Belgian Pale Ale La Chouffe

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Gordon,
Another question if you don't mind. Do recommend lagering at 32F after 2 weeks (as in Houblon's recipe) or should I just let it sit at room temp for secondary? Thanks.

If you have the setup to lager at that temp then go for it. My lagering consists of kegging it and putting it in the fridge. Two birds with one stone.

Room temp is fine also but.. this beer is very good young and its interesting to watch its progress as it shifts from very young to mature.
 
That made my night. Thanks for sharing the photos. La Chouffe is why I started brewing (a few months ago). Great photos!
 
I am fairly new to brewing and have limited knowledge and experience but I was keen to try this.
Could someone advice on how I managed or changes you would make to how I did it.

I have limited equipment:

Fermentation bucket with airock and Immersion heater
8 gallon pan
Grain bag

Added 16 lbs pilsner malt in a grain bag
Mashed in my pan at 152 f for 1 hours
Lost about 3 f
Stirred every 15 minutes


Removed the grain bag, emptied the mash water using a sanitized jug into my fermentation bucket.

Added the grains in the grain bag back to my pan and sparged at 176 f, I added the water over the top of the grains and left it. I needed to heat the pan slightly to get this heat, I was only a few degrees out before reheating the water.
Stirred the grain a few times


Left it for about 10 minutes, drained my grain bag and then got rid of the grain.

Added my mash water back to the pan and sparge water, added 1 lb of golden syrup (couldn't find any white syrup, live in the UK)
Added 1 oz perle, 0.5oz Styrian, 0.75 oz saaz
Brought to the boil and boiled for 90 minutes.

Removed from the heat added crushed corriander

Cooled in the pan using a copper wort chiller I made, managed to get it down to 24 f in about 20 minutes

transferred to the fermentation bucket using plastic tubing.

Shaked the fermentation bucket, added my starter yeast

Yeast used White Labs WLP550.
Added 2 pints water to 3.5 oz dried malt boiled for ten minutes then cooled to 73 f
Started 24 hours before in a demi john with foil over the top, kept at about 60 f (room temperature) and shook every several hours

Put immersion heater at 75 f and now leaving


Mash water - 5 gallons
Sparge Water 3.3 gallons

Original gravity reading before adding yeast 1.07


Whats your thoughts did I do it right with the kit I have.
Where my water volumes right


My water volumes were slightly different to what I posted but this I believe is what I should of used. I thought I ended up with too much water so boiled for longer and in the end ended up with only 4.2 gallons.

Many thanks
 
I'm about to try this recipe... when i plug 16 lbs belgian pilsner and 1 lbs blonde belgian cani syrup (1.032) into beer smith I get 1.090... Even with just the malt I get 1.084 assuming about 70% efficiency. Is this going to be way too big?
 
If I may add to this and give you some ideas to try if you want:mug:

FG is too high - try it closer to FG 1.08 - 1.012

Bump up the IBU`s

Styrian and Saaz, and coriander



A 1.5L starter is needed to produce a cleaner flavor.

Primary for 14 days as that yeast needs some time to clean up.





<Mash Temps >

62 ºC = 143.6 ºF >>20min

68 ºC = 154.4 ºF >>70min



Ferment around 75-77ºF,

the brewery goes up to > 26 ºC = 78.8 ºF ,but I and others have a hardtime at that temp as the yeast tries to takeoff along with producing too many fusels. They say that yeast dies above 80ºF.



Belgian malt would be best and you can taste the difference, but I understand with your situation.



The Belgian brewers use beet sugar and /or syrups from places such as>

BELGOSUC SUGAR SPECIALITIES

http://www.belgosuc.be/EN/productgamma.asp



But plain cane sugar works just fine, I use beet sugar only as a `tip of the hat to the Belgian brewers. Achouffe only use pilsner malt & sugars(syrups) in all the beers.



I've visited Achouffe twice now for beer research :drunk:

http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/UknowWho2u/Img_0405.jpg

http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/UknowWho2u/Img_0402.jpg

http://i821.photobucket.com/albums/zz138/UknowWho2u/Img_0401.jpg



Why is your protein rest 143? I have never done a step mash but am attempting this right now. Everything I've read says the protein rest is between 120 and 130f?
 
I'm about to try this recipe... when i plug 16 lbs belgian pilsner and 1 lbs blonde belgian cani syrup (1.032) into beer smith I get 1.090... Even with just the malt I get 1.084 assuming about 70% efficiency. Is this going to be way too big?

Depends what you like of course. I like a bigger body in my beer, more mouth feel than the usually dry Belgians have.

If you feel this will be too big a beer, or if your equipment is different enough to yield substantially different results then simply cut down on the amount of malt going in.
 
well i ended up at about 1.074 which is only about 60% eff. not sure what i'm doing wrong, my last few beers have come in low...


Sent from my iPad using Home Brew
 
Made this one a couple months ago, I was hesitant just because the grain bill was super simple and I didnt think it would have much character but was I ever wrong. This is now one of my favorite recipes to brew and and a 5 gallon batch never lasts long, I will be brewing a 10 gallon batch this weekend with our small brew group!

