Hard wiring rather than all these plugs?

In all these build posts I see everyone using plugs in and out of their boxes. why is that, wouldn't it be easier just to wire eveything direct do away with all these additional conections that are prone to corosion, wear or just fatigue? I can see if you are taking the system apart and putting it away after each brew, but how many do that?

duckdogs said:

In all these build posts I see everyone using plugs in and out of their boxes. why is that, wouldn't it be easier just to wire eveything direct do away with all these additional conections that are prone to corosion, wear or just fatigue? I can see if you are taking the system apart and putting it away after each brew, but how many do that?

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i know the locking plugs are nice for safety. and i doubt it would wear very quickly. as for me, i plan to hard wire the power input to my enclosure. i don't see a need to have that as an outlet as well. that's just me though

Well, if you have an element in your kettle and it's hard wired and the other end is hard wired, it would be difficult to separate the kettle for cleaning purposes.

If your pumps are attached to the stand, and you need to move the stand around, you have to move EVERYTHING together. Depending your configuration, it could potentially be cumbersome.

In general using connectors helps with

a) cleaning
b) moving items around
c) troubleshooting/diagnostics

Not saying that hard wiring both ends won't work, but it could make it more challenging at times.

Flexibility. It leave all components easily removable/ replaced. Plus you can use pumps in away from the control panel.

There is no need for locking plugs. Has anyone checked how much force is required to insert or separate a regular oven or dryer plug? It is a lot of force! Save your money for something that matters. Locking plugs are a waste of money unless you are jerking on your power cord all the time. I keep my power cords out of the way, so no jerking is possible.

Back to the question of hardwiring. If a particular piece of equipment won't be moved ever or often, then it seems plausible to hardwire. In my case, everything except my HLT is mobile. Even so, I elected to use a dryer plug for that element. Its extra security to be able to have a visible disconnect if I'm working on the HLT.

Personal preference.

Interesting thread. I was thinking about this recently as well. I don't remember the last time I removed any one of my vessels from my stand. I've cleaned in place from the very beginning. Once you go electric, the odds of taking a single vessel out of the brewhouse is seriously diminished unless you have a big brew in the parking lot surrounding a PSEG transformer.

I can imagine it starts getting cumbersome to finish the wiring on a panel when you have a mess of cords hanging off it, but it doesn't sound that bad. In the end, we're probably going to save $150 max by leaving off at least one disconnect per cord.

I did not hardwire for two reasons

1. If a component fails replacement is easier
2. I will be moving in the next year to 18 months so it will make it much easier to move my whole setup.

In regards to the locking plugs, I went that direction since that is common practice in all the plants I do work in when around industrial equipment. I do not want to risk anything becoming unplugged or partially loose in a wet environment.

To me hardwiring could be an option, but I want to have mobility just in case there comes a time I can bring my brew system somewhere to use.

I figure it costs about $100 bucks (estimate 4 220 outlets @ $8 a piece, 4 6 ft dryer cords at $15 a piece) for a setup similar to mine – dryer outlet, spa panel, control panel, and two elements all with separate plugs/outlets. Factor in the cost of the actual wire if you were hardwiring (copper 6 awg is around $2 per foot and the comparison cost is less).

110 power outlets and cords are so cheap that I don’t see why you would hardwire your pumps/motors/etc.

mabrungard said:

There is no need for locking plugs. Has anyone checked how much force is required to insert or separate a regular oven or dryer plug? It is a lot of force! Save your money for something that matters. Locking plugs are a waste of money unless you are jerking on your power cord all the time. I keep my power cords out of the way, so no jerking is possible.

Back to the question of hardwiring. If a particular piece of equipment won't be moved ever or often, then it seems plausible to hardwire. In my case, everything except my HLT is mobile. Even so, I elected to use a dryer plug for that element. Its extra security to be able to have a visible disconnect if I'm working on the HLT.

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I have to agree here on the locking plugs. I foresee most of my vessels staying in place for the majority of the brew, and all my element wiring is run behind my vessels, along the wall, meaning the wires will not be pulled or yanked. There will be no jerking on brewday (hehe).

I can see the allure of locking plugs in an ideal world, but they are just too expensive for me to justify putting in my brewery. You can get regular 220 outlets for about $8 and 6 foot dryer cords for around $15.

Bobby_M said:

Interesting thread. I was thinking about this recently as well. I don't remember the last time I removed any one of my vessels from my stand. I've cleaned in place from the very beginning. Once you go electric, the odds of taking a single vessel out of the brewhouse is seriously diminished unless you have a big brew in the parking lot surrounding a PSEG transformer.

I can imagine it starts getting cumbersome to finish the wiring on a panel when you have a mess of cords hanging off it, but it doesn't sound that bad. In the end, we're probably going to save $150 max by leaving off at least one disconnect per cord.

