Craigslist Etiquette?

I'm not sure if I ****ed this deal up, or the person selling it, but I do know that the experience left me particularly enraged and in dire need of venting. Here's what happened:

Friday I find this gem.

kegerator for sale - $150 (camarillo)
I have a Summit kegerator that i am looking to sell, it is in very good condition and many parts have been replaced on it. I replaced the compressor, beer lines, valves, faucet, and taps. There is one issue with it, when you turn it on it just keeps running and gets very cold. In all it works it just needs a cheap part to make it work right. All of the most expansive components on the kegerator have been replaced and it comes with a bunch of stuff. Along with the fridge comes two taps (a standard tap and an "S" tap) two Co2 bottles, shelves, two tap handles (ceramic Coors and Pyramid handles), two drip trays, a beer line cleaning kit, a draft beer book, and an empty keg which will save you about $40 on the deposit of a full keg. I am very firm on $150, it comes with a lot of pricey stuff and it is in very good condition. I cant get pictures to upload, but it definitely is worth checking out if you looking for a kegerator.

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I text the guy after he doesn't respond (for several hours) to an email. I don't know why people don't use Craigslist and email together sometimes. It just doesn't make sense to me, but that's another tirade altogether.

So I tell him I want it and offer $160 instead, hoping that offering more than asked will convey my seriousness in this transaction. Great, he says, hit him up after 3 PM on Saturday. Great, I say. I will.

So I text him again just before 4 PM on Saturday and ask him when a good time to roll by is. It just got sold, he says.

:smack:

Oh. Alrighty then, I say.



Realize, I'm just as pissed at myself for getting tied up until nearly 4 PM as I am for this guy not sticking to what seemed like a pretty solid agreement, as far as any Craigslist agreement can go.

No, that's a lie. I'm more pissed at him, whoever he is.

:hs: Camarillo seller-guy. You only get :hs:.

So, let me get this straight. You're butthurt over a non-binding agreement to buy a paste-and-glue kegerator that doesn't even work properly that got sold out from underneath you? I'd consider whoever did buy it, did you a favor if there were that many repairs and it still didn't work properly.

Just my 2 cents. Keep watching craigslist, used kegerators show up on it all the time.

After having sold and given away a few things on CL, I can tell you that I will never hold something for anyone unless they show up with cash first. Too many effing flakes on there. I had some cleaning supplies that I wanted to give away. Some lady called and said she would be by later that evening to pick them up. After three days of no-show, I reposted the ad. Got someone else who called and showed up within 20 minutes. Later that evening, the first lady shows up and gets irate that I gave away "her" stuff.

Not to offend, but if I were that guy, I would probably have done similar. Pick it up now, because I'm not holding it for you.

jmendez29 said:

...Not to offend, but if I were that guy, I would probably have done similar. Pick it up now, because I'm not holding it for you.

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Only issue is that the seller told him to contact him after 3pm on Saturday to organise the pick up. He text within an hour of 3pm and the guy had sold it to someone else.
Saying that as you said, don't expect anything from anyone when dealing with craigslist... i'm not even from the US and I know that just from reading threads like this on here!

That is nothing.

I found 3 corny kegs in the next town over. Contact the guy, we agree on the price, and agree on a time to pick them up (his terms not mine). So a couple days later I drive up there to get them, and call to tell him I am on my way. I get his voice mail. An Hour later I arrive on the edge of his town, and call again to get the final directions, No answer. So I make the best of it and head to the nearby homebrew shop, to kill some time, in case he got hung up at work or something. Eventually I give up and drive 60 Mi back home. 2 Weeks later the ****** calls me up to see if I am still interested in the kegs, and If i would like to come pick them up, he will hold them for me.

I thought I was pissed off the first day, but I was twice as pissed when he called 2 weeks later.

I've been stood up by people on CL too many times. I hold nothing for nobody anymore. First come first serve, and I don't care if you have to call around to friends and family to find a truck/trailer.

The latest thing was with a plush living room set I was trying to get rid of. It was in the garage and I had to rearrange the garage to fit more stuff in, and the set had to go. I moved it out into the driveway and listed it on CL for 150$. It was easily worth twice that. Got a call within an hour, guy said he was going to borrow a trailer and be there first thing in the morning. I waited until 9am before calling, and he says "oh yeah, the wife vetoed it, so I won't be coming by." Great, I could have used that information sooner. Now there's rain on the way. If this stuff gets wet, nobody will want it, even for free, and I'll have to make arrangements to get it to the dump. So I put another ad up in the free section. Getting calls off the hook. I told each person I talked to that I wasn't holding it, and that it was first come first serve, "get it before the rain does" I told them. I talked to 7 people who said "I'm on my way now." Only one showed up.

