Magnum/Maris SMaSH

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JacobInIndy

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I did a little searching and couldn't find quite what I was looking, but was wondering about Magnum hops. The only thing I can find about them is they are good for bittering and fairly clean.

I'm planning a SMaSH with it.
Here's the basic recipe:

3 gal batch

7lbs MO(2 of it toasted, 275 for 30 mins)
.5 oz magnum 60
.25 oz magnum 45
.25 oz Magnum 30
Notty yeast rehydrated

It comes In at about 70 Ibu's. Am I making hop water here? Has anyone made a MO/Magnum SMaSH?
 
I use them for bittering only...can't say I am all that impressed with their aroma or flavor properties (especially considering all the hops w/ great character for those roles). That's a whole lot of IBUs you're throwing in there....
 
I use them for bittering only...can't say I am all that impressed with their aroma or flavor properties (especially considering all the hops w/ great character for those roles). That's a whole lot of IBUs you're throwing in there....

That's my concern. Will toasting the MO and mashing high produce enough malty flavor to balance? Or should I just scale back the Magnum?

I also have a 1/4oz of Cascade, but then it's no longer a SMaSH, obviously. But if the beer will be considerably better, I will use it for flavor/aroma.
 
That does sound overly hoppy for a hop that may not taste that good...In fact it's way out there for a 1.038 beer...if you want to get a better idead of the flavor profile bring it between 20 and 30 ibus...

Ignore the dot on this chart (it's BM's outerlimit's IPA) and look where the ibu/OG range for a beer at your grav would be. Extra hoppy for you would be in the high 30's. At 70 you are off the chart with to malt to back you up...even toasted.

8366d1225904648-bms-outer-limits-ipa-outerlimits_chart.jpg
 
Look a little better? I know it's no longer a SMaSH, but I want good beer more than I really want to see how not good Magnum hops can be.

Type: All grain
Size: 3.5 gallons
Yeast: Nottingham, rehydrated
Color: 5 HCU (~5 SRM)
Bitterness: 33 IBU
Boil volume SG 1.044 @ 4.25 gallons
OG: 1.053
FG: 1.012
Alcohol: 5.3% v/v (4.2% w/w)
Grain: 7 lb. British pale
Mash: 70% efficiency

Hops:
.25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 60 min.)
.125 oz. Cascade (6% AA, 45 min.)
.125 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 30 min.)
.125 oz. Cascade (6% AA, 15 min.)

I'm still planning on toasting 2lbs of the MO @275 for 30 minutes. Wait, does toasting the MO remove the enzymes?
 
i say move the 45 and 30 min additions to 10 and 5 or 5 and 0, you will get more hop flavor and aroma and less bitterness. just my 2 cents
 
i say move the 45 and 30 min additions to 10 and 5 or 5 and 0, you will get more hop flavor and aroma and less bitterness. just my 2 cents

Yeah, it might be easier for you than measuring out.125th of an ounce (al if you have a gram scale convert that to grams for ease of measuring anything that tiny.)
 
Alright, revised recipe...thanks everyone for the input. I'm still not sure about the toasting of the MO. I have 7lbs of grain and I'm toasting one lb. Will it lower my gravity if I toast a lb?

Type: All grain
Size: 3.5 gallons
Color: 4 HCU (~4 SRM)
Bitterness: 30 IBU
Boil volume SG 1.038 4.25 gallons
OG: 1.046
FG: 1.012
Alcohol: 4.3% v/v (3.4% w/w)
Grain: 6 lb. British pale(7lbs total, one lb toasted)
Mash: 70% efficiency

Hops:
.25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 60 min.)
.1 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 45 min.)
.25 oz. Cascade (6% AA, 5 min.)
 
I wouldn't toast on the first SMaSH...because you want to taste each ingredient unaltered the first time (and I got yelled at in my Smash thread for wanting to do the same thing)...Most people who smash mess with things like toasting or even oaking after the first one...


But why are you adding cascade? it's not a SMASH if it's got more than 1 hop...you won't know the flavor/aroma potential of the magnum if you cover it with cascade...I personally would stick with smashing JUST the single hop and un toasted grain...

Sorry to send you back to the drawing board...(uoi could just tell us to f off and do what you want)

:D
 
I wouldn't toast on the first SMaSH...because you want to taste each ingredient unaltered the first time (and I got yelled at in my Smash thread for wanting to do the same thing)...Most people who smash mess with things like toasting or even oaking after the first one...


