Double Pitch?

AHB suggests double pitching for high gravity beers. Is this necessary assuming a starter is used?

I think they are suggesting you double pitch if not using a starter. Now...This depends on how big of a starter you are using...

Use this for reference
http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

Ok, let me restate the question:

What beers would require a double pitch w/starter?

I like big beers and am looking at possibly a Belgian Trippel or Imperial IPA at some point.

triangulum33 said:

Ok, let me restate the question:

What beers would require a double pitch w/starter?

I like big beers and am looking at possibly a Belgian Trippel or Imperial IPA at some point.

Click to expand...

LOL. None of them require it if you have time to step your starter up. How bout we try it this way, how big a beer do you want to brew, and how many days ahead of brew day can you start a starter?

You can use the Mr Malty pitching calculator to show you how much starter you should need based on the anticipated OG, and method of stirring the starter. Any recommendation that is going much beyond 2000ml you should should ideally consider stepping up in multiple steps rather than doing all at once. Not absolutely necessary, but the bigger you go in a single step, the more stress you put on the yeast.

http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

Thanks.
AHB's Belgian Trappist Ale Trippel lists the OG at 1.082. Mr Malty calls for 2 packs and ~2L of starter.
I can do that. I dont mind making 2 starters.

Do they get pitched at the same time, or pitch the second later?

triangulum33 said:

Thanks.
AHB's Belgian Trappist Ale Trippel lists the OG at 1.082. Mr Malty calls for 2 packs and ~2L of starter.

Click to expand...

I see yours with 1L of starter and 2 packs of yeast OR a 1.82L of starter with 1 pack of yeast (adjusting the growth factor). I like less yeast packets because I like to get all the money I can out of the yeast (it's the cost factor I can really control).

Now what Zen is talking about is starting say with a 1L starter and 1 pack and then adding another 1L of wort to step up your starter and producing less stress on your yeast, which is probably the smarter way to do it.

For the Noobs: AHB means Austin Homebrew Supply or www.austinhomebrew.com

We suggest double pitching on beers over 1.060 original gravity. You can also make a starter but it is very popular to buy 2 vials instead of making a starter.

Forrest

So Forrest,
Instead of making a starter, one could just dump 2 yeast vials directly into the fermenter? I thought liquid yeast almost always should have a starter.

Thanks for the advice and please forgive my ignorance. My 2 semesters of biology doesnt seem to be helping me here.

triangulum33 said:

Thanks.
AHB's Belgian Trappist Ale Trippel lists the OG at 1.082. Mr Malty calls for 2 packs and ~2L of starter.
I can do that. I dont mind making 2 starters.

Do they get pitched at the same time, or pitch the second later?

Click to expand...

There is a drop down menu in the middle top of the calculator. I think you left it on simple starter to come up with 2 packs and 2 liter starter each. Do you have a stir plate? If not even intermittent shaking, which is shaking or swirling your starter will cut your starter size down.

Next question is how big a vessel or flask do you have to make starter in.
1.8L is pushing it a bit for a 2000ml flask. It doesn't leave much room in case a krausen comes up. If you have a larger than 2000ml flask, or other vessel I would still try to do only one starter at 1800ml. If not you will have to step up from a smaller starter or pitch the two vials if you really aren't that concerned about buying two vials of yeast.

Yes, you should ideally pitch both starters at the same time, as one of the things the yeast do when the hit the wort is assess how much food appears to be about, and then start reproducing to get their numbers up to the task. So more yeast in all at once, means more yeast at the start, less lag time reproducing, and sooner to work for the yeast.

Hey, thanks Zen. That clears it up a lot. That's pretty interesting how the yeast behave.

I only have a 1000mL flask.

triangulum33 said:

So Forrest,
Instead of making a starter, one could just dump 2 yeast vials directly into the fermenter? I thought liquid yeast almost always should have a starter.

Thanks for the advice and please forgive my ignorance. My 2 semesters of biology doesnt seem to be helping me here.

Click to expand...

Other than growing the yeast colony and waking up all the yeast and preparing them for the task at hand, the other big benefit you get from a starter is it proves that the yeast are viable. Whitelabs and Wyeast are both outstanding suppliers, but sometimes something happens along the way and the yeast are exposed to high temps or whatever and many or all of them leave this world. The starter will verify that the yeast are alive and well as they ferment your starter. So it isn't necessary, but it gives you proof that your yeast are good.

As far as me and my wallet are concerned, it is more popular to make a starter than to buy two packs of yeast. However, it depends on if you have more time, or more money, and I'm sure Forrest is correct and a lot of brewers just buy the 2 vials and are done with it. Of course in your case Mr Malty says with no starter you should have 3 vials. It gets pretty easy to justify a stir plate once you've done a couple real big beers.

Most people just dump the yeast straight in. There are many advantages to making a starter but a lot of people consider the time and timing involved and would rather just pitch extra yeast.

Having more yeast cells either by double pitching or making a starter and adding nutrients such as Yeast Fuel will lead to a more healthy fermentation and a better tasting beer. Breweries use as much as the equivalent of 1 package of liquid yeast per gallon of beer.

Make sure you have an adequate sized primary fermenter once you start having more healthy fermentations. If you have more yeast cells and you add Yeast Fuel nutrients, you will have more foam to deal with. Yeast Fuel can take as much as 2 days off of your primary fermentation so it will ferment faster and create more foam. Faster, healthier and cleaner fermentation will lead to better tasting beer.

Forrest

Thanks a lot guys. Very informative.

Yes very informative posts. I always wondered about double pitching on Austin Homebrew Supply site. Thanks!!!