Thank you for posting ....its a regular in the rotation now!
 
Made this one a couple months ago, I was hesitant just because the grain bill was super simple and I didnt think it would have much character but was I ever wrong. This is now one of my favorite recipes to brew and and a 5 gallon batch never lasts long, I will be brewing a 10 gallon batch this weekend with our small brew group!

Thank you for posting ....its a regular in the rotation now!

You are most welcome, glad to be able to pass on such an enjoyable recipe
 
Update on my efficiency, this time (DIPA) I used a 5.2 buffer in my wort and my mash efficiency went up like 10 points to 72!


Sent from my iPad using Home Brew
 
I've been working this beer clone for a couple of years now. In side by side tests with the original I find theirs is drier and has a tang to it that mine hasn't. I think theirs may come from a larger addition of sugar. Most people prefer mine to the original. Something to be said for fresh beer.

16 lbs lager malt
1.1 lbs white syrup

1 oz Spalt or Perle in the boil
.5 Hallertau at 30
3/4 oz Saaz at 5

.4 oz crushed coriander seed at the end of the boil

This beer should be fermented at a high temperature. Living in a temperate part of the world I often have to resort to a brew belt to up the temp.

This is a favorite of mine and one I try to keep on tap as a standard. It is fine to drink young and is usually good after just a week or so in the keg.

It changes over time, dries out and becomes more like an aperitif. An uncomplicated recipe that produces a beer of great complexity.


Hi! Im about to try this recipe! But i have a question about the coriander. After ive cool my beer i pour it through a strainer into the fermenting bucket to get some of the boiled hops and gooey stuff out before airation and yeast addition. Will i loose the flavor from the coriander by doing this? Do i want them in my fementation bucket?

Also, have you tried any of the changes discussed?
 
How long do you leave this in the primary? Do you use a secondary, or straight to the keg? Any cold crashing?
 
I enjoyed this fine beer many a time while living in the Netherlands--it's a lot cheaper over there (€1.19 IIRC)! It's been a year since I've had it, until I found it at my local bottleshop+pub (the Bier Stein in Eugene, OR). Think it was about $5. Please ignore the hazy pour as the tapmaster dumped the whole thing in, bottle completely vertical, like a caveman :confused:

Screen Shot 2019-10-30 at 10.41.32 AM.png


I'm thinking about attempting a clone of it for my next Blonde and love love love the Ardennes yeast for blonde, dubbels and tripels. Have there been any updates to the recipes discussed earlier in this thread, or experiences worth sharing? It's been more than a few years since the last post!
 
Houblon,
could you be more specific in recommendations for the bump in IBU hop additions and coriander?

I think I can answer the question on hop addition. The BU:GU ratio in the OP's recipe is super low at 7 IBU (about 0.09). The ratio target for the style is 0.33. This would put the IBU target at 25 for the OP's recipe.

I've been playing with a recipe that should be structurally similar to the OP's and would love some feedback on it. Looking to get as close to La Chouffe Blonde as possible. BU:GU is 0.33, and it's on the lower end of the SRM for the style at 4.1. I added Munich to get out of the super pale territory and for complimentary flavor, but hopefully not so much that it would overshadow the Ardennes yeast characteristics. I increase the plain sugar to hopefully get it to attenuate nice and dry, and use Nugget for bittering since it's my neutral go-to bittering hop and any flavors aren't likely to survive a 60 minute boil. Would love feedback on this.

In BLAM, it says 3522 produces Clove, Bubblegum, Tart, Phenol flavors starting at 75F, and is clean and malty just below that, so I was thinking about a steady 75F (which was recommended earlier in this thread) for the first 3 or 4 days followed by a ramp/free rise to finish it out.

Thoughts?

Screen Shot 2019-10-30 at 10.21.25 PM.png
 
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That recipe looks great and thanks for the advice I will probably try yours out. I've been reading/listening to some information on munich vs Vienna malt. Some saying that Vienna is a mixture of Munich and pale malt-not sure how true that is. 6L is pretty light but if you want to keep it as light as possible maybe substitute Vienna for the munich or do a mixture.
 
Right on! Happy brewing and post your outcome if you think of it! Would love to hear how this one turns out (for my own selfish reasons :p)
 
Yes, I surely will. I'll make the decision on Munich vs Vienna vs a mix when I get to the LHBS. Also magnum or a similar hop if nugget isn't available. Ill try to keep it as similar to your recipe and see how it turns out.

Plan to primary for 14-21 days then keg condition for another 3 or so. We'll so how impatient I am...
 
Yes, I surely will. I'll make the decision on Munich vs Vienna vs a mix when I get to the LHBS. Also magnum or a similar hop if nugget isn't available. Ill try to keep it as similar to your recipe and see how it turns out.

Plan to primary for 14-21 days then keg condition for another 3 or so. We'll so how impatient I am...

Sounds great! Can't wait to hear about your results. :D

FWIW, I used to use Magnum pellets for bittering before I started going to a LHBS closer to my house. I don't think they carry it, but they have a crapton of loose leaf nugget 14.1 AA for CHEAP. Haven't really noticed a difference since I use those high AA hops at the 60 minute mark exclusively in my beers. Maybe if they were late additions I would. Anyway, just saying it probably won't be perceptibly different if you use Magnum or something else for bittering. Wonder if there's an exBEERiment on that. That'd be a good one.

