Yeast Washing Illustrated

Using this very method, I "washed" (rinsed? scrubbed? apologies to everyone to whom the terms matter) the Wyeast Fat Tire yeast that a fellow homebrewer mailed me back in '08. I made a batch then and saved it just like the first post in this thread outlines.

It's been sitting there since Oct 2008 and last week, using all 3 jars I had to give myself the best possible chance of it taking off, it worked! I got a nice, frothy starter! It took 2 days, and I was nervous and getting sadder by the hour, but it took off!!! Yay!

So there's your answer to "how long does this last" - about 3 years!

And it still smells just perfect. I may have altered the strain a bit, selecting for the heartier of the breed, but it smells absolutely perfect - it has that nice, malty breadiness of Fat Tire that I remember. YUM.

Here's what my belgium washed yeast looks like after 4 months or so.



What do you think? Whats the yeast layer and whats the other layer?

Was that taken from a primary? I'd bet you have a layer of napping yeast, and a layer of dead ones mixed w/ sundry trub...

my mason jars never have that much in the bottom! I'm lucky to have 1/4" of yeasties in the bottom, but they always work like a charm anyways!

Well i've used the trub at the bottom of my primary 4 times after racking. So after all 4 beers, i wanted to keep the yeast so i did the washing process but i scrapped the bottom of my plastic fermentor and got this much yeast soo thats why i have so much at the bottom. It's in my fridge since then.

nice! you're my new hero - racked on those bad boys four times!! heheh.

Yeah i bought 4 brewferm kit that would be better with belgium yeast so

After reading a lot of this thread I decided to try my hand at yeast rinsing (or washing...). I bottled yesterday with 4 quart jars filled with boiled cooled water at the ready. Once my bottles were full and capped I tossed the water over the yeast cake, gave it a swirl and filled all 4 jars. After tightening down the lids I place them in the fridge. The yeast has settled as did the trub at the bottom. There's also a bunch of beer-colored liquid taking up the majority of the jar space.

My question is what should I do to ready a pit h of yeast? I think I should decant off the beer-colored liquid, add more boiled and cooled water, let settle for 20 min and pour off the yeast-filled water. Then pitch this into my newly brewed wort. Sound good?

Just decant most of the liquid from the mason jar, swirl it to get the yeast into suspension, and pitch the slurry into your wort or starter. I recommend making a starter for every batch, especially with washed yeast that's been in the fridge for a while.

bigbeergeek said:

just decant most of the liquid from the mason jar, swirl it to get the yeast into suspension, and pitch the slurry into your wort or starter. I recommend making a starter for every batch, especially with washed yeast that's been in the fridge for a while.

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+1

I'm slowly climbing (or perhaps descending) the ladder of laziness. Last night, instead of following this yeast *****ing procedure, I just swirled up the trub remaining in my primary and poured it into isopropyl alcohol-sterilized mason jars. Labelled, and popped em in the fridge.

Problems I can forsee;

1. A little fermentation still trying to happen, warping the lid and breaking the seal

2. The extra trub and sediment (the dead detrious) spoiling everything in the jar. Hopefully storage in the fridge would slow this?

I only tried this cause I also have a separate "starter" of the yeast that I'm culturing specifically for storage.

Anyone with experience or thoughts on my laziness???

Yeah Wheeled Goat that is what I usually do too. I don't add water, just swirl up the yeast with the excess beer and dump it into a sanitized container. I can't tell the difference between the trub and the yeast anyways.

I think what the original post is suggesting is after adding the one gallon plus the 4 jars of water, swirling it up, letting it settle for a bit and only collecting one gallon off of that, then decanting into the 4 jars after the one gallon settles a bit you will have mostly yeast and less trub, which was left at the bottom of the carboy with the other 4 pints of water you dumped in. I can see this being a smart idea. You will then have 4 jars of yeast that you will be able to make a starter with then pitch into a full 5 gal batch.