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Depends. My 3-keggle system gets put away after every brew (it's outdoors on patio by pool when brewing, afterwards it gets cleaned and stacked behind the house. Plugs make sense for me.

What I did was mount my control box to a rolling cart and hardwired the receptacles to the cart. I have a 10 foot cable from the back of the controller to the spa outlet everything else is in pvc across the back of the cart.

tator2k said:

What I did was mount my control box to a rolling cart and hardwired the receptacles to the cart. I have a 10 foot cable from the back of the controller to the spa outlet everything else is in pvc across the back of the cart.

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Thats a good idea. One of the issues I am worried about is having all these 220 dryer cords plugged into my small control panel, and the tension from the thick cords pulling on the panel all the time. I was originally thinking the CP could just sit on my bench but I think it will have to be mounted fairly securely I believe.

Since my system is totally portable it was better for me to put the locking plugs on the control box. It's much easier for me to clean and store my system on it's roller cart.
My control box is plastic and the appliance plugs take so much force to insert plus I wanted my outlets on the bottom. I am not aware of an appliance plug that isn't 90°.
I plan on adapting the main power cord for the box and the kettle later on.

I was just making sure I wasn't missing something. My system is built on a rolling stand everything is plumed in with 5/8 od hard copper & stainless fittings, with the exception of my MT that is set up to dump & be switched out for a larger MT when more than 3 of us are brewing. Cleaning has never been a problem, after brewing everything is cleaned out & flushed, drained and stored with all the valves open to dry.

I feel the plug for pwr in is a little over done. I dont know people w many of those recept that if i wanted to go there for a brew day id be able to just pack up my stuff and go. Also i dont really want to either. Cleaning of the vessels is a different story. I def want to detach my vessels from the elect connection and get a good cleaning. But thats also why theres a nut on the element. Just undo the nut amd take it out. Wipe it down. Sanitize and reinstall. Now u have me thinkin about doing away w my plugs. Save the room in my cp. Hmmmm

dcarroll86 said:

I feel the plug for pwr in is a little over done. I dont know people w many of those recept that if i wanted to go there for a brew day id be able to just pack up my stuff and go. Also i dont really want to either. Cleaning of the vessels is a different story. I def want to detach my vessels from the elect connection and get a good cleaning. But thats also why theres a nut on the element. Just undo the nut amd take it out. Wipe it down. Sanitize and reinstall. Now u have me thinkin about doing away w my plugs. Save the room in my cp. Hmmmm

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How do you have your element installed such that you can get to the wiring easily, unscrew the nut(s) (two power and one ground) then reattach so easily?

I chose to hardwire everything for several reasons. It was simpler, it cost less, it left more room inside my control panel, it looks cleaner, and it matches my intended hard-plumbing. I intend for this to all be clean in place. That being said, I am a mechanic by trade, and I know that EVERYTHING is prone to failure. Everything in my build is assembled to be serviceable, meaning that I can disassemble IF needed without a complete disaster. My girlfriend might not be able to take it apart (because of the lack of plugs) but she probably shouldn't be touching the rig anyhow

kpr121 said:

How do you have your element installed such that you can get to the wiring easily, unscrew the nut(s) (two power and one ground) then reattach so easily?

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Ok. So i forgot one step. "undo grd". Then remove nut and take out element. Either way not a big deal. Not dealin w either phase wires

Brewing outdoors vs indoors is what drives the hard wire format.
Here you go: Outside brewing with 60amp whip, plug & sleave.

Sparky said:

Brewing outdoors vs indoors is what drives the hard wire format.
Here you go: Outside brewing with 60amp whip, plug & sleave.

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Okay you suck!

I want to brew there.

Damn Sparky that is badass.

Yeah - brew day (week?) at Sparky's!!!!

Everyone is always welcome. Plenty of beer, but need to watch out for SWMBO - she'll put you to work in the yard!

Man- your life sucks! You have to brew beer with an ocean view! And I thought I had it made in my basement



.

We hard wired the element coil into the control panel and have about six feet of waterproof cord between the two so the kettle can be lifted and dumped. The single pump is hard mounted so that wasn't an issue. Since it is a Brutus 20 rig those are the only electrical connections on the cart. The panel connects to a locking plug off of a spa panel with a ten foot cord. The rig is on wheels, so it is just a matter of rolling it to the outlet and rolling it back to a corner of the garage when done. We hard wired primarily because my buddy felt it would be more water tight to do it that way.

Sparky that is really wonderful. (by the way folks there was a "brew view" thread about a year ago, some of you guys have a really nice view for sure).

Mux, I don't know what to say!

Don't think anyone mentioned this, but a hardwired control panel could cause insurance issues if anything happens

milldoggy said:

Don't think anyone mentioned this, but a hardwired control panel could cause insurance issues if anything happens

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On that note, I can pretty much guarantee that a hard wired panel would be considered a "sub-panel" in my municipality, which would require permits.