But why are you adding cascade? it's not a SMASH if it's got more than 1 hop...you won't know the flavor/aroma potential of the magnum if you cover it with cascade...I personally would stick with smashing JUST the single hop and un toasted grain...

Sorry to send you back to the drawing board...(uoi could just tell us to f off and do what you want)

:D


No way! This is why I come here. I'm new to the world of All Grain, so I need the feedback. So no toasting and stick with the magnum. I shall do just that.

Type: All grain
Grain: 7 lb. British pale
Boil Volume: SG 1.044 4.25 gallons
Batch Size: 3.5 gallons
Mash: 70% efficiency
Color: 5 HCU (~5 SRM)
Bitterness: 33 IBU
OG: 1.053
FG: 1.012
Alcohol: 5.3% v/v (4.2% w/w)

Hops: .25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 60 min.)
.25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 15 min.)
.25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 5 min.)

This puts me just into the "Slightly Hoppy" section of the Gravity/Hops ratio chart. Sound good?
 
No way! This is why I come here. I'm new to the world of All Grain, so I need the feedback. So no toasting and stick with the magnum. I shall do just that.

Type: All grain
Grain: 7 lb. British pale
Boil Volume: SG 1.044 4.25 gallons
Batch Size: 3.5 gallons
Mash: 70% efficiency
Color: 5 HCU (~5 SRM)
Bitterness: 33 IBU
OG: 1.053
FG: 1.012
Alcohol: 5.3% v/v (4.2% w/w)

Hops: .25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 60 min.)
.25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 15 min.)
.25 oz. Magnum (13.4% AA, 5 min.)

This puts me just into the "Slightly Hoppy" section of the Gravity/Hops ratio chart. Sound good?

That is exactly what I would do...slightly hoppy...:mug:

I did a Marris Otter/Argentinian Cascade Smash last week....Not many people have used that hop yet (I did something this summebr with it and lime zest and the lime kinda overpowered it) so I wanted to have a reference when people asked about using Argentinian Cascade.
 
It's your choice but I wouldn't brew that w/ magnum. I'd pick a hop w/ better aroma and flavor characteristics however, if that's how you roll, rock on.
 
Are you just trying to see if Magnum will be a suitable hop for you to use as flavoring and aroma? The idea behind the production of the super high alpha acid hops was to get more bang for the buck as far as the per ounce bittering. They weren't really designed to be great for later additions.

Having said that - I think your recipe is pretty good for trying to get an idea of the flavor of magnum. My best guess is that you will have a moderately bitter beer with little hop flavor/aroma.
 
Are you just trying to see if Magnum will be a suitable hop for you to use as flavoring and aroma? The idea behind the production of the super high alpha acid hops was to get more bang for the buck as far as the per ounce bittering. They weren't really designed to be great for later additions.

Having said that - I think your recipe is pretty good for trying to get an idea of the flavor of magnum. My best guess is that you will have a moderately bitter beer with little hop flavor/aroma.


Yes, my goal was to see what flavors I could get from the hop. I posted the question to see if anyone had done a Magnum SmaSH before.

I'll do it:rockin:...check back for updates on this hop's flavoring abilities(or total lack thereof).
 
Alright, after bottling this on accident on Jan 19(meant to bottle the other Pale Ale I had in the fermenter next to it...doh!) this has now been bottled for only two weeks.

Even after only two weeks, this is remarkably good. I'm not going to lie, there isn't much complexity, just a nicely balanced malt sweetness and hops bitterness...very simple--but it is great. this hop is SUPER CLEAN for bittering. Not harsh at all.

No real reason to this post other than to let everyone know that Magnum and Maris Otter is an acceptable SMaSH combo.
 

Hello everybody,
I'm resuming this thread because I want to try the same experiment with an extra variable: my own grown magnum hops. I obviously don't have the alpha acid percentage and I still don't know how many of them I have (I will pick the flowers from the plant right during the brewing process).

Let's just suppose I have "enough", I would use them in this way:
15gr over 60mins (14,5/19,8 IBUs)
20gr over 15mins (9,6/13,1 IBUs)
20gr over 5mins (3,9/5,3 IBUs)
OG 1053
mash temp 66°C
25,5 liters batch
total IBUs: 28,0/38,2
the IBUs are a min/MAX Tinseth value calculated at 11%/15% alpha acid (range in which I suppose my hops will be).

