Building a British bitter from the bottom up

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Nugent

Nugent

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Just back from the UK and fell hard for real ales, especially bitters. Had some fantastic, yet seemingly simple, light-coloured bitters, especially in Scotland (Kelburn's Goldihops, Caringorm's Trade Winds, Caledonian Deuchar's IPA (neither a bitter really, nor an IPA in the NA sense), etc.). Have decided that to get the British bitter/ale that I really want, I'm going to start from the basics. Here's what I brewed yesterday:

AG ESB malt/Goldings SMaSH

OG: 1.042
SRM: 5.6
IBU: 37.4
Batch size: 5.5 gals.
Mash: 60 mins. @ 154F (68% eff.)

8.5 lbs. of Gambrinus ESB malt
1.0 oz. Goldings (whole) (5.0%) @ 60 mins.
1.0 oz. Goldings (whole) (5.0%) @ 30 mins.
1.0 oz. of Goldings (whole) (5.0%) @ 10 mins.

1.0 tsp. Irish moss

Wyeast 1098

Water: Very soft Vancouver water - pH 6.7 (similar to Portland, OR, but even less dissolved solids)


Beyond what I like in a bitter, my question to you all is where you would go from here if you were me. Would you work with the malt side or hop side first? Would you keep what I have and monkey with ferm. temps, water profile or yeast?

All input would be appreciated. Thanks as always.
 
If you're interested in changing only one thing at a time I'd start tweaking the malt bill. I find that these beers are very much defined by malt character.

However, water profile can have a big impact as well. Vancouver water is so pure. You need some salts in there to get the character you fell for. My best beers have all been made with salt additions, though they are also my most recent beers so this might be the other reason they are better. For bitter I would aim for something like:

Ca 50 - 100
SO4 100 - 200
Cl 20

I've never used that 1098 yeast myself, but 1968 is excellent and worth a try as well.
 
Nugent -- very interesting question. I would agree and go with tweaking the malt bill. Seem to me that EKGs are the quintessential UK hop and so I see no need to monkey with those.

I would however switch to Marris Otter as a base malt. This is another staple, can't-go-wrong ingredient.

Next, I'd add some dark crystal, perhaps .5 of 120 (less if you want to dial in and experiment).

You might then add Biscuit (or Victory, if you can't get Biscuit, pretty identical from what I've read here) and again you might start with .5 lb.

To WorryWort: I too have very soft water (Boston). What would you suggest as far as additions? 4-5 grams each of gypsum and chalk? I'd be keen on knowing specific suggestions.
 
Nugent, I'll second the reply on water. Your water is almost Pilsen like so bumping up the ions as WW suggested is a good idea. I don't know anything about the malt you are using but British malt is going to make the best tasting British style beer IMO. A good UK pale malt should be the backbone of the recipe. I would go easy with the specialty malts. Dark crystal can be a little agressive. If you want a little color boost and background sweetness try some traditional Brit medium crystal in the 55L range at maybe 3-5% to start. As far as procedure goes I would use a basic British bitter hop schedule of one early (90 minutes) and one late (15 minutes). The three addition American style hop schedule makes a good beer but after years of using it without getting the results I wanted I switched to the two addition Brit style and found it really yields more of the Old World profile that makes a bitter a bitter. Personally I would drop the mash temp 2 or 3 degrees F to get a little more attenuation. The EKG hops are wonderful and one of my favorites although there are a number of other very nice UK varieties you may want to try. Fuggles, Bramling Cross, WGV and First Gold are all worth consideration. :mug:
 
jsullivan02130 said:
I would however switch to Marris Otter as a base malt. This is another staple, can't-go-wrong ingredient.

You might then add Biscuit (or Victory, if you can't get Biscuit, pretty identical from what I've read here) and again you might start with .5 lb.

To WorryWort: I too have very soft water (Boston). What would you suggest as far as additions? 4-5 grams each of gypsum and chalk? I'd be keen on knowing specific suggestions.
Click to expand...

I agree with all of this. Unfortunately, we can't easily get Marris Otter in Vancouver. Gambrinus is a very good maltster though, and their ESB is the closest thing we've got at LHBS. (Ordering grains via mail can be a b!tch, in cost and timing. The closest place I know is in Toronto. US web suppliers don't ship here cheaply)

Same goes for Victory. Biscuit is easy though,and it's a great substitute. I'm assuming Nugent goes to Dan's for supplies.