I've also had things sold out from under me under the pretense that it was being "held" for me.

So, the ettiquette for CL, regardless of any over the phone "agreements" is as follows:
Firs come first serve.
Don't ask the seller to hold anything for you, and don't expect it to be held even if he says so.
Don't tell anybody that you hold anything; they will probably stand you up anyway.
Don't even waste time trying to haggle with people until you go look at what they're selling.
Don't reply to emails that say "is it still available?" - that's a spam bot, and make not of that in your listing - "Don't ask if its still available - if the ad is up, its still available"

Jeebus, a lot of you -- "not to offend" -- lack propriety, or an appreciation of it. It's not as if I've never bought or sold via Craigslist before. I offloaded an apartment full of furniture before driving across country and furnished a new apartment when I got there, both primarily through the very same site.

I've dealt with my share of crazies too, but a seller like this? No. Guy asks me to contact him after 3 to arrange a meet. I do, but it's too late. Yeah, I think that's bad form. This was, mainly, the source of my butthurt, which was -- I thought -- somewhat tongue in cheek, given the accompanying photo of a little girl crying.

The rest of the butthurt comes from me missing out on a profit because Mr. Pants-on-Fire couldn't spot me 60 minutes. Even if that Summit kegerator has been partially blown up, covered in rust, and held together with duct tape, I could have stripped it down and sold all the included parts for triple what he was asking.

Again... damn, let a guy rant a little, eh?

Oh trust me I feel your pain. I'd be pissed too. But learn from it. I'd say 75% of the promises made on CL aren't worth the cell minutes spent to make them.

Where I live brewing related stuff is sort of odd. Stuff seems to be more expensive or a couple percent less than brand new at the LHBS. If you want to get rid of stuff, price it like you do. In the same note, I scored $5 cases of 22oz bottles which was a very fair deal. Picked up 10 cases. Sorry to the guys selling used bottles for $14 because the LHBS sells them for $15....

A plus when picking up the bottles was to see this guy's set up. A couple thousand of AG working hard.

I totally agree on the lack of email usage for 90% of CL users.

It makes no sense. You had to go online to post your ad, so reply to the obfuscated email. If you didn't want to bother with email in the first place, you should've posted in the PennySaver.

novafire said:

I totally agree on the lack of email usage for 90% of CL users.

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Big_Blue said:

It makes no sense. You had to go online to post your ad, so reply to the obfuscated email. If you didn't want to bother with email in the first place, you should've posted in the PennySaver.

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The assumption you are making is that a upon posting to CL, sits at home clicking the refresh button on his email every 2-3 seconds until he get a buyer on the hook.

As a seller of stuff on CL, I've got places to go too.

Big_Blue said:

The rest of the butthurt comes from me missing out on a profit because Mr. Pants-on-Fire couldn't spot me 60 minutes. Even if that Summit kegerator has been partially blown up, covered in rust, and held together with duct tape, I could have stripped it down and sold all the included parts for triple what he was asking.

Again... damn, let a guy rant a little, eh?

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Maybe you should offered more, if it was worth that much to you (or you could have sold it for triple what you paid).

My rules for selling on CL: assuming they are offering the same amount of $, whoever gets there first gets the deal. I don't always let them know there are other people interested, either. Just because I'm emailing you doesn't mean I'm ignoring all of the other emails from people expressing interest.

Which leads me to my second rule: If buying, always assume somebody else is interested, and act accordingly....offer more if its worth that much to you, get over there ASAP if its worth that much to you.

Which leads me to my third rule: the more money you offer the more crazy I'm willing to put up with. Can't low-ball me and expect me to deliver it, wait all weekend, etc. See rule #1.

White girl problems.

People are complete flakes on CL. Again, kegerators come up all the time, so keep watching the interwebz. Even if it's just for the component parts, you can make your own kegerator with the right sized mini fridge or drop freezer.

I used to be more lenient on holding stuff and waiting on people, but now if I'm selling something, it's by my rules. First person with cash gets the deal. And you can come during the time that I'm home, not the other way around. I don't stay home for someone in the hops that he'll show up.

