American Pale Ale Cascades / Orange Pale Ale

JMass, thanks for the info. I use buckets and there was lots of activity in the air locks prior to my putting them in the fermenter (read temp controlled chest freezer). Now I don't see anything in them but I know that's not a good indicator. My primary concern was it being to cold. So the temp range is the same as US05 - thanks for that. Looks like I'm good to go.

whutever said:

JMass, thanks for the info. I use buckets and there was lots of activity in the air locks prior to my putting them in the fermenter (read temp controlled chest freezer). Now I don't see anything in them but I know that's not a good indicator. My primary concern was it being to cold. So the temp range is the same as US05 - thanks for that. Looks like I'm good to go.

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Whutever, I checked a few more sites for Safale 04. According to MoreBeer
"Recommended temperature range: 64ºF-72ºF"
Homebrew Heaven: recommended temperature range of 68-74 deg F.
ibrew.com (looks like the official pamphlet): Recommended fermentation temperature: 15C – 24C, so that is 59F to 75F
I saw another site that had different temperatures, but in the same ballpark as the 1st 2 above. I assumed that this yeast would follow the characteristics of other ale yeast, but apparently it is more finnicky(?)

a 2002 comment from the Beeradvocate:
"My experience with this yeast is that any temp above 68 causes off flavors, yet under 64 and it will just drop out - difficult for most homebrewers to accomplish."

However, there is some confusion between ambient temps and internal beer temps, so I'm not sure what temperature they are talking about. A later response to a runaway Krausen says:

"If ambient temps are 66 the internal temp is probably 70-74, too high for this yeast, unless you use a water bath. Hence the runaway kreusen."

If there is absolutely no activity now, just take the specific gravity. Some responses I've read said that the yeast may ferment out in only a few days. If the SG is still too high, you may need to repitch the yeast.

Well, that is interesting. I brewed Saturday and put them in the chest freezer Monday am. When I had the buckets sitting in the house where the temp was 68° the temp strips read 76°/78° with lots of activity. But when I put them in the fermenator at 63° the air lock activity stopped. So coincidence? I guess I'll raise to 68° and go from there and start taking gravity readings. This is the first time I've used this yeast so I have no experience with it.

Finally kegged this tonight. It was chugging along in secondary, but only about one bubble ever 10 minutes or so. I want to get this going because my daughter is coming to visit tomorrow night. I added speiss (unfermented wort) to the keg as well as hops. It should be fine. The FSG was around 1.015.

One day after kegging I had to try it. It had a strong orange taste. My guess is that there was extra orange in the speiss I put in and it settled to the bottom. When I drank the FSG cylinder, it didn't taste so orangey. My batch may become less orangey as it goes along. Also I just dried hopped yesterday, so the balance will be changing, I'm sure as the days go on.

Thanks for the recipe.

I just realized, I didn't first wort hop. I wasn't familiar with that procedure. I just read up on it tonite. Well, next time, I'll have to use the light crystal malt and FWH and see if it is different. I don't know if FWH is like Hopback beer, but I do like the taste of that.

JMass said:

I just realized, I didn't first wort hop. I wasn't familiar with that procedure. I just read up on it tonite. Well, next time, I'll have to use the light crystal malt and FWH and see if it is different. I don't know if FWH is like Hopback beer, but I do like the taste of that.

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FWH is supposed to give a more 'mellow' bitterness than your typical 60 minute addition. There is much debate on the subject which I won't try to rehash here. I'd say experiment and see if you like the results. I do.

This sounds pretty cool. I'm planning on brewing a simple pale ale with some light DME, crystal malt, cascade and possibly some amarillo (depends on how much cascade I have in my freezer). Maybe I should add some orange zest and coriander and see how it turns out.

iddqd said:

This sounds pretty cool. I'm planning on brewing a simple pale ale with some light DME, crystal malt, cascade and possibly some amarillo (depends on how much cascade I have in my freezer). Maybe I should add some orange zest and coriander and see how it turns out.

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I support this plan.

Blacklab, just enjoying a great beer and getting ready for the game. Great recipe, great beer!

Hey, I brewed this back in april, posted about it here, loved it and also said I may be moving to Corvallis soon......so here I am settled into Eugene instead.......loving Oregon for the most part, and I just ordered a lb of Cascades to brew this one up again. Eugene has really nice soft, clean tap water (as opposed to the hard Midwestern water of my past), and I'm hoping that will improve this recipe further, though I may add a little gypsum to grab the hops a bit better.....

One question for you guys.....I have been missing my marks since I purchased a new brew rig out here,due to miscalculations in startng water amounts (somehow beersmith has been steering me wrong)....how much water do you generally pull for this recipe? Thanks, and I can't wait to wrap my lips around this one again.....so delicious.