The grams expressed above are the dried weight obtained weighting the actual crop and dividing by 6.

And now the options:
  • If the crop will be few grams more, I will put that on the 5mins drop.
  • If I have a lot more I will store them.
  • If I have less, I cannot scale down the batch (first because I will crush the grains the day before, second because it's too dangerous for me to keep the crushed grains around because I'm allergic to grain powder (yes, how strange can life be?)), so I will use some "standard" cascade hops to up the IBUs.

I'm aiming at 28/38 IBUs to keep it a bit hoppier: if it's low in IBUs I cannot do nothing. If it's high I can age it a bit longer as IBUs tend to get down in time (and I like hoppy beers :) ).

Water profile: something with a balanced chloride to sulfate ratio? Rising sulfate to let the hop shine a bit more?

I hope I've been clear enough, I was hoping in any kind of suggestion. Brewday is supposed to be in 5 days (next saturday) if the hops are ready to be harvested.

Cheers from Italy! :mug:
Piteko
 
Wow! No comments nor suggestions at all? :)
Brewday tomorrow...

Cheers!
Piteko
 
Revvy said:
you won't know the flavor/aroma potential of the magnum if you cover it with cascade...

You won't know it if you don't use the cascade, either =)

Magnum is about as boring and lacking in interesting hop oils as you can get. Could still be a fun experiment, though.
 
You won't know it if you don't use the cascade, either =)

LOL :D


Magnum is about as boring and lacking in interesting hop oils as you can get. Could still be a fun experiment, though.

I'll let you know how the final product is. The fresh hops smelled quite fragrant and the wort was interesting. We'll see... :)

Cheers from Italy! :mug:
Piteko
 
Any particular reason you want to SMaSH with magnum? Just a learning experience? Magnum is known as a really weak flavor hop and is rarely used for anything other than bittering.
 
Any particular reason you want to SMaSH with magnum? Just a learning experience? Magnum is known as a really weak flavor hop and is rarely used for anything other than bittering.

I don't know the reason for the original poster. Mine is that I have 4 hop plants (of different varieties) and the only one that this year produced enogh hops was magnum. I wanted to make a brew with my hops, I had only magnum, that's how I came across this thread. :)

I'm also a big fan of columbus and I made two beers using only that bittering hop. I was surprised by the result so I didn't have any particular prejudice for this kind of test :)

Cheers from Italy! :mug:
Piteko
 
Columbus most certainly is not just a bittering hop though. It's one of the dominant flavor and aroma hops in american IPA.
 
Columbus most certainly is not just a bittering hop though. It's one of the dominant flavor and aroma hops in american IPA.

I totally agree with you. What I was trying to say is that whenever you read the description of columbus, it's always defined as a bitterness hop. I never saw it described as a dual purpose hop, like here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_hop_varieties#Columbus

So, if I never saw it described like a dual purpose but I always used it that way (sometimes even for dry hopping), I thougth I could give the same chance to a wet magnum hop which, even if with low aroma compounds, should preserve more aroma (since it's just harvested).

Cheers from Italy! :mug:
Piteko
 
You won't know it if you don't use the cascade, either =)

Magnum is about as boring and lacking in interesting hop oils as you can get. Could still be a fun experiment, though.

So, here is my feedback.
The experiment went fine, but nothing more.

Base malt gives the backbone to the hop to shine, except that there isn't so much there to shine :D
The average bitterness math went well, the beer is balanced.

The principal characteristics of this beer are: grassy, a bit spicy, oily. Maybe too much "fresh" aroma from the fresh hops than I expected. I could give it a 6,5 over 10, which means I will enjoy the results of the experiment but I won't repeat it again.

Cheers from Italy! :mug:
Piteko
 
Looks great! At some point I'll have to take a stab at growing hops.

If you do it for the sake of the experimentation, go for it!
Otherwise:
- it's not easy to grow: the plant is very strong, to the point that you must worry for the other plants surrounding it, but it's subject to many diseases that can compromise the harvest;
- during the summertime it requests A LOT of water, which means you need an irrigation system or something similar (like your mother that comes daily to your house for your 4 plants while you are on vacation :D ).

I have it on my balcony because it helps me covering from the ugly building I have in front of my house with the side effect that it's cool saying to your friends you grow hops, nothing more :)

Cheers from Italy!
Piteko
 
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