As a beginner do you feel your beer is not as good?

As a beginner, do you feel your beer isn't as good as other beer (commercial) that you drink? I've done 8 batches so far and they've all been extract. I plan on upgrading to AG, but while most of my beer is good and some of it is great I still feel that there are higher quality brews out there.

I learn more with every batch I do, but if I weren't a persistent person this would most likely discourage me. I may be overly critical because it's my own stuff and other people have told me it's great, but my beer isn't good enough to me. Does anyone else share this point of view on their own brews?

I feel that my beers are not as good as commercials, but I am only on my 3rd batch. But then again I can barely make rice and I'm brewing drinkable (at least for me) beer.

Haha, fair enough.

I think brewers as a whole are more critical of thier own beers.
Keep working on your processes, paying more attention to little things (ie. temps, timing, water, yeast types etc.) and your beer will continue to improve.
Read alot!

Bull

I dont know, i think homebrew tastes different to commercial brew, but this taste is neither better nor worse, i think it just different.
More variety for life thats all =]

I'll definitely agree with the idea that brewers are more critical of their beer. Better to strive for continual improvement than rest on your laurels.

Join a good homebrew club. There were at least 5 beers at my last one that were easily better than any commercial I have tasted in the style. Unfortunately, none were mine.

I must say though, I have brewed a couple that I did not feel a need to buy commercial while I still had them on tap. I also got a little emotional when the keg kicked.

Dude, give yourself a break. You have made eight (8) batches of beer. Commercial brewers do it for a LIVING, and most of them went to school for it, plus have a gazillion years of homebrewing experience before that. Your brews will get better, and more consistent. That is the important thing.

I think it depends on what you are comparing yourself to. I have done 7 batches since March.

If you are comparing yourself to a well known and highly recognized commercial beer (Bell's, Stone, New Glarus, etc) then yours probably is not as good. Those brewers needed time to refine their recipe and perfect their process.

However, there are a lot of crappy commericial beers out there also. I have had really good, ok, and "I am about to dump a case" batches. Like others have said, each time I learn something and hopefully improve. If we were perfect the first time it wouldn't be much of a hobby now would it?

My best advice to beginners would be to keep it simple. Learn everything about fermentation and yeast; flavors and aging. Then do your best to make the best beer you can.

I am with you, a lot of people have told me that my beer is really good, but those people arent real big craft drinkers so I think that they just associate homebrew with that stronger taste (as compared to BMC). I personally can pick out the flaws in my beer. I am about 6-8 batches in, and next week will be my first AG. I have done 2 PMs and have one scheduled for this afternoon. I like to think that each one of my batches has gotten progressively better, especially with better fermentation temp control. That is, IMHO, the single most important factor to improve the brews. So much so that I am building a fermentation/cellaring closet.

I brewed a partial mash Rye IPA kit from Northern Brewer, and dry hopped it in addition to the recipe. I tasted it yesterday and can honestly say it's as good as any commercial craft beer out there. I drink a lot of craft beer, and think I have a pretty good palate, and it tasted spot on. I am completely blown away, and this has really hooked me on brewing.

I feel my first one wasn't as good as it could have been but that's because I started really late at night not estimating how long it would take and started rushing towards the end. From now on I start first thing in the morning after cleaning everything and preparing star san night before

My very first batch is what hooked me for good. It was so much better than commercial brews! Extract amber ale, and it was superb. I liked it better than Sam Adams for sure. Now, I have had less than stellar batches since, but none undrinkable. There was an uncarbonated porter, it just needed a little extra TLC. A raspberry wheat where I boiled the fruit and had this crazy thick pectin haze. It wasn't pretty but it was prety damn tasty. My blueberry blonde (first AG) I took preboil SG measurements and did not adjust for temperature (150F will change that reading A LOT) and thuoght I had a really inefficient mash/sparge. I added a few lbs of DME when really, I was just stupid. The beer has a alcoholic bite (and almost double the ABV intended), but it sure is drinkable.

Then again, I always have done full boils and I have tasted one partial boil extract and it wasn't all that tasty... in any case there are a hundred factors that coul dbe why you have a less than great impression of your beer, but as long as its good enough for you to drink and share and enjoy, then keep on keepin on man.