I have been using the spreadsheet found at this link to calculate volumes for about two years. Works great.

http://www.bayareamashers.org/content/maindocs/BatchSparging.htm

Welcome to Oregon, Eugene is a great spot! I'm not sure about the water there, but I always add Burton salts to our water up here in PDX.

I believe you are on EWEB water there which should be pretty soft as well (mountain runoff).

Hey guys,

Well I kegged this up about 5 days ago and brought some to a new years party last night for the official taste test.. This turned out to be a very well balanced beer. I did a few things different. I accidentally used Caravienne Malt instead of the vienna malt and I also used 2.75 oz of sweet orange peel and Wyeast 1056.. All in all a great beer, but there is too much orange.. You can definitely taste it and the orange flavor lingers on your taste buds for what seems like forever.. I was worried about not enough orange and I think I got too much! lol.. Oh well, a great beer, and a great recipe, and people loved it.. Thanks!

I had some problems too. I have tannins in my beer, so I need to pay more attention to my sparging next time. They interfere with the taste of hops. However, it is a good looking beer. My brother in law says its great and I'm too fussy.

blacklab said:

I have been using the spreadsheet found at this link to calculate volumes for about two years. Works great.

http://www.bayareamashers.org/content/maindocs/BatchSparging.htm

Welcome to Oregon, Eugene is a great spot! I'm not sure about the water there, but I always add Burton salts to our water up here in PDX.

I believe you are on EWEB water there which should be pretty soft as well (mountain runoff).

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Thanks, I'll give that spreadsheet a try. I am on EWEB water, which is indeed soft. I've been adding Gypsum to each batch to firm it up a little. Do you think I'd do better with Burton Salts though? I haven't tried them yet.....

Question regarding the orange peel. It says 2 oz of zest in the recipe. I took 4 oz of fresh orange peel(after being depithed and scraped), cut it into 1/8 inch strips, and dried it down to 1.2 oz. How much of this should I use for the recipe? All of it? More, less?

I brewed this on the 8th...I doubled the recipe for a 10gallon batch. I plan to leave it in primary until the 28th and keg it to finish off and add the hops.

It calls for 2oz of cascade dryhopped in the keg.....is this too much?

Anyone add just 1oz per 5 gallons?

Thanks
Joe

IMO its not too much.

annasdadhockey said:

Question regarding the orange peel. It says 2 oz of zest in the recipe. I took 4 oz of fresh orange peel(after being depithed and scraped), cut it into 1/8 inch strips, and dried it down to 1.2 oz. How much of this should I use for the recipe? All of it? More, less?

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I would use all of it.. I am not an expert on oranges, but I've always heard that you should use sweet "Valencia" oranges for the peel.. I dont know what kind of orange that is (ie: the common supermarket variety?) but you may want to double check that if you havent already. I used 2.75 oz of dried sweet orange and I thought it was just BARELY too much, though twelve other people didn't ( I am very critical of my beers).

ILOVEBEER said:

I brewed this on the 8th...I doubled the recipe for a 10gallon batch. I plan to leave it in primary until the 28th and keg it to finish off and add the hops.

It calls for 2oz of cascade dryhopped in the keg.....is this too much?

Anyone add just 1oz per 5 gallons?

Thanks
Joe

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I wouldnt skimp on the hops for this one, if I were you.. They bring soooo much aroma to this beer to complement the orange and coriander.. Could you get away with 1 oz? Yeah.. Could you tell the difference that you only used one instead of two? OH yeah, if you had ever smelled/tasted with two.. One oz will still make a great brew, but it's all up to you. I have been known to skimp on dry hopping to save a few bucks, but this brew really does call for them, IMHO..:rockin:

Has anyone brewed this w/o the coriander? Just wondering how much and what kind of flavor comes from it?? Just thinking.

Thanks

Funny you say that....This is my 3rd AG batch taht I have done with my RIMS and for some reason.....I tweak the recipe a bit, don't ask me why but I do and I shouldn't. I will dry hop as planned with 2oz in each 5 gallon corney. NOW THE MAGIC QUESTION...How long is too long to leave the hop bag in the corney?

