Steeping grains: How much H2O? How long?

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HoppyDaze

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Amount Item Type % or IBU
5.00 lb Extra Light Dry Extract (3.0 SRM) Dry Extract 83.3 %
1.00 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 16.7 %
0.25 oz Centennial [9.50%] (45 min) Hops 7.8 IBU
0.25 oz Centennial [9.50%] (20 min) Hops 5.1 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [7.80%] (10 min) Hops 2.5 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [7.80%] (5 min) Hops 1.4 IBU
1 Pkgs Nottingham (Danstar #-) Yeast-Ale

Im doing this quick extract recipe tonight and was wondering how I know the amount of water to use for steeping the cara-pils? Im used to doing AG batches where I use 1.25 - 1.75 qt per lb. Does the same hold true for steeping this Cara-pils? and why does steeping only take 15 minutes when mashing take an hour?

How long should I steep? In how much water? how much water to sparge?
 
I've been brewing with specialty grains and always used more water than what you'd normally use for a mash, usually like 2 to 3 quarts per pound. My guess is that's partly to get more flavors extracted in less time. In BCS, Jamil says "the ratio of steeping water to grain should be less than 1 gallon per pound. This will help keep the pH under control and minimize tannin extraction." With carapils I think you'd really have to overdo it.
 
What would be the effects of steeping in 2 gallons? did this over the weekend on my batch hope it's alright.
 
I use the amount of water that I used for my boil.

If I am making a 5 gallon batch, I fill my kettle with about 4.75 gals of water and steep with that.

Am I doing it wrong?
 
The amount of water you steep in shouldn't really matter since 2 gallons @ 150 degrees is the exact same as 4 gallons @ 150 degrees. Tannins get extracted if the temp gets too high, or you squeeze the hell out of the grains when pulling the bag. Correct me if I'm wrong.... Oh and I steep for 30 minutes.
 
I thought I was doing it right.

I let the grains drip out in a strainer over a bowl and pour it in during mid boil. I never squeeze it.

I have steeped for 30-50 minutes
 
Crap I squeezed the hell out of my rye in my rye IPA in an attempt to get all the "goodness" out

Brewing is so complicated!
 
Brewing is not that hard. Read "How to Brew"...Palmer recommends around 30mins at +/- 150*F. You can steep a little longer if you want more color and flavor.

I typically steep in about 3/4 quart per pound of grain. After steeping, I pour 1/2 gallon of 150*F water through the grain bag to sparge the last bits out without squeezing or waiting. Works beautifully!

-Tripod
 
You absolutely want to avoid a dilute steep of specialty grains. If you steep the relatively small amount of specialty grains used in an extract recipe in too much water, that small amount of specialty grains is not sufficient to lower the pH of that large amount of water enough to avoid extracting excess tannins from the grain husks. 1-3 quarts of water per pound of specialty grains will avoid a dilute steep.

If you would like to see a great article that was written about this very subject by Chris Colby of BYO magazine please feel free to PM me and I'll be glad to email it to you.
 
You absolutely want to avoid a dilute steep of specialty grains. If you steep the relatively small amount of specialty grains used in an extract recipe in too much water, that small amount of specialty grains is not sufficient to lower the pH of that large amount of water enough to avoid extracting excess tannins from the grain husks. 1-3 quarts of water per pound of specialty grains will avoid a dilute steep.


I'm also one of the people that just has been steeping in whatever I'm using for my partial boil (usually 3-4ish gallons).

So let's say I switch to steeping in 3 quarts:

1) Can I steep in my normal cookware? If I steep in my brew pot there won't be enough water to keep the bag off the bottom, and it will burn. But my normal cookware is not stainless steel or aluminum. I dunno what it is, but it is non-stick (not teflon).

2) Do I need to have hot water ready when I bring the volume up to 3-4 gallons? Or can the water be tap temprature?

Thanks
 
I just keep learning more and more. I just did my first batch in a long time and steeped my grainbag in the 4 gallon partial boil I was using.
Brewing in essence is a fairly simple process, but just like in cooking, it is the little nuances that sneak up on you, and I guess separate the experienced brewers from the novice.
I googled steeping grains and there are quite a few sites suggesting to steep with the intial amount of water you will boil.
I know, I know. Can't trust everything you read on the net. LOL
 
I'm also one of the people that just has been steeping in whatever I'm using for my partial boil (usually 3-4ish gallons).

So let's say I switch to steeping in 3 quarts:

1) Can I steep in my normal cookware? If I steep in my brew pot there won't be enough water to keep the bag off the bottom, and it will burn. But my normal cookware is not stainless steel or aluminum. I dunno what it is, but it is non-stick (not teflon).

2) Do I need to have hot water ready when I bring the volume up to 3-4 gallons? Or can the water be tap temprature?

Thanks

The bag shouldn't burn on the bottom- you're steeping in the 150-160 degree range and the flame should be off.

I like to have some 170 degree water ready in another pot. Then, lift the grain bag and hold it over your pot. A colander or other strainer works great- I put the grainbag in the colander, and pour the 170 degree water over the grain bag, "rinsing" the grains. That can bring you up to your boil volume, so you can turn on the flame and continue.
 