Unwashed yeast cakes don't last long in the fridge in my experience. The literature ("Yeast") suggests keeping unwashed yeast for up to a week. I tried to save an unwashed cake for 3 months and it was completely dead when I tried to revive it on my stirplate with 1.030 wort. So if you expect to brew within a week, go for it. But if you want to store yeast for months and months without worry, wash it. It only takes 30-40 minutes (during which you can walk away and do whatever you want) if you have some boiled, canned water just sitting in the back of your fridge.

bigbeergeek said:

Unwashed yeast cakes don't last long in the fridge in my experience. The literature ("Yeast") suggests keeping unwashed yeast for up to a week. I tried to save an unwashed cake for 3 months and it was completely dead when I tried to revive it on my stirplate with 1.030 wort. So if you expect to brew within a week, go for it. But if you want to store yeast for months and months without worry, wash it. It only takes 30-40 minutes (during which you can walk away and do whatever you want) if you have some boiled, canned water just sitting in the back of your fridge.

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I am wondering why this is true...is there something chemical in the bottom of the fermenter that kills the yeast ??

Some of my yeast froze in my fridge. They were too far towards the back and are now frozen. I was going to feed them fresh wort today in order to pitch them tomorrow (brew day). How is their current frozen state going to impact their viability?

Hopleaf11 said:

Some of my yeast froze in my fridge. They were too far towards the back and are now frozen. I was going to feed them fresh wort today in order to pitch them tomorrow (brew day). How is their current frozen state going to impact their viability?

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To quote the guide to making a frozen yeast bank: "Yeast can recover from sub-zero temperatures, but frozen water can kill them. Frozen water crystallizes and can puncture yeast cell walls, but two things can be done to prevent this. First, use a small volume of water (hence the small vials) and leave a bit of room for expansion. Second, a bit of glycerine, also known as glycerol (but NOT glycol!!) helps prevent freeze damage. I buy glycerine from my LHBS or pharmacy. Just be sure to get the type that is safe to ingest (it is harmless at these quantities)."

I hope this helps.

In other words, you're effed.

bigbeergeek said:

In other words, you're effed.

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Well I'm not effed. I did say some of my yeast froze. There's still plenty to work with. Just made a starter using one jar that wasn't frozen and one that was. Gonna see what happens.

Just kidding friend. Best of luck, let us know how it goes.

Glad I read this post on how to wash yeast. I pulled a wheat out of primary yesterday and using these tips saved some time and made the final product better. I had done it 3 previous times, but there were some tips in here that definitely improved my process.

bigbeergeek said:

Just kidding friend. Best of luck, let us know how it goes.

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The starter took off. Pitched it into a porter this morning. Probably what saved it was the jar that wasn't frozen. Lesson learned. I'll definitely try the process again.

bigbeergeek said:

In other words, you're effed.

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LOL!

I'm glad things turned out well for ya - beergeek's comment just broke me up is all...

Bernie Brewer said:

All that's left to do is label the jars and put them in the fridge. Then when it's time to make a starter, you just pull one out, let it warm to room temp, and decant most of the liquid out of the jar, give the rest a good shake, and pitch it into your starter..

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After putting them in pint jars, how soon can I start making a starter? Just a couple hours, probably?

I would think you could use it for a starter immediately. No reason to chill it for a few hours just to bring it right back to room temp. If I was going to use it immediately, I'd just pitch the whole jar in the starter instead of cold crashing and decanting off the clear liquid.

I may have missed this part?

BB info says to pour the 4 boiled n cooled jars into the carboy.And swirl.

Do you also pour the large jar filled with the same water into the carboy, Or just the 4 pints? Im going to rack my brown Ale tonite, and wanta wash the yeast.

Did this a week or so ago and got alot of trub into my mason jars.

Also, is the 20 minutes the most time to wait, or watch and look to see if most of the trub has fallen 1st? Maybe longer than 20 minutes?

A couple questions from someone who hasn't washed yeast before...

1) Are there any issues from washing yeast from a high gravity beer? I was just concerned the yeast could be too stressed from fermenting a 9%+ ABV beer.

2) How many yeast cells would you say you'd end up with in one of the pint sized mason jars? I know the typical Wyeast Smack Pack has about 100 billion, so would one jar of washed yeast start with a similar cell count? A lot of the recipes I've made already require 200-400 billion cells, so I want to make sure I have the correct pitching rates.

Has anyone tried washing mead yeast this way?

Dumb question..... How do you get the hops and other trub out of the yeast? Or is this somehting you should note be worried about?

stompbox said:

Dumb question..... How do you get the hops and other trub out of the yeast? Or is this somehting you should note be worried about?

