That's Right, I'm in the Club Now - Best Start Showing Me Some Respect
- Thread starter Pappers_
- Start date
Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
teehee
And you can only choose one because...??
I got a Cicerone Beer Server certification thing when they were doing a special deal last year and it was $10 I think. I just remember that test being way easier than the BJCP exam.
OP
OP
Do you want to judge in competitions?
Cicerone is WAYYYY cooler than just being a BJCP judge.
OP
OP
Cicerone is WAYYYY cooler than just being a BJCP judge.
No doubt. BJCP is definitely deep into geek territory, not at all cool.
The BJCP entry-level computer-based exam (the one you MUST take if it is your first time) if pass/fail. I don't know about all of the Cicerone exams, but the beer server exam is definitely pass/fail.
I am not sure what your definition of "ace" is, but there's very little point in studying like crazy to get 100% on a pass/fail exam IMO. Also IMO, there are at least a few poorly-worded or ambiguous questions on each of those exams which makes getting 100% somewhat impractical.
The BJCP tasting exam, however, is worth spending plenty of time studying for and you ought to practice writing scoresheets until you can write them at a Master level in 8-10 minutes. The trick with the tasting exam is having your scores align with those of the proctors, though, in addition to providing similar feedback. So in my opinion the best way to prepare is to start volunteering to judge at competitions so you can learn from more experienced judges.
I am not sure what your definition of "ace" is, but there's very little point in studying like crazy to get 100% on a pass/fail exam IMO. Also IMO, there are at least a few poorly-worded or ambiguous questions on each of those exams which makes getting 100% somewhat impractical.
The BJCP tasting exam, however, is worth spending plenty of time studying for and you ought to practice writing scoresheets until you can write them at a Master level in 8-10 minutes. The trick with the tasting exam is having your scores align with those of the proctors, though, in addition to providing similar feedback. So in my opinion the best way to prepare is to start volunteering to judge at competitions so you can learn from more experienced judges.
Also, while we're on the topic of the BJCP tasting exam, quick question for anyone who might know. Are you treating the exam as if you were judging in a real competetion? For example, they hand me a beer and tell me to judge it as a pilsner but it pours dark and smells roasty. Now, the judging manual says to ask the organizer if the beer was accidentally placed in the wrong flight, so would you do that in the exam? For the same situation, would you still somehow find a way to give it the traditional minimum score of 13 or give it the score it deserves? Thanks.
Yes, although the beers won't be that obviously wrong so it shouldn't come up, HOWEVER what you should probably do is put appropriate comments in the "overall" section about how this might do better entered as a _____. You will likely get at least one beer of the low teens variety, though. I seem to recall that the lowest score you ought to give on the exam is a 13. In fact it might say something to that effect somewhere in the test instructions. Our "horrible" beer was actually kind of a tough one because one of the proctors gave it a relatively high score--something like low-mid 20's, while the other one gave it a low score, and then when they discussed the beer the consensus score ended up being fairly high (low to mid 20's) thus skewing everyone's score for that beer.
As I recall, that beer was horrible in many ways. It was a diacetyl bomb, it had pretty strong acetaldehyde, no carbonation, and the bitterness was way off style.
As I recall, that beer was horrible in many ways. It was a diacetyl bomb, it had pretty strong acetaldehyde, no carbonation, and the bitterness was way off style.
Thanks. I've been meaning to ask someone that for a couple weeks now, but every time I get online I keep forgetting. Cheers!
Congrats. (to all who have been certified)
I'd like to, but I am a terrible student.
For now I'll be content to stand on the other side of the judging table. :cross:
I'd like to, but I am a terrible student.
For now I'll be content to stand on the other side of the judging table. :cross:
Can I join the club now, or do I have to wait until I have certificate and pin in hand? I got an e-mail today saying I am a Recognized judge and that my materials should be here within a week.
Congratulations,but until you have proof you're honorary!
OP
OP
Can I join the club now, or do I have to wait until I have certificate and pin in hand? I got an e-mail today saying I am a Recognized judge and that my materials should be here within a week.
Congratulations!!!
Well,since I took only 10 years to win best in class at Midwest Mazdafest in 2010 (94 Probe SE tuner),Maybe I should take a shot at this?!? I've been thinking about giving it my best shot. but what would they think about my warped way of arriving at the same styles?