Also, AG isn't necessarily a "step up". Extracts can be superb. There are medal winning extract brews. There are other factors that need to be controlled, thats all. AG is simply more things TO control. It is also more work. If you are the type to be happy with baking a cake from the box, then you should be happy with extract beer. Betty Crocker would probably make a damn good funfetti beer if she tried. I refuse to do anything unless it is from scratch, so AG was a natural progression after nearly a year of extracts. I pay for it with intensity of labor usually, but I feel more satisfied.
To each their own.
Rockandroll

I had a photography instructor who told us all to look at 10,000 pictures before submitting a portfolio for review. In his book "Outliers" Malcolm Gladwell postulates that it takes about 10,000 hours to become exceptional at something. That's a lot of time and unless your 8 batches took a lot more time than mine did, you're not even skimming the surface. Many commercial brewers exceeded that 10,000 hour mark before going commercial. Add to that the fact that they are working on perfecting a small number of recipes and that they have commercial level control on there process and ingredients I don't think that they're beer is really good should shock you.

That being said, I brew partial boil extract, my next upgrade will be full boil and then fermentation control. I have brewed about the same amount as you and have come up with 2 beers that I am really proud of, that I want people to ask for and that I want to offer them. In both cases I took copious notes so that I can repeat the process and make that great beer again.

I'll never be a commercial brewer and I may never hot 10,000 brewing hours but I can make a really good beer and can repeat it if I work really hard at it. Since, I do this for fun I'm fine with that.

An artist is the most critical of his own work. It may never be good enough for you and you might have to live with that. If only there was some kind of pill you could take after brewing it to forget you brewed it and fool yourself into thinking you bought it in a store

Give yourself a break. You can produce great beer from your own home and even beer that rivals commercial offerings, but since you are a beginner, just like me, you can't expect to run before you can crawl. I don't know what you do for a living, but I'd bet that if the head brewer from any commercial brewery replaced you for a week or two, he wouldn't be able to do as good a job as you do on a regular basis. It's basically the same thing for brewing. These guys brew all day, every day.

Now, this doesn't mean you can't make better beer for your own tastes once you have experience on your side. After all, you don't have customers to please or corporate demands to follow.

i've done 14 batches. 7 have been "meh", 4 "damn good", and 3 "f*** yeah!" I'm happy with it.
The fact that we brew such a variety of beer as homebrewers also doesn't help our good to great ratio.

Yeah, I get bored doing the same thing over and over, so I rarely brew the same recipe twice. There are a couple that I've made 4 or 5 times though because my friends liked them so much they requested I make it (I even had one friend get me a gift certificate to a LHBS because I kept refusing his money to make the beer he was requesting, I was just making it because I enjoyed it) I have found that when I repeat a recipe, tweaking it here or there (because I get bored) I've come up with some really spectacular beers. Practice makes yummy!

You're always more critical of you own brews than others will be. I've had beers that I thought were "meh" but sent them in to contests anyways and they placed. I seem to be able to pick out every little flaw in my own brew and others do not.

As far as homebrew not being as good as commercial brew I have to beg to differ. If you're into IPA's of hoppy pale ales you can make beers that are better and unlike anything you can buy in a store. I'm always disappointed in hoppy beers that I buy from the store. I think my hoppy beers are 100 times better when they are in their prime than anything I can buy.

I'm about 50/50 on my new recipes turning out as intended. I have a few "go-to" recipes that I brew pretty frequently. Experiments are hit or miss. You win some and you lose some.

I've been brewing for three months now and I have enough problems with efficiency, making starters, hitting estimated gravities etc, etc etc. However, all of my batches have turned into beer A couple of my friends have even said "i'd pay for this at a bar" so I guess my beer does have it's merits.

Eric

The only bad beer I made was from a Coopers prehopped kit. The other attempts might not have been great, but they were definitely good enough for me (and my friends) to consume with gusto!

Each time I brew, I'm still learning. Just when I understand most extracts, I try different grains. Then, different yeasts. And so on. I'm dabbling in water chemistry now. There is no way that I will ever be "finished" learning and growing as a brewer. Hopefully, that means that my beers are improving too!

There are a couple of things you can do right now to make even kit beers taste better- one is fermentation temperature control. If the yeast strain lists a temperature range of 60-70, stay in that zone! You can do it with a swamp cooler, a cool basement, etc, but you'll notice a huge improvement in the beer. The second thing is take good care of your yeast. That means making a starter for liquid yeast, as you want to pitch the correct amount of yeast. Use good quality yeast (ditch Munton's and Cooper's) and the beer will be markedly better in the first or second batch, I promise.

I would say that all of my beers are every bit as good as a comparable commercial example- sometimes better if I don't like that particular beer!

I only do extract, but overall I've been pretty happy with the beers I made. Can they get better, sure, but I'm still happy, I just remind myself I made them.

