Quantitative assay for characteristic compounds in wild ales

I plan on designing a quantitative assay to profile various wild ales (lambic, gueuze, flander's red and brown). I plan on testing ethyl acetate, acetic acid, and total volatile acids. I am also looking into additional compounds to add to the assay (depending on the ease/cost of creating a quantitative test for them). What are some characteristic compounds that you would like to see added? So far I have only looked into Isoamylacetate and a few phenols, but no sure-fire test methods yet...

I dont know if it can be tested but I love the Butyric acid in Geuze

Your thread was so wildly successful, it spawned a copy of itself.

cheezydemon3 said:

Your thread was so wildly successful, it spawned a copy of itself.

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ya thats my fault... i was going for maximum penetration lol


looking into butyric acid now. thanks for the suggestion!

What about an assay for species of yeast and bacteria? What would be really neat would be a qPCR assay at different time points during fermentation and conditioning to see how proportions species shift during development.

Crayfish said:

What about an assay for species of yeast and bacteria? What would be really neat would be a qPCR assay at different time points during fermentation and conditioning to see how proportions species shift during development.

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you've figured out part 2 already!

After the profiling is done I will be using the assay with qPCR to study population dynamics and gene expression is a few different mixed cultures.

If you don't mind me asking, is this part of work for a graduate program or do you work in a lab? Or, are you just very rich and inquisitive?

Is this volatile compound assay going to be on a mass spec? It does sound like you are looking for a grad school project. The proteomics and metabolomics core at my school has loads of collaborations with our local breweries.

Crayfish said:

If you don't mind me asking, is this part of work for a graduate program or do you work in a lab? Or, are you just very rich and inquisitive?

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Its for a grad school thesis. Inquisitive, yes. Rich, not so much.

ColoHox said:

Is this volatile compound assay going to be on a mass spec? It does sound like you are looking for a grad school project. The proteomics and metabolomics core at my school has loads of collaborations with our local breweries.

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They want to avoid using the mass spec because they have a limited number of columns (all being used). I am talking with a few companies about making a biolog type test or a custom ELISA assay. Will hear back in a week or so

failbeams said:

They want to avoid using the mass spec because they have a limited number of columns (all being used). I am talking with a few companies about making a biolog type test or a custom ELISA assay. Will hear back in a week or so

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This would be an interesting project. Biolog assay maybe, but you cant make an elisa for organic compounds and volatiles like those. Although presence of certain proteins in various beers would be cool, and elis-able. If not mass spec or NMR, you would almost certainly have to use chromatography.

bradjoiner said:

I dont know if it can be tested but I love the Butyric acid in Geuze

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Love it? Isn't that what makes vomit smell like vomit? I've smelled faint whiffs of it before in gueze, but I can't say I loved it.

Crayfish said:

What about an assay for species of yeast and bacteria? What would be really neat would be a qPCR assay at different time points during fermentation and conditioning to see how proportions species shift during development.

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That would be an awesome doctoral project. So many questions could be asked.

Idk that anyone would be willing to give you enough money to pull it off though.