Jsullivan - It isn't just softness, but also sulfur to chloride ratio that is important. So I couldn't necessarily tell you without a water report.

This is a very simplified explanation but alkalinity influences the pH mostly. So 'soft water' doesn't necessarily mean you need to change. But you do need to adjust if you are brewing darker, or lighter beer. Generally speaking higher alkalinity favors darker beer. I don't know what you need without a water report.

However, in terms of the beer's flavour profile or character, more sulfur will make the hops and bitterness more pronounced, while more chloride will up the malt presence, or perception thereof.

See these:
How to Brew - By John Palmer - Balancing the Malts and Minerals
The Brewing Network.com - :

Both are great resources, and the brewstrong show has 2 follow up shows on the topic. Very, very helpful. I am just starting to experiment with water though, but it is already making a difference.
 
BigEd, is it your opinion that the 90 minute addition contributes anything other than bitterness? I've heard that some hop flavor or other characteristics come through depending on the hop. I'm not sure if that depends more on the amount or type of hop used or the style of beer.
 
If you're wanting to tweak little bits at a time, I'd say water profile first, as your water's really soft, then some crystal malt, about 10% 55L is what I use. To add some extra breadyness, you could start toasting some of your malt, or doing longer boils (90-120 mins) which will increase the mallard reactions and caramel tones.
 
If I am not mistaken bitters use a bittering addition and an aroma addition 0 min. I was not aware that they used a late addition or 15 min like BigEd is suggesting?
 
14thstreet said:
BigEd, is it your opinion that the 90 minute addition contributes anything other than bitterness? I've heard that some hop flavor or other characteristics come through depending on the hop. I'm not sure if that depends more on the amount or type of hop used or the style of beer.
Click to expand...

I don't know what it is but I beat my head against the wall for years trying to re-invent the wheel with UK bitter hop additions. After trying all kinds of combinations based on the basic US three hop addition method the beers just never had the same kind of hop flavor that all the Brit beers I tasted drank. Once I tried the old UK profile of the two additions and a 90 minute boil it all fell together. I can't explain it but it certainly seems to work. :mug:
 
jlpred55 said:
If I am not mistaken bitters use a bittering addition and an aroma addition 0 min. I was not aware that they used a late addition or 15 min like BigEd is suggesting?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. A lot of recipes I looked at, many from UK brewing forums, seemed to have a late but before end of boil addition. This is the one I prefer although you could certainly use a 0 minute addition. Better yet might be to substitute dry hopping for a 0 minute addition. :mug:
 
jlpred55 said:
If I am not mistaken bitters use a bittering addition and an aroma addition 0 min. I was not aware that they used a late addition or 15 min like BigEd is suggesting?
Click to expand...

I don't believe this is a fair statement. I don't have evidence to the contrary, but it is almost certainly untrue to say that all bitters have only one type of hop schedule. While I will agree that this is a great hop schedule for the style, it is certainly acceptable to do something else.
 
WorryWort said:
I don't believe this is a fair statement. I don't have evidence to the contrary, but it is almost certainly untrue to say that all bitters have only one type of hop schedule. While I will agree that this is a great hop schedule for the style, it is certainly acceptable to do something else.
Click to expand...

I agree, I've not come across this info anywhere in my research on the style.
 
I don't like the Ordinary Bitters, but I very much like the Special and Extra Special Bitters.
Also, my experience of these brews was gained in southern England, and it probably slightly different to Scottish brews.
Your recipe falls into the Special Bitter category, and is light enough to drink as a session beer. I like that, and brew about one 5g batch per month.
I have never tried the Gambrinus malt, because I can't get it. I can get Maris Otter at a reasonable price, so that it what I always use.
Your hop schedule is a bit different to mine. I go for 2 oz at 60 minutes, 1 oz and 20 - 15 minutes, and 1 oz at 0 minutes when using EKG. I prefer the extra bittering, and really link the effect of the 0 minute addition.
I also add 0.75# crystal 55 to the grain bill. I find this adds considerably to the complexity of the beer, but that may be a bit much for your taste judging from your description.
I prefer the 1968 yeast, but the 1098 would also work well, as would 1275.
I have also found that a thick mash (1 qt/lb) as recommended by Ray Daniels makes a substantial difference to the flavor profile.

-a.
 