Seriously though,how hard can it be beyond a good memory?...
Seriously though,how hard can it be beyond a good memory?...
Well,since I took only 10 years to win best in class at Midwest Mazdafest in 2010 (94 Probe SE tuner),Maybe I should take a shot at this?!? I've been thinking about giving it my best shot. but what would they think about my warped way of arriving at the same styles?
Seriously though,how hard can it be beyond a good memory?...
It's less about memory and more about tuning your palate to detect the multitude of different types of flavor, aroma, mouthfeel and all the combinations thereof. True, for the exam you don't get the style guidelines in front of you so there's a bit of memory involved, but I would say your perceptive and descriptive abilities are far more important than memory.
Once your palate is tuned in can you ever just enjoy a beer without detecting the subtlies that put it out of style
This is on my "list of things I want to do but probably won't find the time for the next few years" list.
Once your palate is tuned in can you ever just enjoy a beer without detecting the subtlies that put it out of style
I find that with beers I am having for the first time I run through the judging process in my head, but after I get a bead on how I like it, I turn my judge switch to the OFF position. For beers I have had before, the switch is off to begin with and I just sit back and enjoy the ride.
Once your palate is tuned in can you ever just enjoy a beer without detecting the subtlies that put it out of style
Oh, definitely! There are some things I can't let go of- chlorophenols, diacetyl, oxidation- but I still love to just have a beer and not analyze it.
The thing is, I'm less tolerant of bad beer than I used to be. I've gone to some brewpubs recently and the beer is sometimes just not good or even downright bad. As an example, an American wheat beer was so phenolic as to be undrinkable. I think they thought that since it was a wheat beer that they'd just let it ferment at very warm temperatures and pretend it was part of the style. At another place, an American red had distinct phenols from poor yeast health, and it was flat.
Training your palate can be a dangerous thing- beers you enjoyed in the past are now noted to be flawed and thus less enjoyed.
But when I go out and have a beer, I am perfectly capable of just enjoying it and not get into "judge mode" unless I want to.
Thanks! Yeah I would like to train my palate but with the cost of craft beer to practice on and what seems to be a lack of BJCP sanctioned events in New Zealand (one per year I think, most others are run as per the styles but judge on a group tasting/voting, i.e. which beer did you like the most with trying to think about how it fits into the style entered as) it is a bit hard.
I got my package from the BJCP today. Perceptive ability and description were my weak areas. I missed one off flavor that the proctors picked up and I picked up to that the proctors didn't. Other than that most of my points off were because I didn't say enough about the the character of the beer. There's just so little space to write and when I want to talk about something off I don't have any room left for addressing every single other flavor/aroma/mouthfeel component. I'll work on being more succinct for my next exam.
OP
OP
Congratulations!
OP
OP
I received an email today that I've been promoted, to Certified Beer Judge. Woot!
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
That position had best come with a hat. Otherwise, where are the perks?
OP
OP
From the email I received:
Lapel pins aren't really my style and I would much prefer a hat. A Panama hat.
CreamyGoodness
Well-Known Member
I say you march in there and demand your hat.
OP
OP
Arrived in the mail yesterday.
butterpants
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2013
- Messages
- 1,146
- Reaction score
- 128
Ok I need to do this. I'm a compulsive bookworm and good student. In the last year I've read probably 20 books on beer and brewing yet need more..... my thirst for knowledge is unquenchable. After a quick glance on the BJCP web site(which seems kind of ****tily organized) , is this a logical order of progression?
1) Obtain downloadable study guide
2) Take 200q online exam
3) Study some more
4) Practice filling out score sheets
5) Sign up for local tasting exam
What costs and waiting period / timeline are we talking? I'm in Denver is that makes a difference.
I'm decent at learning styles from written guidelines and finding examoles at the liquor store.... but not to be a ******, my beers don't have all these crazy flaws..... where can I score a bottle of diacetly or acetaldehyde bomb?
1) Obtain downloadable study guide
2) Take 200q online exam
3) Study some more
4) Practice filling out score sheets
5) Sign up for local tasting exam
What costs and waiting period / timeline are we talking? I'm in Denver is that makes a difference.