I've just had too many no-shows. One guy was wanting to buy a $50 tow-bar from me. He made 5 appointments to pick it up, and every time, he didn't. I quit replying to his emails and to his text msgs.

If I'm the buyer, I give the seller a phone call before I'm headed over, in case he sold it from underneath me.

MC

broadbill said:

The assumption you are making is that a upon posting to CL, sits at home clicking the refresh button on his email every 2-3 seconds until he get a buyer on the hook.

As a seller of stuff on CL, I've got places to go too.

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It's 2013. Get a phone with email capability.

broadbill said:

Maybe you should offered more, if it was worth that much to you (or you could have sold it for triple what you paid).

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I offered $10 more, sight unseen. No much, but it's worth a bonus six pack. I think the might warrant waiting a full hour after "sometime after 3" begins. I was up and out at 7am and and would've gone after it if that time frame was given to me.

My rules for selling on CL: assuming they are offering the same amount of $, whoever gets there first gets the deal. I don't always let them know there are other people interested, either. Just because I'm emailing you doesn't mean I'm ignoring all of the other emails from people expressing interest.

Which leads me to my second rule: If buying, always assume somebody else is interested, and act accordingly....offer more if its worth that much to you, get over there ASAP if its worth that much to you.

Which leads me to my third rule: the more money you offer the more crazy I'm willing to put up with. Can't low-ball me and expect me to deliver it, wait all weekend, etc. See rule #1.

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I don't see where the crazy came into play here, or lowballing. What I'm describing may not have been entirely unwarranted, but it was a dick move nonetheless.

Just curious about your rules, how are you entertaining all these emails when you've got all these places to go?

Big_Blue said:

I offered $10 more, sight unseen. No much, but it's worth a bonus six pack. I think the might warrant waiting a full hour after "sometime after 3" begins. I was up and out at 7am and and would've gone after it if that time frame was given to me.

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See rule about low-ball... $10 on $150 for equipment being offered at a steal (you said it was worth triple what you were paying) would not have moved the needle for me at all, if I was the seller.

Big_Blue said:

Just curious about your rules, how are you entertaining all these emails when you've got all these places to go?

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I'm not entertaining them...I pick one and go with it...ignore the rest (they'll figure you they aren't getting it). If there is alot of interest I will email 2-3 and tell them they are in line; make your best offer.

More than one asked for is a boon, no matter how much more. Nearly everyone tries to lower the cost on Craigslist; you've sold, you know that. The triple worth factor comes into play if said item could have been fixed, which I was willing to do. If it wasn't, I was willing to break it down and sell everything off, which is work in and of itself, work that this guy was clearly not willing to do. Craigslist is a way to offload **** you don't need for what you figure is a fair price. If someone is willing to come pick up your ****, and toss you some extra bucks in the process, you can allot at least a 60 minute window, especially when you're the one narrowing it (and you've already all but confirmed an exact time via texts the night before). If that's too long for you, fine. You're still an impatient prick for thinking it.

Big_Blue said:

More than one asked for is a boon, no matter how much more. Nearly everyone tries to lower the cost on Craigslist; you've sold, you know that. The triple worth factor comes into play if said item could have been fixed, which I was willing to do. If it wasn't, I was willing to break it down and sell everything off, which is work in and of itself, work that this guy was clearly not willing to do. Craigslist is a way to offload **** you don't need for what you figure is a fair price. If someone is willing to come pick up your ****, and toss you some extra bucks in the process, you can allot at least a 60 minute window, especially when you're the one narrowing it (and you've already all but confirmed an exact time via texts the night before). If that's too long for you, fine. You're still an impatient prick for thinking it.

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meh...I may be a prick, but at least I have a kegerator.

big blue you got screwed. other folks defending the sellers crappy ethics are part of the instant gratification movement in this country. they screwed you over so you should take it and realize that "hey, its cl". people have lost their decency and don't care about another persons time or efforts. doesnt make it right when someone promises one thing and does something else. thats called BS and at a better time in this country that person would have to pay up with an asswhoopin for acting like that. now they just hide behind the internet. they got theirs, so screw you.

i have a kegerator too, but i am not a prick, because i try to keep my word, even to total strangers.

I think somebody offered the seller $200, and he waited until he had money in hand before canceling the deal with OP.