I have nothing of note to add except that those are some darn tassty beers. My folks live up in Edinburgh so I get up there 2-3 times a year. Trade Winds and the Deuchars IPA are both on tap at my Dad's local and these are definitely two of my favourites. I lost count of how many Deuchar's IPAs I drank last time I was up there but it was definitely in double figures. And that was just one evening :cross:


Anyway, carry on :)
 
A hearty thank you to all for the input and advice. A lot of food for thought.

I'm really determined to see this experiment through and will let you know how it goes.

Will be researching and focusing on water, specialty malt additions and hop schedule.

Cheers :mug:
 
In Brew Your Own British Real Ale, the recipes only have two hop additions, a bittering addition at the start of the 90 minute boil, and an aroma addition during the last 15 minutes of the boil. That's the schedule I've always used for my British beers.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
To my taste American pale ales have a pronounced hop flavor, not just bitterness and aroma. In an English bitter, the first hop addition gives you bitterness and the late hop addition gives you some hop aroma -- but there is no hop flavor to compete with the maltiness of the beer. That hop flavor, at least in general terms, comes from the 20-30 minute addition common in American hop schedules. At least that's my rationale.
 
Chad said:
To my taste American pale ales have a pronounced hop flavor, not just bitterness and aroma. In an English bitter, the first hop addition gives you bitterness and the late hop addition gives you some hop aroma -- but there is no hop flavor to compete with the maltiness of the beer. That hop flavor, at least in general terms, comes from the 20-30 minute addition common in American hop schedules. At least that's my rationale.
Click to expand...

I like your way of thinking on the bitterness. I never thought about it, but you very seldom taste the actual hops in a British beer.
 
I'm drinking this as I type:

Best Bitter
8-C Extra Special/Strong Bitter (English Pale Ale)
Date: 8/18/09

Original Gravity: 1.050 (1.048 - 1.060)
Terminal Gravity: 1.012 (1.010 - 1.016)
Color: 11.42 (6.0 - 18.0)
Alcohol: 4.87% (4.6% - 6.2%)
Bitterness: 33.2 (30.0 - 50.0)

Ingredients:
4.0 lb Maris Otter
4.75 lb Pale Ale Malt
0.5 lb Corn Flaked (Maize)
0.5 lb Crystal 60
1.0 oz Challenger (7.0%) - added during boil, boiled 60.0 min
0.5 oz East Kent Goldings Leaf (5.0%) - added during boil, boiled 30.0 min
0.5 oz East Kent Goldings Leaf (5.0%) - added during boil, boiled 5.0 min
1.0 ea Fermentis S-04 Safale S-04

I've also brewed a batch w/ WLP026. Haven't tried it yet.
 
You should tried the WLP0023 (Burton ale). I think it's become my house yeast for English styles.
 
Nugent said:
If this website of JZ's is correct, it appears that WLP0023 is the same strain at Wyeast 1275. This is great since I can only get wyeast at my LHBS.

Thanks for the tip.

http://www.mrmalty.com/yeast.htm
Click to expand...

While that yeast list has them listed as the same strain, I get different results from them. The thames valley has had an almost dirty kind of flavor in the couple beers I used it in while the burton ale has been more flavorful and without the muddy kind of flavor. It could be that something infected that thames valley culture I had since all the beers I made with it came from a washed sample from the same smack pack.

As for the original question in this thread, I also have been pursuing the perfect bitter and have a few suggestions that closely follow several other good posts in this thread.

First, get a little british crystal 55 in there. Don't use american crystal, it tastes completely different. You can kind of think about it like this, the british crystals are a bit more complex toffee while the american crystals are more simple sweet caramel. Theres a bit of burnt sugar/roastiness in the british crystals. You don't have to use much, just 3-7% of the grain bill to start. And let that be your only specialty grain. Don't worry with biscuit or victory malt yet. You should get enough toasty/bready flavors from your base grain. The gambrinus esb malt should be fine if you can't source some maris otter. I think I remember hearing it is traditionally floor-malted and kilned to the slightly darker colors like british base malts.

Second, work on that water profile. There are several sources to calculate mineral additions, beersmith being one, if you have it. I find that if I try to hit the Burton profile exactly, the resulting beer is too minerally. If I add minerals to about half the levels of burton, the beer is much better.