Good luck!
 
Brewing this as my first Belgian brew, and have more a general brewing question about fermentation schedules. For this beer Wyeast 3522 at 75F:23.8C looks to be the move. After your have reached your final gravity are your keeping it at the 75F or letting it fall back down for conditioning then packing? Thanks for the help!

Hope everyone is staying safe and healthy.
 
Planning on brewing this as well. I'm adjusting the amount of malt to bring down the FG as suggested, however, my IBU's are pretty high. Is it just my aa% or was the original recipe supposed to have a lot of hop character? My SRM is also low, but I'm guessing that's normal. Below is my recipe build. Any suggestions welcome!

CubOdPg

IwbcHDY
 

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Planning on brewing this as well. I'm adjusting the amount of malt to bring down the FG as suggested, however, my IBU's are pretty high. Is it just my aa% or was the original recipe supposed to have a lot of hop character? My SRM is also low, but I'm guessing that's normal. Below is my recipe build. Any suggestions welcome!

CubOdPg

IwbcHDY
I'm brewing a Belgian Blonde right now (using WY3522 Ardennes) and was also concerned about super low SRM, so I added some 28L Victory (also for flavor). I'm not going for an exact La Chouffe clone, but I've brewed this one before and find it to be an excellent Blonde. Maybe this can be somewhat helpful for you as you tweak recipe design:

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/748993/whistling-gnome-belgian-blonde-ale

SRM is right where I want it to be: 6.5. I'm not sure why my efficiency was so low on this batch, but I adjusted it to reflect my actual numbers post-brewday.

With such a low lovibond base malt being your only grain, you're more along the lines of a Golden Strong or a Tripel (except for the gravity). If you wanted to brew one of those, you could up your grain weight or sugar adjuncts to 2 or more pounds (don't exceed 15-20% by weight, though!).

Brewing this as my first Belgian brew, and have more a general brewing question about fermentation schedules. For this beer Wyeast 3522 at 75F:23.8C looks to be the move. After your have reached your final gravity are your keeping it at the 75F or letting it fall back down for conditioning then packing? Thanks for the help!

Hope everyone is staying safe and healthy.

The BLAM guide states that temperatures in excess of 75F for 3522 will throw fusels, clove, spice, phenols in quantities proportionate to temperature. It can become harsh and undrinkable if it goes too high. The exothermic ability of this yeast for me on my first brew with it (a tripel) was through the roof (66F attic, 78F beer temperature, before I got a chest freezer with an inkbird). That tripel was HOT and harsh but mellowed out a little over time. The second attempt at the tripel was with the chest freezer--it came out much softer. If you push the upper end of the recommended temp range for this yeast, make sure you're going off of liquid temp as best as possible rather than ambient.

When working with other strains (3787) and higher gravity worts (Tripels, Quads), I usually start LOW around 62-64F and raise by a degree or two per day for 7 days, then hold until fermentation is complete. This is the method generally recommended by candisyrup.com on their recipes page (definitely check them out if you haven't yet, and are interested in brewing Belgians with some regularity). Some yeasts, like this one, have the tendency to give up if you try to reign them in too much--my last 3787 Tripel did just that and finished 6 points higher than it should've based on previous batch attenuation percentages.

I personally think you could let it sit at your room temp for a week or two post-fermentation and prior to packaging with no ill effects. You could do the traditional cool/cold conditioning for weeks on-end, like Westvleteren does, but 3522 drops clear and fast, so your conditioning could alternatively take place in bottles/keg, barring the arguments of bulk aging being more efficient.

Good luck! This is my favorite Belgian yeast strain.

edit: I should add that I am fermenting this one at 67F for the first 3 days, with a free rise afterward. When I was building my starter, I tasted some of the wort and was punched in the mouth with a clove bomb (probably 70F in my pantry, where my stir plate is--and 75F wort temp is my guess). My goal with this initially lower-end fermentation temperature/schedule is to limit fusels, create a clean and malty flavor profile and encourage complete attenuation. It'll be kegged and carbed to 3.0 volumes.
 
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I've been drinking a good bit of La Chouffe the past few months (also tried McChouffe and Houblon Chouffe, but like La Chouffe best) and saving the bottles. I'm about ready to try brewing something similar. Main things I was searching for are the amount of coriander, and how much carbonation. It seems a lot of American "Belgian" beers scream "Coriander!" instead of just having a hint of it 😂 Is the recipe at the beginning of the thread pretty close with 0.4 ounces (11.3 grams) coriander for a 5 gallon batch? And is a little over 3 volumes of CO2 about right?

Not looking for a clone, I just want to get in the ballpark of La Chouffe but a little more on the bitter side towards H. Chouffe. I'll probably use all pilsner malt, some amber invert syrup I made a year ago to use it up and to give a little color, and Sterling and Willamette hops because I don't have Saaz or Styrian Goldings.
 
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