Has anyone ever tried using a metal steaming tray for the steep? My brewing pot is too wide for the one I have, but I wondering if it would yield a better result in a smaller pot since the grain can sit suspended on the tray and partially filtered by some of the holes. I know I've had more than one muslin bag decide to fall apart and I'm not a big fan of chasing chunks around a pot and then digging out the colander (disastrous wassail incident). If anyone has done this, post it so we can know if it works out. My greatest concern would be any off-flavors from the metal of the steeping tray.

I steep at 155 for 45 in my partial boil (3.5 gal) like the directions with the kit said. Time will tell the results. Tastes really good so far.
 
:off:
Im Working on a wheat Wassail beer "wicked witch wheat wassail" lol:drunk:, for the fall have you tried the wassail in a beer

:off: Nope. I leave the wassail making up to my mother nowadays. I was never a huge fan, but it's always a "must" around Christmas. I plan on doing a hard spice cider this year and (hopefully) a barleywine for the year after. I personally don't think wassail in a beer would work very well, especially in a wheat. But maybe it will. You'll have to let us know.
 
I steep in 1-2 quarts per pound on the kitchen stove (150-160* for 30 minutes). I then take that and add it to the rest of my water to start the boil on my burner outside (and add the rest of the extract, hops, etc. then). I think I got this process from Brewing Classic Styles or maybe somewhere else.
 
Geez, I've been steeping in the full 5-6 gallons, and I've never noticed excess tannins. But I will definitely try it with a smaller amount next time to double-check!
 
thanks all...I steeped one pound in 2 quarts of water. Although 2 quarts barely covered the grain bag I was using. It sure didnt seem like I was doing it right. I rinsed by t-bagging the grain bad into 2 quarts of fresh water for about ten minutes...drained the grain bag and all the wort went into five and half gallons of hot water almost to boiling for a total of 6.5 gallons pre-boil...boiled off about a gallon and quarter and ended with exactly 5.5 gallons in the fermenter 1.050 ...pitched at 68 s-04 instead of nottingham. Its been a while since Ive done an extract batch...I forgot how fast they are! I am excited to see how it turns out. It tasted great!

thanks again!
 
The bag shouldn't burn on the bottom- you're steeping in the 150-160 degree range and the flame should be off.

I like to have some 170 degree water ready in another pot. Then, lift the grain bag and hold it over your pot. A colander or other strainer works great- I put the grainbag in the colander, and pour the 170 degree water over the grain bag, "rinsing" the grains. That can bring you up to your boil volume, so you can turn on the flame and continue.

So you heat the water up to 150-160 degrees, turn off the flame, put the grain bag in and then cover? Seems that the temp would go down pretty quickly without the flame turned on. Covering it would be the only way to slow the cooling.
 
yep...do that in the smallest pot you can find that will fit the grains and water. I only lost two degrees last night and I was using a pot that had a ton of head space...
 
So you heat the water up to 150-160 degrees, turn off the flame, put the grain bag in and then cover? Seems that the temp would go down pretty quickly without the flame turned on. Covering it would be the only way to slow the cooling.


An easy way to combat this problem is very simple. Preheat your oven to 150F and place the kettle in the oven. It keeps the perfect temp.
 
Remember guys, this is not mashing. This is steeping. The temperature accuracy in steeping is no where near as important as it is when mashing. All we are doing when we are steeping is making "tea" and extracting the color, sugars and flavors out of the specialty grains. There is no starch conversion occurring.

The most important temperature when steeping is 170˚F. Do not exceed this temperature during the steep to avoid extracting excess tannins from the grain husks. Other than that, any temperature from 140˚F to 165˚F is acceptable.
 
All the recipes (kits) that I have ever used just say to add the steeping grains in the same amount of water that I do the boil in. I may have to try the smaller amount of water to steep in, and then add the rest of the water to boil in. It would seem that it would take a lot longer to reach a boil that when I start the whole thing at 150 degrees. I guess you learn something every day.
 
Amount Item Type % or IBU
5.00 lb Extra Light Dry Extract (3.0 SRM) Dry Extract 83.3 %
1.00 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 16.7 %
0.25 oz Centennial [9.50%] (45 min) Hops 7.8 IBU
0.25 oz Centennial [9.50%] (20 min) Hops 5.1 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [7.80%] (10 min) Hops 2.5 IBU
0.25 oz Cascade [7.80%] (5 min) Hops 1.4 IBU
1 Pkgs Nottingham (Danstar #-) Yeast-Ale

Im doing this quick extract recipe tonight and was wondering how I know the amount of water to use for steeping the cara-pils? Im used to doing AG batches where I use 1.25 - 1.75 qt per lb. Does the same hold true for steeping this Cara-pils? and why does steeping only take 15 minutes when mashing take an hour?

How long should I steep? In how much water? how much water to sparge?


Ahh looks familiar...from BM's Centennial thread no doubt? I brewed this recipe a couple months ago (except I added some Crystal 10 grains to it). I steeped for 20 mins. in 3.5 gals. which was also my boil, then topped up to 5 gal. It fermented out in 3 days but I let it sit for 4 weeks in primary, then bottled. On brew day the wort was yummy. 1 week tester bottle was decent. 2 weeks tester bottle was worse - had me worried. 3 weeks it really started coming around. At 4 weeks the stuff was great. Looking forward to this Saturday (week 5).
 
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