If you do that and use good british style hops (I really like fuggles mixed with my EKG, and bramling cross, challenger, and styrian goldings are also very good in a bitter) and a good british yeast, you'll be making great bitters that while drinking will make you swear you're back at the pub, well almost.:cross:
 
Great advice, KingBrianI.

Thanks again to everyone. I'm feeling really confident that I have a direction to follow, as well as a better handle on the key elements for the style(s).

Further advice and thoughts are certainly welcome and appreciated.

Cheers, HBTers!!!
 
I just tried an appropriately aged bottle of my ESB today, and MMMMMMMM yum. I need to post that recipe up here soon. MO + biscuit = tasty brew.
 
The biscuit/medium crystal/Special Roast addition seems to be the necessary malt direction. Anyone use something like Carapils for body? I noticed that there was a 'thinness' to the bitters that I had in the UK; the handpumping seemed to give the beers some more fullness and creaminess.

Just realised that the last sentence above could be badly taken out of context. ;)
 
Nugent said:
The biscuit/medium crystal/Special Roast addition seems to be the necessary malt direction. Anyone use something like Carapils for body? I noticed that there was a 'thinness' to the bitters that I had in the UK; the handpumping seemed to give the beers some more fullness and creaminess.

Just realised that the last sentence above could be badly taken out of context. ;)
Click to expand...

You could use some dextrin malt if you like. British Carastan malt has some dextrin characteristics but is much darker than the usual CaraPils/CaraFoam malts so you could replace some of the crystal with it. Another possibilty would be to bring the mash temp up a few degrees. :mug:
 
I am experimenting with special B in bitter at the moment. I know it is not a British grain, but an early tasting at 3% of the drist is looking promising for a bitter with a particular caramel flavour. My next batch will probably be at 2%, special B is powerful stuff!

Edit: I just noticed that Monkeydan lives in my hometown.......Made me feel warm and fuzzy for a moment. :)
 
WorryWort said:
I agree with all of this. Unfortunately, we can't easily get Marris Otter in Vancouver. Gambrinus is a very good maltster though, and their ESB is the closest thing we've got at LHBS. (Ordering grains via mail can be a b!tch, in cost and timing. The closest place I know is in Toronto. US web suppliers don't ship here cheaply)
Click to expand...

North American Malting co-op is in Vancouver. They carry Thomas Faucett and Bairds. Both make a variety of English pale malts including Marris Otter.

http://www.northamericanmalt.com/
 
The wyeast 1098 is definitely not the right yeast for a bitter. I've used it twice and both time the beer fermented bone dry with and almost tart like finish. The recommendation of using the 1275 sounds like a great idea. I'm currently fermenting an ESB with the 1968 strain which basically the Fuller strain which is used in the classic english bitter of the same name. We'll see how it turns out.
 
I like the 1968 strain. Sometimes it drops out really quickly and I get a bit of diacetyl with it though. S-04 also seems to work well.
 
mithion said:
The wyeast 1098 is definitely not the right yeast for a bitter. I've used it twice and both time the beer fermented bone dry with and almost tart like finish. The recommendation of using the 1275 sounds like a great idea. I'm currently fermenting an ESB with the 1968 strain which basically the Fuller strain which is used in the classic english bitter of the same name. We'll see how it turns out.
Click to expand...

Having tried a sample of my now-fermented beer when racking to secondary with the 1098, I found it clean, but lacking and, as you said, bone dry. I deliberately used the 1098 for its description of allowing the malt and hops to shine through the yeast esters. At this stage, it has done what it promised to do. I'll report back when I keg/carb it in the next two weeks.

1275 and 1968 are definitely on my list. Does any one use 1318? I've used it for an English IPA, but not a bitter.
 
Yeah, sorry about the ranting about the 1098. I just hate that yeast with a passion. That yeast cost me close to 80$ worth of ingredients and two months of my time for two pretty terrible batches of beer. But in answer to your question, I think both London strands, the 1028 and the 1318 are also good choices for a bitter.
 
mithion said:
Yeah, sorry about the ranting about the 1098. I just hate that yeast with a passion. That yeast cost me close to 80$ worth of ingredients and two months of my time for two pretty terrible batches of beer. But in answer to your question, I think both London strands, the 1028 and the 1318 are also good choices for a bitter.
Click to expand...

No problem. I hate it too when that one thing make a batch "less than memorable", shall we say.

:mug:
 

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