GarageDweller said:

big blue you got screwed. other folks defending the sellers crappy ethics are part of the instant gratification movement in this country. they screwed you over so you should take it and realize that "hey, its cl". people have lost their decency and don't care about another persons time or efforts. doesnt make it right when someone promises one thing and does something else. thats called BS and at a better time in this country that person would have to pay up with an asswhoopin for acting like that. now they just hide behind the internet. they got theirs, so screw you.

i have a kegerator too, but i am not a prick, because i try to keep my word, even to total strangers.

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Of course he got screwed. But a deal ain't a deal until money changes hands....until then we are just talking. Blue could have just have easily flaked out on the 4PM meeting as the seller decided to do the deal with the person standing there with cash in his hand.

As for being a prick, I've sold a number of things on CL where the buyer asked me to hold it and they took their sweet time getting over to my place. It came down to how they sounded over the phone/email and a if I thought I could trust them to follow through. Sometimes I decide not to hold it as they sound too flaky.

Maybe blue just didn't impress the guy enough with his offer.

This thread is the reason why I only buy hookers off craigslist, people can keep their damn junk...

dstranger99 said:

This thread is the reason why I only buy hookers off craigslist, people can keep their damn junk...

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I should probably follow that example.

GarageDweller said:

big blue you got screwed. other folks defending the sellers crappy ethics are part of the instant gratification movement in this country. they screwed you over so you should take it and realize that "hey, its cl". people have lost their decency and don't care about another persons time or efforts. doesnt make it right when someone promises one thing and does something else. thats called BS and at a better time in this country that person would have to pay up with an asswhoopin for acting like that. now they just hide behind the internet. they got theirs, so screw you.

i have a kegerator too, but i am not a prick, because i try to keep my word, even to total strangers.

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That's exactly what I was trying to convey: dismay/rage because it's come to this. Your word is you word, I said I'd buy it, he said he'd sell it. I had not missed the timeframe given.

But, whatever, I'm over it. Mostly. I already have a working kegerator I built and an easy design deal just popped up that'll make up the money I "lost."

broadbill said:

As for being a prick, I've sold a number of things on CL where the buyer asked me to hold it and they took their sweet time getting over to my place. It came down to how they sounded over the phone/email and a if I thought I could trust them to follow through. Sometimes I decide not to hold it as they sound too flaky.

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I get that. I've done it too -- but always emailed them when it did sell. I don't see how I could be taken as "flaky" as I've never flaked out over a deal. Dude was a dick, is all. Whatcha gonna do besides rant on a homebrew forum?

On a side note, I found this:

kegerator (oxnard)
i want to trade this 3 tap kegerator for an electronic device or anything thats pretty useful. please email if you have any questions.

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I had to email to find out.

For CL free, I just put it out front and end the ad with "emails or other inquiries will be ignored, the item is at my_address, if you want it come and get it" and it always disappears. I just gave away an old cheap vinyl pool *covered* with algae this weekend and even that disappeared by the end of the day. The best is the people that respond to a free ad asking for you to deliver to them...

If i'm selling something, I don't hold for anyone and always price in multiples of $20 because if you are asking $30 or $50, they will inevitably show up with only $20 or $40 "because the ATM only gives $20s"

There are some variations from state to state, but an agreement is generally binding whether it's verbal or written. Those that say it isn't final until the deal actually takes place are wrong. If two parties agree to exchange goods for legal tender, it is binding.

That being said, if the agreement is verbal, you have to have some sort of proof, or both parties would have to admit before a judge that the agreement took place. Also, the vast majority of dealings on CL aren't worth taking to someone to court over. Especially a $150 keggerator.

In this case, it would probably be difficult to say that the two had an actual agreement, since Big Blue said "I'll offer you $X" and the seller only responded vaguely, at least from Blue's description.

Just curious, how do most of you sellers go about discerning the real inquiries from the spam/fake/serial killers? I'm trying to sell a kitchen table and so far I have no idea (except for one obvious scammer) who is for real and who isn't. I really don't want to give out my address to someone who's going to come to my house and rob it while I'm at work.

^ Don't send your money to Nigeria and meet somewhere besides your house. Poosibly your neighbor you don't likes driveway.

Upthewazzu said:

Just curious, how do most of you sellers go about discerning the real inquiries from the spam/fake/serial killers? I'm trying to sell a kitchen table and so far I have no idea (except for one obvious scammer) who is for real and who isn't. I really don't want to give out my address to someone who's going to come to my house and rob it while I'm at work.