I'm decent at learning styles from written guidelines and finding examoles at the liquor store.... but not to be a ******, my beers don't have all these crazy flaws..... where can I score a bottle of diacetly or acetaldehyde bomb?
The website lists ways you can spike a beer to get the effect of specific flaws. If you have a club you might consider having everyone pitch in to buy a BJCP spiking kit that has the full complement of ingredients that mimic those flaws. if I recall correctly I think they are like $100 and can be used for 2-3 training sessions.
MichaelBrock
Well-Known Member
I would probably move step 5 to the top. Tasting exams are unfortunately rare and fill up quickly. If you are serious about taking the exam I would first sign up for one, and that will give you a deadline for being ready. Not to say that you can't study before that, especially getting familiar with the classic examples of each style, but it sets your calendar.
butterpants
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2013
- Messages
- 1,146
- Reaction score
- 128
Interesting... ok.
Do you sign up for a tasting exam at the bjcp website? What do they usually run?
Do you sign up for a tasting exam at the bjcp website? What do they usually run?
The exams are all listed on the BJCP website, but to sign up you need to e-mail the exam organizers directly. Don't be surprised, though, if the exams within the next year all have waiting lists.
OP
OP
Take the online entrance exam first, pass it, and then contact the exam organizers. Tell them you've already passed the entrance exam. They will tell you that their test is full, and you ask to be put on a waiting list.
Begin Rant:
Many exam organizers are not approaching this correctly. For example, I just took an exam last weekend in Detroit, the organizer contacted me 10 days ago telling me that I had a spot if I wanted it. I had been way down on the waiting list, so that means many who he had given reserved spots to didn't pass the entrance or weren't serious. The end result is I had very little notice but it just happened that I could travel to Detroit that weekend (a five hour drive).
Also, the test was only 3/4s full - 9 out of a maximum of 12. I know, first-hand, how challenging it is for people to get into the tests because of the way the tests are being organized and here's a test that wasn't even close to being full.
Another test organizer I know is doing it right. She has a class and encourages class members to take the exam. But, she will not even write your name down until you pass the entrance exam. Then she methodically goes through the list by category - those who take her class get first shot, current bcjp judges get second shot, others from her local area get third shot, etc.
In addition, she requires you to pay in advance. The upshot is its organized, everyone knows months ahead of time that they will be taking the exam, that they have an assured spot, and she has very few people pull out at the last minute.
End Rant.
MichaelBrock
Well-Known Member
Keep in mind that you have only 1 year after taking the entrance exam to take the tasting exam, otherwise you'll need to take the entrance exam again. Not a big deal obviously, just something to keep in mind, considering how difficult it can be to get into the exam.
Our club hosted a tasting exam this past July. All 12 places were taken by club members and we had a waiting list. I think we ended up taking only one person from the waiting list to fill a vacancy. The club ran a weekly BJCP tasting class for 3-4 months before the exam so the people taking the test were definitely dedicated to it.
Our club hosted a tasting exam this past July. All 12 places were taken by club members and we had a waiting list. I think we ended up taking only one person from the waiting list to fill a vacancy. The club ran a weekly BJCP tasting class for 3-4 months before the exam so the people taking the test were definitely dedicated to it.
I thought that you had to show that you had passed the entrance test to book a place in a exam? obvisoly I was wrong.
Pappers I agree with you rant and maybe the BJCP need to look at how the exams are booked from a top down directive. I understand the 1 year limit for the entrance test, but surely if the take pre bookings for the exams it should be up to the applicant to show 6 months in advance that they have passed the entrance test an pay for the exam. And the should treat pulling out like hotels do, e.g. 6+ months = full refund, 3+ months = 80% refund, 2+ months = 50% refund, <2 months = 0%
that would get rid of the tire kickers early and the waiting lists would get much more notice of a place opening.
Pappers I agree with you rant and maybe the BJCP need to look at how the exams are booked from a top down directive. I understand the 1 year limit for the entrance test, but surely if the take pre bookings for the exams it should be up to the applicant to show 6 months in advance that they have passed the entrance test an pay for the exam. And the should treat pulling out like hotels do, e.g. 6+ months = full refund, 3+ months = 80% refund, 2+ months = 50% refund, <2 months = 0%
that would get rid of the tire kickers early and the waiting lists would get much more notice of a place opening.
Similar threads