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When you wash the yeast you add the sterilized water in the beginning then swirl it up ........ what settles out in that first 30 minutes is the heavier trub and hop material. This leaves the yeast still in suspension for you to harvest.

cmoon said:

Thought I'd contribute the dumbest thing to this thread: Living in the San Fernando Valley, I don't even know where to buy mason jars. We're just far too detached from the 20th century to bother with anything like canning.

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You don't have to use Mason jars. That said if you care to find them you may be in a similar situation as the stores (grocery or otherwise) do not carry them at non-canning times of the season. *IF* you have one you might find them at a farmer's supply (like Co-op or Tractor Supply for examples). Alternatively if you're heart is set on Mason style jars there are a variety of options out there. For one it appears that Wal-Mart (assuming you have one, doesn't everyone? ) has a generic line of salsa that they keep in Mason jars (I haven't tested the lids on these but they look right. They're also etched with deep "Mason" on the jars themselves.) which for some damn reason isn't kept with their Generic salsa (Pace clones) options but rather on the top shelf. They come in Black Bean & Corn and a Chili Lime and are much nicer than the other options imo and strangely are also cheaper per ounce. Alternatively if you don't have a Wal-Mart there is a spaghetti sauce that costs about the same as comparable level spaghetti sauces (~$2-2.50/jar) that comes in a "Mason" jar (and etched with the name as well). I've tested these personally and can confirm for you that standard rings and lids will fit these. Or like some have done on here you could use just about any container although glass seems to be the favorite regardless of source as long as you clean it well and sanitize.

bigbeergeek said:

Unwashed yeast cakes don't last long in the fridge in my experience. The literature ("Yeast") suggests keeping unwashed yeast for up to a week. I tried to save an unwashed cake for 3 months and it was completely dead when I tried to revive it on my stirplate with 1.030 wort. So if you expect to brew within a week, go for it. But if you want to store yeast for months and months without worry, wash it. It only takes 30-40 minutes (during which you can walk away and do whatever you want) if you have some boiled, canned water just sitting in the back of your fridge.

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kappclark said:

I am wondering why this is true...is there something chemical in the bottom of the fermenter that kills the yeast ??

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While I am speculating to some extent I would say one of the potential chemicals in the bottom of the fermenter that kills yeast is alcohol. Alcohol toxicity to most beer yeasts is what, in the 10% range? While lower percentages may be present in the resulting beer it's still going to be fighting at those yeast cells even if it's not doing it as efficiently. The water you added not only gave you extra space to help decant the yeast from the trub (in the multiple steps) but also thins out the remaining alcohol that would have been in the beer you made. This also reduces the effectiveness of the alcohol protecting the mix and increases the chance of bacterial contamination.

While I've had most turn out well (even with trub in the bottom for just over 6 months with no problems), I've also had a few that I threw them away upon opening just off the smell alone. I've had less issues since learning to separate the yeast out better though and in a double washed batch I had it take off no problems at just over 22 months in a starter to which I swirled it up, let it settle out then poured the active/suspended yeast into a 2nd starter and it worked without a hitch. I wouldn't recommend it as a general rule mind you but even if you have accidently frozen yeast there's a chance it will take off in a starter. As I understand it though the chances of mutation are much MUCH greater with that kind of stress though. Palmer pointed out (IIRC it was Palmer anyway) that reuse and mutation over the centuries helped to lead us to some of the strains not to mention variety of yeast we have today so if you don't mind taking a chance on the cost of a starter which doesn't tend to cost a lot anyway what can it really hurt to give it a try?

CTownBrewer said:

2) How many yeast cells would you say you'd end up with in one of the pint sized mason jars? I know the typical Wyeast Smack Pack has about 100 billion, so would one jar of washed yeast start with a similar cell count? A lot of the recipes I've made already require 200-400 billion cells, so I want to make sure I have the correct pitching rates.

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I'm also very interested in an answer to this question... Buying new yeast packets every brew day can be more expensive, but at least you can get a good estimate of your starting cell count. In this kind of case, I've got no idea how you'd calculate what's an appropriate starter size to use...

stratslinger said:

I'm also very interested in an answer to this question... Buying new yeast packets every brew day can be more expensive, but at least you can get a good estimate of your starting cell count. In this kind of case, I've got no idea how you'd calculate what's an appropriate starter size to use...

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I know this thread is 115 pages long, but it has been answered numerous times... There is simply WAY too MANY variables to answer it in numbers. The only way you would know is by using a microscope and plates. However, most on here, including myself, find that a single jar of washed yeast behaves similarly to a single smack pack... Obviously ALWAYS make a starter. Results will vary drastically from brewer to brewer based on equipment, procedure, yeast health, age, temperature, water, how the Mets finished this year, etc, etc, etc.