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Only respond to emails that restate what the item is or that do not have a local phone number, or it is probably spam.
Don't take pictures of it in your house.
Don't show it to them in your house or in the garage.
Put the table outside before they come and meet them outside.

Also, emails with ghetto speak go right in the trash.

SpentGrains said:

Only respond to emails that restate what the item is or that do not have a local phone number, or it is probably spam.
Don't take pictures of it in your house.
Don't show it to them in your house or in the garage.
Put the table outside before they come and meet them outside.

Also, emails with ghetto speak go right in the trash.

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This is sound advice.

Oh... and give a fellow a reasonable window before selling to someone else.

Big_Blue said:

This is sound advice.

Oh... and give a fellow a reasonable window before selling to someone else.

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Just sold a toddler bed. I loaded it up, took it to a highly populated place (Walmart). Would not show anything at my house unless I absolutely could not move it.

I dont have anything in my house that millons of other americans dont have in theirs. I dont see how sombody seeing inside of it is going to give them an edge on robbing the place. All of the stuff is where everybody else keeps there their stuff.

Also, why would they go through the hassle of answering an ad, faking a meeting, etc? If they want to rob the place they could just break in.

Lastly, selling stuff on CL does exactly scream "moneybags" to a potential thief...

broadbill said:

I dont have anything in my house that millons of other americans dont have in theirs. I dont see how sombody seeing inside of it is going to give them an edge on robbing the place. All of the stuff is where everybody else keeps there their stuff.

Also, why would they go through the hassle of answering an ad, faking a meeting, etc? If they want to rob the place they could just break in.

Lastly, selling stuff on CL does exactly scream "moneybags" to a potential thief...

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Depends on what kind of stuff you have... And people have done much more than "answering an ad" and "faking a meeting" to do some sort of terrible act.

I meet/work with members of society every day, 98% being complete strangers. There are a lot of strange human beings in the world, and the less they know about me the better. It is not my belongings that I worry about as much as the safety of my family. Just my 2 cents.

mccumath said:

Depends on what kind of stuff you have... And people have done much more than "answering an ad" and "faking a meeting" to do some sort of terrible act.

I meet/work with members of society every day, 98% being complete strangers. There are a lot of strange human beings in the world, and the less they know about me the better. It is not my belongings that I worry about as much as the safety of my family. Just my 2 cents.

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The world must be a scary place for you.

Lemme tell yall about my flaky experience with Free Cycle.

We had two queen size metal bed frames, boxes and mattresses to give away, for free. Everything on Free Cycle must be free. It's a cool idea. Goodwill wouldn't take them. Something about not having the resources to resell mattresses. The local church didn't want them either.

So I post on Free Cycle. It was no time before some sketchy sounding chic called. All strung out sounding and just generally weird. And kinda wired. But hey, if she can get these things outta my way, she can be as sketchy as she wants. She'll pick up tomorrow. Needs one for her and one for her kid. Great. Then the next day. Then no word. Then that Saturday. And her messages were like she was holding two conversations at once. I'm not sure if they were with actual different people. I called her back each time and got her voice mail. Now it's next Monday. I've told people it was taken all this time too.

Next woman who calls, I tell her come and get it. She and her husband and kid show up that evening. In a van. Loaded with stuff. I mean, sat down on the shocks, hardly room to sit in it loaded. Toys, pots, pans, boxes, clothes. I dunno. Were they Free Cycle hoarders? Their plan was to put the frames in the van and strap the two boxes and two mattresses to the top of the van. Now, imagine the height of these four items, on top a van. We had to use a ladder to stack them. They cinched them down with straps hooked to the bottom of the van's body. It was a road hazard if I ever saw one. They nearly lost it twice going down the road out the neighborhood. I told my wife we'd have to watch the news to see if anyone was wiped out on the highway by errant bedding. That almost happened to me once. I didn't hear about it, so i guess they made it okay.

Never did hear from sketchy chic again.

But this van. Seriously. It could have been an episode of Hoarders all by itself. They had to be getting gallons per mile loaded down like that.

broadbill said:

The world must be a scary place for you.

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Not as much as it might sound. I just don't trust random strangers that want to buy stuff from me on Craigslist. Better safe than sorry.

You buy and sell on Craigslist the way you like, and I will do it the way I like. Most likely, it will work out fine for both of us, don't you think? Just figured I would offer up a little advice on how I prefer to do business on Craigslist.