So, I brewed this for the second time yesterday using whole hops. I recently picked up a 3-tier system from an ex-homebrewer in the area and have been struggling to get in tune with the system. Blacklab, that spreadsheet helped with determining water volume, but what it doesn't take into account (nor does beersmith for that matter) is the massive amount of hop material with whole hops. I think they soaked up nearly as much water as the grain did, honestly. I was prepared this time with extra water, but didn't up the grain to account for it, so I brewed this to about 1.048 and ended up adding a lb of dry amber extract just to bump it up in the 50's....it looks beautiful in the better bottle and is already popping off 12 hours later on a dry packet of S-04. can't wait. I used fresh zest this time, too.

bbone66 said:

Has anyone brewed this w/o the coriander? Just wondering how much and what kind of flavor comes from it?? Just thinking.

Thanks

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Haven't brewed this without it, but I can tell you that the coriander adds a subtle spice and really amplifies the citrus nose of the beer. Crushed coriander smells a lot like a peppered grapefruit

ILOVEBEER said:

Funny you say that....This is my 3rd AG batch taht I have done with my RIMS and for some reason.....I tweak the recipe a bit, don't ask me why but I do and I shouldn't. I will dry hop as planned with 2oz in each 5 gallon corney. NOW THE MAGIC QUESTION...How long is too long to leave the hop bag in the corney?

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I usually leave it in there until it's empty, but that's just me.

I wouldn't want to take the hops out once they are in the keg.

I was drinking this last night and it was tasting good. Talk about food pairings. Try this with some quesadillas. Wow. I made mine with jalapeno, mexican grated cheese mix, green onion, cilantro, cherry tomato and pork (or whatever leftover meat is in the fridge). I glaze a little Louisiana hot sauce on the outside after I've cooked these on the griddle.

Wow, this recipe looks great. I am hoping to brew it this coming weekend, but had a question before I do. I've never FWH before, and I read up on the basics of it. Pretty much let them steep while the kettle is heating up, but want I dont know is do I remove them once the boil starts, or just keep them in there for the whole time?

Whole time, set it and forget it.

Brewin this tomorrow. Got plenty of cascades and oranges. Ill let you know how my version comes out. Its a summer beer, but im in cali, so ill brew it. Got extra time off from furlough days at my city job, so im brewin.

I brewed this last month and kegging it today....up until your post I did not know what FWH'ing was until the other day....so needless to say I did not do it. I brought to a boil then added the first hop addition. OOOPS oh well. It smells great and I really don't know how it will change the flavor.

I'll let you know how it tastes, I tap it Superbowl Sunday.

I'm 1/2 way through 1 of 2 kegs of this and even though I'm not a fan of Safale-04 it's really quite good.

I kegged my ten gallons a week ago...I tap them the 5th....can't wait! I used gelatin for the first time on this batch and it came out CLEAR as day!

whutever said:

I'm 1/2 way through 1 of 2 kegs of this and even though I'm not a fan of Safale-04 it's really quite good.

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05 or any other clean ale yeast works fine as well. I just happen to like 04.

blacklab said:

05 or any other clean ale yeast works fine as well. I just happen to like 04.

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Yeah, I'm definitely brewing this one again and will use '05. I cleared it with Gelatine and my wife told me that it looked like I was drinking something that was brewed professionally.

Thanks for the awesome recipe by the way.

Yes thanks for the recipe...I try it tonight.....I'll let you know how it came out

I really liked this beer. I used gelatin for the first time and it did clear it up substantially, but the dry hopping in the corney gave me particles in my glass....which I am ok with.

Once in a while I will taste orange and other times I don't. I wonder how it would taste with more orange zest added to it?

ILOVEBEER said:

I really liked this beer. I used gelatin for the first time and it did clear it up substantially, but the dry hopping in the corney gave me particles in my glass....which I am ok with.

Once in a while I will taste orange and other times I don't. I wonder how it would taste with more orange zest added to it?

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I made this with 2.75 oz of orange peel and I personally felt there was too much orange.. However 6 or 7 other people loved it and told me not to change a thing.. So, go figure.. In short, it will be fine with more zest, and I think you could even do the full 3 oz and be fine.. But that orange flavor will cling to your tongue! I can taste it a full hour after I drink it. It's a hard flavor to shake, I imagine because of all the oils...

I know what you mean....hey you know how i mentioned that I was getting a bunch of hop material in my glass....after 10-12 glasses it is gone. I used a fine bag and whole leaf cascade...I didnt think it would deposit particles, but I guess they gotta go somewhere. My beer looks exactly as the glass pictured in the original post. I am happy with it and will brew this again for sure!

I just brewed a half batch of this (2.5 Gallons) and I will have to say it smells and looks great so far. I used fresh orange peel, and zested two large oranges for this. Do you think this was enough for a half batch. I had no scale so it was just an estimate.

Damn, I was going to make this tomorrow but my starter (made from the sediments from a bottle) hasn't grown enough and the LHBS is closed. Might have to postpone it a few days.