Pitching on the cake

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forcabrew

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So I just brewed a small Irish red with a OG of 1.042 and I was planning on brewing a barleywine and just dumping it in the same fermenter on top of the yeast.

Wondering if its ok to pitch on a cake that's been in the primary fermenter for a month or if I should brew earlier? assuming fermentation has ended

Also how does everyone usually go about this. Are ther certain steps i need to take or a certain process

My first time pitching on cake

Thanks
 
have never pitched on cake, but from what I've read, that's just what it is, pouring your wort into the fermenter with the old batch's yeast still in there.

also from what I've read, it's a fairly vigorous ferment - USE A BLOWOFF TUBE
 
I'd love to hear some feedback on this, or if anyone knows of a good thread already posted. I just started washing my yeast, but pitching directly onto an old cake would be easier if the beer styles are suitable.
 
I have pitched on cakes before, as long as you pitch a darker wort on top ie a pale to a stout because you will impart flavors from the previous beer, I only do this if I am brewing the same day as I am rackin the beer off the primary cake, and obviously I don't worry about sanitizing the primary again because it should still be sanitary from the last batch, hope this helps
 
is there a time frame? should you pitch on cake immediately or is it fine to leave the initial beer and yeast i the primary for a month and then pitch onto cake?
 
You really do not need the whole cake. I usually just scoop out a couple of cups and put it into a sanitized jar. Clean put the fermenter and then put the new brew in there and add the scooped up yeast. I have never tried it but some say you can store the scooped up yeast for a week and still use it.

I just grabbed some yeast from an Irish Red yesterday and pitched it into a milk stout I brewed. Fermentation started up very fast.
 
You'll find a lot of good discussions on here about this. You'll have better luck if you remove most of the cake prior to dumping fresh wort on it. Run your volume/OG through a pitching calculator for volume of slurry and only leave that amount.
 
If your cake is light on hop trub, I don't see a problem. The yeast will be surely dormant so I bet the first 24 hrs will be quiet. I just pitched on top of a cake that sat 5 days after I racked the donor wort to secondary.

If you can rack your donor to secondary, you could dump the cake in a mason jar and refrigerate it for a couple weeks until your next brew.
 
You'll have better luck if you remove most of the cake prior to dumping fresh wort on it. Run your volume/OG through a pitching calculator for volume of slurry and only leave that amount.

This.

Pitching directly onto a cake is almost always massively over-pitching, even for really really big beers.
 
I've pitched on the yeast cake several times. I just rack off the done wort and pour in the new. Easy Peasy. Fermentation really takes off fast.

One time I racked off and had to wait 3 days for the new wort. Just sealed the primary and waited until I was ready and no problems.
 
I've racked onto a full 5 gallon yeast cake, but more often onto 2-2.5 gallon small beer yeast cakes. I've used them as a starter for 4-5 gallon big beers with success.
An 1.042 Irish red is only a little above starter wort gravity, so the yeast shouldn't be too stressed. A 5 gallon cake will be overpitching, so it would be better to save slurry instead. Storing a yeast cake in a fermentor for 1 month is a long time too, and I doubt that it would be healthy for the yeast.
Overpitching is tough on a homebrew scale, but a 5 gallon cake from a small beer used for a barleywine would certainly still be overpitching. Be prepared for a vigorous, fast ferment with lots of blowoff, and fewer esters and phenols (fruity/spicy flavors) if you do decide to do it.
IMO the biggest issue is a month old yeast cake, rather than the overpitching aspect of it. Several new packs of yeast, and/or a starter aren't going to cost much, but a ruined batch of barleywine (and the time invested) will.
 
I usually let my beers ferment in the primary for month then rack to a keg. So in this case it would be a month since i initially pitched on the donor beer before I rack then pitch the barleywine wort on the cake. Would that still be too long of a wait?

I can always brew earlier

I guess I could scoop some cake out for my next brew.
 
I usually let my beers ferment in the primary for month then rack to a keg. So in this case it would be a month since i initially pitched on the donor beer before I rack then pitch the barleywine wort on the cake. Would that still be too long of a wait?

Above refrigeration/storage temps, viability drops pretty quickly after fermentation is finished.
 
CharlosCarlies said:
Above refrigeration/storage temps, viability drops pretty quickly after fermentation is finished.

Ok I get it now. It's been 2 weeks since original pitch so ill take my final FG tomorrow, rack to keg and save the slurry in the fridge till next weekend
 
Should be fine. Putting a few cups of the slurry into a sanitized sealed jar with distilled water over it (no nutrients) in the fridge will keep it dormant and ready to re-pitch up to about ten days out or so.
 
I think the main question here is not cell count or overpitching, but age of yeast cake. Any issues with sticking an airlock back on the carboy after racking and using the yeast again in 2 weeks to a month?
 
I've been considering just pitching directly over a yeast cake too...

But my LHBS owner keeps discouraging it
I'm thinking that's more about selling me more yeast than anything else though...
Everyone once in a while their advice is a little self-serving...

Gonna give it a try with next batch from a pale ale to IPA this weekend
 
the one thing i would be worried about is autolysis of the yeast if it is a month old. I have pitched on plenty of yeast cakes and have had great results. especially smaller beers to bigger beers. i personally would not use a yeast cake that is a month old, if i pitch on yeast cake it is typically on two weeks old. you can always wash the yeast with sterile water and do a mini fermentation and taste the sample. I would use some fresh yeast to avoid any problems
 
I've been considering just pitching directly over a yeast cake too...

But my LHBS owner keeps discouraging it
I'm thinking that's more about selling me more yeast than anything else though...
Everyone once in a while their advice is a little self-serving...

Assuming your sanitation is good, you can definitely re-pitch the slurry, but at least try and measure the cell count versus just pitching on the entire cake.
 
Thanks! After reading several other threads

It sounds like the using entire yeast cake may be "overpitching" - which can have some consequences...

So I may follow method others suggest by using 1/2 or 1/4 of cake to get closer to proper amt of yeast

Not exact science but... Seems like an ok compromise for something I'm just gonna drink at home and not submitting for
Competition or anything...
 
I have brewed three beers back to back pitching on the same cake without scooping any out I feel it is almost impossible to over pitch, the cake was huge for the third beer and was the best stout I have brewed to date I wouldn't worry about it just another risk of contamination by trying to get some out
 
I pitch on cakes all the time. I love it. Definately go smaller beer to bigger beer, and also be aware that you will probably never be able to reproduce the resulting product, so its a no-no for competitions and the like, but if its just for your own consumption, do it, and DO use a blowoff tube.

In fact, my usual rotation of brewdays goes something like: IPA (rack to secondary, dump IPA cake), Session beer (goes down same day I rack the IPA, on new yeast meant primarily for the third style in this chain), Bottle both session and IPA two weeks later, and drop a big beer on the session cake. Speeds up the rotation by at least a week, keeps the pipeline full and varied.
 
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