DFP51 said:

We hard wired the element coil into the control panel and have about six feet of waterproof cord between the two so the kettle can be lifted and dumped. The single pump is hard mounted so that wasn't an issue. Since it is a Brutus 20 rig those are the only electrical connections on the cart. The panel connects to a locking plug off of a spa panel with a ten foot cord. The rig is on wheels, so it is just a matter of rolling it to the outlet and rolling it back to a corner of the garage when done. We hard wired primarily because my buddy felt it would be more water tight to do it that way.

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This is basically what I have in mind my system is on wheels and once the electronics are installed they will not be removed on a regular basis except for some maintenance or trouble shooting issue. I just don't see the point in adding 4 plugs for elements, 3 (minimum) for temp probes, 2 for pumps and another for your main power to your GFI.

1 more question that comes to mind Is there an issue with attatching the GFI(spa panel) to the brewing system and just running a "pig tail" from the GFI to the power outlet that powers the system? Or does the GFI need to be wired into the main breaker to function properly?

An issue like this is more or less to each his own. There is certainly no hard rules about "to plug or not to plug" in wiring a control box. I like that people do it each his own way and then share it with everyone. You learn a lot more that way.

On the GFCI, you can simply use a dryer cord wired into the spa panel and plug it into a dryer outlet. It's perfectly safe and functional that way. I use my range outlet to plug my spa panel into and it works great.

wubears71 said:

On that note, I can pretty much guarantee that a hard wired panel would be considered a "sub-panel" in my municipality, which would require permits.

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In that case!! What!! In most counties in the great usa u cant just add a spa panel either. So weather its hard wired direct to ur cp or not. Just bc u throw a plug in there doesnt make it a legal connection. And the insurance issue only comes up if ur control panel caused the fire or was started by an electrical issue in that area of ur panel. Which if u have pwr going to it when ur not around then part of that is just plan stupidity anyways. Turn the breaker off after ur brew day. And i cant stress enough to people that when u say ur nec compliant. Thats like saying. "i only needed a D to pass a test and thats what i got". The nec is a BARE MIN CODE, its there so everything isnt completely ghetto rig. People get so caught up in "The Code". How bout if u dont know what ur doing hire someone that does so u dont F something up and hurt or kill urself or worse others! Man i need a beer now!!!
Sorry for going on a rant but dumb people and stuff bother me

You must provide a disconnecting means. A cord-and-plug connection provides that. If you hardwire, you must install a disconnect.

My son flipped the BK switch to manual ON and fried my element in a matter of seconds. I only have a float switch on the HLT, so until I install another float switch I'm glad I'm able to unplug my BK to prevent Porter from flipping the switch and frying the element again.

pickles said:

My son flipped the BK switch to manual ON and fried my element in a matter of seconds. I only have a float switch on the HLT, so until I install another float switch I'm glad I'm able to unplug my BK to prevent Porterfrom flipping the switch and frying the element again.

Click to expand...

Great...another thing to add to the build..
1. lights to show power at element
2. Float switches HLT & BK

Alright what are you using for a float switch?

thanks for the input

This http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewitem?itemId=260986951052&index=12&nav=SEARCH&nid=55643211872

It's wired so that it completes a circuit on the low voltage side of SSRs on both hot legs of my element.

pickles said:

This http://item.mobileweb.ebay.com/viewitem?itemId=260986951052&index=12&nav=SEARCH&nid=55643211872

It's wired so that it completes a circuit on the low voltage side of SSRs on both hot legs of my element.

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Great thank you, seems like an easy enough add on that without could ruin a brew day, with one semi drunk flip of the wrong switch....wait drinking, brewing...those don't go together at all

I just want to be clear. When I refer to "hardwiring," I mean the electronics on the rig. NOT the rig to the structure. I think the meaning got lost there for a bit, but it is still a valid point for some to consider.

pickles said:

My son flipped the BK switch to manual ON and fried my element in a matter of seconds. I only have a float switch on the HLT, so until I install another float switch I'm glad I'm able to unplug my BK to prevent Porter from flipping the switch and frying the element again.

Click to expand...

I like the plug/cord on my BK for this reason. It does not get plugged in until wort is over the element so no chance of frying anything.

tjpfeister said:

I just want to be clear. When I refer to "hardwiring," I mean the electronics on the rig. NOT the rig to the structure. I think the meaning got lost there for a bit, but it is still a valid point for some to consider.

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Yes, and maybe I should have been a bit clearer when I started this... I was only refering to the elements & other brewing related items being wired directly into the brewing pannle and not into the residental structure itself.

In that case, hard wire away. I rarely unhook my stuff. it was handy when I had to replace a pump. Also, I dry fired my ulwd for 30 secs and it is still kicking.