Yooper_Brew said:

There are a couple of things you can do right now to make even kit beers taste better- one is fermentation temperature control. If the yeast strain lists a temperature range of 60-70, stay in that zone! You can do it with a swamp cooler, a cool basement, etc, but you'll notice a huge improvement in the beer. The second thing is take good care of your yeast. That means making a starter for liquid yeast, as you want to pitch the correct amount of yeast. Use good quality yeast (ditch Munton's and Cooper's) and the beer will be markedly better in the first or second batch, I promise.

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Both HUGE points here, in retrospect, some of my earlier beers seemed better than they really were, just because I was so excited to be trying them. For me, temp control was and, even after moving to all-grain, still is the number one factor in making a quality beer, followed very closely by yeast health. I still brew the occasional extract batch and they are great beers as long as I'm paying attention to my yeast and keeping them happy.

If you follow known recipes and ferment at the correct temperature your beer will be great. Often better than commercial beers.

Common off flavors I have seen and their causes:

• Don't ferment ales too hot. The suggested temperatures are usually too high for most yeasts I have used so far. They will work but will usually not taste great. It really does make a difference. Even for Belgian yeasts, start them off on the low end of the temperature range.
  
• Other off flavors I have seen are extract scorching (even a little is bad and will screw up your brewpot for the next batch). Don't add extract while on the burner.
  
• Adding either too much spice or adding the spice way to early in the boil. I now just usually add them in secondary if at all.
  
• Don't drink all of your beer to early. I know its tough, but it will get better with age, although this depends on the style, alcohol content, hops etc.

I've made some beer that was soo good I couldn't believe I actually made it. I've also made some that made me want to puke as soon as I tasted it. I've dumped a few batches I think may have been infected. I sure miss the really good batches though.

jbrookeiv said:

I brewed a partial mash Rye IPA kit from Northern Brewer, and dry hopped it in addition to the recipe. I tasted it yesterday and can honestly say it's as good as any commercial craft beer out there. I drink a lot of craft beer, and think I have a pretty good palate, and it tasted spot on. I am completely blown away, and this has really hooked me on brewing.

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Congrats. I'm stoked for my Imperial Stout and I'm hoping it's going to be great. I still have a good 2 1/2 months until I try one though. However, I've got a good feeling about this beer.

sportscrazed2 said:

An artist is the most critical of his own work. It may never be good enough for you and you might have to live with that. If only there was some kind of pill you could take after brewing it to forget you brewed it and fool yourself into thinking you bought it in a store

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Hilarious. Thanks for the laugh.

I really think giving it the full two weeks in the fridge is pretty critical, especially for ales.

If you're feeling bad about yourself, make a nice, simple wheat beer -- you'll feel better.

Justibone said:

I really think giving it the full two weeks in the fridge is pretty critical, especially for ales.

If you're feeling bad about yourself, make a nice, simple wheat beer -- you'll feel better.

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I just made a Raspberry Wheat with raspberry extract. It's OK, but the extract tastes too candy like. I LOVE the stouts I make though...

dfc said:

I just made a Raspberry Wheat with raspberry extract. It's OK, but the extract tastes too candy like. I LOVE the stouts I make though...

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The simple part is key. Whenever I mess with a wheat I end up regretting it a bit... "Why didn't I just leave it alone?"

Unless you take the time to really get your system down, adding fresh-fruit/sugar/kool-aid/candy/extract/flavoring/dye/candi/puppy-tears to a wheat usually ends poorly.

I never keep score. How do I compare myself to other brewers? By height. (HT to anyone who gets the reference.)

On a more serious note, I make beer for me. That means I'm going to really like my beer if I meet my goals. There are a lot of beers out there I don't particularly care for. At least half of the commercial IPA examples I've ever had are terrible IMHO. I'm sure somebody likes them, but it's not me. Of course I'm going to prefer my own to those. On the other hand, there are some commercial beers I absolutely love. I've never had a bad commercial Dunkel. I don't think I could ever make anything as good consistently even compared to the lesser-regarded Dunkels like Warsteiner.

hal2814 said:

I never keep score. How do I compare myself to other brewers? By height. (HT to anyone who gets the reference.)

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Judge Smails: You know, you should play with Dr. Beeper and myself. I mean, he's been club champion for three years running and I'm no slouch myself.

Ty Webb: Don't sell yourself short Judge, you're a tremendous slouch.

But anyway, one of the reasons I started brewing again was because none of the beers I was getting really excited me anymore. I have a decent local selection of micros near me with great reputations. However after so many years none of them tripped my trigger anymore.

One of my master plans is to take a single recipe and just expand upon it; make it my own and learn from my mistakes and tailor it to my own tastes and preferences.

