pot if i need extra). I will do the sparge, and drain as I did with the mash.

Then I'll simply pour the wort from my bucket back into the big pot with the sparge, and continue as per usual.

Yeah, it's a few extra steps, but it will keep me from having to buy any extra equipment for now. Might work for you?

onipar said:

I will then put the bag of grain back into the now empty 5 gallon pot, and pour in the sparge water that was heated in my 2 gallon pot (and a third small pot if i need extra). I will do the sparge, and drain as I did with the mash.

Click to expand...

Yes, that could work. When you do the sparge, will you pour the water over the grains into the 5 gallon pot, and then tea bag in the sparge water/wort?

I'm trying to think through the specific steps before I attempt this...

A tip for holding the bag up to drain- I'm a decent size (6'1", 245lbs) but holding a heavy bag of soaked grain nearly at eye level can get even hard for the strongest person. Recently by mistake, I realized that if you wrap the extra part of your bag around your mixing stick and lay it across the top of your pot, you can avoid having to do this (imagine a winch). I have one of those plastic stirring paddles which is about 3 feet long so luckily when I wind the bag around it my hand is not over the hot pot.

grace1760 said:

I like these ideas. The drilled bucket is so that you don't have to use a bag? You just open the spigot after the mash is finished and drain into your brew kettle? If I took BryceL's method, I probably wouldn't want to use my fermentation bucket in case it got scratched in the process.

Click to expand...

You will still want to use the grain bag. I believe that the holes just create a false bottom so that when you sparge you get an even flow through your grain bed which will increase your efficiency. The holes will still allow grains to pass through, hence the need for the bag. Also, good idea to keep a separate bucket for your fermentation vessel.

onipar said:

I'm in the same boat. I have a 5 gallon pot and a 2 gallon pot, and plan on doing partial mashes and 3 gallon AG. My plan at the moment is somewhat comical, but should hopefully work.

I'm going to mash using the BIAB method in the 5 gallon pot (and mash out if need be). Then I'll hold the bag up to drain as best as I could. I will then pour that part of the wort into my primary bucket to hold.

I will then put the bag of grain back into the now empty 5 gallon pot, and pour in the sparge water that was heated in my 2 gallon pot (and a third small pot if i need extra). I will do the sparge, and drain as I did with the mash.

Then I'll simply pour the wort from my bucket back into the big pot with the sparge, and continue as per usual.

Yeah, it's a few extra steps, but it will keep me from having to buy any extra equipment for now. Might work for you?

Click to expand...

I just did a 2.5 gallon all grain batch with a very similar method to this. It seemed to work pretty well.

grace1760 said:

You mean via pre-heated water...like just pour in a few cups of hot (190*)water to raise the temp?

Click to expand...

That would work or you could just turn the heat back on to your stove top. You would need to mix the grains while you're mashing to keep the heat uniform, but that would work well.

I'm not sure I follow you here. Should I be mashing 5-6 lbs. of grain in more than 2 gallons of water?

Click to expand...

2 gallons would be fine. However, I am just referring to the fact that you have a very wide 10 Gallon pot. Two gallons of water might not rise very high in that pot. Might be OK though. I don't have that pot.

grace1760 said:

Yes, that could work. When you do the sparge, will you pour the water over the grains into the 5 gallon pot, and then tea bag in the sparge water/wort?

I'm trying to think through the specific steps before I attempt this...

Click to expand...

Yeah, my plan is to place the bag open in the pot (the way it was when I mashed) and pour the sparge water in to let the grain soak for a bit, stiring a few times. If I had a colander that fit over top of my pot, I might do the "pour over" sparge instead, but I don't have a big colander.

I'm not entirely sure which method is better.

boomtown25 said:

A tip for holding the bag up to drain- I'm a decent size (6'1", 245lbs) but holding a heavy bag of soaked grain nearly at eye level can get even hard for the strongest person. Recently by mistake, I realized that if you wrap the extra part of your bag around your mixing stick and lay it across the top of your pot, you can avoid having to do this (imagine a winch). I have one of those plastic stirring paddles which is about 3 feet long so luckily when I wind the bag around it my hand is not over the hot pot.

Click to expand...

Great tip, thank you. Yeah, i have been trying to think of easier ways to drain. The best way I can think of would be to buy a nice big colander that fits either on my bucket or on the pot, that way I could just leave the bag to drain.

Being broke sucks.

grace1760 said:

I like these ideas. The drilled bucket is so that you don't have to use a bag? You just open the spigot after the mash is finished and drain into your brew kettle? If I took BryceL's method, I probably wouldn't want to use my fermentation bucket in case it got scratched in the process.

Click to expand...

I use two food grade buckets one with a spigot and one without. I drill the holes in the bottom of the bucket that doesn't have the spigot and place it inside the bucket with the spigot. That way, one bucket sits inside the other creating a false bottom just above the spigot. The buckets i use for this I don't use for anything else. It doesn't matter if they get scratched because the collected wort is always boiled.

This system provides essentially the same fluid dynamics as a false bottom inside a stainless kettle with a ball valve. Waaaay better than a bottling bucket with a giant strainer bag.

Jonk- Any suggestions on material to wrap around the mash tun to keep it holding heat?

I noticed the AHS partial mash kits only include about 2-3.5 lbs. of grain...maybe I can get away with mashing in the 8 qt. pot after all (3.5 lbs * 1.25 quarts/lb = 1 gallon of water for the mash.

If I wanted to calculate efficiency, do I do this before I add the DME? I don't have software...do I just add up the total potential, take a gravity reading, and calculate:

Starting Gravity/[Total points/volume]