Well i just tried a yeast starter with my 5 months old belgium washed yeast. O decanted the water and maybe half of the grey brown layer. Pitch the beige color bottom goop and waiting for some action to start. It's been almost 5 hours, still no reaction from the yeast so far

Grinreaper said:

Well i just tried a yeast starter with my 5 months old belgium washed yeast. O decanted the water and maybe half of the grey brown layer. Pitch the beige color bottom goop and waiting for some action to start. It's been almost 5 hours, still no reaction from the yeast so far

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And this proves my point.... I just made a starter from a jar of WLP037 that I washed and jarred on 12-27-2010.. a full 9 months ago. Sure, it was a little slow to start, but it is fermenting like crazy now! So be patient! Yeast are some hardy little bastards... give em a chance.

Grinreaper said:

Well i just tried a yeast starter with my 5 months old belgium washed yeast. O decanted the water and maybe half of the grey brown layer. Pitch the beige color bottom goop and waiting for some action to start. It's been almost 5 hours, still no reaction from the yeast so far

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Give it 5 days if necessary (well, maybe not, but you get the point). They're coming out of a long slumber -- patience!

Ok it's been more than 15 hours. There was small whitish spots on the surface and the yeast was at the bottom. So i reshaked it to give it more oxygen and see if it can help.

BigB said:

And this proves my point.... I just made a starter from a jar of WLP037 that I washed and jarred on 12-27-2010.. a full 9 months ago. Sure, it was a little slow to start, but it is fermenting like crazy now! So be patient! Yeast are some hardy little bastards... give em a chance.

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Yesterday, I pitched a 3 week old 2L starter flask of Essex Ale yeast (2nd gen )...1054 ,,, and the yeast are happy again. Yes - very hard workers.. I think we sell the yeast short .. if you had a viable starter, I think you can expect a viable fermentation...my lag time was 12 hours - which is fine with me..in 6 weeks, I will have some HPA to serve at Thanksgiving..and I give thanks to the faithful yeast!

/Here's the update. After reshaking the jar i have fermentation. Really good one at that. Now here's the question. Is there still contamination in the starter that could affect to next beer?/

New update. WOW. Took 15 hours or so to see a fermentation in my 2 x Brewferm Grand cru. Just got back from work and amazed how much foam there is in my bucket. It's a 30 litres semi transparent bucket and the beer is only 18 litres. The whole empty space is filled with kraussen. There was a little bit in the airlock and my appartment smells like beer lol. The bucket is even in my fermentation chambre is built with a small whirlpool fridge.

Tonight I knew that I was going out after work, and also knew that I needed to keg my APA. I had every intention of reclaiming the 1056 goodness at the bottom of the carboy for a couple of bigger beers I'm doing this weekend. Since I was short on time tonight, I decided to boil my water, mason jars, etc. last night and let it cool for 24 hours.

After I got the kegging chores completed, I took the lid off of my stockpot that had the boiled and cooled water, jars, lids, and bands. The water was rust-red. Apparently I had a few rust spots somewhere, and they multiplied between last night and tonight.

So....by saving a few bucks by reusing lids and bands, I'm now going to spend $17 on more yeast, plus I'll use more starter wort than I would normally use for yeast that was harvested 36 hours before pitching.

Sigh....

jeffjm said:

Tonight I knew that I was going out after work, and also knew that I needed to keg my APA. I had every intention of reclaiming the 1056 goodness at the bottom of the carboy for a couple of bigger beers I'm doing this weekend. Since I was short on time tonight, I decided to boil my water, mason jars, etc. last night and let it cool for 24 hours.

After I got the kegging chores completed, I took the lid off of my stockpot that had the boiled and cooled water, jars, lids, and bands. The water was rust-red. Apparently I had a few rust spots somewhere, and they multiplied between last night and tonight.

So....by saving a few bucks by reusing lids and bands, I'm now going to spend $17 on more yeast, plus I'll use more starter wort than I would normally use for yeast that was harvested 36 hours before pitching.

Sigh....

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I would have just used it.

Me too. Rust isn't really an infection after all. Just a little more nutritive iron is all. Besides, looks like your lid did you a favor and ate some of the oxygen.