Skarekrough said:

One of my master plans is to take a single recipe and just expand upon it; make it my own and learn from my mistakes and tailor it to my own tastes and preferences.

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This is my plan for my house beer -- I'm thinking it's going to be a wheat.

Why wheat? I've brewed better wheat than anything else, wheat has complexity, variability can be desirable batch-to-batch, I like it, SWMBO likes it, most people who come over will probably like it... and I won't mind drinking the mistakes while I perfect it!

YMMV!

Justibone said:

This is my plan for my house beer -- I'm thinking it's going to be a wheat.

Why wheat? I've brewed better wheat than anything else, wheat has complexity, variability can be desirable batch-to-batch, I like it, SWMBO likes it, most people who come over will probably like it... and I won't mind drinking the mistakes while I perfect it!

YMMV!

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That sounds like a winner right there! If it's getting consumed then you know you're doing something right.

Now you just need to convince those consuming it that if, ya know, they chipped in some cash now and again you can keep this party of top-shelf beer available the gravy train won't come to a halt!

Of course, this is kind of counter to my philosophy of brewing which is "I'm making a Stout that I like and everyone else can piss off if they don't like it."

No. But it is getting better.

I have been brewing since October. I have brewed a new recipe every 2-3 weeks. The last 5 have been all grain. I feel i know my system and hit my numbers. I usually primary for 3 weeks then bottle and drink them after another 3 weeks. The beer i am making doesnt taste bad, and it is carbonated, but i am not real happy with the results when it comes to the taste. I am loving everything about brewing and want to keep doing it but if the end results doesnt become much better, im not sure if I can keep doing it. I am wondering if simply I shouldt consume the beer until 6 weeks in bottle? thats my next test with the current batches I have bottled. For the brewers that bottle, how long do you guys wait until drinking most of them?

Go purchase a $4.5M brewery, and you'll make plenty quality beer. haha

grasshopperfirestarter said:

I have been brewing since October. I have brewed a new recipe every 2-3 weeks. The last 5 have been all grain. I feel i know my system and hit my numbers. I usually primary for 3 weeks then bottle and drink them after another 3 weeks. The beer i am making doesnt taste bad, and it is carbonated, but i am not real happy with the results when it comes to the taste. I am loving everything about brewing and want to keep doing it but if the end results doesnt become much better, im not sure if I can keep doing it. I am wondering if simply I shouldt consume the beer until 6 weeks in bottle? thats my next test with the current batches I have bottled. For the brewers that bottle, how long do you guys wait until drinking most of them?

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My buddy made a brown that he wasn't very happy with, despite it being a very popular recipe on this site with about a gazillion recommendations. I tasted it, and the problem was his efficiency I believe -- it ended up tasting watery, like a session beer.

If you have done some all grain, and you aren't happy with your beer, try going back to extract and see if you can make a beer you really really like. There is no shame in extract brewing -- just extra expense and less flexibility.

Without knowing precisely what it is that you find disappointing about your own beers, I can't give much better advice than that. Except to say this... anyone can make a tasty wheat.

I always thought the beer I brewed was damn good, but not untill my friend from England was here for a visit did I feel like I had made it as a home brewer, after the first glass he said both my Irish Stout and my Ale were "freaking awesome".

+1 to picking a house style and just brewing it over and over again until you have nailed it. There are a lot of variables that go into the end result of your beer's taste, the only way to know what is and isn't working in your process is to limit the number of variables that are changing from batch to batch. So many people on here wonder why their brews are so different from batch to batch, but then thy say that they've made a raspberry wheat, a Russian vanilla imperial stout, and a coffee caramel two pump no whip lager for their first three batches. So the answer to the question "what changed between the differed batches you've made" is: virtually everything! I'm all about brewing what sounds good to you, but you can't just jump in and expect to make a Sublimely Self-Righteous on your first try out of the gate.

When I got to music school in college I had to take piano lessons as part of the curriculum. I was a trombone player and had never so much as laid a finger on a piano key. We started by playing scales over and over and over again, just like I did when I picked up the trombone in 5th grade. So here I was, an accomplished musician, struggling to bang out a C scale on a piano for an entire semester. It was frustrating as hell because I knew what a beautiful Beethoven sonata should sound like, I just didn't have the skills to do it.

Brewing beer is the same thing. You know what a great beer tastes like and you want to be able to replicate that. But you need to learn the "C scales" of brewing before you can bust out the "sonatas." Find a style you really like and get the basics down. Your process should be second nature before you start going crazy with different flavors. The upside is that you could perfect your craft in a few months as opposed to the years it takes to be really good at a musical instrument. And, in the process, you might make some really good beer before you even know what you're doing.